Business exporting classics and older high end cars

goochy

Does anyone think that you could make a living ( not a fortune) doing this ? Seems if u bought up a lot of cars like merc e class (w124) coupes / conv. Sl ( r129) a class - w126 jag xjs , xk8 Porsches etc you should be able to sell them to U.K. Dealers who are always looking to buy such vehicles ?? Obviously ex uk cars and cars with good service histories would be best . A uk dealer. Wouldn't be able to travel all over Ireland hoping that a car would be worth buying was thinking that u could set up a website aimed at the trade and contact dealers all over uk to make them aware of stk and honestly describe cars and build up trust with them that they can buy from you without seeing

Greenmachine

What's your experience in the trade. I suspect you will have trouble getting noticed in the UK with out doing what your aiming for without significant experience.

Bigus

Ex irish cars will have a stigma attached. So values might be soft.

Fundamentally the answer is yes , but volume and getting shot of the stuff and getting paid would be the key.

oceanman

plus you would have the tax man crawling all over you!

Bigus

oceanman wrote: »

plus you would have the tax man crawling all over you!

Whats wrong with that ? It's called business.

Capri

Nice thought in principle, but If anyone was going to do this it would be Matt Roche from this parish - he must have plenty of UK contacts but I've not heard of him or ANYONE snapping up stuff here. I've 2 big Mercs lying up and no sign of a sniff at either of them. There was a place in Lithuania/Latvia selling lots of Irish reg big stuff , and I myself have put my stuff up on the web in UK / Malta/ Cyprus / Canada and still no bites :(
Just have to wait until they're 30 years old here - if I live that long :eek:

Grimreaper666

Most of the good stuff's gone at this stage, especially the classic stuff. If you want to export modern stuff you'll need very clean cars with service history before the Brits would even look at it and also consider the revenue have a documentation fee of 500 Euros if you were thinking of trying to claim back some of the VRT. It all looks good on paper until you try and put it into motion but it doesn't work out as smoothly as you might like it to.

Capri

Grimreaper666 wrote: »

Most of the good stuff's gone at this stage, especially the classic stuff. If you want to export modern stuff you'll need very clean cars with service history before the Brits would even look at it and also consider the revenue have a documentation fee of 500 Euros if you were thinking of trying to claim back some of the VRT. It all looks good on paper until you try and put it into motion but it doesn't work out as smoothly as you might like it to.

the revenue have a documentation fee of 500 Euros :eek::eek: :mad::mad:

That's another fine idea gone up in smoke :rolleyes::rolleyes: :P

mattroche

Goochy, I hate to disillusion you, or knock anyones ideas, but I think it would give a very poor return for the amount of hassle that would be involved. There are a glut of classic & high end cars for sale in the U.K. at very small money. I have looked, when someone wanted to part exchange something, say 20/25 years old for one of my cars. I have found that it was not feasible. I.E. There is a 1995 W124 for sale @ £1250, O.N.O. (Dealer). A 1985 Mercedes 200TE,@ £ 1995, both currently on E. Bay. I has a similar 200 TE (1983 ) earlier this year & it made E 3750. If the cars are really good here, they will eventually make their money here. At present, there is very little selling, but as the economy improves, and people get their confidence back you will see buyer coming out of the woodwork.If very rare, advertise it on Car & Classic, E. Bay. or if is a Merc. in The Gazette, and let them come to you, and let them have the hassle of exporting it, bear in mind things are also picking up in the U.K. In the meantime. Good Luck with whatever you decide to do. In the meantime, I suggest you keep your day job.!!:D:D

Notch000

you might be better off looking at performance cars. Jap imports like scoobys Skylines, Evos etc im sure there plenty of really high end stiff here prices cheap where there are big markets for this stuff still abroad.

