Season 4, Episode 6 - Live Bait [AMC] [Spoilers]

wonderfullife

Paddy Cow wrote: »

The woman's voice at the beginning, was that Carol? The whole episode I kept expecting the family to get killed and the Govoner to end up with Carol telling his story.

defo sounded like Carol to me.

5starpool

Paddy Cow wrote: »

The woman's voice at the beginning, was that Carol? The whole episode I kept expecting the family to get killed and the Govoner to end up with Carol telling his story.

Where at the beginning? I just rewatched the first couple of minutes and no womans voice.

Flippyfloppy

Paddy Cow wrote: »

The woman's voice at the beginning, was that Carol? The whole episode I kept expecting the family to get killed and the Govoner to end up with Carol telling his story.

I agree!

Jason Todd

To me, it sounded like two women talking, and one of them definitely sounded like Carol.

Keyzer

Scraggs wrote: »

Not copping you need to shoot/stab walkers in the head and surviving 18 months(ish) really bothered me. Also only a minor thing but the so called nurse blowing on an open wound really grated! I'm surprised they left the where they were holed up it seemed OK and relatively safe although it wouldn't have made an interesting story I guess.

There was lots of really poor writing in this episode:

1. End of the world zombie apocalypse and you sleep outdoors in a tent ???

2. Banging a practical stranger you met five minutes previously in the back of a truck with your sister and daughter,who is terrified of him because he's just smashed your Da's face in with an oxygen tank, right beside you ???

3. Said new friends not knowing that you need to kill the brain after all this time ???

4. Leaving the apartment - why, why, why ???

5. The Governor's just had this massive personality transplant and is no longer a psycho ???

6. You've been on the road for weeks and months, you're knackered and starving, almost dead. You meet a group just at the last minute who take you in and give you a meal. And because you've realised the error of your ways and are punishing yourself, you throw the meal out the window ???

It was a 5/10 episode for me. I don't get why people are raving about it. The acting and writing were poor. The two girls he met couldn't act to save their lives. It was pretty boring too.

I really like the show, I want to see it succeed but the writers needs a kick in the arse. The above points could have been avoided by having someone on the writing team asking every now and then "Would that really happen? Is this plausible in this universe???".

I get the feeling they are getting over confident with the success of the show and standards are dropping.

Keyzer

Jason Todd wrote: »

To me, it sounded like two women talking, and one of them definitely sounded like Carol.

It was the kid talking to the Governor. Doesn't sound anything like Carol.

Jason Todd

Keyzer wrote: »

It was the kid talking to the Governor. Doesn't sound anything like Carol.

I haven't watched it back, so wasn't to know there was a chance it could be a kid talking. But I'm not alone in thinking it was Carol.

Paddy Cow wrote: »

The woman's voice at the beginning, was that Carol?

wonderfullife wrote: »

defo sounded like Carol to me.

Flippyfloppy wrote: »

I agree!

Nalz

Keyzer wrote: »

There was lots of really poor writing in this episode:

1. End of the world zombie apocalypse and you sleep outdoors in a tent ???

2. Banging a practical stranger you met five minutes previously in the back of a truck with your sister and daughter,who is terrified of him because he's just smashed your Da's face in with an oxygen tank, right beside you ???

3. Said new friends not knowing that you need to kill the brain after all this time ???

4. Leaving the apartment - why, why, why ???

5. The Governor's just had this massive personality transplant and is no longer a psycho ???

6. You've been on the road for weeks and months, you're knackered and starving, almost dead. You meet a group just at the last minute who take you in and give you a meal. And because you've realised the error of your ways and are punishing yourself, you throw the meal out the window ???

It was a 5/10 episode for me. I don't get why people are raving about it. The acting and writing were poor. The two girls he met couldn't act to save their lives. It was pretty boring too.

I really like the show, I want to see it succeed but the writers needs a kick in the arse. The above points could have been avoided by having someone on the writing team asking every now and then "Would that really happen? Is this plausible in this universe???".

I get the feeling they are getting over confident with the success of the show and standards are dropping.

this ^

yawn fest

4/10 for me

ps how could it be Carol when she acted like she didnt know him and called them monsters not walkers???

username123

Trilla wrote: »

ps how could it be Carol when she acted like she didnt know him and called them monsters not walkers???

