why are transfers not allowed?

Nanazolie

Hi

Most races don't allow transfers. I don't understand why? If you have paid the fee (usually quite hefty) for a race, why are you not allowed to transfer the race number in case you can't run it?
I've had to pull out of 2 races this year, costing me over a hundred euros. I am not looking for a refund but I'm upset I can't give the chance to someone who couldn't register. Surely, the number of participants stays the same in this case.

Even Ryan Air allows it

Timmaay

Don't they though? I organize a good few races (mostly club races I'll admit!), 2bh its something that I rarely come across, in that people never ask for either a refund or to transfer their number. But if they did, I wouldn't see an issue with someone changing or getting a refund, assuming they don't leave it too late (ie race envelopes with tags/bibs put together). I suppose moving forward, its something that should be clearly laid out in say terms and conditions, ie the method of getting a refund/name transfer, and timeframe that you can do it etc.

What the story with more expensive commercial races is I don't have a clue as I avoid them like the plague, especially when there are loads of cheap and very good quality club races every weekend, (for which, 100quid would get you 5-10 entries!)

Nanazolie

The half marathon and Dublin marathon don't allow transfers
I can understand why they won't refund the fees, they have quite a lot of charges with insurances, etc. The transfer rule, which is clearly stated on the website, baffles me

chinguetti

I don't know but i would guess it depends on resources. If you grant transfers for something like the Dublin marathon, you could have a few hundred changes from say 14,000 entries so that takes up time and a cost of updating names, addresses etc. on their database. Also, having being involved in many work related events where most people leave things until the last minute, it would become a bit of a head wrecker too.

I've had to pull out of two marathons and many smaller races so yeah, its a pain but if their rules are no transfers, you pay your money and take your chances.

Big Logger

I'd imagine its the admin costs and time, if you're transferring your number then the race organisers are not making money on it.
The larger the race the higher the numbers of people cancelling or transferring Its more difficult for the organisers of these big races, not like the small ones were organisers are responding themselves to your emails.
It might be an idea to do it and charge a small transfer fee.

rom

Nanazolie wrote: »

The half marathon and Dublin marathon don't allow transfers
I can understand why they won't refund the fees, they have quite a lot of charges with insurances, etc. The transfer rule, which is clearly stated on the website, baffles me

How about you volunteer this year, find out and report back?

Nanazolie

rom wrote: »

How about you volunteer this year, find out and report back?

Actually, that's an idea. I can't run because I injured myself badly and am still trying to walk without pain. But the pain will have (hopefully) eased then and I could volunteer on the day.

Good point about the admin costs. I'll send the organisers an email to ask whether they would do it for a fee.

rom

Nanazolie wrote: »

Actually, that's an idea. I can't run because I injured myself badly and am still trying to walk without pain. But the pain will have (hopefully) eased then and I could volunteer on the day.

Good point about the admin costs. I'll send the organisers an email to ask whether they would do it for a fee.

95 euro i would say but they will get a new number

RayCun

I think transfers are often allowed in races that will sell out very early. But most running races (including the Dublin half and Dublin marathon) allow entries up to a few weeks before the race. So if you're not very sure that you'll be able to run, why enter months in advance? Yes, it costs more to enter late, but is the extra charge more than a transfer fee would be? And if you're pulling out before race entry closes, nobody is missing out on a chance to run.

RacoonQueen

RayCun wrote: »

I think transfers are often allowed in races that will sell out very early. But most running races (including the Dublin half and Dublin marathon) allow entries up to a few weeks before the race. So if you're not very sure that you'll be able to run, why enter months in advance? Yes, it costs more to enter late, but is the extra charge more than a transfer fee would be? And if you're pulling out before race entry closes, nobody is missing out on a chance to run.

A now come on, a lot can happen in a year. If you enter Dublin marathon in November 2013 for October 2014 a whole multitude of things can happen in between. I got hit by a car the day after the closing date last year...

