Bring back "Film Of The Week"

IvaBigWun

This worked very well during Karl's reign here and I cant remember why it was axed. It sometimes threw up great debate and brought films we wouldnt have otherwise heard about to light.

What say ye Mods?

IvaBigWun

Poll added

bennyineire

sounds good to me

johnny_ultimate

Nope. Nobody took part in the film of the month club we experimented with recently (there's still a sticky there) despite overwhelming interest in it. Enough people will not take the effort to watch the films.

And the reason it was shut down was because people were actually registering multiple accounts to skew results. Too much of a headache for little reward.

IvaBigWun

johnny_ultimate wrote: »

Nope. Nobody took part in the film of the month club we experimented with recently (there's still a sticky there) despite overwhelming interest in it. Enough people will not take the effort to watch the films.

And the reason it was shut down was because people were actually registering multiple accounts to skew results. Too much of a headache for little reward.

There's a great deal of film snobbery around these parts Johnny, very much so with your own almost art house tastes. This is the film forum on the largest online community in Ireland so "Film Of The Week/Month" should start off with an resounding, undisputed classic like, say, Goodfellas.

Not, like previously chosen, Heavenly Creatures and Let The Right One In. Neither film has the broad appeal that a Film Of The Week should have. Maybe they can be looked at as contenders in time but - to start - a FOTW thread should debate all time, acclaimed classics

e_e

IvaBigWun wrote: »

There's a great deal of film snobbery around these parts Johnny, very much so with your own almost art house tastes.

e_e

Let the Right One In did well financially though and is clearly loved by most audiences. Kind of a bad example. Brushing good and interesting films aside as "art house, film snob stuff" is arguably just as snobby in my humble opinion.

I think if you're posting on a film board looking for recommendations I'd wager you've seen most classics anyway. I'd rather participate in a film of the week that gives some real lesser known gems a look. "Crowd-pleasing" be damned.

Sad Professor

I never recall it working well. The voting was very popular, but the discussion never amount to much. Karl tried different versions of it designed to avoid the selection of undisputed classics that nobody had anything interesting or controversial to say about and they all failed one way or the other. We tried it again with the Monthly Discussion Club and none of the threads made it beyond a page.

You are right that the film probably has to be an popular classic to avoid the lack of participation Film of the Month suffered from. But what is there to discuss or debate about films like Goodfellas, Die Hard, Memento, etc, that can't be discussed in a regular thread started by yourself or anyone else?

pixelburp

IvaBigWun wrote: »

There's a great deal of film snobbery around these parts Johnny, very much so with your own almost art house tastes. This is the film forum on the largest online community in Ireland so "Film Of The Week/Month" should start off with an resounding, undisputed classic like, say, Goodfellas.

Not, like previously chosen, Heavenly Creatures and Let The Right One In. Neither film has the broad appeal that a Film Of The Week should have. Maybe they can be looked at as contenders in time but - to start - a FOTW thread should debate all time, acclaimed classics

Have you seen either films? Neither are particularly 'art house', and considering one was made by one of the more populist, crowd-pleasing directors out there, 'snobbery' can hardly apply.

As Johnny U. already mentioned, there was a perfectly good Film Club thread started that sputtered along before dying a death. Now, I openly admit to being one of those who championed the idea, only to fail in matching the enthusiastic theory with practice. Sorry Johnny Film of the Week would likely go the same way all things being equal.

As for the 'snobbery' claim, that's just plainly ludicrous. Everyone here has different tastes and viewpoints about what constitutes a great movie, and I don't believe this forum has tried to stymie debate or oppress opinions on films, whether they be populist or obscure (not in my time here anyway). If anything, it's the General Releases that get the vast majority of debate around here, not the limited independent fare. And honestly? Throwing out comments about snobbery & the generalising about an apparent 'ivory tower' clique is just reverse-snobbery really

Besides, the whole point of a film club imo (or any club of its ilk) is to promote films that perhaps the general public mightn't have otherwise seen the first time around, be it due to lack of wide release or just disinterest from the public. I'm not against a Film of the Week, but would much rather see it try and introduce some unique, interesting pieces that people mightn't know about, than classics everyone and their mother has seen by now

bennyineire

MM well I for one propose we give it a go and see what happens, the way I see it we only need about 10 hardcore peps to get it going, I propose the Godfather III , only because I downloaded the series about 5 years ago and watched the first 2 and loved them but I never got round to viewing the 3rd one, and yes I know the reviews are bad for it but still it can't be all the bad, can it?

krudler

One film a week would be better than one a month, don't see anything wrong with revisiting classic/favourite movies either, there's plenty of decent discussion to be had with movies that are well known

Goldstein

I watched and enjoyed the film of the month choices but didn't have much to contribute beyond the analysis that had already been laid down.

