Overseas landlord, not regestered with PRTB

superman28

Only after 11 months of renting, did I check the PRTB website to see if where I rent is regestered.. It seems it is not on the list? Also, I pay my rent to an irish bank account but have only met the landlord once,, I believe he lives in Spain..

My Rent is up for re-newal,, and I like where I am,, but now I'm worried..
What should I do?

According to the PRTB website.

[URL="javascript:void(0)"]What potential effects can there be on a tenant if their tenancy is not registered?[/URL]

The tenant may require proof of their tenancy for a number of State Agencies. If a tenancy is not registered a tenant may have difficulty in proving residency which could effect any application they may have for residency, college places, bank loans etc. A tenant may find it difficult to apply for tax allowances or rebates.

djimi

Seems a little dramatic. If you have a lease then you have proof of the tenancy. If you can show that regular payments have been leaving your bank account to that of the landlord then you have further proof.

If your landlord is not resident in Ireland and you pay rent to them directly, then legally you must withhold 20% of the rent each month to be paid to revenue.

superman28

I never knew this? That I have to pay tax on the rent.. if the landlord is overseas... from citizens infomation below.. what do I do about the 11 months of not paying tax?? Also, should I report the property to the PRTB?


"However, if you pay the rent directly to the landlord (including into their bank account) whether in Ireland or abroad, you must deduct tax at the standard rate (20% in 2013) from the gross amount that you pay. This deduction is not your tax relief - it is tax payable to Revenue from your landlord's income.

For example, your landlord lives in Germany and you pay him/her gross rent per month of €1,000. First, work out the amount of tax to be deducted (€1,000 x 20% = €200). Now deduct the tax due from the gross rent you pay (€1,000 - €200 = €800). The net rent to be paid to your landlord is €800 per month. The amount due to Revenue is the €200 per month that you deducted from the gross rent of €1,000".

djimi

To be honest I have no idea how it works in reality; you might be better off contacting someone like Citizens Information and see where you stand with the tax.

As for the PRTB, I dont think that there is any need to report the tenancy tbh. If you have a lease and can show regular payments to the landlord then I dont see why there would be any disputing the tenancy.

D3PO

just to clarify. If the LL has an agent working on their behalf (that can be anybody they designate as an agent) then no tax is libel to be withheld from the rent.

However with an overseas LL it would always be prudent to ask and get in writing confirmation of weather an agent or not exists as ultimately if tax is due the tenant is libel for it. In most cases though this isn't actually the case.

djimi

D3PO wrote: »

just to clarify. If the LL has an agent working on their behalf (that can be anybody they designate as an agent) then no tax is libel to be withheld from the rent.

However with an overseas LL it would always be prudent to ask and get in writing confirmation of weather an agent or not exists as ultimately if tax is due the tenant is libel for it. In most cases though this isn't actually the case.

I think its only if the rent is being paid to the agent. My understanding is that if the rent is being paid directly to the landlord (as is the case here) then the tenant is responsible for withholding the 20%, agent or not. I might have that wrong though.

superman28

Right, thanks for your replies.. lets say the money is being paid to an agent,,, and there is no tax due,, should I still ask about why or that I want the property to be regestered with PTRB because as it stands, in unregestered properties the tenant does not have the same rights,, as a normal tenant would have,,

Il get on to the LL and raise all these issues,, as I want everything done by the book,,

D3PO

djimi wrote: »

I think its only if the rent is being paid to the agent. My understanding is that if the rent is being paid directly to the landlord (as is the case here) then the tenant is responsible for withholding the 20%, agent or not. I might have that wrong though.

No your right but we don't know the OP is paying it directly to the LL. We just know they are paying it to an Irish bank account.

djimi

superman28 wrote: »

Right, thanks for your replies.. lets say the money is being paid to an agent,,, and there is no tax due,, should I still ask about why or that I want the property to be regestered with PTRB because as it stands, in unregestered properties the tenant does not have the same rights,, as a normal tenant would have,,

Il get on to the LL and raise all these issues,, as I want everything done by the book,,

From your point of view it doesnt matter whether the tenancy is registered or not; you still have all the rights that you should have, and you can avail of the PRTB services if you need to.

No Pants

If it turns out that the tenant is liable, can the tenant then calculate the tax due and withhold the rent, keeping it in a separate account or something until the due amount is collected? Communicating this to the landlord of course.

djimi

No Pants wrote: »

If it turns out that the tenant is liable, can the tenant then calculate the tax due and withhold the rent, keeping it in a separate account or something until the due amount is collected? Communicating this to the landlord of course.

I would have thought so, yes. It's 20% of the annual rent, and the landlord has been receiving 20% too much rent each month so they can have no complaints.

sunnysoutheast

djimi wrote: »

I would have thought so, yes. It's 20% of the annual rent, and the landlord has been receiving 20% too much rent each month so they can have no complaints.

The tenant has to make a return to the Revenue to account for any tax withheld. The mechanism varies but often it is usually collected via adjustment of the tenant's tax codes. If it is not being collected via PAYE the landlord would be mad to allow the tenant to retain the 20% IMHO.

Any collection agent arrangement for a non-resident landlord must be registered with the Revenue as the agent is responsible for the return -
http://www.revenue.ie/en/tax/it/forms/tax-registration-collection-agents.pdf.

It depends what landlord address is on the tenancy agreement.

Victor

Have you filled out a PRTB registration form? If not, it isn't registered. The register on the website isn't always up to date.

No Pants wrote: »

If it turns out that the tenant is liable, can the tenant then calculate the tax due and withhold the rent, keeping it in a separate account or something until the due amount is collected?

No, any amount withheld should be sent directly to the Revenue, in accordance with whatever procedure they have.

murphaph

sunnysoutheast wrote: »

The tenant has to make a return to the Revenue to account for any tax withheld. The mechanism varies but often it is usually collected via adjustment of the tenant's tax codes. If it is not being collected via PAYE the landlord would be mad to allow the tenant to retain the 20% IMHO.

Any collection agent arrangement for a non-resident landlord must be registered with the Revenue as the agent is responsible for the return -
http://www.revenue.ie/en/tax/it/forms/tax-registration-collection-agents.pdf.

It depends what landlord address is on the tenancy agreement.

The whole setup is a load of nonsense but ultimately if I agree with a tenant that he's to withhold 20% then I'd include it in the lease and forward a copy of it to revenue. It's the tenant's liability even though he's not the chargeable person. In the UK the same rule exists but only in principle. Non resident landlords there can opt out so long as they are tax compliant. Should be the same here.

No Pants

Victor wrote: »

Have you filled out a PRTB registration form? If not, it isn't registered. The register on the website isn't always up to date.No, any amount withheld should be sent directly to the Revenue, in accordance with whatever procedure they have.

I was focusing more on the method used to collect monies already missed. Sending it to Revenue would be the next step.