Quotas

jersey101

Will quotas ever be gone?? I think not. Reading the IFJ this week there will always be some ceiling stopping certain countries blowing the lid of it altogether and if the french get there way qoutas will still be around. I think it will be a very volatile market after 2015 because of all the milk supposedly coming to the market. Im expanding at home and im looking forward to 2015. But im taking it handy as i go.
Any thoughts??

Milked out

Can they pull out now after saying for the last number of years how they are definitely going?? particularly when a lot of investment has been made on the back of it. Germany I think are keen to increase production so that would help to keep things on track. This year will determine my scenario in terms of land etc.but would be looking to expand by 40% in the next 3 years and have the potential to go further once I get the initial expansion running smoothly. Would be worried if any ceiling was put in place again, would throw a right spanner in the works

kevthegaff

it would be a joke if they pulled out of abolition of milk quotas after pushing expansion for the last couple of years. If they did, quota would cost a fortune:(

delaval

He's a socialist looking for re election, playing to the crowd. Sounds more like his concern is more to do with the loss of quota value.

Germany pay the bills and they want rid of quotas and that's about the size of it

sheebadog

delaval wrote: »

He's a socialist looking for re election, playing to the crowd. Sounds more like his concern is more to do with the loss of quota value.

Germany pay the bills and they want rid of quotas and that's about the size of it

Hmmmm........ France ain't getting rid of quotas anytime soon....production rights I think they call them. Our part of France is losing producers fast(easier bobs made out of grain production). No prob getting xtra quota here. Was asked last month did I want an extra 75k litres quota, said yea, no bother got it today.
However post 2015 we will still have " production rights". Can't see the French in a system they can't control !

delaval

With a new processing plant under construction in south KK, the cat will be well and truly among the pidgeons if the frog gets his way.

Why can't the french retain a supply control system themselves if they want?

jersey101

delaval wrote: »

With a new processing plant under construction in south KK, the cat will be well and truly among the pidgeons if the frog gets his way.

Why can't the french retain a supply control system themselves if they want?

I think what they are more worried about is not being able to compete with the 2 and a half countries which will benefit from quotas going.

Was talking to my father about this yesterday and he was anxious about qoutas going because he remembered when they went in nz and what happened over there.

delaval

jersey101 wrote: »

I think what they are more worried about is not being able to compete with the 2 and a half countries which will benefit from quotas going.

Was talking to my father about this yesterday and he was anxious about qoutas going because he remembered when they went in nz and what happened over there.

They never had quotas in NZ, they're too clever for that.

What happened was a labour government got elected and over night removed all subsidies. many went to the wall but a much more agressive and lean ag industry emerged. there were many casualties along the way

Keep grass as your focus, costs down, buildings to a minimum and SR correct and we will be able for any changes. if quotas remain subisdies will have to increase and management can relax.

We cannot be at world prices and not in control of our production. This is typical politican telling us what's good for us.

Get lean and mean and we will be able for no quotas, let the politicans know that we'll look after ourselves

maxxuumman

delaval wrote: »

With a new processing plant under construction in south KK, the cat will be well and truly among the pidgeons if the frog gets his way.

Why??

sheebadog

delaval wrote: »

They never had quotas in NZ, they're too clever for that.

What happened was a labour government got elected and over night removed all subsidies. many went to the wall but a much more agressive and lean ag industry emerged. there were many casualties along the way

Keep grass as your focus, costs down, buildings to a minimum and SR correct and we will be able for any changes. if quotas remain subisdies will have to increase and management can relax.

We cannot be at world prices and not in control of our production. This is typical politican telling us what's good for us.

Get lean and mean and we will be able for no quotas, let the politicans know that we'll look after ourselves

Be careful what you wish for, you just might get it!!
Lean and mean---no quotas-- looking after ourselves--- all very bullish when milk price is good. Won't always be like that as ye know.
Lookit France is a socialist country as ye know and this means they are excellent at looking after the SMALL farmer. France like Ireland has an awful lot of small producers---40 cow herds with small farms. Government want these family farms to stay in business. American or New Zealand capitalist models suit large farms.

delaval

sheebadog wrote: »

Be careful what you wish for, you just might get it!!
Lean and mean---no quotas-- looking after ourselves--- all very bullish when milk price is good. Won't always be like that as ye know.
Lookit France is a socialist country as ye know and this means they are excellent at looking after the SMALL farmer. France like Ireland has an awful lot of small producers---40 cow herds with small farms. Government want these family farms to stay in business. American or New Zealand capitalist models suit large farms.

