Communist china- how far away from this are we

strewthelvis

I have been following this story with great interest lately and the more i see the more i believe we are actually heading in this direction ourselves,
http://www.policymic.com/articles/58399/china-is-forcing-250-million-rural-dwellers-to-relocate
Sometimes i think we dont actually want to see what is right in front of us

zl1whqvjs75cdy

Our country is tiny and agriculture is preforming quite well at the moment. Why in the name of good god would we want to re locate people anywhere? Your never more than an hours drive from a moderate urban area no matter what far flung corner of the island you live on.

spank_inferno

OP... care to articulate how Ireland is like china?

woodoo

I think this policy is outrageous. What if people are perfectly happy farming the land and don't fancy moving to a big city to work in a poorly paid sweat shop 14 hours a day.

Pete_Cavan

strewthelvis wrote: »

I have been following this story with great interest lately and the more i see the more i believe we are actually heading in this direction ourselves,
http://www.policymic.com/articles/58399/china-is-forcing-250-million-rural-dwellers-to-relocate
Sometimes i think we dont actually want to see what is right in front of us

The Chinese government is currently undertaking a programme of relocating millions of people, to suggest that we could be "heading in this direction ourselves" I would hope that you have at least one example of the Irish government forcibly moving rural dwellers to towns. This is nothing more than extreme hyperbole.

Dispersed rural settlements are actually permitted here but are discouraged in most of the developed world.

Iwasfrozen

strewthelvis wrote: »

I have been following this story with great interest lately and the more i see the more i believe we are actually heading in this direction ourselves,
http://www.policymic.com/articles/58399/china-is-forcing-250-million-rural-dwellers-to-relocate
Sometimes i think we dont actually want to see what is right in front of us

I doubt it. Our population is no where near 250 million.

strewthelvis

strewthelvis wrote: »

I have been following this story with great interest lately and the more i see the more i believe we are actually heading in this direction ourselves,
http://www.policymic.com/articles/58399/china-is-forcing-250-million-rural-dwellers-to-relocate
Sometimes i think we dont actually want to see what is right in front of us

You have to see the cities over here.. there's construction everywhere, and the suburbs are covered with apartment blocks 30 floors high. And it continues. This move is as much an attempt to prevent that contruction effort from stagnating as it is to boost the manufacturing industry. I suspect this is an attempt to prevent a property crash that happens in most developing countries..

Its also worth noting that the Chinese government owns all land in China. Naturally its supposed to be held in trust for the "people" but what it really means is that the government has no problem moving these people, and will probably move them again. China has a long history of forced migration.

goose2005

OP, there has been constant migration from the countryside to towns and cities ever since agriculture became mechanised

woodoo wrote: »

I think this policy is outrageous. What if people are perfectly happy farming the land and don't fancy moving to a big city to work in a poorly paid sweat shop 14 hours a day.

What if the alternative is working 15 hours a day in a rice paddy for even less money?

hfallada

It's to create artificial domestic demand for goods and services. If you move into an apartment you buy goods such as washing machines, tvs etc creating demand within the economy.

But I was in china over the summer and its incredible all the building. All the apartments are identical and on top of each other. Places like Beijing and Tianjin are already heavily congested but yet the government wants to concentrate growth between the two cities. The subways are both beyond capacity and pollution is unbearable.

Both the biggest challenge is not infastructure. But how do you control such large group of people. China at the moment relies on mass censorship of media and web to control its people. If protest break out in both Beijing and Tianjin. That 40 million people protesting which will spread rapidly to other cities, much quicker than if china was just a group of villages.

hfallada

hfallada wrote: »

It's to create artificial domestic demand for goods and services. If you move into an apartment you buy goods such as washing machines, tvs etc creating demand within the economy.

But I was in china over the summer and its incredible all the building. All the apartments are identical and on top of each other. Places like Beijing and Tianjin are already heavily congested but yet the government wants to concentrate growth between the two cities. The subways are both beyond capacity and pollution is unbearable.

Both the biggest challenge is not infastructure. But how do you control such large group of people. China at the moment relies on mass censorship of media and web to control its people. If protest break out in both Beijing and Tianjin. That 40 million people protesting which will spread rapidly to other cities, much quicker than if china was just a group of villages.

There are many cities in china with populations lower than 3 million. It's likely that the government wants people to move there and will provide incentives for that. Shenzhen was the last major push to develop a new city, but there will be pushes to move more west to build up the infrastructure of the country. Xian is already receiving huge inputs of capital to bring it in line with the larger cities. The subway was opened last year, with the second line opened a few months back. There are a number of other lines due to open in the near future and they're pumping in money to make it happen.

The point is that there is more to China than the major cities. There is a lot of manufacturing and agriculture based in smaller cities around the country, and that's where the government will want people to move to.

Lastly, I wouldn't get too bothered about protesting. It happens all the time I. Beijing, Tianjin, and other cities in the north. For the most part, the government and the rest of the population ignores them. Obedience is finely integrated into the minds of people here. Sure, they will complain but if someone in a uniform shouts an order the vast majority will comply.

The censorship in China hasn't been working for the last ten years. VPNs are common, and openly advertised. Websites like weibo, renren, and Wei blog, ensure that rumours are passed on quickly, along with a host of other blogged news. The point is that, for the most part, chinese people will not do anything drastic unless the economy bursts, and they lose the possibility of improving their lives. That carrot will keep people in line for a long time yet, along with filial duty and a desire not to shame their families.

Cody Pomeray

http://www.irishmirror.ie/news/irish-news/farmer-loses-family-home-more-2286347

"we want your land. we don't know who's going to set up a factory there yet, there's no guarantee any jobs will come out of it, but we are the IDA and want your land."