0 to marathon

Qumoqq

How's it going. A buddy has talked me into doing the cork city marathon next year for charity.
I have absolutely no running history. I started, with a 3.5 km run that wrecked me for days.
I was gobsmacked as I do quite a bit of mountain biking.
I'm upto 5km in 24 min, and can do that every day. First 5km took me 33 mins. just wondering where I go from here as I've no training programme as such.

Any advise regarding training, technique etc would be great as me and the buddy are clueless.

Diesel

If doing 5km in 24, think how wrecked you were on day 1, some achievment.
The Marathon will be achievable, but more experienced runners than I will say - go slower and do 10km.
Get 10km in an hour, hold that pace and slowly increase to 15km.

www.dublinmarathon.ie (a busy place at moment) shows you a 12 week training plan to get to marathon.

Advice given to me though, and is worth listening to. It's not just running the miles you need to prepare, you need to prepare sufficient rest days between runs. Rest=Recovery. Above 10-15km - you need recovery or you will fatigue.

Go slow - in training, you'll get there.
rgds

ThePiedPiper

Qumoqq,

You've made a very good start anyway, good progression to be running the 5k consistently and faster.

Forget about starting to follow any sort of a marathon plan from now, its much too far out. You should continue to build your aerobic base for a few months, and then maybe in March/April start having a look at a plan to follow to bring you up to June.

Here's a short timetable of the sort of weekly running you could be doing at the moment:

Day 1: 4 miles easy
Day 2: 1 mile warmup, 2 mile tempo, 1 mile warmdown
Day 3: Rest
Day 4: 4 miles easy
Day 5: 3 miles easy
Day 6: 6 mile Slowly
Day 7: Rest

That adds up to just 20 miles per week, but it would give a bit of structure, and obviously over time, you would be adding a bit to the long run for example. For example, you should set yourself the medium term goal of being able to do a 10 mile long run by the end of the year, and possibly target a half marathon in March, off which you would be able to progress onto marathon training very naturally.
I think that 20-30 miles is a nice weekly amount that maintains or for new runners builds an aerobic base without a huge time investment or injury risk.

As you're just starting out, I wouldn't really recommend doing very much hard, full effort running as this would be an injury risk at the moment. But maybe at the end of some of those sessions, you could pick it up a little bit for the last 1/4 mile or so to get the legs turning over.

The fact that you're already planning now for a June marathon is good news, instead of starting to think about it in March. The very best of luck with your training, and enjoy your running.

Qumoqq

Thanks for that. Did two 5km runs sub 24, and a 10km. Friday, sat and Monday. The 10km took it really handy to make sure I ran the whole length without pause. Happy enough to have done it in 57min. Pushed the last 2 km doing both about 4:40 mark.

Funny but my lower back is only part that is feeling the work today??

10K Dave

Hope you don't mind me jumping in but reading your posts I would be of a similar enough level so I said i would follow the thread.

I hadn't done any training for a long time due to illness at the start of the year (missed 5 months of work). Then in mid June I did the Hell & Back 10km run with no training at all. Took me about 2:15. I was carrying a fair bit of weight too. From the week after I cleaned up the diet and started doing a bit of running, building up from 3km, 4km to 5km etc. Like yourself I could manage 5km in and around 25mins.

I built it up a bit more and got the weight down. I had registered for the Race Series but couldn't do the 5 mile race due to work so I said I'd give the Fingal 10km a shot. Disaster. I got no sleep the night before, slept in and got no water on board. Just about got to the start line as race was taking off and my watch jammed so I'd no pace keeper. Ran it in 52:10 which was a PB. Couldn't believe it. Yet to match it though.

Then came the Rock N'Rolla Half Marathon. Early start and had never ran anything over 10 miles before. Would have been great to break 2hrs but legs went completely a mile out and I finished in 2:04:01 I think it was. Had lost 25lbs at this stage and was tipping away nicely until the 10 mile in the Phoenix Park. Had to pull out half way through with what doctors originally thought was a Hernia. Was aiming for 1:36 in this and at halfway point I was on course to hit that. Was very disappointed so next day I got up and ran the course in Phoenix Park by myself and was just outside the 1:36 target.