Bigus

Don't forget we Paddies buy thousands yes thousands of cars every week,in the uk,

So the logic is if there are no X Y or z high co2 models being sold to one of the UK's biggest export markets (Ireland)

this alone will have a knock down effect on uk prices, of that particular type of stuff so adding to this by repatriating the same type of high co2 stuff might be a double whammy,

unless you can find yokes that are in demand,further afield than uk for export out of Southampton , but all the Hiluxes are gone already

Do the Taliban like 5 series BMW s and Nissan Muranos :eek:

shawnee

Knew a guy who was buying the odd classic yoke in the UK and exporting what was required to a garage over there for sale. Range Rovers and the like , when transport and everyone was paid , he wasn't making a lot and don't think he is still doing it.:o

Capri

TOLD YOU Matt Roche (and others) would know the score :rolleyes:

Grimreaper666

I've honestly never seen things so bad here, nobody wants any of the older big stuff, 10 to 20 years old, due to the cost of the road tax and the NCT. It's a shame really because that generation of car will never make it to classic status. I reckon if they brought in a weekend tax on big older cars, where you could use them at weekends it would be a great boost to this sector and generate a lot of money for the state too.

Capri

Grimreaper666 wrote: »

I've honestly never seen things so bad here, nobody wants any of the older big stuff, 10 to 20 years old, due to the cost of the road tax and the NCT. It's a shame really because that generation of car will never make it to classic status. I reckon if they brought in a weekend tax on big older cars, where you could use them at weekends it would be a great boost to this sector and generate a lot of money for the state too.

This govt / Dept. of Enviroment is too stupid to think up/copy anything that works overseas. e,g, In the UK their DoE sells 'cherished numbers' for up to £5k a pop, Germany has a 6mth 'summer use' plate and classic plates, Singapore has weekend use plates, Canada has a 15 year classic limit etc etc.
Can you imagine if the govt introduced SENSIBLE road tax/insurance here, people would start getting older cars fixed up (= employment) and using them (= tax paid on fuel generated) but no, let's just decimate the market and force the potential tax payers to Australia / Canada etc

DUMB DUMB DUMB Govt. :mad::mad:

swarlb

Capri wrote: »

This govt / Dept. of Enviroment is too stupid to think up/copy anything that works overseas. e,g, In the UK their DoE sells 'cherished numbers' for up to £5k a pop, Germany has a 6mth 'summer use' plate and classic plates, Singapore has weekend use plates, Canada has a 15 year classic limit etc etc.
Can you imagine if the govt introduced SENSIBLE road tax/insurance here, people would start getting older cars fixed up (= employment) and using them (= tax paid on fuel generated) but no, let's just decimate the market and force the potential tax payers to Australia / Canada etc

DUMB DUMB DUMB Govt. :mad::mad:

There was a time when the was no such thing as a vintage tax rate. I doubt if the Govt of the time came up with the idea of introducing it. No Govt is ever going to do anything unless they are lobbied successfully.
The problem is also that we simply do not have the population base to sustain any of the ideas listed above.
If Birmingham was a stand alone country, do you honestly think any of your proposals listed above would work ?
I was at the Classic Car Show at the NEC last week in Birmingham, the success of the show is dependant on the whole population base of the UK and beyond. Take the other 55 million people out of the equation, and the NEC would never exist.
What we need to do in this country is to think differently. Take this as a daft idea, ring up China, let them build a few Military bases here, in return they give us protection and money, then the phrase 'You'll never beat the Irish' might actually mean something !!! The alternative, of course, is to wallow in self pity, misery and debt for the next few generations, and if you suggested he buy a 'personalised' plate, he'd have thought you were mad.

lomb

Irelands economy is red hot. The 12.5% tax rate scam generates an awesome amount of money/employment/business here. Sure the government waste it on socialist ideals/ pumping up an asset bubble they knew nothing about but it doesn't take away from the fact of the above.
Microsoft pump their entire European revenue through Ireland and the taxpayer gets 12.5% of software sold in distant France or Germany they have no real right to.
Wrt to the idea it wont work. To make money and make a lot of it you need to improve yourself and simplfy things. Theres too many people and problems involved that need to be solved for any gain. Used cars over 7-8 years old have very little inherent value either here or the UK unless high end classics.

swarlb

lomb wrote: »

Irelands economy is red hot. The 12.5% tax rate scam generates an awesome amount of money/employment/business here. Sure the government waste it on socialist ideals/ pumping up an asset bubble they knew nothing about but it doesn't take away from the fact of the above.
Microsoft pump their entire European revenue through Ireland and the taxpayer gets 12.5% of software sold in distant France or Germany they have no real right to.
Wrt to the idea it wont work. To make money and make a lot of it you need to improve yourself and simplfy things. Theres too many people and problems involved that need to be solved for any gain. Used cars over 7-8 years old have very little inherent value either here or the UK unless high end classics.