Did Carol ever meet the Guv? I think she stayed back minding the baby and didnt meet him.

Keyzer

Jason Todd wrote: »

I haven't watched it back, so wasn't to know there was a chance it could be a kid talking. But I'm not alone in thinking it was Carol.

You need to listen harder, it sounded like a child (the kid we would later be introduced to) talking to a man (who I immediately knew as the Governor)...

Why on earth would Carol have a conversation with the Governor? She knows what he's like, knows he's a former nutbar and knows he attacked the prison.

Wait a minute... are you guys writers for TWD??? :P:P:P

maximoose

Keyzer wrote: »

Why on earth would Carol have a conversation with the Governor? She knows what he's like, knows he's a former nutbar and knows he attacked the prison.

She never met him, doesn't know what he looks like

(but yeah, I don't think that was her in the voiceover at the start)

Grimebox

Jason Todd wrote: »

I haven't watched it back, so wasn't to know there was a chance it could be a kid talking. But I'm not alone in thinking it was Carol.

I thought that for a second too but it makes no sense so I dismissed it. He is talking to the people he is about to meet. I suppose the writers wanted to show the passage of time but it didn't really makes sense. So the voice over at the start occurs over half-way through the episode

Keyzer

maximoose wrote: »

She never met him, doesn't know what he looks like

(but yeah, I don't think that was her in the voiceover at the start)

Regardless if she met him, she'd know him a mile away from the descriptions of the people who did meet him. The eye patch alone would have her running a mile from him...

Cork boy 55

Keyzer wrote: »

There was lots of really poor writing in this episode:

1. End of the world zombie apocalypse and you sleep outdoors in a tent ???

2. Banging a practical stranger you met five minutes previously in the back of a truck with your sister and daughter,who is terrified of him because he's just smashed your Da's face in with an oxygen tank, right beside you ???

3. Said new friends not knowing that you need to kill the brain after all this time ???

4. Leaving the apartment - why, why, why ???

5. The Governor's just had this massive personality transplant and is no longer a psycho ???

6. You've been on the road for weeks and months, you're knackered and starving, almost dead. You meet a group just at the last minute who take you in and give you a meal. And because you've realised the error of your ways and are punishing yourself, you throw the meal out the window ???

(1)
It was in a rural area with open ground on all sides and they had a man on watch and where heavily armed
That said I don't know why they could not just have found a house.
The scene was to show the gov was suicidal and lost it completely in order to get M + S to desert.


(2)
It was not five minutes , Days had passed during which he had done many good deeds fro them and bonded with them , The others where asleep
She had not got laid a year and its the end of the world.

(3)
They where hunkered down in that block with there truck full of processed goods since beginning its plausible they did acquire this knowledge.
The Prisoners in the prison did not know this and Darly had to remind the Dale group of this in season 1 episode 3
I believe they are being setup as useless and "dead weight" to cause conflict in next episodes

(4)
He was leaving and they insisted on going with him.
he was leaving and Lilly said he's stuck with them
As for why they didn't stay there, I personally don't think they could. I got the impression that the reason they were safe and hadn't gotten overrun by walkers was because they pretty much just stayed put and hunkered down. They didn't need to look for food because of the truck. But now the food was running out. Their ability to stay in the apartment and not venture out looking for supplies is what kept them safe.
They had to go sooner or later and now they had found someone who knew
how to fight and they felt was a goodie.
The apartment was not very defensible and they had very limited ammo. TG knew they could not stay there indefinitely; they need to find a place to fortify and start growing crops to feed themselves.
also they were staying there because of their old father the guy had cancer and was not able to move