It's a difficult balancing act to choose films that a) are interesting and rewarding, b) don't alienate people by being too challenging or difficult to watch, c) are easily accessible/obtainable and d) haven't been seen and talked about at length by almost everybody already. It's a tricky thing to keep up without losing people along the way.

I can only speak for myself here but I'm guilty far too often of being lazy and watching too many "easy" Hollywood movies and not enough genuinely interesting/foreign ones despite the near certainty that any from the latter category that I've got lined up to watch will be far better, more rewarding and memorable than the latest action/comic book/blockbuster film from Tinseltown. We all need to be jolted out of our film ruts from time to time and the knowledge that others participating are watching the same film can be enough to convince you to press play on that one you'd been putting off for a while.

Oh and don't confuse snobbery with passion.

krudler

Goldstein wrote: »

I watched and enjoyed the film of the month choices but didn't have much to contribute beyond the analysis that had already been laid down.

It's a difficult balancing act to choose films that a) are interesting and rewarding, b) don't alienate people by being too challenging or difficult to watch, c) are easily accessible/obtainable and d) haven't been seen and talked about at length by almost everybody already. It's a tricky thing to keep up without losing people along the way.

I can only speak for myself here but I'm guilty far too often of being lazy and watching too many "easy" Hollywood movies and not enough genuinely interesting/foreign ones despite the near certainty that any from the latter category that I've got lined up to watch will be far better, more rewarding and memorable than the latest action/comic book/blockbuster film from Tinseltown. We all need to be jolted out of our film ruts from time to time and the knowledge that others participating are watching the same film can be enough to convince you to press play on that one you'd been putting off for a while.

Oh and don't confuse snobbery with passion.

That, I have The Act of Killing and a few things on Netflix I keep meaning to watch, but knowing me I'll throw on something I've seen a half dozen or more times over the weekend instead. why not do both? a classic film of the week and something relatively new, classic one can't be anything in the last 5 years.

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar

no reason why someone couldnt just make a thread and if you dont like it.. don't post in it

wouldn't contribute much myself as I rarely have more to say than pointing out which actresses I would or would not have sex with

e_e

So... Satantango anyone?

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar

e_e wrote: »

So... Satantango anyone?

just to be contrary, I am going to watch this....

e_e

Once you settle into its deliberate rhythms it's an amazing film tbh.

Plus you can treat it like a visual novel as it's split into chapters.

The last few times people have brought up the resurrection of Film of the Week I've said the something as I'll say now. If you want to start discussion about a film then go right ahead and start a thread about the film in question. Absolutely nothing stopping anyone from doing so and if you can find an interesting film the discussion will take care of itself.

johnny_ultimate

I have emphasised countless times that people should start their own threads on films of interest. No offense intended OP, but you've started 3 threads in films - one of which is this one, and another one which was 7 years ago. I'd very much welcome your more regular input if you have films you want to talk about, and the same goes for anyone else (unless they're a troll, in which case boo). There's absolutely nothing stopping someone starting a thread about their favourite films or ones of interest - it's actively encouraged (there's even a note about it on the top of the 'what have you watched recently' thread!). If more people were doing it, and the discussion was robust and consistent, I'd be happy to consider a more formal equivalent. At the moment, I just don't see the use, and that's backed up by experience.

I've been around long enough to have seen film of the week in all the incarnations it took, as well as attempts to kick start similar ideas. It takes a lot of effort to provoke discussions on the well-known classics beyond 'great shout!' and 'brilliant film' type comments. Then, once the pool of popular classics is exhausted - and an awful lot of them, including Goodfellas, were covered in the initial pool of FotW choices, so I'd question the need to start over and just flag the same films again - people start choosing more offbeat titles and personal favourites. That's where I see the real value in these 'films of the week/month' ideas, but the unfortunate reality is they attract even less discussion. It's a vicious cycle, and initial enthusiasm for such formal, regular threads inevitably wane sooner rather than later. If Let The Right One In and Heavenly Creatures - films specifically chosen because they were very much breakthrough, accessible and widely available films - are considered 'too arthouse' or without broad appeal, then that decline is going to start very soon indeed.

