winter milk

jersey101

Discussion about this on another thread so might aswell have it here.
My winter calving this year started in august and wont finish to dec. ideally in the next 2 years i want this to be 6 weeks long....
But when is the best time to start and finish?
I was thinking that the minute i start calving put them all in the shed and let them stay in for the winter. Good or bad udea??

Timmaay

If you still have grass why would you put them in the shed? Another group of animals, and more work. We always try to run the one herd of milkers if we can, only ever separate lame cows if they are walking far. Extra nuts fed in the parlour to the winter ladies.

Going back to your question, the teagasc lads (Joe Patton etc) say the only profitable winter cow one that calves in Nov, she will spend more of her peak lactation out on grass. I suppose this all depends on if you can get out to grass early or not, if your not normally out until Patricks day, it isn't going to make a huge difference. The other reason you might want to stick to August calving would be if you have a high number of carryovers, but Joe Pattons opinion on carryovers is something like "short term gain for long term pain"!

mf240

Wtf I was reading the other thread and just getting around to answer whelan (I hadnt sooner as I was out milking oh the Irony)

Then I noticed the thread was locked and then page 8 dissapeared.

Whelan I am so so for quota, I am hoping the springs will deliver good solids on oad and the fresh will keep the lactose right.

Will probably be around 50,000 litres over but could easily double this if I kept the throttle open.


Heavens above its open again now, never mind.

whelan1

mf240 wrote: »

Wtf I was reading the other thread and just getting around to answer whelan (I hadnt sooner as I was out milking oh the Irony)

Then I noticed the thread was locked and then page 8 dissapeared.

Whelan I am so so for quota, I am hoping the springs will deliver good solids on oad and the fresh will keep the lactose right.

Will probably be around 50,000 litres over but could easily double this if I kept the throttle open.

right a few questions- if i am allowed:cool:- will you milk oad morning or evening and will you give oad any meal, what will you feed fresh calvers?

mf240

I will give oad about 3 kgs meal as I dont want them to lose weight.

I will milk in am so that they will be getting fresh grass for daytime and also if Im away I will only have one bunch to milk if late back.

jersey101

Timmaay wrote: »

If you still have grass why would you put them in the shed? Another group of animals, and more work. We always try to run the one herd of milkers if we can, only ever separate lame cows if they are walking far. Extra nuts fed in the parlour to the winter ladies.

Going back to your question, the teagasc lads (Joe Patton etc) say the only profitable winter cow one that calves in Nov, she will spend more of her peak lactation out on grass. I suppose this all depends on if you can get out to grass early or not, if your not normally out until Patricks day, it isn't going to make a huge difference. The other reason you might want to stick to August calving would be if you have a high number of carryovers, but Joe Pattons opinion on carryovers is something like "short term gain for long term pain"!

ive heard about joe patton but never talked to the man. Say he'd be very knowledgeable about winter milk. Id prefere not calve in august id like to enjoy the last of the summer ha. We tend to get out around late jan here if possisble. Depending on weather give or take a week or so.
im seeing two ones that calved in august here are after going to skin and bone and i dont know why they were dosed and thre getting fed

Timmaay

I guess with all the fresh grass since the drought ended, protein in the diet is high, and they are milking their backs off? Probably low energy also. Actually what %p is in the nuts/ration your currently feeding to the milkers? Seeing as your feeding in the parlour by bucket anyways, you could maybe feed them abit extra of a lower P nut, and boost their energy. Alternatively, if your pushing them out to calf in Oct/Nov next year anyways, you could carry on, take the hit in BSC as they wont need to be back in shape to go in calf as quick?

