Marmotte 2014........

07Lapierre

Mayo self-build wrote: »

Was going well until 10 days ago when picked up chest infection, which I'm unfortunately prone to. Not good timing. Heading now for indoor turbo session to see if I can coax some life back into the legs.

07Lapierre - have you completed Marmotte previously? What advice would you have at this stage, with about 14 weeks to go?

Yep, this will be my 3rd trip.

I've been averaging 100-150klm per week over the winter and I've done one or two 100klm+ spins.

I suggest you sign up for some sportives. I've signed up for the Mt Leinster Challenge and the WW200 so far. I 'll probably do the Kare Tour De Foothills as well. I also intend doing a few trips over to Wicklow on weekends. Each time I'll do 100-150klm and 1500-2000 meters of climbing.

With 14 weeks to go, no need to panic but you need to get out regularly and put the miles/altitude training in.

07Lapierre

Here's a few training spins from last year:

http://www.strava.com/activities/51179391

http://www.strava.com/activities/52702163

http://www.strava.com/activities/55110662

http://www.strava.com/activities/60798531

El Vino

I need to get my finger our, just getting over a cold and probably managing only 100km per week.

No long cycles (over 60K) but won't get them in until after the rugby season finishes anyway.

On the plus side I'm approaching 75 kg which was my Etape 2012 weight. Signed up for the Wiggle Dragon ride in Wales at the begining of June which is 212 km, if anything this slog on crappy roads and with likely crappy weather is worrying me more than the Marmotte

barryf42

for the last 6 weeks, with the improved weather, have been getting out for a 100-130k ride every saturday and where possible a second ride of 70-90k on the sunday.

With the bad weather , did a lot of spin sessions in Jan and early feb, overall have done about 950k in both Dec and Jan and a 1050k in Feb

have signed up to do the skoda tour of wicklow, orwell randonee, mount leinster and the w200 also. Just need to try and lose 4 kilos now to get to 75kg if possible and need to start getting in a lot of climbs from here on in.

07 LAPIERRE routes were interesting and will aim to try shorter route, once the evenings get longer as i am based in dublin during the week.

07Lapierre

Remember, good weather is not guaranteed even in France in July. So don't let bad weather put u off going out for a spin.

El Vino

07Lapierre wrote: »

Here's a few training spins from last year:

http://www.strava.com/activities/51179391

http://www.strava.com/activities/52702163

http://www.strava.com/activities/55110662

http://www.strava.com/activities/60798531

Hope you don't mind, I followed you on Strava, it might help me with motivation

07Lapierre

El Vino wrote: »

Hope you don't mind, I followed you on Strava, it might help me with motivation

:eek: Well..no pressure on me so!

07Lapierre

First spin over to Wicklow on Saturday with a few club mates.
160klm in dull,wet and misty conditions! I'm planning to do similar rides very second weekend or so between now and July. Just hope the weather improves.


http://www.strava.com/activities/124971925

goldenboots

Training going fairly well. Did a lot on the spin bike over winter, much of it at fairly high resistance to simulate climbing.

Since the weather has improved, have got out at least once the last few weekends. Did the Pedal Positive sportive (80km), the Lap of Laois (130km) and a 90km. Have signed up for Tour of Wicklow, Orwell Randonee and Tour of Kerry.

Will start getting out for fast spins, followed by quick 5km runs, in the evenings now as well.

78rpm

Hi 07Lapierre - I'm training for this year's Marmotte. I was looking at the Strava segment you posted for Sat 29th and I reckon you and your mates probably passed me on the Old Military Road heading for the Sally Gap. If it was you (five or six guys, some in Swords cycling club gear) then you were doing an impressive pace for a 160km spin. I did 80 that day and was feeling pleased!!

07Lapierre

Probably was us alright..we were the only SwordsCC guys on Sally Gap that day. That was the first of many more trips to Wicklow.. Say hi next time!

78rpm

I'll keep an eye out for you - I probably panted 'hello' in Morse code.
My usual route is up to the Sally Gap. I took a detour up to the Kippure mast last night - it's a nice tough climb with a better road surface than I'd expected.

Any tips or advice on the Marmotte gratefully received!