Myself and other mods past and current (alongside the regular posters) have really worked to make this forum a place that's welcoming for newcomers and veterans alike, those who want to discuss everything from the latest superhero film to six and a half hour long Bela Tarr films (and, joking aside, Satantango is an astonishing experience I'd recommend to anyone). Start your own threads or even just add your thoughts in existing ones - there's a wonderful pool of intelligent, interesting posters here, from world cinema enthusiasts to those who have genuinely great, down-to-earth insights on the latest blockbusters. It's unfair to dismiss them as 'snobs' (what a cursed word) - they're smart, knowledgeable and enthusiastic, and if they're outspoken from time to time that's the way it should be (what's a real film fan without some passionate opinions?). They don't need dedicated 'films of the week' to post, so why complicate it? The 'new thread' button couldn't be any more welcoming.

IvaBigWun

IvaBigWun wrote: »

This worked very well during Karl's reign here and I cant remember why it was axed. It sometimes threw up great debate and brought films we wouldnt have otherwise heard about to light.

What say ye Mods?

Just to add, it it worked so well why did you never engage in any of the Film of the Week threads. In fact, looking through your post history here and the only time you even posted in a film of the week thread or overall discussion of it was this rather engaging one.

Mickeroo

Deleted User wrote: »

Just to add, it it worked so well why did you never engage in any of the Film of the Week threads. In fact, looking through your post history here and the only time you even posted in a film of the week thread or overall discussion of it was this rather engaging one.

To be fair, maybe they just enjoyed reading them?

Mickeroo

Mickeroo wrote: »

To be fair, maybe they just enjoyed reading them?

There is that aspect, but if you're not going to engage in the discussion then you can't really expect others to do so and keep you entertained.

pixelburp

In fairness, Darko and Johnny Ultimate have hit upon the straightforward reality here; if you feel moved about a movie, no matter how New, Old or Atari Jaguar it is, just start a new thread and if there's discussion to be had it'll naturally take its course. Simples! I still wouldn't think there's much value in starting threads about (for instance) The Godfather or other seminal classics, given how well-debated they are, but I would definitely like to see more in-depth discussion threads beyond the New Release ones that form the majority of the Film forum...

opr

Saying you can just start a thread about a particular film if you want to discuss something is somewhat missing the point of the idea around these things. I've no doubt though that ultimately Johnny is right in that it would peter out without much interest once started.

Opr

opr

opr wrote: »

Saying you can just start a thread about a particular film if you want to discuss something is somewhat missing the point of the idea around these things. I've no doubt though that ultimately Johnny is right in that it would peter out without much interest once started.

Opr

People always want to be involved but when the time comes it's only the same handful of people who actually participate. Remember the idea to do a competition where people wrote an article based on cinema, dozens of people expressed interest but when the time only 11 or 12 people actually did anything for it. It's all well and good saying you want to see it return but if the discussion isn't going to go beyond a single page, what's the point? Especially when most people simply want to nominate the same old films. Look back through the list of film of the week and the more obscure and less Hollywood a title, the less interest.

losthorizon

Re film of the week. Many of the films chosen you would have to go out and buy or have in your film collection. To make it work how about choosing films that are going to be on TV at a fairly accessible hour and on fairly accessible channels giving more people the chance to see them?

So I would exclude Sky Movies.

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar

em

i know we're not really allowed talk about it
but..

yo ho ho and a bottle of rum?

let's not pretend it doesn't happen...

Fysh

re: yo ho ho etc. That has always been an easy (though naughty!) option, but has never made any difference in terms of getting people actually watching films that required some level of effort to watch and analyse.

Which is understandable - I'm as guilty of it as anyone, I've a list as long as my arm of foreign films I have bought on DVD but haven't watched yet because they're heavy going/ require more effort than I can muster on a weekday after along day at work Nonetheless that means that discussion about films we've all seen already and discussed/thought about at length will be dull. I'm not sure there's a point in rehashing the same old conversations under the guise of "Film Of The Week" - at that point you may as well have a weekly "RTE2 or Film4 Friday@9 Film" thread. (Though in saying that, if TG4 are still doing what they used to do, their late night selections would probably be good food for thought...)

johnny_ultimate

losthorizon wrote: »

Re film of the week. Many of the films chosen you would have to go out and buy or have in your film collection. To make it work how about choosing films that are going to be on TV at a fairly accessible hour and on fairly accessible channels giving more people the chance to see them?

So I would exclude Sky Movies.

Again, great in theory. In fact, we went out of our way with the two trial 'film of the month' threads to try and ensure the films were widely accessible either through Netflix, TV or other readily available means (if I recall correctly, I had to veto some of Fysh's initial choices for the first month because they were well-known but hard to get one's hands on). If you check the film of the month thread stickied (should probably remove that soon ) there's a comment pointing out:

Thanks to bnt in the TV Recommendation thread for pointing out that Heavenly Creatures is on TG4 tonight for anyone looking to watch it!

It's the final post of the thread.