The great social experiment in the east failed and can't succeed. Capitalism is about survival of the fittest.

As Thatcher said 'socialism is great until you run out if other people's money'.

You accept my point that if quotas stay we need to be subsidised?

kevthegaff

they should have been gone 5 yrs ago in my book, a real restriction on expansion and progress

sheebadog

delaval wrote: »

The great social experiment in the east failed and can't succeed. Capitalism is about survival of the fittest.

As Thatcher said 'socialism is great until you run out if other people's money'.

You accept my point that if quotas stay we need to be subsidised?

Oh yea, definite need for subsidy. Wouldn't be a fan of Thatcher myself. Ripped the social fabric and opened the way for big business.
You and I might be able to survive without subs but not all small family farms might. Powers that be in Ireland are all about scale and survival of the fittest now, but the majority of producers in Ireland and France can't expand. Should they be sacrificed at the alter of capitalism so the big get bigger? Sh1t sounding like a commie!

maxxuumman

I can't see what the problem is. Farmers are not going to expand at over 5% year in year out. If the wheels fall off the price of milk in year 4 say, you just have to go back to where you were in year 3. You could have still have expanded as much as you want in the previous 2 years.
What is being proposed is not quotas or anywhere near it. The US have market controls and they work very well, but at a cost to everyone even the person who is not expanding. This system seems better as it only slows down the guy that may be over the top with expansion.
Having expanded alot in the last 10 yrs and intending to nearly double in the next few yrs, I think this is a good idea. It was very easy to expand in the early '00's, with the comfort of being able to predict the milk price for a few yrs in the future accurately. Won't be the case for the next few yrs.
There is a lot of talking up the price of milk here, post 2015. If the milk price is going to be so good, what France is proposing will be of no concern.
France is one of the best countries in Europe for looking after its farmers, they are one of the nearest to us re farm sizes, type of farming ,etc. they should be listened to on this one.
Talk of this being socialist or talk of the wonders of the free market is rubbish. How is the free market workin out for the beef, sheep, tillage farmers.
There needs thing in place to manage, both the extremes in price drops and in expansion.

sheebadog

maxxuumman wrote: »

I can't see what the problem is. Farmers are not going to expand at over 5% year in year out. If the wheels fall off the price of milk in year 4 say, you just have to go back to where you were in year 3. You could have still have expanded as much as you want in the previous 2 years.
What is being proposed is not quotas or anywhere near it. The US have market controls and they work very well, but at a cost to everyone even the person who is not expanding. This system seems better as it only slows down the guy that may be over the top with expansion.
Having expanded alot in the last 10 yrs and intending to nearly double in the next few yrs, I think this is a good idea. It was very easy to expand in the early '00's, with the comfort of being able to predict the milk price for a few yrs in the future accurately. Won't be the case for the next few yrs.
There is a lot of talking up the price of milk here, post 2015. If the milk price is going to be so good, what France is proposing will be of no concern.
France is one of the best countries in Europe for looking after its farmers, they are one of the nearest to us re farm sizes, type of farming ,etc. they should be listened to on this one.
Talk of this being socialist or talk of the wonders of the free market is rubbish. How is the free market workin out for the beef, sheep, tillage farmers.
There needs thing in place to manage, both the extremes in price drops and in expansion.

