Ras changes 2014

wav1

Irish riders in 2014 will have to be at least A2 status to compete in next years race which hasn't been the case up to now.As its a UCI race once it said elite on your licence you could take part which includes the A3s.A decision has been taken by the organisers of the race to exclude A3s next year.The Glengarriff Affair in 2013 helped make this decision id say.FWIW I think its about right.No place to be if your riding A3 races all season leading up to the race.

Diarmuid

How many of the 22 DQ'd were A3?

wav1

Diarmuid wrote: »

How many of the 22 DQ'd were A3?

Sorry dont have that info,but some certainly were.

jimbo28

Not many as far as I can remember, I definitely know of 2!

fondriest

Diarmuid wrote: »

How many of the 22 DQ'd were A3?

At least 7 that i could name off the top of my head, and after speaking to a few of them they agree with the rule change.

leCycliste

Apologies for taking this thread slightly..... ahem "off Route", but does anyone know when the 2014 routes will be announced?

Diarmuid

leCycliste wrote: »

Apologies for taking this thread slightly..... ahem "off Route", but does anyone know when the 2014 routes will be announced?

Around the end of Jan

lennymc

in one way i can understand the decision, but in another way, its a shame that its limiting the normal rider a chance to ride the premier race in ireland (of course they should be of a standard to finish it)

Pawlie

This rule is a good thing for the race and for lads that do want to do it,if we are A3 and want to do it we gona have to train harder and earn the points to get promoted to A2 and not upgrading ourselves before season starts.

IMO if riders cant get out of A3 even racing with the super juniors they have no place being at the start line in the most prolific race on the Irish calender.

J Madone

Pawlie wrote: »

This rule is a good thing for the race and for lads that do want to do it,if we are A3 and want to do it we gona have to train harder and earn the points to get promoted to A2 and not upgrading ourselves before season starts.

IMO if riders cant get out of A3 even racing with the super juniors they have no place being at the start line in the most prolific race on the Irish calender.

Going to be some pressure in the early races next year trying to get points to get upgraded

Chips Lovell

You can upgrade yourself again this year.

Peterx

Self upgrade to A2kind of defeats the idea of keeping weaker riders out of the Rás.

If The Rás (capital letters) is really intent on keeping the standard high you should have to have A2/1 points in order to enter.

killalanerr

I agree with the ruling ,but with the self upgrade it will not stop some one that really wants to take the start to do it
But the time-limits will be enforced so regardless whether its a self upgrade the riders will be found out "or not" as the case may be.
If your not getting round the other irish premier race Rás Mumhan in good shape the RAS is goin to be a tall order imo

michael196

Pawlie wrote: »

This rule is a good thing for the race and for lads that do want to do it,if we are A3 and want to do it we gona have to train harder and earn the points to get promoted to A2 and not upgrading ourselves before season starts.

IMO if riders cant get out of A3 even racing with the super juniors they have no place being at the start line in the most prolific race on the Irish calender.

I Vote Pawlie for the RAS !!

Chips Lovell

Peterx wrote: »

Self upgrade to A2kind of defeats the idea of keeping weaker riders out of the Rás.

If The Rás (capital letters) is really intent on keeping the standard high you should have to have A2/1 points in order to enter.

I'd disagree with this. If you're serious about doing the Rás, I reckon you're far better off upgrading at the start of the year. It would be much better preparation to be doing the longer, harder A1/A2 races right from the start of the season rather than scrabbling around A3 for a couple of months looking for points.

Pawlie

michael196 wrote: »

I Vote Pawlie for the RAS !!

Nope not this year,Ras Mumhan,Tour Of Ulster,Tour Of Donegal,Suir Valley etc are what I'll be doing and if I get A2 I'll be doing the Shay Elliot and the Nationals and all the other tough races with the 1's and 2's such nenagh classic,des hanlon.

Roll on feb when season starts

Peterx

Vladimir Kurtains wrote: »

I'd disagree with this. If you're serious about doing the Rás, I reckon you're far better off upgrading at the start of the year. It would be much better preparation to be doing the longer, harder A1/A2 races right from the start of the season rather than scrabbling around A3 for a couple of months looking for points.

I agree with your disagreement:P, but in fairness you are talking about motivated riders who intend working hard. They would hopefully get enough points in A3 for promotion anyway.

As it stands I could be eligible to enter the Rás in 2014 without having sat on a bike since my last A3 race merely by ticking the A2 self upgrade box if and when I renew for 2014.
Shirley dat's knot rite?

ragazzo

Vladimir Kurtains wrote: »

I'd disagree with this. If you're serious about doing the Rás, I reckon you're far better off upgrading at the start of the year. It would be much better preparation to be doing the longer, harder A1/A2 races right from the start of the season rather than scrabbling around A3 for a couple of months looking for points.

There are some riders who ride the Ras after spending the early part of the season hanging on in A3 races. These riders would be spat out of the A1/2 bunch in any reasonably difficult race.
This would not prepare them for the Ras any better than finishing A3 races might.

These riders should not be riding the Ras and got in by default when CI changed from the old A/B categories to the updated A1/2/3/4.

Any rider who intends to ride the Ras should also ride Ras Mumhan, Tour of Ulster, Shay Elliott etc as preparation.