Bipolar Joe

I'm a selfish bastard and used threads like that to find a new movie to watch. I might have had a thing or two to say, but someone else would have said it better before I get the chance.

And, also, not to sound like an asshole, but some of you dudes can get pretty fucking intense. This has nothing to do with snobbery, but at times it can feel like being the stupid one in your school group-project. "Lars von Trier's prolific use of transcendence in his characters is intriguing, beguiling almost, when one takes into account his use of colour." "Ah, yes, but it all becomes much clearer when one appreciates his almost as prolific use of hypnosis." "I really fucking love Steve Buscemi, you guys." I think some of the reason might be that people are intimidated or feel like a dumb ass. I'm extremely confident I'm not alone in this.

Fysh

Bipolar Joe wrote: »

And, also, not to sound like an asshole, but some of you dudes can get pretty fucking intense. This has nothing to do with snobbery, but at times it can feel like being the stupid one in your school group-project. "Lars von Trier's prolific use of transcendence in his characters is intriguing, beguiling almost, when one takes into account his use of colour." "Ah, yes, but it all becomes much clearer when one appreciates his almost as prolific use of hypnosis." "I really fucking love Steve Buscemi, you guys." I think some of the reason might be that people are intimidated or feel like a dumb ass. I'm extremely confident I'm not alone in this.

Well, intense is going to be par for the course at least some of the time anywhere on the internet But in a film discussion forum that caters to a wide audience, it's to be expected that at least some of the time some people want to delve deeply.

What would you suggest as an alternative? In the same way that people can be alienated by what sounds like extremely detailed/up-your-own-hole analysis (choose your terms here, I'm certain that I sometimes sound like I've disappeared up my own arse when raving about films I particularly like), others can be put off by discussion that never goes beyond "Yeah it was deadly, that bit with the thing was brilliant".

Ideally we want a way of striking a balance between the two extremes, but since we have already established that having FotW threads for the classic films is pointless (because everyone has seen and discussed them), how would we reliably choose films that are available, accessible and yet worth discussing at any length?

losthorizon

Bipolar Joe wrote: »

I'm a selfish bastard and used threads like that to find a new movie to watch. I might have had a thing or two to say, but someone else would have said it better before I get the chance.

And, also, not to sound like an asshole, but some of you dudes can get pretty fucking intense. This has nothing to do with snobbery, but at times it can feel like being the stupid one in your school group-project. "Lars von Trier's prolific use of transcendence in his characters is intriguing, beguiling almost, when one takes into account his use of colour." "Ah, yes, but it all becomes much clearer when one appreciates his almost as prolific use of hypnosis." "I really fucking love Steve Buscemi, you guys." I think some of the reason might be that people are intimidated or feel like a dumb ass. I'm extremely confident I'm not alone in this.

Well, if you can put a post together like that Bipolar Joe I'm the one who feels like a Dumb ass.

Bipolar Joe

Fysh wrote: »

Well, intense is going to be par for the course at least some of the time anywhere on the internet But in a film discussion forum that caters to a wide audience, it's to be expected that at least some of the time some people want to delve deeply.

What would you suggest as an alternative? In the same way that people can be alienated by what sounds like extremely detailed/up-your-own-hole analysis (choose your terms here, I'm certain that I sometimes sound like I've disappeared up my own arse when raving about films I particularly like), others can be put off by discussion that never goes beyond "Yeah it was deadly, that bit with the thing was brilliant".

Ideally we want a way of striking a balance between the two extremes, but since we have already established that having FotW threads for the classic films is pointless (because everyone has seen and discussed them), how would we reliably choose films that are available, accessible and yet worth discussing at any length?

I'm neither for nor against FotW/M, to be honest, beyond just finding out about films that slipped me by. I'm not fussed that people can be intimidating, really, that's how some people be, and the concept of being up ones own arse is really down to how other people perceive the behaviour. You can mostly see what I'm talking about in the thread for Upstream Colour. Some people loved it, some people thought it was crap and seemed to get angry at the first group for being "Pretentious." If there's going to be a balance, at all, there would need to be two groups, one for the "Artsy-fartsy hipster bullshit" and the other for "Braindead rubbish for idiots."

e_e

Bipolar Joe wrote: »

Some people loved it, some people thought it was crap and seemed to get angry at the first group for being "Pretentious."

This is one of my major pet peeves with online discussion. People can't seem to form a coherent opinion without accusing those with a differing viewpoint of all sorts. Like I was one of the few people defending Only God Forgives in a thread here and instead of getting counter arguments all I got was "yeah you're talking rubbish, completely making this stuff up". People are way too flippant and condescending about movies that don't work on them or are trying something different, it's very frustrating.