New ceiling light advice

stooge

Hi all,

I bought a new celiing light for the living room
(http://www.diy.com/nav/decor/lighting/indoor-lighting/chandeliers___ceiling_lights/Chloe-3-Light-Semi-Flush-10668046)

Having a little trouble finding a way to convert from the conventional fitting to this semi flush fitting with very little space for wires.

This is a photo of the current setup of the wires


Wires coming in:
- Two earth wires
- 3 neutral wires (one of these is actually a loop for the wall lights)
- 4 live (two switches)

Witres going out (to fitting):
- 1 live
- 1 neutral

The fitting itself has only 4 connectors. It is fitted to the celiing by way of a bracket which inconveniently does not have a hole in the middle to bring the wires out through.

Leaving the existing black plastic fitting would mean the light wont tbe flush, but removing it means I have a crap load of wires and only 4 connectors. Any advice or tips?

Thanks!

hufpc8w3adnk65

You only need 4 conectors!!!!

stooge

sorry, I should have clarified, I am proposing to remove the black plastic fitting above and all that comes with it. I'll be left with a rake of wires (9) and only four holes to put them in. What will go where in that scenario?

sparcocars

stooge wrote: »

sorry, I should have clarified, I am proposing to remove the black plastic fitting above and all that comes with it. I'll be left with a rake of wires (9) and only four holes to put them in. What will go where in that scenario?

First of all make sure you turn off the power to the lighting curcuit and test with a suitable multimeter that its dead. Some of the live wires there will still be live regardless of the light switch position.

All the earths together in one connector including an earth from the new light fitting if its a metal fitting.

All the neutrals together in one connector including the neutral from the new light fitting.

If you look at your picture, you want the first 3 lives from left to right together in one connector.

And the 4th live on the right goes in the last connector together with the live from the new light fitting.

chopperp

CONTACT A PROPER ELECTRICIAN , ELECTRICITY IS NOT FOR DIY ENTHUSIASTS

stooge

Thanks sparcocars, that makes sense. Always flick the switch at the fuse box and test the light switch before working but I see your point about getting the multimeter out and testing all wires regardless. I'll give an update tonight or tomoro with the result. cheers

hufpc8w3adnk65

chopperp wrote: »

CONTACT A PROPER ELECTRICIAN , ELECTRICITY IS NOT FOR DIY ENTHUSIASTS

Here here.. It's also illegal now

tomdempsey200

loop-in at the light fittings is a nightmare for homeowner trying to swop out pendants for fittings

dog-rough too-the wires should be brought in the outside breakouts on the pendant-not the centre

tomdempsey200

MrMac84 wrote: »

Here here.. It's also illegal now

the new laws don't cover replacing light fittings afaik

2011

tomdempsey200 wrote: »

the new laws don't cover replacing light fittings afaik

Correct, it is a like for like replacement.

hufpc8w3adnk65

My bad. Still if you need advice on changeing like for like then let it too a pro

tomdempsey200

the 3-plate roses are prob best left to a professional anyhow

the loop-in to switches is a safer option for domestic lighting circuits in the same way that radial socket circuits are a safer option than rings

there often isn't a competent person undertaking domestic electrical work..

dolittle

just to stick my oar in and not being a smart arse but if you have to ask "how to do it?" then maybe you shouldn't be doing it

2011

We all had to ask questions and learn at some stage.

stooge

Thanks for the advice lads. TBH I didnt think I'd get such a bad reaction though.

Some people like to do a bit of DIY at home and others dont. If I wasn't happy doing it myself there is no doubt I would get a qualified electrician in. For example, we have an oil boiler in the garage and if something went wrong with it I wouldnt even attempt to fix it, as I know little or nothing about boilers and how to work safely with them. However, for something like putting a new light fitting on I think I am competant enough to do that. I know the basics about home electrics and the dangers involved in working with 240V. I was just asking for advice on the best ways of wiring and fixing so that I can get the light flush to the ceiling.

Also, I have to say that 'getting a pro in' doesnt alway work out best. When we were getting our bathroom tiled a few months ago the OH convinced me to call a qualified plumber to take out the sink and toilet. In taking it out he didnt properly close the cold water valve which leaked for two days. In putting it back in, he broke the sink and didnt connect the water properly which again leaked. The sealant was all over the place and looked terrible. The wall started to get mould because of the damp. Tried phoning him to get him to come back out but he said he would charge more for the follow up. I took everything out and put it back in myself with everything properly connected and looking much neater. The reason I was able to do a better job was that I could spend time on it and do it right, whereas this guy turned up for 30-40mins, rushed through it and went on to his next job.


EDIT: Just want to add a disclaimer that I'm not saying people should try to do everything themselves. But if you are confident and competant enough them I don't see the reason why not.

tomdempsey200

there's no such thing as a competent electrical diyer

i've been around long enough to know..

Tokyo

OP - do you have access to the ceiling space above the light?? Replace ceiling rose with covered junction box in the roof space, then drop your line down through the ceiling for the new light fitting....

stooge

mike_ie wrote: »

OP - do you have access to the ceiling space above the light?? Replace ceiling rose with covered junction box in the roof space, then drop your line down through the ceiling for the new light fitting....

have direct acces via the attic so this is an option. However, future plans are to convert the attic so gaining access to the junction box would then be a problem.

stooge

tomdempsey200 wrote: »

there's no such thing as a competent electrical diyer

i've been around long enough to know..

out of interest how much would a qualified electrician charge for such a job as the one I have described?

Tokyo

stooge wrote: »

have direct acces via the attic so this is an option. However, future plans are to convert the attic so gaining access to the junction box would then be a problem.

No more than any two story house would have in accessing cables in the ground floor ceiling. How many times to you plan on rewiring said junction box once installed?

2011

mike_ie wrote: »

No more than any two story house would have in accessing cables in the ground floor ceiling. How many times to you plan on rewiring said junction box once installed?

Junction boxes should always be accessiable.

tomdempsey200

yes but under a floorboard is also considered accessible

the location should preferably be marked

a map or the like would do

Tokyo

2011 wrote: »

Junction boxes should always be accessiable.

I'd consider under the attic floorboards as being accessible. Either lift the board or cut a flap into the floor. Building a wall directly over it might be another issue of course..

DublinDilbert

how big is your new light fitting?? I've done a few and the rose part that goes on the ceiling was so large that it covered the old rose.

So I put the bracket for the new rose up, behind the existing rose, the brought up the light and connected the 3 wires to the fitting.

stooge

DublinDilbert wrote: »

how big is your new light fitting?? I've done a few and the rose part that goes on the ceiling was so large that it covered the old rose.

So I put the bracket for the new rose up, behind the existing rose, the brought up the light and connected the 3 wires to the fitting.

Looked into this too and found that the new bracket would be marginally to small to fit in behind the rose.

chopperp

just get an electrician to ensure the job is done correctly