whelan1

jersey101 wrote: »

ive heard about joe patton but never talked to the man. Say he'd be very knowledgeable about winter milk. Id prefere not calve in august id like to enjoy the last of the summer ha. We tend to get out around late jan here if possisble. Depending on weather give or take a week or so.
im seeing two ones that calved in august here are after going to skin and bone and i dont know why they were dosed and thre getting fed

my august calvers are doing grand getting 4kg of 16% meal- soon to be 18%- milking to 40 litres, have them calving from mid august to end of october, will shorten this next year but dont know which end i will shorten yet, last year was 1st august till end october

jersey101

Timmaay wrote: »

I guess with all the fresh grass since the drought ended, protein in the diet is high, and they are milking their backs off? Probably low energy also. Actually what %p is in the nuts/ration your currently feeding to the milkers? Seeing as your feeding in the parlour by bucket anyways, you could maybe feed them abit extra of a lower P nut, and boost their energy. Alternatively, if your pushing them out to calf in Oct/Nov next year anyways, you could carry on, take the hit in BSC as they wont need to be back in shape to go in calf as quick?

every other calved cow is fine there holding there codition thus one has gne to nothing since she calved and shes only on a 14% nut.

loveta

Not starting calving here till the 25 of oct prefer to have them in full time before they start hitting the high notes grass is way to low in DM for fresh calvers.,would any of you guys consider leasing stock if ye could see yourselfs running tight on quota or would ye prefer to chance it with the high milk prices??

Milked out

This year will be starting oct 13 and finishing dec 16, kicking off again jan 10 all going to plan. Started last few years in mid sep, and never really stopped till april, having two distinct blocks from now on as work load is too much when your constantly calving and something will suffer, either me, the calf or the cow... We keep the herds separate until the majority of lower yielders are dried off as have no feeding in parlour, or when everything is housed and it becomes too awkward to keep them separate.

Timmaay

I don't know how any of yas in winter milk survive without individual parlour feeders, definitely wouldn't do without them here.

mahoney_j

loveta wrote: »

Not starting calving here till the 25 of oct prefer to have them in full time before they start hitting the high notes grass is way to low in DM for fresh calvers.,would any of you guys consider leasing stock if ye could see yourselfs running tight on quota or would ye prefer to chance it with the high milk prices??

Im 99% sure im going to get into winter milk and this is the route i think ill go.Plan on calving from around 10 october to end of november and keep fresh calvers indoors ,Maby out bt day for a few hours if weather is dry.That way diet is stable and consistent and peak will last longer .in spring herd my current average peak yield would be around 33 ltrs and for autumn girls id be aiming for 40 to 45 .diet would consist of high dmd wraps ,Whole crop wheat and a hi maize 18% blend in parlour feed to yield.Am i stone mad to be even considerimg getting into liquid???.All facalities in place and have cows to suit winter milk system.
Id be very slow to lease out stock purely from a disease point of view and i like my cows and would be worried that whoever had them wouldnt feed or manage them to the level i would

Milked out

Its grand when they're at grass as the spring girls would be sent walking while the fresh ones are clos to the parlour, it get awkward inside alrite as only one exit/entry point so involves locking one crowd back. Parlour is too low/small for proper feeders, hoping to fit in batch feeders instead, not ideal but my funds need focusing elsewhere at the moment. Diet feeder does the feeding when all inside, nothing left over when all the ration goes through the tmr, prob better for the system too as not eating a load of concentrates in one go in the parlour

Timmaay

Fair enough Miliked out, no TMR/diet feeder here, which makes the parlour feeders an utter must. With the batch feeders you can do things like rope 4 of them together, you don't have to feed the whole row the same amount. Should be fairly easy to pull out the batch feeders and throw in other feeders if you wanted to down the road also.