Well said!!
A little bit prudence is needed. Irish should remember the very recent past

grazeaway

sheebadog wrote: »

Well said!!
A little bit prudence is needed. Irish should remember the very recent past

i think this is it in a nutshell. my dad chuckles everytime he picks up the jouro or farm exam and its all about expansion for 2015 and how everyone must get bigger and so on. like he says it harks back to the 70's when every farmer in teh country was told to expand, expand, expand. my folks decided to go with it they were in thier 20's and the plan was to ditch the beet, veg and corn and expand the dairy herd from about 20 to 50 and then maybe look to about 100 if they could expand the farm. they got half way and whent eh quotas came in they got a quota for about 30-35 cows but had and set up for over 50. it almost put them to the wall as in order to make enough money to pay off the debt they needed to produce more milk and in order to produce more milk they needed more quota and in order to get more quota they needed more money. twas a visous circle. what they ended up doing was reducing the quanity but increase the quality to get a higher price for protien and butter fat. they were one of the highest quality producers in the area. like my dad said "i cant produce more milk so i have to produce better milk".

he is of the opion that it'll all happen again and that instead of quotas as such you'll be limited by production rights. we had talked about going back into dairy, it can be done here but i would need to invest a nice bit in expanding the slurry storage and putting in a new milking machine and tank, id say about €50k, but would need to employ a relief milker as it would make no sense to give up the job. i think i'll wait till 2017 or 2018 after the initial surge has calmed down and see what the future holds by then. maybe there is a future for sucklers yet

F.D

Quota wont be your problem it will be when you can supply your milk
No more cheap grass produced milk when they limit what you can supply in may / june and push you to supply in nov/dec

delaval

maxxuumman wrote: »

I can't see what the problem is. Farmers are not going to expand at over 5% year in year out. If the wheels fall off the price of milk in year 4 say, you just have to go back to where you were in year 3. You could have still have expanded as much as you want in the previous 2 years.
What is being proposed is not quotas or anywhere near it. The US have market controls and they work very well, but at a cost to everyone even the person who is not expanding. This system seems better as it only slows down the guy that may be over the top with expansion.
Having expanded alot in the last 10 yrs and intending to nearly double in the next few yrs, I think this is a good idea. It was very easy to expand in the early '00's, with the comfort of being able to predict the milk price for a few yrs in the future accurately. Won't be the case for the next few yrs.
There is a lot of talking up the price of milk here, post 2015. If the milk price is going to be so good, what France is proposing will be of no concern.
France is one of the best countries in Europe for looking after its farmers, they are one of the nearest to us re farm sizes, type of farming ,etc. they should be listened to on this one.
Talk of this being socialist or talk of the wonders of the free market is rubbish. How is the free market workin out for the beef, sheep, tillage farmers.
There needs thing in place to manage, both the extremes in price drops and in expansion.

Qoutas without subsidy cannot work simple.

I've not heard much talk here of hihg prices

case 956

F.D wrote: »

Quota wont be your problem it will be when you can supply your milk
No more cheap grass produced milk when they limit what you can supply in may / june and push you to supply in nov/dec

definetly the case in lakeland co op and any new producer coming in will be forced to supply nov/dec milk to even out the supply curve

Viewtodiefor

kevthegaff wrote: »

it would be a joke if they pulled out of abolition of milk quotas after pushing expansion for the last couple of years. If they did, quota would cost a fortune:(

It would be a joke alright, but at least the French seem to give a damn about the average farm, whereas here all they seem to drive into is bigger is better milk hundreds n more hundreds of cows, is that right? All I can see happening is lots of average guys getting out as they cant make a living when milk price hits 20cent and some of the bigger guys with large repayments collapse. The end result or what we will be left with is.

Less jobs in rural ireland as farmers leave the land,

Bigger nz style farms as larger units take over smaller guys

A breakdown of the social fabric in rural ireland as population leave because of lack of work

Again this suits the co op and processors

jersey101

When our government gets there hands on something it normally ends in ****. look at the building boom and the state of our hospitals after all the changing they did.

mahoney_j

maxxuumman wrote: »

I can't see what the problem is. Farmers are not going to expand at over 5% year in year out. If the wheels fall off the price of milk in year 4 say, you just have to go back to where you were in year 3. You could have still have expanded as much as you want in the previous 2 years.
What is being proposed is not quotas or anywhere near it. The US have market controls and they work very well, but at a cost to everyone even the person who is not expanding. This system seems better as it only slows down the guy that may be over the top with expansion.
Having expanded alot in the last 10 yrs and intending to nearly double in the next few yrs, I think this is a good idea. It was very easy to expand in the early '00's, with the comfort of being able to predict the milk price for a few yrs in the future accurately. Won't be the case for the next few yrs.
There is a lot of talking up the price of milk here, post 2015. If the milk price is going to be so good, what France is proposing will be of no concern.
France is one of the best countries in Europe for looking after its farmers, they are one of the nearest to us re farm sizes, type of farming ,etc. they should be listened to on this one.
Talk of this being socialist or talk of the wonders of the free market is rubbish. How is the free market workin out for the beef, sheep, tillage farmers.
There needs thing in place to manage, both the extremes in price drops and in expansion.