Best marathon I've seen is Rotterdam who offer refunds. I dropped out of Rotterdam quite late and got a large chunk of my entry fee refunded.

RayCun

RacoonQueen wrote: »

A now come on, a lot can happen in a year. If you enter Dublin marathon in November 2013 for October 2014 a whole multitude of things can happen in between. I got hit by a car the day after the closing date last year...

Sure, so why enter in November 2013 for October 2014? It's not going to sell out.

I know there are a few races - Warriors Run, triathlons, overseas marathons - where you have to enter months in advance. So yeah, there's a good reason to allow transfers there. A lot can happen between the time you have to book your place and the race date. But you can enter DCM up to 3/4 weeks before race day

average_runner

RayCun wrote: »

Sure, so why enter in November 2013 for October 2014? It's not going to sell out.

I know there are a few races - Warriors Run, triathlons, overseas marathons - where you have to enter months in advance. So yeah, there's a good reason to allow transfers there. A lot can happen between the time you have to book your place and the race date. But you can enter DCM up to 3/4 weeks before race day

But if you enter just before the deadline and then get injured 2 weeks out, surely a number swap should be allowed??

To be honest, its down to pure laziness and all it encourages is for people to run when ill or injured, which is stupid.

Apparently Tri lets number swapping.

RacoonQueen

RayCun wrote: »

Sure, so why enter in November 2013 for October 2014? It's not going to sell out.

I know there are a few races - Warriors Run, triathlons, overseas marathons - where you have to enter months in advance. So yeah, there's a good reason to allow transfers there. A lot can happen between the time you have to book your place and the race date. But you can enter DCM up to 3/4 weeks before race day

You know yourself there are a number of reasons why people enter early, for just three...
Excitement
So that they have their entry = they have to do it
It's cheaper

As I said, even when you enter with a couple of weeks to go...something can still come up to take you out of the race. So saying they shouldn't enter so early is a poor argument and does nothing to justify why transfers can not be facilitated. Not sure why there is a concentration on these two races, most organisers will not facilitate it in any way.

I'm not really bothered with doing any races that don't offer on the day entry anymore. I've lost out on too much money through races I wasn't able to do.

RayCun

average_runner wrote: »

But if you enter just before the deadline and then get injured 2 weeks out, surely a number swap should be allowed??

Number swaps in the last couple of weeks present other problems - the organisers are under the cosh for time and entrants lists may have been sent out already to the medical teams.
Triathlons sell out months in advance and have far fewer participants

RayCun

RacoonQueen wrote: »

You know yourself there are a number of reasons why people enter early, for just three...
Excitement
So that they have their entry = they have to do it
It's cheaper

Sure, but if you do all that in the knowledge that transfers are not allowed? That's a choice you can make - book early for those reasons, or book late and pay a bit more to have more chance that you'll run the race.

average_runner

RayCun wrote: »

Number swaps in the last couple of weeks present other problems - the organisers are under the cosh for time and entrants lists may have been sent out already to the medical teams.
Triathlons sell out months in advance and have far fewer participants

Thats an excuse, Edinburgh allows number swapping for their marathon and it has a bigger number than Dublin.

Does Dublin offer a deferal option if you get injured like other marathons?

RayCun

What's the difference between an excuse and a reason?

RayCun

Edinburgh marathon allows transfers for a £10 fee, up to 6 weeks before the race date.

average_runner

RayCun wrote: »

Edinburgh marathon allows transfers for a £10 fee, up to 6 weeks before the race date.

I have no problem with the fee part. Just think its an option that should be provided.
I am sure i could find other races that do it for free that would have 7,000 runners in it.

I just think it sends the wrong message, while you and i won't run unless we are fit and well, there is another 5 that probably would.

RacoonQueen

RayCun wrote: »

What's the difference between an excuse and a reason?