Mahoney, you love hardship . Only messing, I guess you have different priorities with a young family etc. Out of interest, is the winter milk going to be in the form of expansion (ie extra cows over what you currently have), or will you be taking them out of the spring ladies? And are you going winter milk to allow yourself to push up the milking platform SR, and if so what are you expecting it to go?

stanflt

mahoney_j wrote: »

Im 99% sure im going to get into winter milk and this is the route i think ill go.Plan on calving from around 10 october to end of november and keep fresh calvers indoors ,Maby out bt day for a few hours if weather is dry.That way diet is stable and consistent and peak will last longer .in spring herd my current average peak yield would be around 33 ltrs and for autumn girls id be aiming for 40 to 45 .diet would consist of high dmd wraps ,Whole crop wheat and a hi maize 18% blend in parlour feed to yield.Am i stone mad to be even considerimg getting into liquid???.All facalities in place and have cows to suit winter milk system.
Id be very slow to lease out stock purely from a disease point of view and i like my cows and would be worried that whoever had them wouldnt feed or manage them to the level i would

can you elaborate

the winter milk cow should be no different to a spring cow-high ebi

150-200kg milk 35kg solids and +.30 on % and plus 100 on fert

mahoney_j

stanflt wrote: »

can you elaborate

the winter milk cow should be no different to a spring cow-high ebi

150-200kg milk 35kg solids and +.30 on % and plus 100 on fert

More or less as you have outlined,My milk pd is currently+140,and kg of solids is 34.Heered ebi 151.If i had a low pd milk ainmal like a british freisan or x breed i wouldnt bother.i just feel that you need a high production/High solids cow with good fertility to justify the extra cost of producing winter milk.Plan would be to calve 15 to 20 cows for winter milk and milk whatever april calvers i have on to feb 1

mahoney_j

Timmaay wrote: »

Fair enough Miliked out, no TMR/diet feeder here, which makes the parlour feeders an utter must. With the batch feeders you can do things like rope 4 of them together, you don't have to feed the whole row the same amount. Should be fairly easy to pull out the batch feeders and throw in other feeders if you wanted to down the road also.

Mahoney, you love hardship . Only messing, I guess you have different priorities with a young family etc. Out of interest, is the winter milk going to be in the form of expansion (ie extra cows over what you currently have), or will you be taking them out of the spring ladies? And are you going winter milk to allow yourself to push up the milking platform SR, and if so what are you expecting it to go?

Winter herd will be breed from within.Quota restriction means i always have more stock than needs be.Currently opperaye an 10 to 11 week breeding season for spring ,Will extend this to 12 .Plan to calve 16 to 20 fresh cows for winter milk and milk april calvers to feb 1.Milk platform stocked at 2.5 and plan on shoving this to 3 or 3.2.Also have outside block .Post 2015 i will sell all bulls bar maby 10 of the high ebi for breeding and only have in calf heifers and heifer calves.Will have to buy in some winter feed (trying out 10 acres of wholecrop wheat next year)and after that if it works out maby 10 to 15 acres of maize.Over 80% of milking block and outside block reseeded in last 5 years.By the way i hate hardship!!we were winter milking about 12 years ago but i hated it especially around christmass as i had different priorities namely the ladies and having a good time,Thats all out of the system now though.....

Mulumpy

mahoney_j wrote: »

More or less as you have outlined,My milk pd is currently+140,and kg of solids is 34.Heered ebi 151.If i had a low pd milk ainmal like a british freisan or x breed i wouldnt bother.i just feel that you need a high production/High solids cow with good fertility to justify the extra cost of producing winter milk.Plan would be to calve 15 to 20 cows for winter milk and milk whatever april calvers i have on to feb 1

Great figures there J don't think could ever see myself in winter milk. Like my 8week break from milking too much. Much happier to hold onto my Coop job and gets much out of the cows I have.

mahoney_j

Mulumpy wrote: »

Great figures there J don't think could ever see myself in winter milk. Like my 8week break from milking too much. Much happier to hold onto my Coop job and gets much out of the cows I have.

Get your neighbour to stick in a robot,Yo could keep the job and the cows milking on auto pilot for the winter and youd be loaded!!!!!!!!!

Mulumpy

mahoney_j wrote: »

Get your neighbour to stick in a robot,Yo could keep the job and the cows milking on auto pilot for the winter and youd be loaded!!!!!!!!!