Leroy42

78rpm, since you have acquainted yourself with the mast I found the climb from Ballyboughal to the mast to be the best Marmotte type climb we have available. There is a big difference between climbing continually for an hour and doing 5 twenty minute climbs in a row. On the Alpe there is no respite so you need to factor that in.

Climb Stocking Lane to viewing point, over Featherbeds, over Sally Gap and up to the mast. There is the downhill section after the Featherbeds to Glencree, but it is fairly short and other than that it is fairly constant climbing and should take over an hour. In terms of getting you trained for the type of climbing in the alpe's I found it to be the best. Possibly the route over Luggala from Roundwood to the mast is even tougher but I come from the city so it suits me better to come the Killakee way. That way however gives some respite from the sally gap crossroads to the start of the mast unlike coming straight from Glencree.

07Lapierre

78rpm wrote: »

I'll keep an eye out for you - I probably panted 'hello' in Morse code.
My usual route is up to the Sally Gap. I took a detour up to the Kippure mast last night - it's a nice tough climb with a better road surface than I'd expected.

Any tips or advice on the Marmotte gratefully received!

Training tips or Tips on Do's/Dont's on the day itself or both?

07Lapierre

Leroy42 wrote: »

I found the climb from Ballyboughal to the mast to be the best Marmotte type climb we have available.
.

Which climb is this exactly?? I assume you mean Enniskerry to Kippure mast?

Leroy42

This is the link to the Killakee climb. Then continue this on upwards across the Featherbeds towards Glencree and then up over Sally Gap (the steep part past Lough Bray) and this brings you to the entrance to the Kippure mast road.

http://www.strava.com/segments/2472552

cheerspal

Doing about 180km a week and 1600m climbing in that. Not nearly enough.

07Lapierre

78rpm wrote: »

I'll keep an eye out for you - I probably panted 'hello' in Morse code.
My usual route is up to the Sally Gap. I took a detour up to the Kippure mast last night - it's a nice tough climb with a better road surface than I'd expected.

Any tips or advice on the Marmotte gratefully received!

Training:

La Marmotte is an endurance event, so my training consists of getting used to 6 - 8 hours in the saddle and in that time, do as much climbing as possible. Doing anything non-stop for 8 - 10 hours is hard, so IMO being mentally prepared is also important. You need to be realistic about what you are trying to achieve. if its your first attempt at the Marmotte, your main aim should be to simply complete the course. If you get a good time, great! but that's a bonus.

I don't have a very scientific approach to training. I simply set myself a few targets to meet (e.g. 100 -150 klm per spin and 1500-2000 meters climbing)
I'm lucky that I can commute very regularly and I get out for an 80 -100klm spin most weekends. I've also signed up for 3 sportives of 100+ klm each between now and July.



On the Day itself:

Do get to your start "Pen" early. If like me your staying in Alp D'huez, take it easy decending to the start. there will be hundreds of cyclists flying down the Alpe (let them). The last thing you want is to crash on the way to the start!

The food stops:
1. At the top of the Glandon,
2. in Valloire and
3. at the bottom of the Alpe.

I stopped at all 3 last year and IMO there's no right or wrong strategy. Everyone's different and it really depends on how you feel on the day. (I stopped at all 3)

There is water available at these stops and also at:

1. The town of Maurienne (bottom of the Telegraph),
2. 1/2 way up the Telegraph,
3. at the summit of the Telegraph,
4. in Valloire,
5. on the Galibier at Plan Lachet and the summit,
6. at the foot of Alp D'huez,
7. at hairpin no. 5 and again at the Finish line.

I stopped for water at the 3 food stops, at Plan Lachet and on the Alpe. they were very brief stops but how often you need water will vary from person to person and the heat on the day will also be a factor. By the time I started climbing the Alpe last year, it was be over 30 degrees. when you combine that with sheer exhaustion you can imagine how tough it was.


finally, don't forget to enjoy it! when you get to the summit of the Galibier, do take a minute to look around you...its a fantastic view and makes all the suffering worth it.

goldenboots

Thanks 07Lapierre,

The advice about the day itself is very helpful, especially for a Marmotte debutant.

My training plan is similar to yours, though the climbing will only really start this weekend. My approach is also unscientific, just focussing on mileage, time and average speed as a guide. All are increasing at the moment. I don't use strava or anything like it.

