Why are Fianna Fáil, Fine Gael, RTE & the Independent obsessed with Sinn Féin?

IrishProd

Why are Fianna Fáil, Fine Gael, RTE & the Independent obsessed with Sinn Féin?

Especially Micheal Martin, Niall Collins, Brian Hayes and Alan Shatter?

Why? Anytime economic issues or political issues that are relevant are in the media somehow it is always turned into a Sinn Féin or Gerry Adams bashfest.

Has anyone else noticed? Is it smearing? All I have read in the papers and listened from RTE for over the last 3 months is how bad Sinn Féin and Gerry Adams are? Is it because Sinn Féin are a threat to the status quo and their past is just used as a smokescreen to vilify them in order to scare voters into voting for the usual gombeens?

shamrock55

Because they are affraid

coolhull

IrishProd wrote: »

Why are Fianna Fáil, Fine Gael, RTE & the Independent obsessed with Sinn Féin?

Especially Micheal Martin, Niall Collins, Brian Hayes and Alan Shatter?

Why? Anytime economic issues or political issues that are relevant are in the media somehow it is always turned into a Sinn Féin or Gerry Adams bashfest.

Has anyone else noticed?

The problem is, my cat knows more about economics than SF

D1stant

Is it because they cant be arsed doing anything else?

Jamie2k9

It's Micheal Martin that takes every chance to have a dig whenever and wherever possible.

Paulie Gualtieri

The reason is they don't want Sinn Fein to get into power. EVER!

Jamie2k9

Paulie Gualtieri wrote: »

The reason is they don't want Sinn Fein to get into power. EVER!

Would you?

There policy is to do the exact opposite to what they do in the North done South.

A property tax is fine for SF in the North but its not done here.

Less of the double standards.....

shamrock55

coolhull wrote: »

The problem is, my cat knows more about economics than SF

Is your cat ff or fg

emo72

They told the unionists to accept them and get on with them. Which is logical. Therefore we should do the same down here.

Except they assumed they would never have a chance down here, but the major mainstream parties have been so abysmal that SF are starting to look like a decent alternative. And that's it. SF are next.

IrishProd

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

Would you?

They policy is to do the exact opposite to what they do in the North done South.

A property tax is fine for SF in the North but its not done here.

There is no such thing as a property tax, they have household rates, that is means tested and covers all essential household services (waste collection, water, etc)

Westminister dictates fiscal policy and tax measures, Stormont has no such powers.

Galwayguy35

IrishProd wrote: »

Why are Fianna Fáil, Fine Gael, RTE & the Independent obsessed with Sinn Féin?

Especially Micheal Martin, Niall Collins, Brian Hayes and Alan Shatter?

Why? Anytime economic issues or political issues that are relevant are in the media somehow it is always turned into a Sinn Féin or Gerry Adams bashfest.

Has anyone else noticed? Is it smearing? All I have read in the papers and listened from RTE for over the last 3 months is how bad Sinn Féin and Gerry Adams are? Is it because Sinn Féin are a threat to the status quo and their past is just used as a smokescreen to vilify them in order to scare voters into voting for the usual gombeens?

Shatter could nearly be a member of the DUP he is so far over on that side of things with his opinions and comments.

FF are just trying to get some votes back from SF, but despite all the comments I think SF will do well in the next election because their TDs and councillers work their arses off in the working class communities where they are based.

Jamie2k9

IrishProd wrote: »

There is no such thing as a property tax, they have household rates, that is means tested and covers all essential household services (waste collection, water, etc)

Westminister dictates fiscal policy and tax measures, Stormont has no such powers.

yes because all area's in NI are full of local services and whatever way you dress it up its much more expensive than down here in the South all in all. It's SF being very two faced, why don't they support a blanket household rate done here instead of the LPT and all other charges?

Jamie2k9

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

Shatter could nearly be a member of the DUP he is so far over on that side of things with his opinions and comments.

FF are just trying to get some votes back from SF, but despite all the comments I think SF will do well in the next election because their TDs and councillers work their arses off in the working class communities where they are based.

They might do well but won't be in power.

I expect the next Gov will be a FG-Independents or FF-Independents. Know us "Irish" half of use will completely forget about FF and what they caused and they will have the majority again. There is no other choices left.