Ha ha I dont think the boss man there would be too happy about that.

Timmaay

mahoney_j wrote: »

More or less as you have outlined,My milk pd is currently+140,and kg of solids is 34

Just looking at mine now, +134, but kg solids only 13kg, maybe I should consider afew JE straws to improve that :P. But nay, calves coming through are average 18kg, so at least I'm going the right direction, I think I'll use sexed straws on the higher solids/high fertility cows next year, and breed replacements more selectively if they hold.

delaval

mahoney_j wrote: »

Im 99% sure im going to get into winter milk and this is the route i think ill go.Plan on calving from around 10 october to end of november and keep fresh calvers indoors ,Maby out bt day for a few hours if weather is dry.That way diet is stable and consistent and peak will last longer .in spring herd my current average peak yield would be around 33 ltrs and for autumn girls id be aiming for 40 to 45 .diet would consist of high dmd wraps ,Whole crop wheat and a hi maize 18% blend in parlour feed to yield.Am i stone mad to be even considerimg getting into liquid???.All facalities in place and have cows to suit winter milk system.
Id be very slow to lease out stock purely from a disease point of view and i like my cows and would be worried that whoever had them wouldnt feed or manage them to the level i would

J,
I don't think you're mad at all. The one thing I would consider carefully is the contract type you'd be getting onto. Is it a purely liquid contract or is it a winter type scheme like Baileys? Will it be with your existing co-op?

Farfield

Well up north where we are most dairy farms are in what i would call all year round milk/calving - no real blocks at all. I myself would like to get mine into a spring block and an autumn block - its just so hard to see a cow bulling and hold off serving to bring them into a block line period as this will leave them dry for months and to scrap them is difficult because they are perfectly good cows. I suppose its just a "bite the bullet" for a year or so and try to bring some forward and hold off on some others - god ther'll be some amount of dry cows for a year!!

Milked out

only ones that roll from one block to the other here are the ones that have the milk to pay their way, if they aren't milking well and not in calf give em the road, there should be no need to dry them off longer than is necessary part of the advantage of milking all year round going forward will be the ability to get the most out of the lactation length,as you'll be milking anyway, depending on body condition, etc.

jersey101

Farfield wrote: »

Well up north where we are most dairy farms are in what i would call all year round milk/calving - no real blocks at all. I myself would like to get mine into a spring block and an autumn block - its just so hard to see a cow bulling and hold off serving to bring them into a block line period as this will leave them dry for months and to scrap them is difficult because they are perfectly good cows. I suppose its just a "bite the bullet" for a year or so and try to bring some forward and hold off on some others - god ther'll be some amount of dry cows for a year!!

holding up your heifers would be the easiest way to do it. I have 8 heifers that im putting in calve for next winters milk. Havent decided wether to synchronize them yet or let them go naturally. I seen 4 bulling two weeks ago and two since friday. Hopeing to have them calving in the first weks of sept. Never sycronised here before so im a bit skeptical

Farfield

Yea, i also plan to hold the heifers for next autumn at this stage and cull some and milk away at others to get at least some contribution from them until they land in the next block calving season. If it happened again though to them they are for the road.
I have never syncronised either but the neighbours do and it seems to work well. I just dont fancy 15 heifers all calving inside 10 days and trying to train them all to the parlour at one go. Might be the quickest way to do it but i will let them go naturally myself.

delaval

jersey101 wrote: »

holding up your heifers would be the easiest way to do it. I have 8 heifers that im putting in calve for next winters milk. Havent decided wether to synchronize them yet or let them go naturally. I seen 4 bulling two weeks ago and two since friday. Hopeing to have them calving in the first weks of sept. Never sycronised here before so im a bit skeptical

A board from IGA open day might help.