Thank you, at last a coherent statement. My business is car scrappage, there is little or no value in what people here (this forum) consider to be 'high end' or 'classics'.
At my house at present are an 01 BMW728, 03 MercE320, 04 Merc E270, 01 Merc E200, XJ8 Sport and an 01 CL500. All are driving, all in good condition, some even have a little tax and NCT, but they are of no value other than for parts. Even if the road tax was half of what it is, they would have no more value than they currently have. Even in the UK, where car tax rates are much less, the above models have no value.
In time they will be broken up various parts sold, the rest just for metal value.
Back in the 70's FF introduced a standard road tax of a fiver (I think) across the board. It lasted a few years. People didn't rush out and buy big cars with big engines, the market more or less stayed the same as it was, with of course the few exceptions. My father at the time I think, bought a 1.6 Cortina, as opposed to a 1.3. He was never going to buy anything bigger. Cheap tax was money in his pocket, he certainly was not going to waste it on extra fuel bills.

Mully_2011

Notch000 wrote: »

you might be better off looking at performance cars. Jap imports like scoobys Skylines, Evos etc im sure there plenty of really high end stiff here prices cheap where there are big markets for this stuff still abroad.

The good stuff has already being exported or is under lock and key.But since the Yen went up more people are importing again. I'm looking at bringing in a MKIV Supra next year myself.

lomb

swarlb wrote: »

Thank you, at last a coherent statement. My business is car scrappage, there is little or no value in what people here (this forum) consider to be 'high end' or 'classics'.
At my house at present are an 01 BMW728, 03 MercE320, 04 Merc E270, 01 Merc E200, XJ8 Sport and an 01 CL500. All are driving, all in good condition, some even have a little tax and NCT, but they are of no value other than for parts. Even if the road tax was half of what it is, they would have no more value than they currently have. Even in the UK, where car tax rates are much less, the above models have no value.
In time they will be broken up various parts sold, the rest just for metal value.
Back in the 70's FF introduced a standard road tax of a fiver (I think) across the board. It lasted a few years. People didn't rush out and buy big cars with big engines, the market more or less stayed the same as it was, with of course the few exceptions. My father at the time I think, bought a 1.6 Cortina, as opposed to a 1.3. He was never going to buy anything bigger. Cheap tax was money in his pocket, he certainly was not going to waste it on extra fuel bills.

There is alot of money in car scrappage. I scrapped my car in Burnley Lancashire a very poor place when picking up my new motor in the UK and saw an amazing operation with skip fulls of metal chippings. They must have been making millions. Thats a classic example of improving oneself and ones business operation and becoming very wealthy. Cars like old CL500s are real enthusiast metal but are worthless economically. I suppose us car nuts are lucky we can have a fleet full of motors say 4 for peanuts and even if we only tax each for 3 months at a time and transfer the insurance most of us can afford it if we wanted.

hi5

Has anyone looked into the storage of such cars for say 20 years....
You buy 20 cars for €3000 each, would these cars be worth say the equivalent of €15000 each allowing for inflation/maintenance in 20 years time?
So your €60000 now could be €300000 in 20 years time
If you bought an industrial unit now would the capital increase of the cars pay the mortgage over 20 years?
It might be worth doing the figures on;)

swarlb

hi5 wrote: »

Has anyone looked into the storage of such cars for say 20 years....
You buy 20 cars for €3000 each, would these cars be worth say the equivalent of €15000 each allowing for inflation/maintenance in 20 years time?
So your €60000 now could be €300000 in 20 years time
If you bought an industrial unit now would the capital increase of the cars pay the mortgage over 20 years?
It might be worth doing the figures on;)

They will still be worthless. We'll say a CL500 cost 90k in 2000, and its worth 1k now, in 20 years you wouldn't even get your storage costs back.
Buy a classic car magazine (not a 'retro' fanboy I love MK1 Golf magazine), and have a look at auction values of cars sold TODAY.
You'll find that the run of the mill cars from yesteryear do not command high values.
The reason people deal in 'high end' cars as potential investments, is because its an easy place to put your cash. And, most investors only bet on a sure thing, rather than, a what 'might be'.