Excellent post ,whilst welcoming the post quota era.quota will still be there,we will be restricted by land fragmentation,production rights,seasonality restrictions etc.all these beef and tillage boys waving there willys and saying they will switch to dairy and milk 2 ,3 and 400 cows would be in for some culture shock with the rigours of a busy spring,health issues and been tied to milk twice a day.a lot easier farm a few hindered acres of tillage than milk a few hindered cows.
Nitrates restrictions also need to be taken into account.it really irks me that Tegasc in particular is gone lazy with its advice and is just ramming the kiwi way down our throat the whole time.ireland aunt New Zealand and never will be.

bob charles

Irish people are very quick to forget history in all walks of like. Those who forget history are doomed to repeat it

bob charles

mahoney_j wrote: »

Tegasc in particular is gone lazy with its advice and is just ramming the kiwi way down our throat the whole time.ireland aunt New Zealand and never will be.

What are the Nitrates rules in NZ? Nitrates regulations cost serious money each year to intensive farmers. at a guess could be costing up to 5k a year to individuals

jaymla627

bob charles wrote: »

What are the Nitrates rules in NZ? Nitrates regulations cost serious money each year to intensive farmers. at a guess could be costing up to 5k a year to individuals

I dont think they would even know what nitrates are over their to be honest, only the past 5 years they have started to put in lagoons for parlour run-off etc before that it was into the river with a lot of it, think the new zealand goverment is cracking down a bit as water quality has really started to get bad due to polloution from dairy farms http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/08/06/new-zealand-environment_n_3710859.html this article sums it up pretty well.

Lambofdave

Dept. of Agri, Teagasc and the IFA have a lot to answer for always jumping before they see where they could land.

Quotas in Ireland protected some farmers from others who have expanded at rates that have put some farms in jeopardy.

kevthegaff

i cant understand why they were pushing so much for expansion when the increase was so little every year on the national q. Another thing is the co ops only want more milk and dont seem to be deterring the farmer to send in more. I know the farmer has to take most of the responsibility, but these factors look like costing most lads alot of money!

rancher

mahoney_j wrote: »

Excellent post ,whilst welcoming the post quota era.quota will still be there,we will be restricted by land fragmentation,production rights,seasonality restrictions etc.all these beef and tillage boys waving there willys and saying they will switch to dairy and milk 2 ,3 and 400 cows would be in for some culture shock with the rigours of a busy spring,health issues and been tied to milk twice a day.a lot easier farm a few hindered acres of tillage than milk a few hindered cows.
Nitrates restrictions also need to be taken into account.it really irks me that Tegasc in particular is gone lazy with its advice and is just ramming the kiwi way down our throat the whole time.ireland aunt New Zealand and never will be.

Is the 2-300 cow herd not the way to go.......I don't see their owners doing much milking

maxxuumman

delaval wrote: »

Qoutas without subsidy cannot work simple.

I've not heard much talk here of hihg prices

What is being proposed cannot in anyway be called quotas.

On milk price, if low thirties is taken as an average, say 31c. At an average of 37 cent this year and 30 the year before, that means that next year could easily be 26c.

delaval

maxxuumman wrote: »

What is being proposed cannot in anyway be called quotas.

On milk price, if low thirties is taken as an average, say 31c. At an average of 37 cent this year and 30 the year before, that means that next year could easily be 26c.