We synchronise a different way. We AI standing heats for 7 days and est the remainder followed by ai on sight

delaval

Farfield wrote: »

Yea, i also plan to hold the heifers for next autumn at this stage and cull some and milk away at others to get at least some contribution from them until they land in the next block calving season. If it happened again though to them they are for the road.
I have never syncronised either but the neighbours do and it seems to work well. I just dont fancy 15 heifers all calving inside 10 days and trying to train them all to the parlour at one go. Might be the quickest way to do it but i will let them go naturally myself.

Calve all together and get hardship out of the way, that's what we do. All heifers synch to calve just before cows. Not all hold but it's a busy fortnight but out of the way

jersey101

delaval wrote: »

A board from IGA open day might help.

We synchronise a different way. We AI standing heats for 7 days and est the remainder followed by ai on sight

i was going to do it in the spring alright because ill have alot more heifers. Would you bother with 8 though?? I suppose it wouldnt be a bad number to do it on for your first time

loveta

delaval wrote: »

Calve all together and get hardship out of the way, that's what we do. All heifers synch to calve just before cows. Not all hold but it's a busy fortnight but out of the way[/QUOTE

I would not have a tight calving spread but 80% of the hefs normally calve over 3-4 weeks l let them through the parlour for about 10-15 days before they calve and put cheno on the teats and a kg of nuts did not need a kick bar on one of them in fact they be busting to get in

Farfield

Do you run your heifers with the herd then for the last 2-3 weeks prior to calving or do you keep them seperated from the herd until they calf? I run mine through the parlour alright a good few times before they calf but keep them in a separate pen until they calf and join the herd.

delaval

jersey101 wrote: »

i was going to do it in the spring alright because ill have alot more heifers. Would you bother with 8 though?? I suppose it wouldnt be a bad number to do it on for your first time

8, you'll prob get 5 in first week, inject 3 and get to ai 2 more. Conception should be 60%. That's 5 in calf and the rest 3 wks later calving. So you'll have all 8? Calved in 3 weeks. Would you use sexed semen? The frozen sexed worked well for us this year, wil use on all heifers in the spring not sure about the cows

delaval

loveta wrote: »

delaval wrote: »

Calve all together and get hardship out of the way, that's what we do. All heifers synch to calve just before cows. Not all hold but it's a busy fortnight but out of the way[/QUOTE

I would not have a tight calving spread but 80% of the hefs normally calve over 3-4 weeks l let them through the parlour for about 10-15 days before they calve and put cheno on the teats and a kg of nuts did not need a kick bar on one of them in fact they be busting to get in

We do the same and spray udders with conditioner to ease oedema. It's amazing how they get used to it.

delaval

Farfield wrote: »

Do you run your heifers with the herd then for the last 2-3 weeks prior to calving or do you keep them seperated from the herd until they calf? I run mine through the parlour alright a good few times before they calf but keep them in a separate pen until they calf and join the herd.

We mix with dry cows from Jan on to 'socialise' them and cows lead them through parlour

jersey101

delaval wrote: »

8, you'll prob get 5 in first week, inject 3 and get to ai 2 more. Conception should be 60%. That's 5 in calf and the rest 3 wks later calving. So you'll have all 8? Calved in 3 weeks. Would you use sexed semen? The frozen sexed worked well for us this year, wil use on all heifers in the spring not sure about the cows[/quote

said it to the father during dinner and got a point blank no. Another job on my hands now to get him to agree to it ha.
Ye if i could calve em all in 3 weeks id be happy. Id get my 6 weeks calving in not to long if i put in the effort.
Ye i wouldn't mind using the sexed semen. If i got 8 heifets out of them that would be all the heifers id need. We used tge semen advantage a few year ago and got on really well with it got 75% heifers

whelan1

delaval wrote: »

We mix with dry cows from Jan on to 'socialise' them and cows lead them through parlour

We do this too and have milking machine on to get them used to it and radio

jersey101

does any one else cows fight like pure tinkers when you bring freshly calved cows in with the main herd? Mine do and they would nearly kill each other. Ive heard that only cross breeds will do it but im not sure

delaval

whelan1 wrote: »

We do this too and have milking machine on to get them used to it and radio

A radio in the parlour, Jesus what next?