Galwayguy35

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

They might do well but won't be in power.

I expect the next Gov will be a FG-Independents or FF-Independents. Know us "Irish" half of use will completely forget about FF and what they caused and they will have the majority again.

Being honest I agree they won't be in power, and I'm sure some of them were cringing when Gerry made his speech earlier on in the Dail, none of them would be prepared to give him the heave though even though privately some might want this to happen.

catallus

A more salient (and sapient) question would be "Why are RTE obsessed with Fianna Fail and Micheal Martin?"

This goes for Newstalk too. And the major papers.

Mint Aero

Because it's porn to them. Fg, ff and rte loooove jizzing in a circle to sf dirt talk

Galwayguy35

Mint Aero wrote: »

Because it's porn to them. Fg, ff and rte loooove jizzing in a circle to sf dirt talk

It would be in the "party" catagory so.

[-0-]

It is all part of the Free State spinster machine.

They're afraid of how much support Sinn Fein has received in the past few years.

[-0-]

It is all part of the Free State spinster machine.

They're afraid of how much support Sinn Fein has received in the past few years.

dxhound2005

IrishProd wrote: »

There is no such thing as a property tax, they have household rates, that is means tested and covers all essential household services (waste collection, water, etc)

Westminister dictates fiscal policy and tax measures, Stormont has no such powers.

There is such a thing as a property tax. Unless you know better than the people appointed to collect it. And where did you get the idea that NI domestic rates (property tax) funds water services?

http://www.nidirect.gov.uk/index/information-and-services/property-and-housing/rates/your-rate-bill/what-are-rates.htm

What are rates?

Rates are a property tax based on the valuation of your home. The income from rates provides funding for services at both local (your council) and regional (NI Assembly) levels.

The Golden Miller

The media has a lot to answer for here in the south with their anti-nationalist agenda. It's nothing new, and has been like this for the past 15 years or so. You can see the influence daily even on this website. 20 years ago do you think half the population would be looking at everything from the British perspective, apologising for their actions here and distracting any British wrong doing from the point with their IRA whataboutary? Even the current IRA-Garda "collusion" story shows this. Such a big deal made out of it. Yet recent stories have come out, of drive-by shootings at random Irish nationalists in the north by members of the British security forces and it hardly gets a mention.

There's an agenda against nationalism in our media. Just look up Eoghan Harris who got the ball rolling and the damage he's done within RTE, where him and others of his ilk outed anyone of a nationalist persuasion and its been well documented. And then the influence they had churning out their pro-unionist rubbish which people bought into. Not surprisingly he's now a UUP advisor. Conor Cruise O'Brien, Fintan O'Toole, Kevin Myers, Pat Flanagan and the unionist agenda goes on and on through-out every major media outlet. The Times, the Independent, the English red tops, you name it. Its propaganda really and we've been exposed to it daily in the south for the past 15-20 years, so its no surprise that many the people in the south are of that opinion. Over time its worked and you can see the puppets of its influence rife within this site alone

WilyCoyote

The Golden Miller wrote: »

The media has a lot to answer for here in the south with their anti-nationalist agenda. It's nothing new, and has been like this for the past 15 years or so. You can see the influence daily even on this website. 20 years ago do you think half the population would be looking at everything from the British perspective, apologising for their actions here and distracting any British wrong doing from the point with their IRA whataboutary? Even the current IRA-Garda "collusion" story shows this. Such a big deal made out of it. Yet recent stories have come out, of drive-by shootings at random Irish nationalists in the north by members of the British security forces and it hardly gets a mention.

There's an agenda against nationalism in our media. Just look up Eoghan Harris who got the ball rolling and the damage he's done within RTE, where him and others of his ilk outed anyone of a nationalist persuasion and its been well documented. And then the influence they had churning out their pro-unionist rubbish which people bought into. Not surprisingly he's now a UUP advisor. Conor Cruise O'Brien, Fintan O'Toole, Kevin Myers, Pat Flanagan and the unionist agenda goes on and on through-out every major media outlet. The Times, the Independent, the English red tops, you name it. Its propaganda really and we've been exposed to it daily in the south for the past 15-20 years, so its no surprise that many the people in the south are of that opinion. Over time its worked and you can see the puppets muppets of its influence rife within this site alone

Fixed your post!

