Issue with a bill to pay with my landlady (responsability)

superMarco

Hi everybody.

I'm coming here to ask you a question about something that bother me a lot recently about my landlady and me.

Three is like 1 month ago on a sunday morning, when I woke up my electricity poped out in my apartment (I don't know if it was during the night or the morning, but when I woke up, I didn't have anything). I tried to put the fuse back on, but nothing was working.. Everytime the fuse didn't want to go back on (no one of them was destroyed).

After 1hour trying to fix this, I decided to call the real estate agent that actually take care of the apartment for the landlady (I never saw the landlady, I just know her name).

Impossible to reach him after 3 or 4 calls. No answer. No message. Nothing.

Since my food in the fridge began to melt and be warm (meat, chicken, cream etc...) I went to the fuse box and call the number on it, since I couldn't reach the real estate agent.. I couldn't wait for his call back because I didn't have anything working, heater off, hot water as well, internet down.. nothing!

I called the number, and the electrician came and manage to see that the problem came from the washing machine, I don't really understand, but it was something related to the earth plug, and this has to be repair. (The apartment was already furnish when I moved in).

After that, my real estate agent called me back (around 1h and a half I tried to reach him), and said that I didn't had to call someone else because its forbidden etc etc..

I have to say that I'm French, and I don't really know the law about it, but on my tenancy agreement, there is nothing mention about calling him first and he will fix everything.. Since it was an emergency, I couldn't really wait for this anylonger without any news.

Anyway the electrician manage to put the electricity back on, but desactivate the washing machin.

My real estate agent told me that he would sent someone tomorrow fixing this probleme and to see if it was really coming from the washing machine... (He didn't trusted me).

The fee for the electrician (the one I called) was expensive, but since I found it on the fuse box, I thought it was legitimate to call them, instead of looking online to find one etc.. (Around 200€.. yeah that sucks)

But my landlady doesn't want to pay for this, because they say that its my responsability.. wtf ? I don't really understand why this is my responsability but she "offer" to pay the half of the fee.

If it was my responsability do you really think she would pay the half ?!?

Anyway.. I'm stuck here, and they ask me to paye for this, but I just call a repair guy to do something that my real estate agent couldn't do it before the day after.. (Like I would wait 1 day without electricity with him)

What should I do, or say ?

Help me

D3PO

I don't see how this is the landladies responsibility at all. Calling out an expensive on call electrician after less than an hour and a half's wait is not defensible by a tenant.

The fact your food was spoiling is irrelevant. you should have contents insurance that would cover this if it was infact such a big deal for you.

I agree with the landlady this is your bill to foot you didn't give them a reasonable opportunity to fix the issue nor did you give them any opportunity to fix the issue without incurring large expense.

This is 100% your bill. Next time you might actually think before leaping into something. I think the offer from your landlady to pay half is more than reasonable and is being done on the basis she acknowledges this is something that would cost her a certain amount to fix but most likely not as much as your being charged for an expensive on call electrician.

srsly78

Is there not circuit breakers? One of the switches will be down, just flip it back up like the others. This is really basic stuff... Exactly the same as in France.

Is there only 1 big fuse on the board? That's the main fuse and it probably not the fault.

superMarco

Well I understand your point of view, but I didn't get any news, any message, anything from my real estate agent, and from the beginning, we have issue with him because we don't get the inventory yet (after 3 months), a lot of stuff was broken and just for a single washing machine door, he took him 2 weeks.. anyways.

I didn't choose an expensive one on purpose you know, I just took the one on the fuse box because its the most logical thing to do.. and he didn't want to give us his contact because its not working like that.. and what he wanted to do, it for me to wait one entire day without electricity to wait the monday after for his "repair guy" to come to fix it..

He didn't even ask the price for this and he told me that he would take care of it.

I decided to call an electrician after 1 hour and a half yes, but I didn't have anything during hours before..

Does this mean that if next time I will have a huge water leak in my flat, I will have to wait for his call ? Thinking like this is kind of stupid (sorry for the expression), but being cut out all electricity during hours since my girlfriend had some exam to study, and nothing was working.. I don't know how I could wait for something that I wasn't even sure to get (an answer from him).

Thank for your answer D3PO

srsly78 wrote: »

Is there not circuit breakers? One of the switches will be down, just flip it back up like the others. This is really basic stuff... Exactly the same as in France.

Is there only 1 big fuse on the board? That's the main fuse and it probably not the fault.

