Estate agent wants references from my visitors?

SpaceRocket

I am renting a house 4 years and am now having issues with my estate agent and landlord.
(I live in a small town where everyone knows everyone elses business, however i am a "blow-in".)
My girlfriend stays over a couple of nights a week, usually at the weekend. I stay over some nights in her privately rented house also.
The estate agent is looking for references from her and an increase in rent as they claim she is living with me. She is not living with me though, and this i have already stated to the estate agent.
I want to apply to the PRTB as i think i am being treated unfairly here, however the tenancy is not registered.
Where do i stand?

BTW - I only began seeing this girl during the summer, so things are still new and it would be ridiculous of me to ask her to provide references so she can visit my house when the subject of us living together has not even been approached yet!

Mrs OBumble

Talk to the PRTB anyway, the non-registration is not your fault.

Kenny Logins

Why would the rent go up with the number of occupants?!

SpaceRocket

It's the fact that she is not an occupant of my house, she is solely a guest/visitor.
My mother drops over a lot too, yet they are not asking me for references for her...

I've never come across this before and am quite stunned by their insistance that if someone sometimes stays overnight in my home that they are now deemed occupants?

Kenny Logins

I know, but even if she was an occupant why would the rent go up? ..and why would they need references, if you're still the main rent-paying tenant?

Your agent and landlord sound like right pair of chancers.

SpaceRocket

Chancers is right, I'm going to have to alert the PRTB as to their non registration so I can make an official complaint.

foggy_lad

SpaceRocket wrote: »

It's the fact that she is not an occupant of my house, she is solely a guest/visitor.
My mother drops over a lot too, yet they are not asking me for references for her...

I've never come across this before and am quite stunned by their insistance that if someone sometimes stays overnight in my home that they are now deemed occupants?

You are entitled to have her stay over a few nights a week if you so chose. And you are entitled to stay ovet at her place. Tell the estate agent you are referring the matter to the PRTB and they will decide on it. Even though the place may not be registered you can still avail of all the services and protections of the prtb who may even fine the landlord for not being registered.

foggy_lad

SpaceRocket wrote: »

Chancers is right, I'm going to have to alert the PRTB as to their non registration so I can make an official complaint.

You can still make your complaint regardless of the place being unregistered. The PRTB will deal separately with your landlord over not being registered.

Synyster Shadow

The only rent that can go up is that of a council house if (which she's not) she's living with you privately is not based on how many live there. You can share the house and bills with a cousin or friend should you choose.

But I wouldn stand for the treatment your gettin. Next he'll want your weekly income put down on paper

gaius c

It's pretty outrageous to be frank.

SpaceRocket

Thanks for the advice. I would not be someone who would usually involve an agency such as the PRTB in a dispute, but I don't know how to deal with these people on my own as I feel they are being completely unreasonable with their demands.
It is disconcerting that neighbours went to the estate agent informing him that there was someone staying over in the property from time to time.
I will contact the PRTB and see what they can do to help me out with this.

gaius c

SpaceRocket wrote: »

Thanks for the advice. I would not be someone who would usually involve an agency such as the PRTB in a dispute, but I don't know how to deal with these people on my own as I feel they are being completely unreasonable with their demands.
It is disconcerting that neighbours went to the estate agent informing him that there was someone staying over in the property from time to time.
I will contact the PRTB and see what they can do to help me out with this.

Any anti-social behaviour going on?
That's very underhanded stuff from them.

petes

Where the hell is this place...Royston Vasey??

dissed doc

SpaceRocket wrote: »

I am renting a house 4 years and am now having issues with my estate agent and landlord.
(I live in a small town where everyone knows everyone elses business, however i am a "blow-in".)
My girlfriend stays over a couple of nights a week, usually at the weekend. I stay over some nights in her privately rented house also.
The estate agent is looking for references from her and an increase in rent as they claim she is living with me. She is not living with me though, and this i have already stated to the estate agent.
I want to apply to the PRTB as i think i am being treated unfairly here, however the tenancy is not registered.
Where do i stand?

BTW - I only began seeing this girl during the summer, so things are still new and it would be ridiculous of me to ask her to provide references so she can visit my house when the subject of us living together has not even been approached yet!

That is a completely unreasonable thing to demand.

She is a guest, not a tenant. Therefore they can be told to f off.

Secondly, the rent can be raised only in accordance with the market in the area.

Read the tenancy agreement and make sure you have not broken any of it.

murphaph

Kenny Logins wrote: »

Why would the rent go up with the number of occupants?!

More wear and tear. Leases can specify maximum occupancy. Imagine a case where a LL rents a 3 bed house and a family of 10 moves in.

However, casual visitors cannot be prevented. The law clearly states that.