Agree with you on price but low 20's are gone

Anyone any way serious will top av Manu price by 1.5c

keep going

I think we will be fine as long as the banks stay bust and not give out too much money .after all its not expansion is the problem, its borrowing a heap of money to do so is the problem.it doesnt matter what system you go for as long asyou can survive the low prices and make it during the prices.many areas in europe have quite low feed costs due to high yeilds in maize but overheads are killing them

sheebadog

keep going wrote: »

I think we will be fine as long as the banks stay bust and not give out too much money .after all its not expansion is the problem, its borrowing a heap of money to do so is the problem.it doesnt matter what system you go for as long asyou can survive the low prices and make it during the prices.many areas in europe have quite low feed costs due to high yeilds in maize but overheads are killing them

Bang on. Overheads and soya price are the killer here.
Maize can be produced very cheaply in this part of France, kinda like grass is fairly cheap to produce in Ireland.

delaval

Lambofdave wrote: »

Dept. of Agri, Teagasc and the IFA have a lot to answer for always jumping before they see where they could land.

Quotas in Ireland protected some farmers from others who have expanded at rates that have put some farms in jeopardy.

Complete crap. I bought and leased quota from guys sitting in arm chairs and more luck to them. I for one do not want to see another generation do this

Lambofdave

delaval wrote: »

Complete crap. I bought and leased quota from guys sitting in arm chairs and more luck to them. I for one do not want to see another generation do this

Its only crap because it don's suit your expansionist idea. Some farms need to be protected from neighbors who have taken up all land around

sheebadog

delaval wrote: »

Complete crap. I bought and leased quota from guys sitting in arm chairs and more luck to them. I for one do not want to see another generation do this

It should never have been allowed to buy and sell quota and entitlements on the open market. Put a big value on a PERMIT. I'm no one to talk cause made killing at that craic too

yellow50HX

delaval wrote: »

Complete crap. I bought and leased quota from guys sitting in arm chairs and more luck to them. I for one do not want to see another generation do this

it all depends on your business model and cost to revenue ratio. a number of the smaller dairys lads like my dad were approached to sell/lease thier quotas to a fairly big dairy lad near here about 15 years ago. the price was good but my dad couldnt see how this lad was going to make it pay, between buying up quota, leasing land and then drawing silage back to the main farm his costs were huge. i know a few lads that cashed in but it all ended in tears about 2 years later when the price of milk went down.

when it comes to econemy of scale and then like the returns can be much higher but this is mainly because they can be done on smaller margins. but every single cost from, leasing, fertilzer, esb to diesel and feed needs to be tracked and managed to make it work. not everyone has the skills or inclination to micro manage to that level. best of luck to those that can and fair play to them.

yellow50HX

Lambofdave wrote: »

Its only crap because it don's suit your expansionist idea. Some farms need to be protected from neighbors who have taken up all land around

this is actully a bigger issue then many people think. have noticed a number of the farms near here that are let on an ongoing basis (retired owners, widows, etc.) and a number of the lads that have been leasing them for a number of years are being squessed out for soem dairy lads that have more money to splash (although i cant see where it is coming from) my neighbour has rented his place out for the next 5 years to a dairy lad, the tillage guy that has had it for the last 10 years said there was no way he could even compete. he intially tough it would be for growing maize and silage as its good tillage land and has been well kept with cearls and beet for years. twas all resseded and FRS where in there for a few weeks early in the year putting it all in paddocks. new well after been bored and a second esb meter fitted for the farm. its used for raising replacements some dry stock and silage. The silage draw is 20 mile round trip. for a 5 year deal it seems a collosul investment in infrastructure with no guarentee that hell still have it in 5 years time. this on top of the extra stock and farm buildign that have been built in the last 2 years. we reckon he has shelled out about €500k over the last few years to get ready for going from 70 to 200 cows. i hope it all goes well for him

jersey101

just heard on the radio there that africas population is set to double to 2.4 billion by 2050. Quotas have to go if we have to feed s population like that

rancher

jersey101 wrote: »

just heard on the radio there that africas population is set to double to 2.4 billion by 2050. Quotas have to go if we have to feed s population like that

The population is there to eat the food already, the money to buy it isn't

Timmaay

They need carbohydrates anyways, not dairy products! The money is there alright, but in the wrong hands between corrupt governments, and selling off mining rights etc! Anyways offtopic!

maxxuumman

delaval wrote: »

Complete crap. I bought and leased quota from guys sitting in arm chairs and more luck to them. I for one do not want to see another generation do this

Again, why such a bad thing. I know I'd be a lot happier if I knew that when I retire that I had a quota(asset) to lease/sell/or pass on. Meanwhile the product I'm producing wouldn't be subjected to massive price fluctuations.

delaval

Lambofdave wrote: »

Its only crap because it don's suit your expansionist idea. Some farms need to be protected from neighbors who have taken up all land around

Protection from the neighbour, you may explain that one

The reality is that 100-120 cows will be about the size of it. There will be a few high profile large conversions and there will be some low profile failures.