I tried to switch it of course, but nothing was working.. I don't even know how he actually manage to put the electricitt back on.. I'm sorry but its not my domain It was coming from the appliance, but we didn't know that..

djimi

D3PO wrote: »

I don't see how this is the landladies responsibility at all. Calling out an expensive on call electrician after less than an hour and a half's wait is not defensible by a tenant.

The fact your food was spoiling is irrelevant. you should have contents insurance that would cover this if it was infact such a big deal for you.

I agree with the landlady this is your bill to foot you didn't give them a reasonable opportunity to fix the issue nor did you give them any opportunity to fix the issue without incurring large expense.

This is 100% your bill. Next time you might actually think before leaping into something. I think the offer from your landlady to pay half is more than reasonable and is being done on the basis she acknowledges this is something that would cost her a certain amount to fix but most likely not as much as your being charged for an expensive on call electrician.

There is provision in the RTA to get repairs done and deduct the cost from the rent should the landlord fail to sort the problem. I dont know whether or not that would apply in this case, and even if it did then an hour and a half might not be long enough to wait, but as the OP points out its not really acceptable to be without electricity, and if the landlord/agent cant be contacted then the tenant is going to have to take some action. Its not like the OP called a carpenter to fix a press door, or some other non essential issue, its a bit more serious when you face the prospect of 24 hours without electricity because the agent cannot be contacted.

OP Id be inclined perhaps to contact Threshold and see what their opinion on this is.

superMarco

djimi wrote: »

OP Id be inclined perhaps to contact Threshold and see what their opinion on this is.

I just did, thank you for the information.

The thing that D3PO didn't understand, is that I didn't have any internet during this time and I only had this phone number on the fuse box.

I would love to call someone cheaper, but I couldn't. If that would happen during a working day, It wouldn't bother me, because I'm not home before the evenning.. But since it was on a Sunday, and I don't really go out on Sunday and to stay in an unknown state during hours didn't help. Should I wait in my cold apartment doing nothing and waiting for his call that could actually never come ?

My real estate agent told me that he wasn't a 24/7 hotline service... yeah well.. I don't know how to react when someone who is actually pay to take care of this kind of issue throw this to your face when you have a problem... :eek:

djimi

What did Threshold say?

superMarco

I didn't got any anwser from them yet.. I guess they left their office for the day, so I will wait tomorrow morning.

But really.. we are very nice with the landlady because she asked for a spare key of the apartment and the postbox (because she receive some letter at our address...), so we did.. It took 3 weeks to a month to got the lease signed from the landlady and the real estate agent, so when I had to open an account the electricity company, the real estate agent asked me to fake his signature and the signature of the landlady to open it because it was "okay" to do it..

We didn't complain about anything but our washing machine was broken and same for the fridge.. We loose time and food a lot of time.. The wooden floor is begin to take off the ground so we asked the real estate agent about it since months ago, but nothing moved.

I asked the inventory of the apartment for months as well, he lied about it that he said he sent to us by mailbox (we didn't received anything) and said after that he will figured out. Nothing yet.

And now, our electricity pop out, and since he's incapable to do anything, we still tried to reach him, but in vain! He complain about us taking initiative !!

I don't know if we are too nice or too stupid..

D3PO

djimi wrote: »

There is provision in the RTA to get repairs done and deduct the cost from the rent should the landlord fail to sort the problem. I dont know whether or not that would apply in this case, and even if it did then an hour and a half might not be long enough to wait, but as the OP points out its not really acceptable to be without electricity, and if the landlord/agent cant be contacted then the tenant is going to have to take some action. Its not like the OP called a carpenter to fix a press door, or some other non essential issue, its a bit more serious when you face the prospect of 24 hours without electricity because the agent cannot be contacted.

OP Id be inclined perhaps to contact Threshold and see what their opinion on this is.

are you arguing just for the sake of it ? You genuinely think no electricity for an hour and a half is too long a wait ? You think tenants should be able to unilaterally make decisions on repairs after 90 mins ?

give me a break I respect you opinion on here generally even if I disagree but even you cant seriously believe what you have typed

D3PO

superMarco wrote: »

I just did, thank you for the information.

The thing that D3PO didn't understand, is that I didn't have any internet during this time and I only had this phone number on the fuse box.

1) 3G / 4G internet on your mobile
2) Yellow pages
3) 11850

give me a break

Kristopherus

You do realise that to call out an electrician on a Sunday will cost an arm & a leg. Estate agents do not work on a Sunday either. You really were very lucky to get help in the timeframe that you did.

superMarco

D3PO wrote: »

1) 3G / 4G internet on your mobile
2) Yellow pages
3) 11850

give me a break

I don't have 3G on my phone I'm sorry, and we don't have the yellow pages either.. and I don't know the last number.