Stereomaniac

Sounds like the landlord is just chancing their arm in this situation.

Kenny Logins

murphaph wrote: »

More wear and tear. Leases can specify maximum occupancy. Imagine a case where a LL rents a 3 bed house and a family of 10 moves in.

However, casual visitors cannot be prevented. The law clearly states that.

Ok, yeah, that's fair enough, but not the case here.

The_Conductor

magicman88 wrote: »

I'd torch the house

Thats nice.
You can consider your responses to posts in this forum during your 5 day ban.
Anyone else advocating arson- or any illegal activity- will have a similar posting holiday.

Regards,

The_Conductor

foggy_lad

Stereomaniac wrote: »

Sounds like the landlord is just chancing their arm in this situation.

more likely that the LL has a local person watching the house to see that there is no wild parties or sub-letting etc and has been told someone else has moved in.

the_syco

SpaceRocket wrote: »

The estate agent is looking for references from her and an increase in rent as they claim she is living with me.

Sounds like they disapprove of your relationship out of wedlock. Eg; religious bullsh|t... Are there any other houses to rent in the town?

djimi

Tell the estate agent/landlord in no uncertain terms to piss off with themselves, and if they have an issue then tell them to take a case with the PRTB themselves and see how far they get. Bunch of absolute clowns.

The_Conductor

djimi wrote: »

Tell the estate agent/landlord in no uncertain terms to piss off with themselves, and if they have an issue then tell them to take a case with the PRTB themselves and see how far they get. Bunch of absolute clowns.

They can't they're not actually an interested party. The PSR (Property Services Regulator) on the other hand........

djimi

the_syco wrote: »

Sounds like they disapprove of your relationship out of wedlock. Eg; religious bullsh|t... Are there any other houses to rent in the town?

I went with a former girlfriend when she was viewing a house sometime back, and when she enquired about getting a double bed (there was only a single bed in the house) the landlady looked genuinely confused and asked what she would be needing one of those for. Some people live such backwards sheltered lives its unbelievable, but it wouldnt surprise me at all if it was the case here also.

sunnysoutheast

SpaceRocket wrote: »

Thanks for the advice. I would not be someone who would usually involve an agency such as the PRTB in a dispute, but I don't know how to deal with these people on my own as I feel they are being completely unreasonable with their demands.
It is disconcerting that neighbours went to the estate agent informing him that there was someone staying over in the property from time to time.
I will contact the PRTB and see what they can do to help me out with this.

Is there any back story to this situation - disputes over parking, parties, subletting, whatever - the whole thing just seems a bit odd to me.

The landlord is entitled to review the rent versus the local market (as are you) and request a change accordingly. You can appeal any increase to the PRTB, whether the tenancy is registered or not.

Note that if you have been there 4 years a new 4 year tenancy cycle starts - and you can be issued with a NoT in the first six months.

syklops

When I was looking for where Im living now I rang up a place enquiring about a place and I said Im looking for somewhere for me an my partner. The response I got was "Is it a man or a woman or whats the story?", and I said "Im a man and she is a woman", "And are ye married?" and I said "no", and he goes, "Well I don't have anything anyway". People are weird.

sunnysoutheast

djimi wrote: »

I went with a former girlfriend when she was viewing a house sometime back, and when she enquired about getting a double bed (there was only a single bed in the house) the landlady looked genuinely confused and asked what she would be needing one of those for. Some people live such backwards sheltered lives its unbelievable, but it wouldnt surprise me at all if it was the case here also.

Was she a former girlfriend when you looked round the place with her? - a slightly awkward conversation would then follow as to why she needed a double bed

djimi

sunnysoutheast wrote: »

Was she a former girlfriend when you looked round the place with her? - a slightly awkward conversation would then follow as to why she needed a double bed

Ha no she was current at the time

Victor

SpaceRocket wrote: »

My mother drops over a lot too, yet they are not asking me for references for her...

Have the parish priest, doctor and local dignitaries do reference for your mother and tell the agent / landlord to sod off.

gaius c

syklops wrote: »

When I was looking for where Im living now I rang up a place enquiring about a place and I said Im looking for somewhere for me an my partner. The response I got was "Is it a man or a woman or whats the story?", and I said "Im a man and she is a woman", "And are ye married?" and I said "no", and he goes, "Well I don't have anything anyway". People are weird.

Slightly off-topic but there's been a number of cases with similar stuff happening with B&B's.

wirelessdude01

How did they frame this request? What happens if you don't comply with the request?

djimi

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

How did they frame this request? What happens if you don't comply with the request?

Nothing, legally. Im sure the PRTB would have a field day if the landlord tried to terminate the lease based on this nonsense.

wirelessdude01

djimi wrote: »

Nothing, legally. Im sure the PRTB would have a field day if the landlord tried to terminate the lease based on this nonsense.