(5)
From another forum
No The TG didn't do a 180. EVERYTHING he is stems from his desire to protect his family. He kept What used to be Penny because he was in denial at her status, but even then, he knew she wasn't coming back on some level. The scene where he was brushing her hair and she refused to acknowledge him. "Look at me!!!!" The cracks were there, they couldn't help but be there and working from within his mind to screw him up.
He was becoming the person that could have kept Penny alive. The man who would do anything it took to keep her safe. Sure he got addicted to the power, fought to keep it, but only an alpha dog would have been able to keep her alive. Phillip couldn't have saved her. Only TG could have. Anything that could help Woodbury was one thing that could have helped her. Anything that posed a potential threat to Woodbury, could have been a threat to her. All he had to do was hold out and Milton, or someone like Milton, would give the answer to wake her and him up from the nightmare.
We know that didn't happen. Michonne 'killed' her. His link to Phillip was gone. All that was left was The Governor. So now... we have this person that Phillip grew into to protect Penny turn all that love, and all that denial into rage. We saw Rick go nuts after Lori died. Psychologically, TG went through the same. He didn't plan to kill his towns people. All he knew was that these people weren't doing what was right for Penny. They were letting her killers go free.
He utterly snapped, and when he was abandoned he wandered around. He found this girl to whom he bounded, and we all saw him trying desperately not to let ANYONE in. He sees her as a new Penny. He doesn't want to be TG or Phillip. That's why he took that name he saw written on the wall. (Nice Nod to the Comics!!!) TG is not the way he is because he's not a decent human being. He became TG BECAUSE he's a decent human being. It's the good intentions he paved his way to hell too.
Martinez is going to black mail him. "I'm the top dog here. You want your secret kept, you do what I say." I think Phillip is going to be okay with that, but when something happens to Megan (Penny 2.0) TG is going to be pulled out to save or avenge her.

(6)
He was not starving, just tired and suicidal he eat a can of food he had afterwards. The Governor felt like he didn't deserve anything from those people. That's also why he turned down the supplies Lilly tried to offer him.
On talking dead he said he didn't want to feel that he owed them anything.

Keyzer

@Cork boy 55

I'm not going to quote your entire post as it was long enough but you're going out on a limb on some of those replies.

Can you honestly say the writing of that episode was on par with other episodes?

Paddy Cow

Keyzer wrote: »

Regardless if she met him, she'd know him a mile away from the descriptions of the people who did meet him. The eye patch alone would have her running a mile from him...

Is she met him and recognised him, he wouldn't know who she was. Maybe she wanted to get close to him to kill him so that she could redeem herself and get back into the prison.

wonderfullife

Keyzer wrote: »

There was lots of really poor writing in this episode:

1. End of the world zombie apocalypse and you sleep outdoors in a tent ???

2. Banging a practical stranger you met five minutes previously in the back of a truck with your sister and daughter,who is terrified of him because he's just smashed your Da's face in with an oxygen tank, right beside you ???

3. Said new friends not knowing that you need to kill the brain after all this time ???

4. Leaving the apartment - why, why, why ???

5. The Governor's just had this massive personality transplant and is no longer a psycho ???

6. You've been on the road for weeks and months, you're knackered and starving, almost dead. You meet a group just at the last minute who take you in and give you a meal. And because you've realised the error of your ways and are punishing yourself, you throw the meal out the window ???

It was a 5/10 episode for me. I don't get why people are raving about it. The acting and writing were poor. The two girls he met couldn't act to save their lives. It was pretty boring too.

I really like the show, I want to see it succeed but the writers needs a kick in the arse. The above points could have been avoided by having someone on the writing team asking every now and then "Would that really happen? Is this plausible in this universe???".

I get the feeling they are getting over confident with the success of the show and standards are dropping.

1. End of the world zombie apocalypse!! you've no problem with that happening but do have a problem with the tent?

On a serious note, if we're going to do a list of illogical things the characters have done since day 1 it'd be a long, long list. Plus,the Irish girl was sleeping in a tent too and she was suicidal/bonkers also at the time. Maybe there's a trend.

2. What did you want them to do? Go out and have danger sex in front of the Walkers?! I'd have tapped that the exact same way as the Gov did, regardless who was around!

3. There was hardly a bulletin on the news or radio saying "shoot them in the head". Speaking of which that adds another illogical thing to the list - all those people still alive in the country and nobody was able to print up a newspaper or posters or put out a radio message giving advice? I try not to think about it.

4. Gov was leaving, they wanted to come. Seems simple.

5. He was always a psycho (and still is). But like many real life psychos they don't spend 24/7 being psychotic. Some of the most messed up people in history were described as charming, affable,friendly, loving by people who knew them!! When we were first introduced to the Governor he was this outwardly nice guy. He still has the nice guy part to his personality.

