Dublin Bus to implement cost-cutting plans - unions split

LXFlyer

http://www.rte.ie/news/2013/1025/482657-dublin-bus-ballot/

SIPTU Dublin Bus drivers reject cost-cutting plans

SIPTU drivers at Dublin Bus have voted to reject cost-cutting measures by a margin of 51% to 49%.

MOD EDIT: Please don't post more than a paragraph of an article.

monument

Press release from the Department of Transport, Tourism & Sport:

Friday 25th October 2013

Statement by Minister Leo Varadkar & Minister of State Alan Kelly on Dublin Bus

Minister for Transport, Tourism & Sport Leo Varadkar and Minister of State for Public Transport Alan Kelly have noted the outcome of the ballot of drivers at Dublin Bus represented by NBRU, and expressed deep concern at the outcome of the ballot of drivers represented by SIPTU.

The very narrow rejection by SIPTU comes in the face of the conclusion by the independent experts, which was not disputed by the drivers’ unions, that the latest proposals were the best that could be achieved in the current financial circumstances and that the potential consequences for the company were stark should they be rejected.

There have already been substantial fare increases and payroll savings are needed to protect existing service levels. There is no other solution to the financial challenges facing the company.

Given that the proposals have been accepted by a clear majority of the drivers in the company, and by a clear majority of the staff represented by all unions, both Ministers call on SIPTU to join with all the other grades in accepting the overall outcome of the vote and the views of the staff as a whole, and in implementing the necessary measures without any disruption to services that would be detrimental to the travelling public as well as their own members. Any strike will be prolonged as it is hard to see how it could be resolved given that all the industrial relations processes of the State have already been exhausted and there is no basis for any further intervention. There will be no winners and all sides will be worse off.

Ends

An RTE article quotes this from Dublin Bus:

"Given that 55% of drivers have accepted the proposals of the expert group and all other grades have accepted the Labour Court Recommendation, Dublin Bus will now commence with the full implementation of the Cost Recovery Plan for all grades without delay."

Grandeeod

So all eyes are on the Siptu drivers. This will be better than Love/Hate.

liger

They voted no? okay, just make them vote again. seems to be almost there, one more vote should get it sorted.

BowWow

Deja Vu again..............

http://www.thejournal.ie/siptu-dublin-bus-cost-saving-nbru-1147963-Oct2013/

cdebru

Bit of a mess alright.

Siptu have rejected it so if the company go ahead and implement it then they would presumably have no option but to strike, and NBRU won't pass a picket. But strictly speaking DB have the ok from the majority of their drivers to the deal.

Where now ?

Grandeeod

I would expect democracy to come into play. The majority have spoken. Unless CIE unions work on the basis of democracy section by section, union by union, grade by grade.

paulieb

Grandeeod wrote: »

I would expect democracy to come into play.

Irish style, keep voting until you get the result you want?

cdebru

Grandeeod wrote: »

I would expect democracy to come into play. The majority have spoken. Unless CIE unions work on the basis of democracy section by section, union by union, grade by grade.

That is how it works, unless agreed beforehand that it is a joint ballot. This wasn't so if one union reject it that's it.

paulieb

it a sticky situation for siptu, if they dont strike the 51% will just move over to the nbru. the unions want to keep there members, so what will they do

cdebru

paulieb wrote: »

it a sticky situation for siptu, if they dont strike the 51% will just move over to the nbru. the unions want to keep there members, so what will they do

I can't see what choice they have they asked their members and it was rejected by their members. Unless they reballot for strike if the plan is implemented and see what way that goes.

end of the road

most likely their will be a revote with siptu and their members, they will except the deal now that they know the other unions and their members have done so

cdebru

end of the road wrote: »

most likely their will be a revote with siptu and their members, they will except the deal now that they know the other unions and their members have done so

No I can't see that happening, they have rejected the deal, what they could do is ballot them as to what they want to do about it. They could just not accept the deal but decide they won't take any action if the company implements it, or they could strike or they could take industrial action that doesn't involve strike, like a work to rule, were they would continue working but not do overtime, rest days etc.

foggy_lad

liger wrote: »

They voted no? okay, just make them vote again. seems to be almost there, one more vote should get it sorted.

Nice treaty deja vu, is that you Bertie?

liger

40 votes the difference!
I bet you siptu are racking their brains on how to make their members vote on the same document without changing it.

If the document is changed then that other union will need to be re-balloted because all the drivers will be on same changed T&Cs.

