Landslide closes train station

JohnC.

http://www.thejournal.ie/waterford-train-station-landslide-1245324-Jan2014/

This landslide apparently happened yesterday evening. There's a couple of blurry pictures attached to the article, but I can't really make out if the debris is actually covering the tracks. They say there's bus transfers to Kilkenny and the Waterford station will be closed for at least a day.

IE twitter seems to suggest they not only have to clear the debris, but have to make sure there isn't a danger of more landslides, in response to someone suggesting they just have people board a train a little further down the track.

mike65

Just posted this on Rail Transport sub forum (yes there is one!), while its clearly been very wet and windy period you'd have to wonder about the kind of monitoring that is done of that whole cliff face.

Aestivalis

Jaysus, half of mount misery falls on top of the train station and hardly a decent photo around.
Anybody got some?

JohnC.

Looking at "First for Waterford" WLR FM whose "team brings you the latest Waterford news" you wouldn't think anything had happened. Not even on their twitter. Though they do let us know this morning that racing is going ahead in Tramore.

cbl593h

There's good pictures if you're a member of "Waterford gang" on facecloth.

Faq

https://scontent-a-ams.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-frc3/q71/s720x720/1557530_560057540743876_426000949_n.jpg

danjo-xx

I thought that whole cliff was as solid as a rock...no pun intended.

tomwaterford

does this mean theres more rockface for peopleto paint county coulers on
:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

Sully

Additional photos (click to enlarge);

danjo-xx

mike65

Looking at that you'd have to wonder about the rest of it now its been exposed and with more violent weather on and off for at least a couple more weeks if the computer models can be trusted.

shockwave

Its a shame that rock with the crappy flag on it is still there.

wellboytoo

shockwave wrote: »

Its a shame that rock with the crappy flag on it is still there.

with a name like that, do it again! and take it down.

road_high

Could they not have used the railway line on the other side of the platform thus avoiding the damaged bit?

CardBordWindow

I think the possibility of further debris falling is more the issue than the actual damage. They are going to have to reinforce the cliff face first I'd say.

Trick of the Tail

road_high wrote: »

Could they not have used the railway line on the other side of the platform thus avoiding the damaged bit?

They can, but it's a bay platform and the longer trains don't fit. Also, the damaged line is 'through' to Belview port, where the DFDS liners run from.

And, some of the signalling rods and cables have been damaged, making it difficult to work any traffic.

Apparently they're going to start using the bay platform on Monday, using hand signalling if necessary.

Jamie2k9

Trick of the Tail wrote: »

They can, but it's a bay platform and the longer trains don't fit. Also, the damaged line is 'through' to Belview port, where the DFDS liners run from.

And, some of the signalling rods and cables have been damaged, making it difficult to work any traffic.

Apparently they're going to start using the bay platform on Monday, using hand signalling if necessary.

One other little problem pic number 24
http://www.rte.ie/news/galleries/2014/0103/495778-floods/

AdMMM

Has anyone got any of the bus transfers yet? Do they leave at the scheduled time that the train is meant to, or a bit earlier because it takes longer to get to Kilkenny by bus?

danjo-xx

From twitter

saintchrisburg

Might sound funny, but I was down with the missus at Grattan Quay for a few minutes around 6ish, and I saw the area of the landslide since they had a light there (don't recall if there was always a light there or it's just due to the clear-up they have to do) and we both thought it actually looked nice the way it was lit up - kind of like a nice natural feature of the landscape.

Aquos76

The lights are there to facilitate the clean up, they are working round the clock to get the train station reopened again.

I agree with you thou, it does actually enhance the area

jebus84

thought the same thing about the lights aswell

road_high

Has the bus transfer been quicker than the time it takes the train?

Jamie2k9

road_high wrote: »

Has the bus transfer been quicker than the time it takes the train?

Its roughly the same time if the 5 minute stop in KK is factored and the few minutes required when some services cross in Ballyhale. Thomastwon-Waterford is the worst section of the track for low speeds. Services are delayed no more than 10 mins departing KK.

Aestivalis

Train station was flooded at high tide today.
Landslide still covering the tracks. I'd say it'll be a fair few weeks until its back to normal.

Jamie2k9

services resume form 14.50 today from the bay platform but a log while before they use the main platform.