Farfield

Jersey main are all Brit friesien and they fight like hell also. That's why I don't like putting the heifers in with the herd 2 weeks before they calf. I would love to run all together to get all used t parlour but one of the heifers threw the calf last year 3 weeks before her due date as a result of fighting.

jersey101

Farfield wrote: »

Jersey main are all Brit friesien and they fight like hell also. That's why I don't like putting the heifers in with the herd 2 weeks before they calf. I would love to run all together to get all used t parlour but one of the heifers threw the calf last year 3 weeks before her due date as a result of fighting.

we normally throw them all in together before they calve. Stay with them for a while untill they calm down and tgere grand. But when they calve down the young cows go straight for the older ones. Lost a few cows over the years from this

Timmaay

delaval wrote: »

8, you'll prob get 5 in first week, inject 3 and get to ai 2 more. Conception should be 60%. That's 5 in calf and the rest 3 wks later calving. So you'll have all 8? Calved in 3 weeks. Would you use sexed semen? The frozen sexed worked well for us this year, wil use on all heifers in the spring not sure about the cows

We haven't scanned yet, but disappointing enough conception rates with the heifers, afew of them were served 4 times. Minerals shouldn't be a problem with them, always had licks. Fert subindex isn't bad either, most around the 100 or so. I think I'll use sexed semen on some of the better cows, I'll see which usual hold to the 1st serve. Anyone know if there is much correlation there, ie if a cow say held 1st serve 2 yrs in a row is she lightly to the 3rd year?

mahoney_j

Timmaay wrote: »

We haven't scanned yet, but disappointing enough conception rates with the heifers, afew of them were served 4 times. Minerals shouldn't be a problem with them, always had licks. Fert subindex isn't bad either, most around the 100 or so. I think I'll use sexed semen on some of the better cows, I'll see which usual hold to the 1st serve. Anyone know if there is much correlation there, ie if a cow say held 1st serve 2 yrs in a row is she lightly to the 3rd year?

How do y find the licks Tim??never used them as I think some will gorge themselves on them and others just won't like them at all.feed a dry cow mineral scatters twice a day on silAge ,would question what goes into those licks.did u ever pool a few blood samples to test for mineral deficiency s,did it this year after slightly disappointing scan and iodine levels were extremely low which my vet said would of been a big cause as all emptys bar 2 were cycling perfectly and no cysts etc

Timmaay

We feed the cows a mineral scatter, heifers got left a bucket of minerals as they are feed in a ring feeder and my dad certainly wasn't going to jump into one to throw minerals around ha. But I thought an animal will only gorge themselves if they are lacking in some mineral? But it certainly could be a factor, abit of bullying etc might result in some heifers not getting to the lick at all, I'll lob in more from the mineral bags this winter. Now that I have 2 fairly distinct calving seasons, I'll definitely be prescanning before both autumn and spring breeding seasons to try and catch issues likes cysts/retained clearings etc.

mahoney_j

Timmaay wrote: »

We feed the cows a mineral scatter, heifers got left a bucket of minerals as they are feed in a ring feeder and my dad certainly wasn't going to jump into one to throw minerals around ha. But I thought an animal will only gorge themselves if they are lacking in some mineral? But it certainly could be a factor, abit of bullying etc might result in some heifers not getting to the lick at all, I'll lob in more from the mineral bags this winter. Now that I have 2 fairly distinct calving seasons, I'll definitely be prescanning before both autumn and spring breeding seasons to try and catch issues likes cysts/retained clearings etc.