I'm sorry to be a foreign worker, but I'm quite new in Ireland and I'm sorry if I don't get everything of it yet.

Kristopherus wrote: »

You do realise that to call out an electrician on a Sunday will cost an arm & a leg. Estate agents do not work on a Sunday either. You really were very lucky to get help in the timeframe that you did.

I know that would cost a lot, its the same in France, but what else should I do ?

PucaMama

Unbelievable attitude here. Op if landlord refuses to pay the bill caused by his faulty washing machine take it from the rent.

superMarco

PucaMama wrote: »

Unbelievable attitude here. Op if landlord refuses to pay the bill caused by his faulty washing machine take it from the rent.

Can I do it like that ?

PucaMama

superMarco wrote: »

Can I do it like that ?

Yes any tenants I had to deal with would do that. Sure the landlord would have to pay for the repair anyway even if they got their own electrician.

superMarco

PucaMama wrote: »

Yes any tenants I had to deal with would do that. Sure the landlord would have to pay for the repair anyway even if they got their own electrician.

So I just go to say to the agent that I would pay for the entire bill, but I take this from the rent ?
I'm sorry if its a stupid question, but its kinda the first time I have to deal with this kind of issue..

PucaMama

superMarco wrote: »

So I just go to say to the agent that I would pay for the entire bill, but I take this from the rent ?
I'm sorry if its a stupid question, but its kinda the first time I have to deal with this kind of issue..

Yeah just say that.

superMarco

PucaMama wrote: »

Yeah just say that.

Thank you for your help
(Because they most likely said that since we didn't wait for his call back, its not their responsabilty )

Thomas D

Deduct the money from your rent. The PRTB will fully back you on this. The landlord is to blame by being uncontacable.

PucaMama

They will try and tell you these things but stick to your position on this

D3PO

what a load of nonsense you cant just get the firs ton call sparks you ring after 90 mins and deduct from the rent.

there are provisions yes but not after 90 mins for a start. The OP hasn't a leg to stand on and the attitude sure they would have to get an electrician anyway isn't relevant either.

they may have contracters that provide services at a reduced rate for starters.

The facts are the OP was hasty had no right to call an on call electrician after 90 mins and rightly will suffer some of the cost for jumping in

D3PO

Thomas D wrote: »

Deduct the money from your rent. The PRTB will fully back you on this. The landlord is to blame by being uncontacable.

another uneducated post from you. You really need to educate yourself before you speak.

Thomas D

Mr.S wrote: »

On a Sunday morning after less then 2hrs?

The EA / Landlady is pissed of because they have their own electricians etc which give far better rates.

Taking money out of the rent will seriously piss them both off. Try and work it out

What difference does the day make? There was an electrical problem that needed to be looked at. The op paid a far price for a call out.

mitosis

Sunday morning. Gives the LL 90 minutes to respond. Not reasonable IMHO

jsd1004

superMarco wrote: »

Can I do it like that ?

No you can't. Ridiculous advice. Faulty appliances happen and are no ones fault. Maybe it was your problem with something you did with the machine. You cannot call an electrician out because of your basic lack of electrical knowledge. You should have plugged everything out and reset the power. It's like calling a plumber out when the sink is blocked. Pay the bill. Btw I'm a tenant and a landlord.

superMarco

I don't understand why you are so agressif D3PO. I'm sorry if I pissed you off with my attitude for this problem, but I did what I had to do for the situation I've got.
Which mean, I woke up without electricity around 10, and I try to reach my agent around 12 after trying to fix it.. So I just called the electrician to get this fixed straight away.

Otherwise my problem would stay like this until monday.. (And their electrician actually came on Wednesday...)

Coles

The landlord and agent are completely in the wrong here. Greedy feckers. Take it to Threshold.

The_Morrigan

Ok the attacking nature of some of the posts in here are not on!
Please remain civil or refrain from posting.

Thank you

Morri

wexie

djimi wrote: »

and if the landlord/agent cant be contacted then the tenant is going to have to take some action. Its not like the OP called a carpenter to fix a press door, or some other non essential issue, its a bit more serious when you face the prospect of 24 hours without electricity because the agent cannot be contacted.
.

Thomas D wrote: »

Deduct the money from your rent. The PRTB will fully back you on this. The landlord is to blame by being uncontacable.

The estate agent got back to OP after an hour and a half!!!! on a SUNDAY MORNING!!!!