Banjo String

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

yes because all area's in NI are full of local services and whatever way you dress it up its much more expensive than down here in the South all in all.

Dumb this down for me please

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

It's SF being very two faced, why don't they support a blanket household rate done here instead of the LPT and all other charges?

Their isn't a blanket rate in the North. Rates are calculated on your property, location, ability to pay etc etc.

You're also fully paid up for a lot of other services once rates are paid.

Refuse collecting. Health care (yeah no gp / a&e charges etc. No book fees for school. No tolls on the Road. Etc etc etc.

The 'shinners' don't view the Irish citizens as cash cows.

That be the other parties problems

Banjo String

dxhound2005 wrote: »

There is such a thing as a property tax. Unless you know better than the people appointed to collect it. And where did you get the idea that NI domestic rates (property tax) funds water services?

Oh that's right. Water still gets paid for via their tax payments/vat (like we did)

We'll pay separate now (yet I see no paye/vat reductions)

dxhound2005 wrote: »

http://www.nidirect.gov.uk/index/information-and-services/property-and-housing/rates/your-rate-bill/what-are-rates.htm

What are rates?

Rates are a property tax based on the valuation of your home. The income from rates provides funding for services at both local (your council) and regional (NI Assembly) levels.

Ah here DXHOUND.

In the name of Transparency and fairness at least copy and paste the whole text from that site.

What do rates pay for?

Rates fund public services in Northern Ireland, both regional and local. Your rate bill is made up of two parts, the regional rate and the district rate.

Regional rate

The regional rate is set annually by the Northern Ireland Executive and is applied to each district council area in Northern Ireland. This pays for such services as:

education
emergency services
health
housing
roads
water and sewerage

Although a contribution is made by all ratepayers towards public services, there is no specific proportion that can be linked to the availability or usage of any particular public service.

District rate

The district rate is set annually by each of the district councils in Northern Ireland, and is used to fund services such as:

arts, events and recreation
building control
community centres
environmental health
leisure facilities
tourism
waste management

I'm sure that was an oversight on your part. (Again)

Eight Ball

SF would end the largesse of RTE and government. They wouldn't (rightfully) accept the montrose millionaires getting paid what they do on the back of the tax payer.

BillyMitchel

The Golden Miller wrote: »

The media has a lot to answer for here in the south with their anti-nationalist agenda. It's nothing new, and has been like this for the past 15 years or so. You can see the influence daily even on this website. 20 years ago do you think half the population would be looking at everything from the British perspective, apologising for their actions here and distracting any British wrong doing from the point with their IRA whataboutary? Even the current IRA-Garda "collusion" story shows this. Such a big deal made out of it. Yet recent stories have come out, of drive-by shootings at random Irish nationalists in the north by members of the British security forces and it hardly gets a mention.

There's an agenda against nationalism in our media. Just look up Eoghan Harris who got the ball rolling and the damage he's done within RTE, where him and others of his ilk outed anyone of a nationalist persuasion and its been well documented. And then the influence they had churning out their pro-unionist rubbish which people bought into. Not surprisingly he's now a UUP advisor. Conor Cruise O'Brien, Fintan O'Toole, Kevin Myers, Pat Flanagan and the unionist agenda goes on and on through-out every major media outlet. The Times, the Independent, the English red tops, you name it. Its propaganda really and we've been exposed to it daily in the south for the past 15-20 years, so its no surprise that many the people in the south are of that opinion. Over time its worked and you can see the puppets of its influence rife within this site alone

Best comment I've read on boards in a long long time -apart from my own if course.

Phoebas

The Golden Miller wrote: »

The media has a lot to answer for here in the south with their anti-nationalist agenda. It's nothing new, and has been like this for the past 15 years or so. You can see the influence daily even on this website. 20 years ago do you think half the population would be looking at everything from the British perspective, apologising for their actions here and distracting any British wrong doing from the point with their IRA whataboutary? Even the current IRA-Garda "collusion" story shows this. Such a big deal made out of it. Yet recent stories have come out, of drive-by shootings at random Irish nationalists in the north by members of the British security forces and it hardly gets a mention.