Sorry Tim for heifers I meant a bolus,that way u know each ainmAl is getting an equal amount..I bolus heifer calves with all sure calf bolus in may at first dose again at housing and then the full all sure bus before breeding in early April.serious shine of heifers since I started this.this year had one out of 28 empty and one with cyst in womb after 10 weeks ai with over 60% hiding to first service and only 2 served 3 times

Milked out

delaval wrote: »

A radio in the parlour, Jesus what next?

The way county boards and GAA are fixing games at milking times you could hardly go without it! Helps with cows being used to voices in parlour when recording, etc. as well, or me giving out...:o

jersey101

mahoney_j wrote: »

Sorry Tim for heifers I meant a bolus,that way u know each ainmAl is getting an equal amount..I bolus heifer calves with all sure calf bolus in may at first dose again at housing and then the full all sure bus before breeding in early April.serious shine of heifers since I started this.this year had one out of 28 empty and one with cyst in womb after 10 weeks ai with over 60% hiding to first service and only 2 served 3 times

we put minerals through the water here. Right job had two cases of milk fever last year and no tetany in years. Always good bulling and conception too. Cant complain after that. Going to do bloods this year to see if any thing is low

delaval

Timmaay wrote: »

We feed the cows a mineral scatter, heifers got left a bucket of minerals as they are feed in a ring feeder and my dad certainly wasn't going to jump into one to throw minerals around ha. But I thought an animal will only gorge themselves if they are lacking in some mineral? But it certainly could be a factor, abit of bullying etc might result in some heifers not getting to the lick at all, I'll lob in more from the mineral bags this winter. Now that I have 2 fairly distinct calving seasons, I'll definitely be prescanning before both autumn and spring breeding seasons to try and catch issues likes cysts/retained clearings etc.

I'll tell you for free that prescanning is a waste of money. A load of hormones will be prescribed with the same result.
An easier and more effective way is to record heats and get vet to check non cyclers.
Pre calving mins adlib (powder) is the job, cows in correct BCS and the least intervention the better. If a cow is not cleaning quickly a bottle if cal in the vein one under skin can really help

Milked out

delaval wrote: »

8, you'll prob get 5 in first week, inject 3 and get to ai 2 more. Conception should be 60%. That's 5 in calf and the rest 3 wks later calving. So you'll have all 8? Calved in 3 weeks. Would you use sexed semen? The frozen sexed worked well for us this year, wil use on all heifers in the spring not sure about the cows

I find diet consistency is key when breeding heifers, with the autumn heifers I got 90% conception to first service, the spring girls I only got 60%, with one difference that the winter diet is the same and spring grass can vary depending on conditions. then again that could be down to me as much as anything as would be easier to watch autumn girls in shed, and the april routine would be a bit busier on farm

Timmaay

delaval wrote: »

If a cow is not cleaning quickly a bottle if cal in the vein one under skin can really help

When you say not cleaning quick, as in retained her clearings? Had about 6 in total that retained clearings, I use to remove the clearings afew 5days, put in two of the tablets for it and inject some antibotics for it. Of them 6, 4 came in heat as per normal in April/may, never showed up in heat after it, then were bloody empty on an early scan in July. So different approach need this year!

Mahoney, I don't give bullets to the heifers, Need to dose them soon so that would be the time to start, http://www.magentadirect.ie/proddetail.php?prod=ALLSURESPOFFER&cat=23 using these bolus at the minute on the cows.

delaval

Timmaay wrote: »

When you say not cleaning quick, as in retained her clearings? Had about 6 in total that retained clearings, I use to remove the clearings afew 5days, put in two of the tablets for it and inject some antibotics for it. Of them 6, 4 came in heat as per normal in April/may, never showed up in heat after it, then were bloody empty on an early scan in July. So different approach need this year!

Mahoney, I don't give bullets to the heifers, Need to dose them soon so that would be the time to start, http://www.magentadirect.ie/proddetail.php?prod=ALLSURESPOFFER&cat=23 using these bolus at the minute on the cows.

I mean as in anything out side the normal time it would take.