I'm wondering what the estate agent/landlord said would happen to the OP.

No Pants

Complain to the PRTB definitely. That's a given.

The request for references, has it been made in writing? If not, ask for it in writing, explaining why the request has been made and details on how any data collected belonging to third parties (your girlfriend, other visitors) will be treated in accordance with the Data Protection Act. That it will not be shared with others, etc.

If he doesn't furnish you with such a request in writing, yet brings the matter up again verbally, then you should send him a query in writing yourself.

Grandpa Hassan

Before you do all this, have you actually explained to the LL and agent the situation? The LL may just be under the impression that someone else has moved in, and therefore is requesting references (as I would if someone moved in who was not on the lease...:I want to be sure I know and am comfortable with who is living in my house). Incidentally, if it were a gf/bf moving in I would be happy to just leave it be, or it were explained it was someone staying over now and then it wouldn't be an issue, but how would I know if I wasn't told?

Are you sure the LL knows the situation?

happywithlife

It could be neighbours trying to make life difficult if you are prone to having parties etc - not anti social but just run of the mill in your 20's kinda stuff... Otherwise it seems very very odd
Maybe try to make peace with them or tone it down

the_syco

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the OP is renting the entire house, so if they have such silly requests, ensure they give them to you in writing.

Mrs OBumble

Grandpa Hassan wrote: »

Before you do all this, have you actually explained to the LL and agent the situation? The LL may just be under the impression that someone else has moved in, and therefore is requesting references (as I would if someone moved in who was not on the lease...:I want to be sure I know and am comfortable with who is living in my house).

If I was renting an entire house, and subletting was allowed in my lease and I decided to sublet a room or half of my bed to someone, then I would tell you to put your request for references into a very dark, place where there is very little sunshine.

djimi

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

If I was renting an entire house, and subletting was allowed in my lease and I decided to sublet a room or half of my bed to someone, then I would tell you to put your request for references into a very dark, place where there is very little sunshine.

It would be very unusual for subletting to be allowed as part of the lease; the norm would be for a lease to specify that subletting is forbidden.

Grandpa Hassan

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

If I was renting an entire house, and subletting was allowed in my lease and I decided to sublet a room or half of my bed to someone, then I would tell you to put your request for references into a very dark, place where there is very little sunshine.

I've never seen a lease where subletting is permitted

Ray Palmer

djimi wrote: »

It would be very unusual for subletting to be allowed as part of the lease; the norm would be for a lease to specify that subletting is forbidden.

This would also explain why a LL would ask for reference for somebody if they thought they were moved in. Also looking for a rent increase.

I know LL who have given discounted rent for one person to move into a house. If they moved somebody in they would be breaking the lease and I would expect to increase the rent as if no discount was applied.

djimi

Ray Palmer wrote: »

This would also explain why a LL would ask for reference for somebody if they thought they were moved in. Also looking for a rent increase.

I know LL who have given discounted rent for one person to move into a house. If they moved somebody in they would be breaking the lease and I would expect to increase the rent as if no discount was applied.

It doesnt explain why they thought that someone was moving in though. Surely any rational person would ask the question first rather than just make wild assumptions and start asking for references etc?

Ray Palmer

djimi wrote: »

It doesnt explain why they thought that someone was moving in though. Surely any rational person would ask the question first rather than just make wild assumptions and start asking for references etc?

Any rational LL wouldn't believe their tenant and believe the neighbour whom they probably know longer.

I gave you a logical reasoning do with it as you please.

ElKavo

SpaceRocket wrote: »

so things are still new and it would be ridiculous of me to ask her to provide references so she can visit my house when the subject of us living together has not even been approached yet!

You should ask here for references before she moves in for sure!! but for your own peace of mind not the landlords.....

You never know she may be a bunny boiler!

Ah No I Jest. That is possibly the most ridiculous thing I have heard in a while.

Onthe3rdDay

Ray Palmer wrote: »

Any rational LL wouldn't believe their tenant and believe the neighbour whom they probably know longer.

I gave you a logical reasoning do with it as you please.

I'd be very slow to believe neighbours especially when they own their houses.
People are very odd and If a neighbour takes a dislike to you, it's a problem.

Anyway what right does anyone have to spy on anyone else? would it be okay for the tenant to go to the landlords neighbours and ask questions about him?

And I do understand the hassle that some landlords are put under, but those that listen to neighbours are usually the amateurs, the same ones that don't register with the PRTB.

Pawwed Rig

Onthe3rdDay wrote: »

And I do understand the hassle that some landlords are put under, but those that listen to neighbours are usually the amateurs, the same ones that don't register with the PRTB.