There's an agenda against nationalism in our media. Just look up Eoghan Harris who got the ball rolling and the damage he's done within RTE, where him and others of his ilk outed anyone of a nationalist persuasion and its been well documented. And then the influence they had churning out their pro-unionist rubbish which people bought into. Not surprisingly he's now a UUP advisor. Conor Cruise O'Brien, Fintan O'Toole, Kevin Myers, Pat Flanagan and the unionist agenda goes on and on through-out every major media outlet. The Times, the Independent, the English red tops, you name it. Its propaganda really and we've been exposed to it daily in the south for the past 15-20 years, so its no surprise that many the people in the south are of that opinion. Over time its worked and you can see the puppets of its influence rife within this site alone

tl;dr: Anyone that doesn't share your analysis is just a puppet; a victim of propaganda.

.jacksparrow.

Media Propaganda backed by the government has always been the most valuable asset against nationalists.

People will believe almost anything they read in the papers and are told by rte or tv3 low budget documentaries.

Christy42

All possible reasons. That or the serious connection to people's deaths. I seem to remember a pretty horrific tape of McGuinness coming out around the time of the presidential election. I don't think anyone seriously believes that Gerry Adams is clean either. Get rid of the old guard and they might have a chance. Reckon everyone is rather wondering when the united Ireland thing is gong to come up, Sinn Fein have be very quiet about that goal down south but I can see it being a big deal once they get in whether or not the people wanted that.

And yes for balance if the unionists ever run for election down here I will bring up their violent past and throw in the treating Catholics like second hand citizens bit for good measure.

gandalf

I think the main issue that those parties have with Sinn Fein is the same as mine. They acted as a front for murdering thugs for years and a lot of their senior members were involved directly in murder and criminality.

Add to that their fantasy Marxist economics, although that stance does look hypocritical given their performance in Government in Northern Ireland where they have towed the British Exchequers line in a very subservient manner.

In reality they have as much credibility as Fianna Fail and are the same except their members directly did harm to many whereas Fianna Fail indirectly did it via their disastrous policy (or not policy) decisions.

Sunnyisland

Christy42 wrote: »

All possible reasons. That or the serious connection to people's deaths. I seem to remember a pretty horrific tape of McGuinness coming out around the time of the presidential election. I don't think anyone seriously believes that Gerry Adams is clean either. Get rid of the old guard and they might have a chance. Reckon everyone is rather wondering when the united Ireland thing is gong to come up, Sinn Fein have be very quiet about that goal down south but I can see it being a big deal once they get in whether or not the people wanted that.

And yes for balance if the unionists ever run for election down here I will bring up their violent past and throw in the treating Catholics like second hand citizens bit for good measure.

As it might be a while before any unionist party run for election down here, Why don't you ask the senior members of the Labour Party about there not to distanced past in there connection to the Official IRA ?

Annasopra

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

Shatter could nearly be a member of the DUP he is so far over on that side of things with his opinions and comments.

Em Alan Shatter is a social liberal; he's pro choice, pro gay marriage and adoption. You could not get further away from DUP.

Banjo String

Phoebas wrote: »

tl;dr: Anyone that doesn't share your analysis is just a puppet; a victim of propaganda.

How did you arrive at that conclusion without reading it

golfball37

What I find most puzzling is that there is at least 30% of the population who won't touch SF with a barge pole no matter what they do. All the coverage and obsession with them is just playing to this minority who don't need to be convinced of their badness.

DexyDrain

I guess it's partly the stench of death, blood and broken bones off them and partly exasperation at their nutty economic worldview. It's like listening to the playground talk back in primary school 'yeah, we'll make the teachers do all the homework and see how they like it. And we'll make Mars bars and Mr. Freeze compulsory for lunch, and we'll get everyone who gets an A in the exams to hand over their answers and then we'll have a whole school exam so we all get the same marks, then we'll barricade the school gates....'

.jacksparrow.

DexyDrain wrote: »

I guess it's partly the stench of death, blood and broken bones off them and partly exasperation at their nutty economic worldview. It's like listening to the playground talk back in primary school 'yeah, we'll make the teachers do all the homework and see how they like it. And we'll make Mars bars and Mr. Freeze compulsory for lunch, and we'll get everyone who gets an A in the exams to hand over their answers and then we'll have a whole school exam so we all get the same marks, then we'll barricade the school gates....'