Max Powers

Aestivalis wrote: »

Train station was flooded at high tide today.
Landslide still covering the tracks. I'd say it'll be a fair few weeks until its back to normal.

if rocks still covering tracks, that is ridiculous. Doesnt take much for a digger to get in there to clear it. Get the first stage done FFS CIE.

Jamie2k9

Max Powers wrote: »

if rocks still covering tracks, that is ridiculous. Doesnt take much for a digger to get in there to clear it. Get the first stage done FFS CIE.

Of course we have the expert in dealing with such a problem. It's not just about clearing the rocks, they would of knocked more done to secure the area before clearing....

Max Powers

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

Of course we have the expert in dealing with such a problem. It's not just about clearing the rocks, they would of knocked more done to secure the area before clearing....

alright sarky, thats why i said get the first stage done i.e clear rocks and secure.

Jamie2k9

Max Powers wrote: »

alright sarky, thats why i said get the first stage done i.e clear rocks and secure.

That's all they have being doing but for the whole area and they would of secured before clearing as the chances are that they added rocks to the pile. Combine that with the station flooded on and off over the last couple of days not exactly easy to do the work. It will take time for it to all be completed and anyway its currently open again.

danjo-xx

What causes the tracks to be flooded up to platform level, remember this happened a few years ago, it is just the runoff of rain from the mountain and if so why is there not sufficient drainage out to the river.

To answer my own question I guess if the river is high then any drainage will be backed up too.

So whats the solution...

Jamie2k9

danjo-xx wrote: »

What causes the tracks to be flooded up to platform level, remember this happened a few years ago, it is just the runoff of rain from the mountain and if so why is there not sufficient drainage out to the river.

To answer my own question I guess if the river is high then any drainage will be backed up too.

So whats the solution...

Its the high tide form the river which is very high at the minute. Certain wind direction causes a lot more flooding than normal and isn't helped that the station as a slight slope. It will only flood the platforms but the whole yard which is at river level mostly doesn't see a drop of flooding.

jayboi

danjo-xx wrote: »

What causes the tracks to be flooded up to platform level, remember this happened a few years ago, it is just the runoff of rain from the mountain and if so why is there not sufficient drainage out to the river.

To answer my own question I guess if the river is high then any drainage will be backed up too.

So whats the solution...

I was only saying this to the lads in the pub the other day and suffice it to say we're not happy. We decided we're going over to have a look and sort it out ourselves then we're going to have a look at this "economy" we've been hearing so much about.

danjo-xx

Is there no pumping system in place for emergencies

Jamie2k9

danjo-xx wrote: »

Is there no pumping system in place for emergencies

No sure but it usually clears as soon as it comes.

wellboytoo

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

No sure but it usually clears as soon as it comes.

Men like?

O Riain

Is it back open yet?

Trick of the Tail

Yes, with trains into the bay platform.

mike65

From the Railway forum

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=89186531&postcount=61

- 9 sets of points to be lifted
- complete closure of platforms 3,4 & 6
- all signalling between central and west cabins to be removed
- 1 line between station and west cabin plain track only no points
- 1 line between Waterford Yard and Belview no points or signals this section is to become a siding

Basically the Rosslare line is dead and the station will move to Sallypark goods yard.

wmpdd3

Didn't see that coming, Waterford really will be a city without a station.

Its a good location for the station though, there is a building there already.

Surly there will be a proper bus service to town now though?

mike65

Well they'll have to be really.

I hope everyone is ready to agitate to preserve the signal box as that's a classic piece of railway infrastructure.



EDIT - we'll see of course

tombliboo83

mike65 wrote: »

From the Railway forum

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=89186531&postcount=61



Basically the Rosslare line is dead and the station will move to Sallypark goods yard.

Station not moving to sallypark, no money for such a move. 16million plus to rectify the rock so it'll be platform 5 for passenger services and one track to the port via platform 3 and 4.

mike65

16 million?! On the rock face.

tombliboo83

mike65 wrote: »

16 million?! On the rock face.

An x-ray of sorts was carried out and there are quiet large fissures in the rock, it would cost that much to step it back, similar to the job done further up the way when building dual carriage way. So, we are left with a situation where the least amount of money possible will be spent, which means removal of said points and operations from platform 5 only.

Jamie2k9

tombliboo83 wrote: »

An x-ray of sorts was carried out and there are quiet large fissures in the rock, it would cost that much to step it back, similar to the job done further up the way when building dual carriage way. So, we are left with a situation where the least amount of money possible will be spent, which means removal of said points and operations from platform 5 only.