I know that this will be a severe mental test and am trying to prepare as best I can. I find it hard to picture the Alps in my mind, particularly the length of the climbs and climbing for up to two hours, despite much time spent on youtube and google earth. To try to prepare, I have often spent 60-80 minutes continuously at high resistance on a spin bike.

At this stage, all advice most welcome. Enjoy the training!

07Lapierre

One last thing.....when you get to the finish line...CELEBRATE!

http://vimeo.com/91457542

78rpm

Hi 07LaPierre
Thanks for all that. Much appreciated. It's great to get more details regarding the day itself.
Training wise I'm usually getting out twice a week. My standard 'longer' spin when I've time is a loop from Templeogue round the Sally Gap to home (60km) but I'm going to start adding on km to build that - I did 80km recently by heading out the N81 for a bit. I try to keep heart rate about 65- 75% of max on these spins, but it spikes on steeper climbs.
My 'shorter' spins if I only have about two hours is to climb to the Sally Gap via Edmondstown Rd and return same way, but I push the effort a bit to keep the heart rate up around 80% of max.
I find it hard to keep the heart rate up on the flat bits, and down on the climbs, and some days I give up and just go for a blast!

I think Leroy 42 has a point on training on long steady climbs if possible so I always do hills - if I'm short of time I just head up to the masts at 3rock.

07Lapierre

78rpm wrote: »

Hi 07LaPierre
Thanks for all that. Much appreciated. It's great to get more details regarding the day itself.
Training wise I'm usually getting out twice a week. My standard 'longer' spin when I've time is a loop from Templeogue round the Sally Gap to home (60km) but I'm going to start adding on km to build that - I did 80km recently by heading out the N81 for a bit. I try to keep heart rate about 65- 75% of max on these spins, but it spikes on steeper climbs.
My 'shorter' spins if I only have about two hours is to climb to the Sally Gap via Edmondstown Rd and return same way, but I push the effort a bit to keep the heart rate up around 80% of max.
I find it hard to keep the heart rate up on the flat bits, and down on the climbs, and some days I give up and just go for a blast!

I think Leroy 42 has a point on training on long steady climbs if possible so I always do hills - if I'm short of time I just head up to the masts at 3rock.

Yep Leroy42 has given some really good advise...take it on board. I don't analyse my heart rate at all, I just do what it takes to get to the top of the hill. On Long hills, settle into a rhythm that you can sustain for the climb. Don't be tempted to "Sprint for the summit" as this does waste a lot of energy. Save your energy for the sprint to the finish line.

From what your saying I'd recommend you start going out for longer spins..the Marmotte is 174klm and 5000 meters of climbing. You really need to get your body used to being in the saddle for 6 - 8 hours.

78rpm

[QUOTE=07
From what your saying I'd recommend you start going out for longer spins..the Marmotte is 174klm and 5000 meters of climbing. You really need to get your body used to being in the saddle for 6 - 8 hours.[/QUOTE]

I think you're on the money with that. It's organizing my life to let me be in the saddle for that long is another challenge!

cheerspal

What's the downhill total? Looks to be about 60k

Leroy42

It's funny, but the downhills on the Marmotte are actually quite tiring. Not in the sense of HR or legs but they take a lot of concentration and with us not having anything like the descents over here I always find them a struggle to stay focused. Your neck, hands, arms etc will also get sore from the braking etc. Of course you will also be tired after the climb itself!

The descent from the first climb is long and for the first part pretty technical. Whole thing should take somewhere around 30 minutes of pretty much constant descending. The first part is tight, steep and nervy as there as usually many others around and with the corners being hairpins even if you don't pedal between corners you will need to do plenty of braking!

The descent of Galibier is actually harder as the first part to Lautaret is steep and technical and you will be pretty tired after the Galibier (even after a stop!). Once past the town the road widens and although still descending it requires more work. On its own its fine but I have found it difficult after the efforts on the Galibier and the body starts to struggle at that point.

Of course this pales against the efforts required for the climbs but when non cyclists friends of mine look at the profile they always mention "sure half of it of downhill" as if that means no effort at all. As I'm writing this it does seem to suggest that the descending is also tough...thats not what I mean. It's just that it does require some effort and itself does take it toll.