Really? Really?

I challenge any of you to ring your estate agent, management company this coming Sunday morning.

Report back here how long it takes for them to get back to you.

superMarco

wexie wrote: »

The estate agent got back to OP after an hour and a half!!!! on a SUNDAY MORNING!!!!

Really? Really?

I challenge any of you to ring your estate agent, management company this coming Sunday.

Report back here how long it takes for them to get back to you.

Yes and because of this since after 1 hour I didn't got anything from him I made my decision because during this situation that you have to wait, after you tried to fix it by yourself during 2 hours, and you don't know if he's going to answer..

What would you do in my situation ?

djimi

D3PO wrote: »

are you arguing just for the sake of it ? You genuinely think no electricity for an hour and a half is too long a wait ? You think tenants should be able to unilaterally make decisions on repairs after 90 mins ?

give me a break I respect you opinion on here generally even if I disagree but even you cant seriously believe what you have typed

Im saying that where the electricity is out due to a fault, and there is a possiblity that it might be out for 24 hours or more until the agent/landlord bothers to answer their phone, then there might be case for the tenant to take matters into their own hands in order to get the issue resolved.

I did say that 90 minutes probably wasnt long enough to leave it, and its probable that this would go against the OP, but if their only point of contact is an agency who does not open weekends then how long do you expect them to wait? Do you think its okay to sit in the dark and cold for 24 hours before you even get to speak to someone about sorting the problem?

Thomas D

wexie wrote: »

The estate agent got back to OP after an hour and a half!!!! on a SUNDAY MORNING!!!!

Really? Really?

I challenge any of you to ring your estate agent, management company this coming Sunday morning.

Report back here how long it takes for them to get back to you.

So? They should have left the details of their own electricians or plumbers if they wanted to have some favourable rate deal.

Thomas D

D3PO wrote: »

another uneducated post from you. You really need to educate yourself before you speak.

That mod warning was for you btw.

wexie

superMarco wrote: »

What would you do in my situation ?

I'd have :

- switched off all the lights
- unplugged all the devices.
- reset the RCD switch
- Plug in devices one by one to see which one trips the RCD.
- realised it's the washer
- Ring LL, leave a message : there's something wrong with the washer, will you get someone to come round to have a look at it.

Then I would have gotten back to enjoying my Sunday........

The_Morrigan

Thomas D wrote: »

That mod warning was for you btw.

Leave the moderation to the forum mods.

Just to be clear - the mod warnings are for everyone

djimi

wexie wrote: »

I'd have :

- switched off all the lights
- unplugged all the devices.
- reset the RCD switch
- Plug in devices one by one to see which one trips the RCD.
- realised it's the washer
- Ring LL, leave a message : there's something wrong with the washer, will you get someone to come round to have a look at it.

Then I would have gotten back to enjoying my Sunday........

And how do you plan on doing all of that without electricity?

wexie

Thomas D wrote: »

So? They should have left the details of their own electricians or plumbers if they wanted to have some favourable rate deal.

they'd probably have gotten those details if they'd have waited the hour and a half.

Which is an entirely reasonable timeframe on a Sunday.

superMarco

Thomas D wrote: »

So? They should have left the details of their own electricians or plumbers if they wanted to have some favourable rate deal.

I asked for it before, but the agent didn't wanted to gave it to us, because he said : "Its not working like that".. Well. I'm ****ed then.

wexie wrote: »

I'd have :

- switched off all the lights
- unplugged all the devices.
- reset the RCD switch
- Plug in devices one by one to see which one trips the RCD.
- realised it's the washer
- Ring LL, leave a message : there's something wrong with the washer, will you get someone to come round to have a look at it.

Then I would have gotten back to enjoying my Sunday........

I wish I could, but to be honest I wasn't there, it was only my girlfriend (so I'm speaking for her). She's 1M60 for 40kg.. The fridge is like 2m high.. and pretty heavy, the washing machine and the dishwasher are appliance inside the kitchen (inside the closet under the counter). So to take it out, you need, tools, and some strong arms (I tried myself and its pretty hard..)

Thomas D

wexie wrote: »

they'd probably have gotten those details if they'd have waited the hour and a half.

Which is an entirely reasonable timeframe on a Sunday.