If both sides are will to kev this go to a strike over a 40vote swing i think its proof management in DB and union heads need to be cleared out. Its in neither of their interests to let Leo V and FG have a reason to fast track privatisation.

One more vote
One more vote
One more vote

murphaph

Grandeeod wrote: »

I would expect democracy to come into play. The majority have spoken. Unless CIE unions work on the basis of democracy section by section, union by union, grade by grade.

That's exactly how they work.

The_Wrecker

paulieb wrote: »

it a sticky situation for siptu, if they dont strike the 51% will just move over to the nbru. the unions want to keep there members, so what will they do

And if they do strike then the 49% will move to the NBRU.

Delta2113

Can someone confirm that Siptu would have to give 7 days strike notice again?

Devilman40k

Delta2113 wrote: »

Can someone confirm that Siptu would have to give 7 days strike notice again?

Yes they do

cdebru

Delta2113 wrote: »

Can someone confirm that Siptu would have to give 7 days strike notice again?

Depends as they have already served strike notice the original strike from August was only suspended. Also depends on how much notice the company gives them of any change.

Delta2113

"An implementation date will be announced shortly." - should be fun!

paulieb

You could have a scenario where all the no voters go to siptu and the yes voters go to nbru.
It could end up a total impasse if this happens.

paulieb

You could have a scenario where all the no voters go to siptu and the yes voters go to nbru.
It could end up a total impasse if this happens.

rx8

I think that the unions will come together and announce that as the majority have voted in favour, that the new measures should come in.

Even though I voted against it, I know that a strike now will not achieve anything other than a bitter long drawn out feud with no ultimate winners.
The reason I was against it was really because of the attitude of management and I hoped that there would be some kind of clear out of the layers of dead wood and hangers on that are costing the company millions.
As it is now this is just going to kick the can further down the road and in 19 months time they will come back and claim an inability to pay.

MGWR

liger wrote: »

They voted no? okay, just make them vote again. seems to be almost there, one more vote should get it sorted.

And then they don't get to vote anymore, just like treaty votes?

Delta2113

http://www.rte.ie/news/ireland/2013/1029/483312-siptu-bus-talks/ - Good old siptu - we don't like the vote lads so go again and get it right this time.

ConorR32

The main unions are a bloody joke. I'll never understand why workers in one profession would split into two unions rather than having one super-union by and for workers in that profession. This is the same as the ASTI and TUI lark, it creates division and totally diminishes the power of the workers! Unions are supposed to be about solidarity and collective power!

liger

Delta2113 wrote: »

http://www.rte.ie/news/ireland/2013/1029/483312-siptu-bus-talks/ - Good old siptu - we don't like the vote lads so go again and get it right this time.

its a vote on whether or not they have a mandate from its members for industrial action "in changed circumstances"

Actually its smart by the union, they know they can't put the proposals back to their of members but with this vote they could stop a strike!

murphaph

ConorR32 wrote: »

The main unions are a bloody joke. I'll never understand why workers in one profession would split into two unions rather than having one super-union by and for workers in that profession. This is the same as the ASTI and TUI lark, it creates division and totally diminishes the power of the workers! Unions are supposed to be about solidarity and collective power!

I'd say most people are in a union to look after their own interests, rather than in any spirit of solidarity with anyone. The noble ideals of unions of old are gone. Most employees are better protected under the law than our forefathers were when they NEEDED unions to get even basic rights. Nowadays unions are mostly about feathering your own nest, from top to bottom.

rx8

So now SIPTU are going to have another vote next week, Monday and Tuesday...If the vote is in favour of strike action, then they will go out if and when the company implement the changes, and if there is a No vote, then the changes will come in with no further action.

It's SIPTU's way of trying to save face, instead of turning around and saying that they would join with their NBRU colleagues and go with the majority decision to accept the changes.

The whole lot of them should resign, because they are not worth a damn anyway.All in the pocket of management and only looking out for themselves.

LXFlyer

Some good news:

http://www.rte.ie/news/2013/1106/485059-dublin-bus/

SIPTU Dublin Bus drivers vote against industrial action

Drivers at Dublin Bus belonging to SIPTU have voted not to take industrial action over cost cuts at the company........

Hopefully now the company can move on from this period of industrial relations mayhem and focus on recovery.

Gatling

lxflyer wrote: »

Some good news:

http://www.rte.ie/news/2013/1106/485059-dublin-bus/



Hopefully now the company can move on from this period of industrial relations mayhem and focus on recovery.

Glad to see common sense prevailed