But its not really like that at all is it?

Mr.McLovin

They're obsessed with Sinn Fein as they are easy targets.

Sinn Fein get something right or condemn some stupid policy or government fcuk up the retort will always be shut up your terrorists and murders basically, creditability flushed down the jacks and everything gets reflected on to this. Like another poster said maybe its time the old guard passes on...

.jacksparrow.

Its hypocricy of the highest order.

Few weeks ago we had former justice minister mcdowell criticizing Sinn Fein for their past, then he appears on a programme about his cousins who were in the Ira and how he was proud and understood why they went out and killed a group of British soldiers during the tan war.

Please tell me the difference.

LordSutch

Mr.McLovin wrote: »

They're obsessed with Sinn Fein as they are easy targets.

Sinn Fein get something right or condemn some stupid policy or government fcuk up the retort will always be shut up your terrorists and murders basically, creditability flushed down the jacks and everything gets reflected on to this. Like another poster said maybe its time the old guard passes on...

As a self confessed hater of the bearded one (and Sinn Fein generally), I would have to agree that if they let the old "whiff of sulphur" guard go (Adams, Ferris, etc) + all of those with blood on their hands, then they would become not soo repulsive to so many of the electorate in the south. Even I might look at one of their leaflets (and read it) instead of tearing it up as soon as it comes through the letter box.

Sunnyisland

.jacksparrow. wrote: »

Its hypocricy of the highest order.

Few weeks ago we had former justice minister mcdowell criticizing Sinn Fein for their past, then he appears on a programme about his cousins who were in the Ira and how he was proud and understood why they went out and killed a group of British soldiers during the tan war.

Please tell me the difference.

The difference is they shot people with guns and the Provos shot people with with with and and and did the same.

Sunnyisland

golfball37 wrote: »

What I find most puzzling is that there is at least 30% of the population who won't touch SF with a barge pole no matter what they do. All the coverage and obsession with them is just playing to this minority who don't need to be convinced of their badness.

It keeps a lot of the people sidetracked in what SF did or did not then have the people actually question FG FF & Lab,and it sells papers.

Zebra3

IrishProd wrote: »

Why are Fianna Fáil, Fine Gael, RTE & the Independent obsessed with Sinn Féin?

Especially Micheal Martin, Niall Collins, Brian Hayes and Alan Shatter?

Why? Anytime economic issues or political issues that are relevant are in the media somehow it is always turned into a Sinn Féin or Gerry Adams bashfest.

Has anyone else noticed? Is it smearing? All I have read in the papers and listened from RTE for over the last 3 months is how bad Sinn Féin and Gerry Adams are? Is it because Sinn Féin are a threat to the status quo and their past is just used as a smokescreen to vilify them in order to scare voters into voting for the usual gombeens?

FF, and FG (as well as Labour) are happy to constantly harp on about SF/IRA/Adams because it deflects from the fact that all the time those three parties have been in power, a massive terrorist organisation (the Catholic Church) had the freedom for its members to rape Irish children. Even to this day members of the Catholic Church who facilitated and covered up the rape of children are not prosecuted. The taxpayer has also footed the bill for many of their crimes. And the church, despite its crimes against Irish people, is still allowed to operate in this state and spread its cultish lies.

As for the usual crap out of people on here about SF's economic policies (and I don't agree with a lot of them either), FF and FG's policies of No Bondholder Left Behind is working out too well, is it? Amazing that working class people vote for those parties who simply look after the elite while the working class face emigration, unemployment, austerity and choices between heating their homes or eating.

As for RTE, it isn't going to attack the establishment. It's part of it. and if it does, FF/FG will simply threaten to cut the licence fee. That'll whip RTE back in place fairly sharpish.

The Indo too is a tool of the establishment, owned by the wealthy and takes advertising revenue from the wealthy.

If ever in doubt, follow the money trail.....

Wolf Club

I'd vote for Sinn Fein over Fianna Fail or Fine Gael, the same way that I'd take a punch in the arm over a kick in the balls or a bat to the face. The reason Martin, Shatter, etc are so critical of them is because they realise how unpopular and out of touch all of the other parties are that they're trying to nip SF's chances of credibility in the bud by bringing up their past.