That is how it was always done but a mentality of "anyone regardless of category should be allowed enter the Ras" seems to have crept in over the past few years.

County riders always rode the Ras but they were far better prepared and more realistic than some of the current riders who seem to think that riding the Ras is a right.
This is, of course, untrue. Riding the top race in the country is a privelige and deserves respect.

Chips Lovell

Peterx wrote: »

I agree with your disagreement:P, but in fairness you are talking about motivated riders who intend working hard. They would hopefully get enough points in A3 for promotion anyway.

As it stands I could be eligible to enter the Rás in 2014 without having sat on a bike since my last A3 race merely by ticking the A2 self upgrade box if and when I renew for 2014.
Shirley dat's knot rite?

Someone with an A2 licence could be eligible for the Ras as well without throwing a leg over a bike either. It's the preparation you do that counts, not the number on your licence.

Beasty

For a race like this it should never be a case of a rider being able to simply say "I'll give it a go" - there's got to be some "quality control". Presumably everyone that enters is doing so as a member of a team, and there's got to be a responsibility of whoever runs that team to ensure their riders are of an appropriate standard.

ericzeking

Are there guys out there really delusional enough to think they can ride what is essentially a pro race when they can't get out of A3? I find that baffling. I consider myself a half decent A3 and have points but I haven't been able to live with the top A1s anytime I've raced them not to mind pro riders.

Typically, how many A3s would line up?

RobFowl

I'm biased here as have had to to wait for the last rider to finish each stage.
If i was over an hour down in a sportif I'd laugh it off but along with a number of colleagues had to wait 1hr 20 mins after the winner for riders to roll over the line on a stage of the last Ras.
This was simply not near good enough for a UCI 2.2 race.
The organisers have rightly made a decision to limit the entry to those who are potentially of the standard required.

joker77

Vladimir Kurtains wrote: »

I'd disagree with this. If you're serious about doing the Rás, I reckon you're far better off upgrading at the start of the year. It would be much better preparation to be doing the longer, harder A1/A2 races right from the start of the season rather than scrabbling around A3 for a couple of months looking for points.

Vladimir Kurtains wrote: »

Someone with an A2 licence could be eligible for the Ras as well without throwing a leg over a bike either. It's the preparation you do that counts, not the number on your licence.

Are you not contradicting yourself a bit here?

Casati

Beasty wrote: »

For a race like this it should never be a case of a rider being able to simply say "I'll give it a go" - there's got to be some "quality control". Presumably everyone that enters is doing so as a member of a team, and there's got to be a responsibility of whoever runs that team to ensure their riders are of an appropriate standard.

I think that new clubs with the best of intentions have entered teams with riders they believed to be strong enough to get around, but last year was a learning for many managers as well as riders- telling a sponsor that you've only one or two riders left at the finish is going to make it hard to get sponsorship and put in the graft that goes into organising the team.

By limiting A3 riders, will I believe help the clubs and probably isnt a bad thing, though as others have said you can now simply apply for an A2 or even A1 licence so the rule isn't fool proof

ragazzo

Casati wrote: »

I think that new clubs with the best of intentions have entered teams with riders they believed to be strong enough to get around, but last year was a learning for many managers as well as riders- telling a sponsor that you've only one or two riders left at the finish is going to make it hard to get sponsorship and put in the graft that goes into organising the team.


By limiting A3 riders, will I believe help the clubs and probably isnt a bad thing, though as others have said you can now simply apply for an A2 or even A1 licence so the rule isn't fool proof

Without disrespecting your point, I think that any club, team or rider entering the Ras should be aware of the parcours and level of difficulty involved. It is not a park gallop on Tuesday evening.

Any rider who takes it seriously will prepare by riding the toughest domestic races in preparation for the main event.
This will help to illustrate the ability level necessary to ride the Ras. If one is finishing an hour down on each stage of Ras Uladh then the Ras is not for them.
Perhaps it might be in the future but not presently.

Any team or manager should be aware of this and in reality should be capable of choosing riders who can complete the task. If that means inviting riders in to complete team numbers then so be it.

Riders should not be fed rubbish talk about their ability as this just leads to tears, tantrums and disappointment.

This approach is not fair to the riders or the race.

niceonetom

I'm not against the new rule, if only because it can be circumvented by self-upgrade and is therefore nearly meaningless. At least it'll stop the odd A3 who does get through the Rás and the goes back into A3 as a banger.

I question some assumptions here through such as the idea that scoring points in relatively easy races is a good predictor of your ability to survive really hard races. I can think of a few lads who'd regularly get up in a sprint in some 80k race in Meath or wherever who'd never get through more than a day or two of a Rás - though that mostly know this and therefore only pick the easy races. Similarly I can think of some A2s with several Rásanna done who, if you put them back in A3 would be in danger of staying there due to a lack of sprint and the lack of races long or hard enough to suit their skill set.

Bikerbhoy

ragazzo wrote: »

Any rider who intends to ride the Ras should also ride Ras Mumhan, Tour of Ulster, Shay Elliott etc as preparation


County riders always rode the Ras but they were far better prepared and more realistic than some of the current riders who seem to think that riding the Ras is a right.
This is, of course, untrue. Riding the top race in the country is a privelige and deserves respect.

Well said