And if a neighbour makes a complaint to the PRTB about a tenant then who is ultimately responsible??
Answer - The Landlord.

Onthe3rdDay

Pawwed Rig wrote: »

And if a neighbour makes a complaint to the PRTB about a tenant then who is ultimately responsible??
Answer - The Landlord.

I understand what you're saying but many complaints Neighbours make are ridiculous especially in this country. I've been a tenant and a representative for a landlord in the past and some complaints I've heard have included...

He gets too many parcels...
He doesn't turn the houselights out...as in the living room/bedroom lights.
Her children are destroying my garden.... the woman didn't have any children!
That's not counting the usual She's too many men visiting her.

Certain people here who own property are very snobby, add to that the moral attitudes of some and you're looking at a world of pain for both landlords and tenants.

Ray Palmer

Onthe3rdDay wrote: »

I'd be very slow to believe neighbours especially when they own their houses.
People are very odd and If a neighbour takes a dislike to you, it's a problem.

Anyway what right does anyone have to spy on anyone else? would it be okay for the tenant to go to the landlords neighbours and ask questions about him?

And I do understand the hassle that some landlords are put under, but those that listen to neighbours are usually the amateurs, the same ones that don't register with the PRTB.

I have been at this a long time and you will get the nosey neighbour but as time goes on you can get a feel for the neighbours. You will know and have to deal with the neighbours more than tenants over time.

Most neighbours just want a quite life where as a tenant is often not bothered about the local community. It is just the nature of people. If a neighbour complained about every tenant then you know not to trust them but that has yet to happen.

I did have one guy who wanted to buy the house constantly complain about every tenants including ring the Gardaí saying there was drug dealing going on in the house. It took the 4th complaint before the Gardaí realised that it might not be true and the neighbour was ringing in these tips. They had a word with him and the tip offs stopped.

In my experience most neighbour complaints are valid and tenants often lie about stuff. I take a reasoned view like Judge Judy

Rosier

Ray Palmer wrote: »

I have been at this a long time and you will get the nosey neighbour but as time goes on you can get a feel for the neighbours. You will know and have to deal with the neighbours more than tenants over time.

Most neighbours just want a quite life where as a tenant is often not bothered about the local community. It is just the nature of people. If a neighbour complained about every tenant then you know not to trust them but that has yet to happen.

I did have one guy who wanted to buy the house constantly complain about every tenants including ring the Gardaí saying there was drug dealing going on in the house. It took the 4th complaint before the Gardaí realised that it might not be true and the neighbour was ringing in these tips. They had a word with him and the tip offs stopped.

In my experience most neighbour complaints are valid and tenants often lie about stuff. I take a reasoned view like Judge Judy

Sad attitude. Would hate to rent from you!

And in my long experience of renting not true.

At present I am being harassed by a neighbour who has a down on my landlord and covets the house I rent.
His lies are legion.
Thankfully my landlord knows this.
OP; I feel for you and endorse that the PTRB is the way to go; Stay strong

Pawwed Rig

Onthe3rdDay wrote: »

I understand what you're saying but many complaints Neighbours make are ridiculous especially in this country. I've been a tenant and a representative for a landlord in the past and some complaints I've heard have included...

Who are you telling? I have gotten complaints that the garden is a mess sodrove down to look to find a couple of kids toys in the garden but nothing thatyou would even look twice at. I also get regular texts by the neighbours saying'the grass needs to be cut'.
I did have one tenant who was a nightmare with severe anti-socialbehaviour and I am talking about blood all over the driveway here along withsmashing up the neighbours cars. I eventually got her out but the PRTB were nohelp and sided with her at every turn. I eventually got a settlement of €150despite her not paying rent and causing thousands of damage to the house. I wassubtlety threatened by the PRTB that if any part of the eviction process wasdeemed to be illegal that it would cost me alot of money.
This person came with references btw

The_Conductor

pippip wrote: »

I think you need a break, you already banned that poster

Doh- perhaps I do need a break.

Rosier

Pawwed Rig wrote: »

Who are you telling? I have gotten complaints that the garden is a mess sodrove down to look to find a couple of kids toys in the garden but nothing thatyou would even look twice at. I also get regular texts by the neighbours saying'the grass needs to be cut'.
I did have one tenant who was a nightmare with severe anti-socialbehaviour and I am talking about blood all over the driveway here along withsmashing up the neighbours cars. I eventually got her out but the PRTB were nohelp and sided with her at every turn. I eventually got a settlement of €150despite her not paying rent and causing thousands of damage to the house. I wassubtlety threatened by the PRTB that if any part of the eviction process wasdeemed to be illegal that it would cost me alot of money.
This person came with references btw

That is not a threat simply a reminder of the law.

Surely the smashing of the car was a criminal offence .