IrishProd

It really is nauseous how the state media is infested with Fianna Fáil supporters and how they push their anti-republican/nationalist agenda. Eoghan Harris and the stickies took it over completely. Listening to Micheal Martin and his revisionist nonsense it is incredible that they still call themselves the republican party, I often wonder that if they are any remaining republicans and nationalists remaining in Fianna Fáíl how do they feel about their current leader and the direction the party is going. People want to see a FF/SF coalition, but Micheal Martin and Niall Collins hypocritically and venomously attack SF at every given opportunity. The membership of SF vote at a Special Ard Fheis if they want to go into coalition if asked, I would not be surprised if the SF membership tell Fianna Fáil to go stuff their coalition.

dxhound2005

IrishProd wrote: »

It really is nauseous how the state media is infested with Fianna Fáil supporters and how they push their anti-republican/nationalist agenda. Eoghan Harris and the stickies took it over completely. Listening to Micheal Martin and his revisionist nonsense it is incredible that they still call themselves the republican party, I often wonder that if they are any remaining republicans and nationalists remaining in Fianna Fáíl how do they feel about their current leader and the direction the party is going. People want to see a FF/SF coalition, but Micheal Martin and Niall Collins hypocritically and venomously attack SF at every given opportunity. The membership of SF vote at a Special Ard Fheis if they want to go into coalition if asked, I would not be surprised if the SF membership tell Fianna Fáil to go stuff their coalition.

They got over their distaste for the DUP when they wanted power. Some Republican party. And of course they continued to implement all the policies which they condemned when the SDLP/UUP were in power. Cue SF continuing with property tax here if they get in.

IrishProd

dxhound2005 wrote: »

They got over their distaste for the DUP when they wanted power. Some Republican party.

So you would rather them abandon the peace process? But then again I suppose there are people like yourself down here that would love to see that, Micheal Martin & the Independent and their supporters would cream themselves with all the potential opportunities for political point-scoring just to get votes.

Regarding your false assertion about policies, that was already corrected and pointed out earlier in the thread.

porsche959

IrishProd wrote: »

So you would rather them abandon the peace process? But then again I suppose there are people like yourself down here that would love to see that, Micheal Martin & the Independent and their supporters would cream themselves with all the potential opportunities for political point-scoring just to get votes.

Regarding your false assertion about policies, that was already corrected and pointed out earlier in the thread.

For all that people give out about FF and Bertie, if John Brutal was left in charge in 1997 the peace process would probably be dead in the water or at best in its infancy.

dxhound2005

IrishProd wrote: »

So you would rather them abandon the peace process? But then again I suppose there are people like yourself down here that would love to see that, Micheal Martin & the Independent and their supporters would cream themselves with all the potential opportunities for political point-scoring just to get votes.

Regarding your false assertion about policies, that was already corrected and pointed out earlier in the thread.

Why would the peace process depend on SF being in government. If they had continued in opposition the peace process would have been fine as long as the IRA didn't resume bombing and shooting.

I never said anything about SF policies earlier.

IrishProd

porsche959 wrote: »

For all that people give out about FF and Bertie, if John Brutal was left in charge in 1997 the peace process would probably be dead in the water or at best in its infancy.

If Micheal Martin was in charge back then it would also be dead in the water.

Santa Cruz

IrishProd wrote: »

It really is nauseous how the state media is infested with Fianna Fáil supporters and how they push their anti-republican/nationalist agenda. Eoghan Harris and the stickies took it over completely. Listening to Micheal Martin and his revisionist nonsense it is incredible that they still call themselves the republican party, I often wonder that if they are any remaining republicans and nationalists remaining in Fianna Fáíl how do they feel about their current leader and the direction the party is going. People want to see a FF/SF coalition, but Micheal Martin and Niall Collins hypocritically and venomously attack SF at every given opportunity. The membership of SF vote at a Special Ard Fheis if they want to go into coalition if asked, I would not be surprised if the SF membership tell Fianna Fáil to go stuff their coalition.

The membership of SF will do what they are told by their bosses and don't be fooling yourself that it will be otherwise.

boobar

Because Sinn Fein are "amazeballs"