Will they add a little bit to P5 to take a 6 piece set, no ideal having to change in Kilkenny.

16 million will have to be found at some point, weather its now or years away it will have to be done as it could happen again.

tombliboo83

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

Will they add a little bit to P5 to take a 6 piece set, no ideal having to change in Kilkenny.

16 million will have to be found at some point, weather its now or years away it will have to be done as it could happen again.

Yes, the talk is that platform5 will he lenghtened as it currently only takes almost 5 coaches, hence the isolation of the rear two coaches leaving kilkenny as you pointed out. I honestly dont see the rock being done for many a year. As im sure you know, Irish Rail simply doesnt have the money for such a project. Imo it would be preferable to move to sallypark in the long run. Ample space, no flooding, safe exiting with the existing trafficlights and run a shuttle bus.

Jamie2k9

tombliboo83 wrote: »

Yes, the talk is that platform5 will he lenghtened as it currently only takes almost 5 coaches, hence the isolation of the rear two coaches leaving kilkenny as you pointed out. I honestly dont see the rock being done for many a year. As im sure you know, Irish Rail simply doesnt have the money for such a project. Imo it would be preferable to move to sallypark in the long run. Ample space, no flooding, safe exiting with the existing trafficlights and run a shuttle bus.

I agree about Sallypark but there is nothing stopping them building a platform there for when flooding happens, once the Mark 3's are scrapped they have lots of room. A shuttle bus would be needed but IE would never fund it and I can't see it being viable alone. It's more less 50/50 in terms of foot and car passengers using the service.

As for it being done, once the Railway Accident investigation Unit publish the report we will see what happens. Would be surprised if they don't recommend its done as the constant flooding and line stone rock never mix together. The Government would probably from the money if the RAIU said it must be done. IE could never afford it they are losing more than that per year.

tombliboo83

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

I agree about Sallypark but there is nothing stopping them building a platform there for when flooding happens, once the Mark 3's are scrapped they have lots of room. A shuttle bus would be needed but IE would never fund it and I can't see it being viable alone. It's more less 50/50 in terms of foot and car passengers using the service.

As for it being done, once the Railway Accident investigation Unit publish the report we will see what happens. Would be surprised if they don't recommend its done as the constant flooding and line stone rock never mix together. The Government would probably from the money if the RAIU said it must be done. IE could never afford it they are losing more than that per year.

Yes, it certainly looks like it will only be done with funding outside IE. I hope it gets done but the way its gearing up, we'll have one passenger line and one freight line and from experience I can say that at once a measure is taken it is hardly ever reversed. On a side note, sad to see the mk3 coaches in sh1te up the yard...great coaches.

Jamie2k9

tombliboo83 wrote: »

Yes, it certainly looks like it will only be done with funding outside IE. I hope it gets done but the way its gearing up, we'll have one passenger line and one freight line and from experience I can say that at once a measure is taken it is hardly ever reversed. On a side note, sad to see the mk3 coaches in sh1te up the yard...great coaches.

It is a shame to see them go but nobody can deny the 22's are much better all round from a passenger point of view and even operating.

Agree that it may never be done but hopefully the RAIU report holds some weight as I can't see it being done either otherwise.

dzilla

tombliboo83 wrote: »

On a side note, sad to see the mk3 coaches in sh1te up the yard...great coaches.

A ****ing disgrace

Jamie2k9

Moderator posted this on Commuting and Transport. Barry Kenny is Irish Rail's PR person.

Originally Posted by Barry Kenny
As you know, we've had temporary working arrangements in place since the start of January at Waterford while the cliff face works were continuing.

The cliff works are taking longer than anticipated so we have made the decision to remove a couple of point ends next week to make the temporary arrangements more efficient. This is not irreversible and does not indicate a longer term plan.

As we've said in public already, there are decisions ahead in the shorter term regarding possible operation of all signalling in the station area from Waterford West cabin, and in the longer term about the station as a whole given the increasing frequency of flood disruption over this and recent winters.

However, the shorter term issues are still under consideration, and there has been no detailed analysis of the longer term issues at this point (and needless to say, no funding to address longer term issues either). So as of now, all that is happening is ongoing cliff face works and minor points rationalisation to facilitate the temporary working arrangements in the station area.