But he's still a psycho too. Possible to be both. Shane demonstrated that pretty well too. He was intrinsically a decent fella but also slightly nuts/evil at times.

6. yeah that was silly. as was the fake beard. But hey, who knows.


I really don't think the writing was more sloppy than most episodes or seasons.

If it's illogical character behaviour you have an issue with, i'm amazed you've got to season 4 as there's simply oodles of examples of it. Lori!!! Andrea!! Those 2 alone performed an insane amount of flip-flops.

LOSTfan57

Some comments here do sometimes really make me wonder if we are all watching the same show...seriously

Hank Scorpio

Would anyone sleep in a tent in a zombie apocalypse, surrounded by a huge open field, after firing a gun shot which attracts them from miles away, in the the pitch dark, having a fire(light) burning? All the while they had a massive truck which would be very safe to sleep in, just throwing that out there....

Two episodes ago, the two young kids miraculousy appear after the walker comes out to greet Rick and Carol all the while they've been hiding out there, again, great writing

David Boyd did a great job for episode 5, wish he would direct more. I might be missing something in the above two examples so If I am i`ll hold my hands up , but to me its lazy writing

Flippyfloppy

Keyzer wrote: »

You need to listen harder, it sounded like a child (the kid we would later be introduced to) talking to a man (who I immediately knew as the Governor)...

Why on earth would Carol have a conversation with the Governor? She knows what he's like, knows he's a former nutbar and knows he attacked the prison.

Wait a minute... are you guys writers for TWD??? :P:P:P

For the record, I was just pointing out that at the time, yes , I did think it sounded like carol. I think all posters were just noting they had the same thoughts ; not the same as actually thinking now, after that episode, that he was talking to carol

John_D80

Is it bad that based on this episode and the episode 7 preview I would happily watch a full series of The Governor?? Loved it. Go Brian/Philip/Governor!!

Yamanoto

I liked this one quite a bit (though I think the show has been incredibly shoddy post-pilot overall).

For me, this episode contained more moments of palpable tension than any number of flu's, fence breaches or attacks by roaming bands of n'er do wells has delivered. T'was also nice to see David Morrisey not having to carve his way through the numbingly inane 'bad guy' dialogue he's had to endure heretofore. Could've done without the slow-mo pans of the Guv looking moody outside various settings, but when it comes to TWD, corny tends to be an unwelcome yet constant companion.

McSasquatch

So I take it this episode happened before the flu epidemic in the prison?

5starpool

McSasquatch wrote: »

So I take it this episode happened before the flu epidemic in the prison?

Yes, in the immediate aftermath of the end of last season.

username123

McSasquatch wrote: »

So I take it this episode happened before the flu epidemic in the prison?

The start of it is certainly in the immediate aftermath of the end of the last season, but judging by the Guvs impressive fake beard, a number of months passed before he came across the family. Im not sure how much time has passed in the prison since the end of the last season.

I would like if we had a better picture of time scales in TWD actually.

I saw an article somewhere on the internet where a guy mathematically proved that all the walkers would be put down by now given the time that has passed and the average number of walkers put down per survivor per month.

Ill look for the link.

Edit - here it is:
http://www.buzzfeed.com/daves4/heres-why-the-walking-dead-doesnt-make-any-damn-sense

Hyzepher

At the end of ep 6 did we not see him at the prison. it seems that whatever happens in the next few episodes it will all have happened in the past up to the point that he gets to the prison and the timelines merge.

McSasquatch

Hyzepher wrote: »

At the end of ep 6 did we not see him at the prison. it seems that whatever happens in the next few episodes it will all have happened in the past up to the point that he gets to the prison and the timelines merge.

That's what I was thinking. I also assumed it was our cycloptic friend who was feeding rats to the zombies at the prison fence.

username123

McSasquatch wrote: »

That's what I was thinking. I also assumed it was our cycloptic friend who was feeding rats to the zombies at the prison fence.

Were the rats not being fed from the inside and was it not one of the young girls who still saw the walkers as people who was doing that?

McSasquatch

username123 wrote: »

Were the rats not being fed from the inside and was it not one of the young girls who still saw the walkers as people who was doing that?

Ha, maybe it was - I never noticed their hand.

LOSTfan57

Rat feeder has not yet been actually revealed