Massive difference between an excuse and a reason.

rom

This year your name is on your number. So they do another run at the printers, reorder t-shirts, possibly change portoloo allocation etc to benifit a few people. All this takes admin and will impact the costs for all and will simply invite people asking for transfers etc at the expo. You give them an inch abx they take a mile. I have entered races I couldnt do. Its not the race organsers problem if I get injured or sick. Btw a marathon is a race not a concert. Its a sport.

I would only look for a refund where the organiser was to blaim.

RacoonQueen

rom wrote: »

This year your name is on your number. So they do another run at the printers, reorder t-shirts, possibly change portoloo allocation etc to benifit a few people. All this takes admin and will impact the costs for all and will simply invite people asking for transfers etc at the expo. You give them an inch abx they take a mile. I have entered races I couldnt do. Its not the race organsers problem if I get injured or sick. Btw a marathon is a race not a concert. Its a sport.

I would only look for a refund where the organiser was to blaim.

There are none of these issues in Triathlon where race number swaps are facilitated. Or some other races where organisers will allow transfers and refunds up to a certain point. None of this bull about 'oh well triathlons sell out' some don't and they still allow this and it doesn't really matter whether a race sells out or not...

Race numbers don't *have* to have your name on them, it's a novelty. I would fold the name away if I could, wouldn't like it myself.

Some organisers will just make a note to change the name on the day etc
Races take entries on the day also, so that rules out that recurring arguement that names are submitted to emergency services and insurance companies long before the race takes place...

rom

Any tri in that 14k people do allow this ? I think its very unfair to be knocking dcm for this when they organized a backup marathon for new york runners last year. Op needs to get over it, life is too short.

RacoonQueen

rom wrote: »

Any tri in that 14k people do allow this ? I think its very unfair to be knocking dcm for this when they organized a backup marathon for new york runners last year. Op needs to get over it, life is too short.

I've already stated that this is not about DCM for me...

And the OP did not mention anything about this race either.

average_runner

rom wrote: »

Any tri in that 14k people do allow this ? I think its very unfair to be knocking dcm for this when they organized a backup marathon for new york runners last year. Op needs to get over it, life is too short.

No one is slagging dcm off here for it. In general all races should do it.

Edinburgh/Brighton(does it for free) marathon does it which has a bigger crowd.

Nanazolie

rom wrote: »

Any tri in that 14k people do allow this ? I think its very unfair to be knocking dcm for this when they organized a backup marathon for new york runners last year. Op needs to get over it, life is too short.

It is DCM actually, but that's not the point. The same rule applies for Dublin half marathon, which is nowhere as big as DCM
I'm not even looking for money back, I'd just be happy to give my number to someone who hasn't had a chance to register

2 years ago, I suffered a stress fracture 2 weeks before the race. At this stage, the registrations are closed so even if you leave it until the last minute, an accident can still happen after you've registered. And that time, names weren't printed on the bibs. I also don't understand the argument of portaloo allocation? If the number of runners stays the same, why impact does it have on portaloos?

rom

Nanazolie wrote: »

It is DCM actually, but that's not the point. The same rule applies for Dublin half marathon, which is nowhere as big as DCM
I'm not even looking for money back, I'd just be happy to give my number to someone who hasn't had a chance to register

2 years ago, I suffered a stress fracture 2 weeks before the race. At this stage, the registrations are closed so even if you leave it until the last minute, an accident can still happen after you've registered. And that time, names weren't printed on the bibs. I also don't understand the argument of portaloo allocation? If the number of runners stays the same, why impact does it have on portaloos?

So this is over 20 euros? They can still register on the DCM website up to 17:00 on the 1st of Oct.

I may be wrong if portoloos are shared or separate. Maybe I am thinking of another race.

