[Legal Discussion] Another Yellow Card....

Cody Pomeray

There was a lively exchange between "camphor" and "infosys" on this thread, which I enjoyed reading.

One morning, I saw that camphor had been site banned. I was sad to see a well-informed professional user leave the website.

I remarked "Camphor is banned forever?", i.e. sitebanned, half a statement of surprise at his siteban, and half to let people know that a regular was sitebanned.

I was given a yellow card for backseat modding by user "hullaballoo:, whose name could hardly be more apt to this affair, for reasons that are about to become clear.

1. There was no "mod notice" to the the effect that camphor was either banned from LD, or site banned. How was I to know why he was sitebanned? You don't get a siteban for a mere infraction, which I didn't even know he had got at that time. I still don't think camphor was banned from LD; nobody told me he was, anyway. I still have no idea why camphor was banned, nor do I especially care at this stage.

2. As far as I know, sitebans are not elected by ordinary mods, and there is no reason for me to believe that one of the legal discussion mods can elect to ban someone forever.

If I had said "why did you ban camphor?" OBVIOUSLY that would be a yellow, if not a red card offense, with good reason. That would be backseat modding.

I have contacted the mod over this, and as much as I regret making the comment, I have to say I felt the need to ask him to get a grip over this silliness, because I don't think this is about camphor at all. I think the mods don't like my feedback thread, which is when all this rubbish started.

To say that no user can actually remark or inform users that a regular poster has been sitebanned, just seems irrational. Imagine if that rule operated site wide? Imagine if you couldn't say that someone was site banned in case you insult the mod of a forum that once infracted him...what??

Cody Pomeray

addendum:
-it appears my comment was subsequently deleted on that thread.
-i had previously considered not to dispute this until i realised that cards can lead to a wider ban, which I consider may be an intention behind the sudden interest in my posts post-feedback.

Scofflaw

Hi Cody,

If you're in doubt why the rule is there, and why it applies in this case, consider that by making the comment you're inviting a discussion about the siteban as opposed to the purpose of the thread. Almost any thread could become a thread about modding decisions if allowed, so Boards separates any such discussions.

Backseat modding is backseat modding. The rules apply to everyone, and there's no special dispensation for you. If you didn't feel strongly enough about it to open a thread in Feedback, you shouldn't have commented on it in a thread whose purpose was not discussion of moderation.

Again, you can appeal this decision to the Admins.

moderately,
Scofflaw

Cody Pomeray

But the discussion didn't relate to moderation by anyone in the legal discussion forum.

I was about to PM camphor with a question/ comment on something he said when I noticed the ban thing under his name. Am I missing the post where he was banned from legal discussion? Who sitebanned him? If a legal discussion mod did, then I accept my card, I guess, for peace sake.

Surely that's relevant though? Like it's just a bit strange if you can't actually mention someone's been sitebanned.

Scofflaw

Cody Pomeray wrote: »

But the discussion didn't relate to moderation by anyone in the legal discussion forum.

That's not actually relevant at all, if you think about the reasoning behind the rule, as explained above. It's not about whether people question mod decisions - clearly they can, and do, as you are here - but about keeping such discussion separate from topical discussion.

Cody Pomeray wrote: »

I was about to PM camphor with a question/ comment on something he said when I noticed the ban thing under his name. Am I missing the post where he was banned from legal discussion? Who sitebanned him? If a legal discussion mod did, then I accept my card, I guess, for peace sake.

Surely that's relevant though? Like it's just a bit strange if you can't actually mention someone's been sitebanned.

You can mention it in Feedback or Help Desk, PM a mod or admin. Again, think about it - there's no reason the thread you were in should be a good place to mention it, because it is unlikely to come to the attention of whoever sitebanned camphor - the only thing your request could do is generate an off-topic discussion.

cordially,
Scofflaw

Cody Pomeray

Scofflaw wrote: »

You can mention it in Feedback or Help Desk, PM a mod or admin. Again, think about it - there's no reason the thread you were in should be a good place to mention it, because it is unlikely to come to the attention of whoever sitebanned camphor

But put yourself in my position just for a moment. Think about the context, camphor's a regular contributor to LD right, and there's an active, interesting discussion he's contributing to with infosys right, and then the conversation seems like it has to stop because suddenly we see "banned" under his username (but is he banned, because sometimes people just write that there?)

It would be a whole different thing if a mod had said 'camphor you're banned' or if we knew whether it even had anything to do with LD.

Do you know if anyone has ever been infracted for telling a thread that a recent contributor was just sitebanned? I don't. A quick search says this may be a new one, at least in recent times.

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=86864523&postcount=2309
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=86366516&postcount=4
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=86072351&postcount=14
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=84361203&postcount=895
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=85999043&postcount=9
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=85937095&postcount=7531
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=84426267&postcount=28

Look I'm mostly highlighting this because it's pretty clear to me what's going on.

Per my other DRP thread, which might as well be forgotten about too, I'm pretty sure nobody has been infracted for giving (as opposed to requesting) legal advice in LD either.

So no need to take this further, I'm enjoying our little chats, and no doubt I'll be back next week with the same story when hullaballoo or someone notices I forgot to dot an i or cross a t. Lets see what the next one is. I'm very excited.