On the subject of type of training, the Marmotte is essentially a climbing day, so your training should be based on that. You need to be "comfortable" climbing. You need to understand how your body responds to different type of climbing styles. Mix up seated with standing, spinning and slower cadence. Just cos Froome spins at 90+ doesn't mean that's either suitable or the most efficient for you. You want to sit as much as possible but you need to be able to stand up regularly to move the stress points and if your not used to this it is worthwhile practising it to see the effect it has on you (normally HR goes up but I find this is balanced against the reprieve I give my back). I would normally include one 5 minute out of the saddle effort on at least one climb to build up in this area. I was not dancing like Contador, but merely maintaining my rhythm and seeing how my legs would hold up in a different position. I went from basically never standing on climbs so be able to stand when required and I think it has made a difference (times haven't changed though!)

You should ideally be either climbing or descending for as much of any cycle as possible. While this may lead to boring routes it is what is required. I found that even moving the finish of my normal climb up Cruagh road to the viewing point to onwards to the Featherbed meant a further 10+ minutes of effort and in effect I was getting nearly 30 minutes of constant climbing. For example, instead of climbing Howth 2 times, I would say it is better (in the context of training for Marmotte at least) to climb Cruagh Road once. Height gain is roughly the same but there is a big difference in climbing a hill for 10 minutes and then descending to having the climb for 20 minutes without any respite.

Sign up for as many sportives as you can. If they include climbing, like the W200, Orwell Randonee, Mick Byrne etc all the better, but sign up for as many as you can. Apart from the cycle itself, the sportive will get you used to a long day in the saddle, getting your eating and drinking fine tuned (unfortunately we cannot replicate the hot weather) and even getting your morning ritual sorted. There is so much anticipation before the Marmotte that getting as many things down to normal as possible means you can concentrate on getting to the start line without worrying about bringing the right food, packing spare tubes etc. All seems a bit silly, but having everything in place before hand makes everything more straightforward. The sportive will also get you used to riding in a group. I like many cyclists spend most of my training either on my own or with one or two others and we can basically do what we want. When riding in a group you can't just move your line, pull over or whatever. Again, its not a big deal but just something to get used to. If you're used to climbing at your own pace having others around you at different paces (a tiny bit slower in some parts and a tiny bit quicker in others) can be frustrating.

The longer rides (whether sportives or on your own) will also give you a better indication of what gearing you need for the Alpe. The last 14k is all uphill and suddenly that 34/25 that you so happily used on your training spin up Sally Gap is no longer sufficient. Try doing the Sally Gap after already having done 100k and see how you respond.

07Lapierre

Personally i Loved the descent from the Galibier and I didn't find it too technical at all. Its certainly a lot easier than the Glandon...no hairpins and less riders around you, so I found I could really let loose and go for it.

There are a few hairpins at the summit of the Galibier, but once your past them the road surface is good and there are long sweeping bends (a few sharp turns too, but you can see them coming from a long way, so you've plenty of time to prepare for them).

The descent is almost 50klm, which takes its toll on your neck and shoulders, so this year i intend to try and sit up and straighten my back and stretch while on the move. Its probably best to do this once you've past through the 3 tunnels.

The tunnels are lit, but I do recommend not trying to overtake other cyclists while in the tunnel. Just follow the rider in front until your back in daylight.

07Lapierre

The Galibier descent starts 9 minutes into this video...first 9 minutes aren't too bad either.

Mayo self-build

Thanks 07Lapierre and Leroy42 for the recent posts. As a Marmotte noobie there is plenty of useful information there. Training going a little better the last week or so. Pretty unscientific approach from me too. I try to get 2 x 90min spins in during the week and a 100km+ spin at th weekend.

I've signed up for a couple of sportives also like Sligo in a few weeks, Tour de Connemara and a few long solo days planned too. There are a few hills in the Westport / Tourmakeady area close to where I live, so those are the mid week routes.

Really appreciate the advice from everyone.

07Lapierre

Today's spin in Wicklow. What a day! Sun and very little wind. 2000meters done.
Really enjoyed it.

http://app.strava.com/activities/131532730

Mayo self-build

A quick question for those that have done the event before... To what extent (if any) are the roads closed for the day? Is it possible to drive up Alp D'Huez that afternoon to watch the suffering, or are there other highly recommended viewing locations for friends / family?