Cabaal

Connemara allow you to defer your entry until the following year if you have a medical cert showing you can't do the race, least they did last year and the year before anyway

RayCun

Nanazolie wrote: »

It is DCM actually, but that's not the point. The same rule applies for Dublin half marathon, which is nowhere as big as DCM
I'm not even looking for money back, I'd just be happy to give my number to someone who hasn't had a chance to register

registration for DCM is still open, so anyone who wants to run still can

RacoonQueen

Cabaal wrote: »

Connemara allow you to defer your entry until the following year if you have a medical cert showing you can't do the race, least they did last year and the year before anyway

Yep and you can change from one race to another as you wish without any issues up to a month or so beforehand....and if you ask really nicely you can sometimes also change races in the few days leading up to the event. Numbers here bigger than a number of the other races in Ireland that do not allow deferrals or transfers.

RacoonQueen

RayCun wrote: »

registration for DCM is still open, so anyone who wants to run still can

All you're saying is you can't transfer numbers, tough sh*t. You're not actually responding to the actual thread which is ''Why are transfers not allowed?'' a question which no one has actually answered yet...

Nanazolie

rom wrote: »

So this is over 20 euros? They can still register on the DCM website up to 17:00 on the 1st of Oct.

I may be wrong if portoloos are shared or separate. Maybe I am thinking of another race.

Did I mention (twice) that I am NOT looking for my money back? I understand that the fees go towards insurance, organisation, etc. So no, it's not over 20 euros.

I still think that if airlines companies can do it for a fee, then any race should be able to (for a similar fee). I was contacted 2 years ago by a few people who would have loved to run the half marathon with my number, only I couldn't give it to them

RayCun

I was responding to this bit

I am not looking for a refund but I'm upset I can't give the chance to someone who couldn't register

There is no-one in this situation now.

I'm sure it's possible for DCM and other races to organise transfers. But it's extra work for volunteers to do, and people would complain if they charged for it almost as much as they complain about it not being possible, and it would reduce the number of places they sell, which has to be made up somewhere else.
And it's not such a big deal, in my mind anyway, because if you don't want to get stuck with an unused DCM entry you can leave it to the end of September to enter.

average_runner

RayCun wrote: »

I was responding to this bit


There is no-one in this situation now.

I'm sure it's possible for DCM and other races to organise transfers. But it's extra work for volunteers to do, and people would complain if they charged for it almost as much as they complain about it not being possible, and it would reduce the number of places they sell, which has to be made up somewhere else.
And it's not such a big deal, in my mind anyway, because if you don't want to get stuck with an unused DCM entry you can leave it to the end of September to enter.

At least give a deferral option. That seems to be the pattern of most marathons

pistol_75

RacoonQueen wrote: »

All you're saying is you can't transfer numbers, tough sh*t. You're not actually responding to the actual thread which is ''Why are transfers not allowed?'' a question which no one has actually answered yet...

While I'm sure most organisers will point to the admin, safety aspect etc. I'm pretty sure the main reason in most cases is to maximise the revenue of their event where they can.

PVincent

In fairness using Brighton as an example is a little bit off the mark . For April 2014 , your deadline to transfer a race no. was June 2013. Just a mere 10 months ahead of the race. It most surely is a logistics issue. How many transfers do we reckon there might be if Dublin allowed transfers, on the basis that at least 10/15% are no shows on the day. How many actually do give their number to someone else.. It is the norm for races not to permit transfers. I would hazard a guess that insurance rules is a big factor . On the basis that the original person fills in the 'contract' to take part in the race , signed the waivers/declarations etc etc, then you would need the person taking over the race number to do exactly the same for there to be a proper contract in place , rather than someone standing in for the original entrant. There are very very few races who allow it , so clearly there is a legal issue that prevents them doing it. Interestingly I noticed one race in America that will allow you to donate your entry fee to Charity if you tell them that you can't take part for medical reasons

911sc

RacoonQueen wrote: »

Why are transfers not allowed?'' a question which no one has actually answered yet...

some do, some don't... no real reason imo other than not wanted to deal with the additional admin involved.
Thumb up to Connemarathon which will postpone your entry for following year if you can't run.

tHE vAGGABOND

Joined a Tri club this year for the first time as I start move to the dark side, and amazed at the amount of "anyone want an entry for x race, I cant do it anymore" threads and emails for small little events you have not heard off, where 2+ years in running club you never get that [as no one allows it!]..