Kept tipping away and did 13 miles after work one day in 2:06:39. Really felt it on the knees but wasn't too worried as I had felt the same after the half marathon. It passed in a day or two. Then one day I went out to do 10 miles and about a mile into it the left knee starting aching. Before long I was carrying it. I was running somewhere and had arranged a lift home. I'd no key so had no choice but to plough on. Was very uncomfortable.

Few days later I said I'd give it another go as I really wanted to do the half marathon in Phoenix Park. Again I was about a mile into the run and the knee started aching. So that was that. No half marathon or marathon. The knee is fine doing sprints or playing 5-a-side but the road running was killing me. I have the proper runners (Asics Nimbus after gate analysis etc) so that isn't the problem. Probably still carrying a bit too much weight.

So having done nothing for a fair few weeks I am doing the Hell & Back 14km run on Sunday, hoping it will kickstart me into things again. Knew plenty doing marathon this year so went out for a look. Was my first time there and I was really disappointed I couldn't take part. So back to square one.

Goals now would be to build back up with some 5k's and 10k's and work towards a couple of half marathons in 2014 like Rock N'Rolla Edinburgh, Liverpool and Dublin again as well as the Race Series in prep for the marathon. But this time I want to start much earlier and work my way up to it properly.

RayCun

10K Dave wrote: »

Then came the Rock N'Rolla Half Marathon. ... I finished in 2:04:01 I think it was.
....
Kept tipping away and did 13 miles after work one day in 2:06:39. Really felt it on the knees but wasn't too worried as I had felt the same after the half marathon.

You need to learn to run more slowly. Trying to do every run as a race is a bad idea.

Qumoqq

Think u and me are on different spectrums really. I've no experience whatsoever. I'm a bucket lister and u are a runner by the sounds of it.

Dilbert75

That may well be the case but RayCun's advice is sound. Even a bucket-lister is going to make their own life very difficult training for a marathon by running fast and long.

Run slow, run long. It's counter-intuitive but it works. Trust me - I've tried both approaches.

10K Dave

Qumoqq wrote: »

Think u and me are on different spectrums really. I've no experience whatsoever. I'm a bucket lister and u are a runner by the sounds of it.

Wouldn't say Im a runner by any stretch. I have ran 2.5 races and that is it. Maxed out at 13 miles and even at that Ive only ran that distance twice.

But I do accept the point re running every run like a race. I tend to get disheartened if i go out with a time in mind and don't meet it. I have thrown in the towel a few times when I have dropped a min or two behind a projected time. The Garmin watch will be the death of me. I need to mark out a run and just head off with no watch.

But I am a beginner and will take any advice going on board(s) :-)

spurscormac

10K Dave wrote: »

But I am a beginner and will take any advice going on board(s) :-)

Slow down - it's already been said, but slower is better when starting.
Decide how many times a week you can run & get yourself a training plan that works with that.

Starting off, do most of your runs at an easy pace where you could easily hold a conversation.
Add a long run at weekend, but take this slower than other runs. Over time, lengthen it.
Some people say starting off, the LSR (long slow run) should be time based rather than distance, increasing by 5/10 minutes every few weeks.
As you get fitter, and you've reached a nice length of time lets say 90mins, then you will gradually run longer for the same time (though still slow in comparison to other runs).

Hope that's not too confusing.

PS: If there's a running club, or fit for life near you, that can be a great incentive to get out & will help you find people to train with at your own pace.

alexanderomahon

Dilbert75 wrote: »

That may well be the case but RayCun's advice is sound. Even a bucket-lister is going to make their own life very difficult training for a marathon by running fast and long.

Run slow, run long. It's counter-intuitive but it works. Trust me - I've tried both approaches.

Aren't there plans such as FIRST that put forward an alternate approach? Is this the one you tried?

Dilbert75

The first time I took a generic beginner plan from the internet (Lucozade website actually) and set to it. No idea of how to balance speed and distance. Within 4 weeks I was unable to run with runner's knee and I was out for 6 weeks (and numerous Physio visits). I'd made the mistake of trying to increase distance as well as increase speed - Physio described it as a typical overuse injury.

Next time round I took the advice of the Boards runners and ran slower than I thought necessary. And it worked. Hence for your first/only marathon, based on nothing more than their expertise and my own experience, I recommend that approach.