swarlb

lomb wrote: »

There is alot of money in car scrappage. I scrapped my car in Burnley Lancashire a very poor place when picking up my new motor in the UK and saw an amazing operation with skip fulls of metal chippings. They must have been making millions. Thats a classic example of improving oneself and ones business operation and becoming very wealthy. Cars like old CL500s are real enthusiast metal but are worthless economically. I suppose us car nuts are lucky we can have a fleet full of motors say 4 for peanuts and even if we only tax each for 3 months at a time and transfer the insurance most of us can afford it if we wanted.

There is, but you need vast amounts of scrap metal to make 'millions'.

ei9go

Weekend plates, great idea in a country that can't / won't even enforce the learner driver regulations.

Ah Guard, sur I'm a hairdresser, my weekend is Sunday & Monday

lomb

swarlb wrote: »

There is, but you need vast amounts of scrap metal to make 'millions'.

Of course you do but any business that can make 300k a year in profit ex labour is worth 2 million which would be 'millions' to me.
I dont have such a beast yet but its not rocket science. An economists solution to an oil shortage with price increases is insert more straws into the earth to pull more oil out. A business mans solution to a 'money shortage' is something similar.

Capri

What I have at the moment will just stay in the yard until they or I croke - luckily I bought them at rock bottom prices compared to similar year/spec on sale then and got a lot of business use out of them so in theory they're financially 'written off' but my problem is that 'back in the day' I ALWAYS made money on motors - buy for €2k, clean up/service and move on for €3k.I see similar Mercs to mine on sale in far off lands for multiples of what they're worth here so I'm HOPING that some nice Nigerian will show up and start paying silly money for old Mercs :rolleyes::rolleyes: :P:P

Grimreaper666

Capri wrote: »

What I have at the moment will just stay in the yard until they or I croke - luckily I bought them at rock bottom prices compared to similar year/spec on sale then and got a lot of business use out of them so in theory they're financially 'written off' but my problem is that 'back in the day' I ALWAYS made money on motors - buy for €2k, clean up/service and move on for €3k.I see similar Mercs to mine on sale in far off lands for multiples of what they're worth here so I'm HOPING that some nice Nigerian will show up and start paying silly money for old Mercs :rolleyes::rolleyes: :P:P

The Nigerian market was our only hope but that seems to have dried up now too......:(.

Capri

UK 01 Saab Aero - 150mph for £695 :eek:

http://www.pistonheads.com/news/default.asp?storyId=28910

As someone else said - put them all in a big warehouse for 20 years , money in the bank :rolleyes: And we know where that 'money in the bank' got us when we did leave it there - up S**T creek :mad:

TBH, once I clear my stuff I'll not be going back to 'classics', I'll watch TV programmes, go to shows, maybe even rent one , but owning one - no way :rolleyes:


Here's a case in point - a Citroen H van

80 model €20k in Belgium http://www.autozone.be/occasion-ancetre/citroen-oldtimers-a-vendre?vehicleType=oldtimer&vehicleType=oldtimer&merkId=CIT&pStartOp=0

68 models €3500 in (France?) http://www.carandclassic.co.uk/car/C454169

67 Catering van €22k in Ireland http://www.buyandsell.ie/motors/classic-cars/dublin/classic1967-citroen-h-van-catering-van

Selection on Carandclassic http://www.carandclassic.co.uk/classic_cars.php?category=&make=15&region=&country=&era=&advert_type=&price=&keyword=hy&S.x=44&S.y=13

In all these ads there's huge variations in price /equipment.

Here's a French sale that'd be a good size for catering (no price tho' ??) http://www.anciennes.net/annonce/A32912-Ventes-Autres-Vehicules-CITROEN-HY-RALLONGE---1965.html?fk=1&ftype=&fcat=&cl=pri&search=citroen%20H
buy a catering trailer http://www.donedeal.ie/catering-for-sale/catering-trailer/6014515 and transfer all the fittings yourself ?

'Classic' + 'Business potential' -+the only way to make money from a classic ??