Ok so say he has serious plumbing emergency at 5am on a Saturday. What should he do then? Those numbers should be provided before and if they are not then it is perfectly acceptable to use a reputable tradesman and deduct the cost from the rent. Point proven. Shut the thread.

wexie

djimi wrote: »

And how do you plan on doing all of that without electricity?

huh?

there was electricity?

superMarco wrote: »

Anyway the electrician manage to put the electricity back on, but desactivate the washing machin.

the washing machine tripped the RCD?

it's not rocket surgery

D3PO

djimi wrote: »

And how do you plan on doing all of that without electricity?

with everything unplugged and checking the fuses weren't tripped the electricity would have been working.

then it would have been easy to figure out what was at fault by trying things one by one if you were so inclined to bother doing so.

Its not the tenants job to go figure it out per se but its also unreasonable to call an on call electrician after 90 mins.

people are also forgetting that the landlady has agreed to split the bill, this is more than reasonable given the OP's haphazard approach to the situation.

Thomas D

wexie wrote: »

huh?

there was electricity?



the washing machine tripped the RCD?

it's not rocket surgery

Not everyone knows this sort of stuff or has the tools and strength to deal with it.

The_Conductor

D3PO wrote: »

another uneducated post from you. You really need to educate yourself before you speak.

Please read the forum charter.
Specifically- if you disagree with what a poster posts- refute their post, without attacking the poster (or if appropriate- report the post and one of the moderators will deal with it). Snide comments such as your post (above) contribute nothing to a debate or discussion.

D3PO

Thomas D wrote: »

Ok so say he has serious plumbing emergency at 5am on a Saturday. What should he do then? Those numbers should be provided before and if they are not then it is perfectly acceptable to use a reputable tradesman and deduct the cost from the rent. Point proven. Shut the thread.

if they had a plumbing "emergency" at 5am switch off the water. and at a reasonable hour 9am ring the LL / agent and report the issue.

If no answer leave a message explaining the issue and the criticality.

If after a reasonable time frame you haven't had a response. and 90 mins is not reasonable try one final time advising that the issue is an emergency and as such if you get no response by insert timeframe that you will be calling a plumber yourself to see to the issue.

common sense really.

you don't go ringing landlords at 5am unless the place is on fire, the roof has fallen in or something else insanely critical

superMarco

I was asking for advice, I didn't mean to create a war... And I'm sorry if I what I did is that shocking oO

But thanks for your answers..

D3PO

Thomas D wrote: »

Not everyone knows this sort of stuff or has the tools and strength to deal with it.

not everybody knows how to flip a tripped fuse ?

What next they should call an electrician to change a bulb and then bill the landlady ......

when you move out of your parents your expected to know a certain level of things. they aren't rocket science, they are things that adults should know.

ignorance isn't an excuse.

Thomas D

D3PO wrote: »

if they had a plumbing "emergency" at 5am switch off the water. and at a reasonable hour 9am ring the LL / agent and report the issue.

If no answer leave a message explaining the issue and the criticality.

If after a reasonable time frame you haven't had a response. and 90 mins is not reasonable try one final time advising that the issue is an emergency and as such if you get no response by insert timeframe that you will be calling a plumber yourself to see to the issue.

common sense really.

you don't go ringing landlords at 5am unless the place is on fire, the roof has fallen in or something else insanely critical

I've no idea how to swtich off the water in a house. I doubt many of my renting friends would own a single tool between them.

wexie

Thomas D wrote: »

Not everyone knows this sort of stuff or has the tools and strength to deal with it.

hmmmm....while not everyone needs to be an electrician, if you're going to live in your own accommodation it probably wouldn't hurt if you understand how a fuse board works.

No tools required and it's hardly a Herculean feat to flick the RCD switch.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that's what OP should have done, he asked me what I would have done.

However I do think he should have waited longer than 90 minutes and I think the LL is being very accommodating paying half the bill.

GerardKeating

Thomas D wrote: »

Deduct the money from your rent. The PRTB will fully back you on this. The landlord is to blame by being uncontacable.

90 minute response on a sunday morning in not exactly "uncontactable".

ted1

srsly78 wrote: »

Is there not circuit breakers? One of the switches will be down, just flip it back up like the others. This is really basic stuff... Exactly the same as in France.

Is there only 1 big fuse on the board? That's the main fuse and it probably not the fault.

More than likely it was the RCD and needed to be reset

superMarco

wexie wrote: »

hmmmm....while not everyone needs to be an electrician, if you're going to live in your own accommodation it probably wouldn't hurt if you understand how a fuse board works.

No tools required and it's hardly a Herculean feat to flick the RCD switch.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that's what OP should have done, he asked me what I would have done.

However I do think he should have waited longer than 90 minutes and I think the LL is being very accommodating paying half the bill.

She did try to fix it with the fuse box. But nothing was working..