Second, to be fair, I entered Conn Full 2 years ago as a fall back for Paris for a complex [and frankly stupid..reason as they were on same day]; I deferred it to this year, changed marathon to ultra over winter - no problems. Injury stopped me doing it this year a bit late, and I was able to defer it to next year. So well run and organised races do allow you SOME flexibility.

ultraman1

I know of one race that kurt godel has defered 3 yrs in a row,,reckon he has to do d next one:)

ger664

I don't get this logistical problem. If a race can take entries online until x number of days before the off surely they should be able to process a number transfer for a small fee online. Its not rocket science and the person receiving the transfer would be able to click I agree not to sue you if I do something stupid disclaimer. If you ask me its a big money spinner for big events, which is why they don't do it.

RacoonQueen

A race I did in the UK a few years ago allowed transfers and defferals through their website. Filled in a form online (don't think there was a fee) and that was it. You deal with the money yourself if you've given your entry to someone else.

Hard Worker

There are a large number of reasons why refunds / deferrals may not be allowed. Take the Dublin Marathon for example. Approximate number of entries = 14000. The race budget is based on that number. If refunds / deferrals were allowed, the race entry fee would have to go up by approximately 10%. There are close to 2000 entrants each year who don't run, for whatever reason. That number would be even higher if people knew when entering that they had the option of a refund or deferral down the line if needed.
That is probably the main one. Other reasons have already been mentioned.

baza1976

I dont get why people register early. What you might gain by as a result of an early bird entry you have a risk of losing through injury our unforseen circumstances. I myself will wait till the last day to register. It might cost 20 euro more but I know if I'm injury free on that day I will more than likely be ok on race day.

Nanazolie

baza1976 wrote: »

I dont get why people register early. What you might gain by as a result of an early bird entry you have a risk of losing through injury our unforseen circumstances. I myself will wait till the last day to register. It might cost 20 euro more but I know if I'm injury free on that day I will more than likely be ok on race day.

Happened to me 2 years ago: stress fracture 2 weeks before the race. Registering at the last minute would have made no difference. Someone asked me whether I could transfer him my number, unfortunately I couldn't

BTW, I still haven't received any answer from DCM to my email offering to volunteer on the day

village runner

BTW, I still haven't received any answer from DCM to my email offering to volunteer on the day [/quote]

Hard worker will nab you. Personally I think offering to steward is top class.

RacoonQueen

Nanazolie wrote: »

Happened to me 2 years ago: stress fracture 2 weeks before the race. Registering at the last minute would have made no difference. Someone asked me whether I could transfer him my number, unfortunately I couldn't

Yeah and as I mentioned, I was hit by a car the day after entries closed last year. Anything can happen anytime...one boardsie was hit by ran into a van 2 days before a couple of years ago...

edit: This is the stage I wouldn't expect a refund etc btw just in response to the ''don't enter so early then'' argument

rom

baza1976 wrote: »

I dont get why people register early. What you might gain by as a result of an early bird entry you have a risk of losing through injury our unforseen circumstances. I myself will wait till the last day to register. It might cost 20 euro more but I know if I'm injury free on that day I will more than likely be ok on race day.

For people who are "doing" the marathon aka a tickbox they register to use it as they can't backout now kind of thing.

Hard Worker

village runner wrote: »

BTW, I still haven't received any answer from DCM to my email offering to volunteer on the day

Hard worker will nab you. Personally I think offering to steward is top class.[/QUOTE]

You guessed that one correctly

chinguetti

RacoonQueen wrote: »

Yeah and as I mentioned, I was hit by a car the day after entries closed last year. Anything can happen anytime...one boardsie was hit by ran into a van 2 days before a couple of years ago...

Ah yes, that was me. But i wouldn't have transferred the entry even if it was possible as well, i'm a bit focused. And i was still on target until mile 20:rolleyes:.