What exactly are you afraid of?

As a matter of fact I'm maxed out but would love to see a position where young people can get in, would you?

F.D

lads one thing your missing about this whole 2015 expansion craic is the availability of land,
How many lads are actually happy with the income from there 50-70 cows
and have no intention of expanding or renting selling out to there 300 cow neighbour...... I would say loads and more luck to them
same with the beef men if the sfp gets cut they will still use there off farm income to keep it ticking over for a hobby or what ever especially if its not costing them a fortune ,

so unless you have more of your own land to utilise or go into an intensive system, or a lot of new entrants have a go at it, i cant see milk supply getting totally out of hand

delaval

F.D wrote: »

lads one thing your missing about this whole 2015 expansion craic is the availability of land,
How many lads are actually happy with the income from there 50-70 cows
and have no intention of expanding or renting selling out to there 300 cow neighbour...... I would say loads and more luck to them
same with the beef men if the sfp gets cut they will still use there off farm income to keep it ticking over for a hobby or what ever especially if its not costing them a fortune ,

so unless you have more of your own land to utilise or go into an intensive system, or a lot of new entrants have a go at it, i cant see milk supply getting totally out of hand

Spot on,

The problem I feel is that some doomsdayers are really only worried about losing their asset value

Wheather we like it or not we are on the world market and have no influence on it. Price flucuation and quota double whammy. I'm all for quota if I'm guaranteed a price, now which EU government is going to give me this? Germany want them gone, France can support their own suppliers if they please.

Nobody has mentioned an Eu wide quota, I'd say the French would love that too and they not filling their quota. Asbsolute protectionism

Milked out

yellow50HX wrote: »

this is actully a bigger issue then many people think. have noticed a number of the farms near here that are let on an ongoing basis (retired owners, widows, etc.) and a number of the lads that have been leasing them for a number of years are being squessed out for soem dairy lads that have more money to splash (although i cant see where it is coming from) my neighbour has rented his place out for the next 5 years to a dairy lad, the tillage guy that has had it for the last 10 years said there was no way he could even compete. he intially tough it would be for growing maize and silage as its good tillage land and has been well kept with cearls and beet for years. twas all resseded and FRS where in there for a few weeks early in the year putting it all in paddocks. new well after been bored and a second esb meter fitted for the farm. its used for raising replacements some dry stock and silage. The silage draw is 20 mile round trip. for a 5 year deal it seems a collosul investment in infrastructure with no guarentee that hell still have it in 5 years time. this on top of the extra stock and farm buildign that have been built in the last 2 years. we reckon he has shelled out about €500k over the last few years to get ready for going from 70 to 200 cows. i hope it all goes well for him

Whats wrong with that?? If renting land is part of your operation the price of the land rental is generally a response of the demand for it always has been, tillage lads especially know this. If that lad has 500k borrowed to get to 200 cows and a good plan in place it can be done, that'll be 2500/cow debt, I'd be well over that and have a plan in place to manage it, good years and bad years. Also quota did f-all to protect us from '09

RobertKK

Quotas will be gone, but as already said, most farmers will have their own imposed quota based on land available for grazing, quality of life - might not want to expand that much or all.

I do think there is a lot of irresponsible journalism around dairying, and all the people who get into dairying will not stay, you need to get into for more than the money. You have to like it, and I am not sure everyone who sees a high milk price will like all the work involved with dairying.
Existing dairy farmers are the ones who will push expansion. It will be interesting to see how many who become dairy farmers stay at it, some will love it but others will think, the sucklers or the tillage was better suited to them and the type of lifestyle they like, given dairying is twice a day everyday for most of the year, or for some year round.
Quotas will be gone, but I can see some people making costly mistakes by entering dairying and finding they do not really like it.

Teagasc and the IFJ never say this. It is more likely to be, some suckler farmer with a lot of cows is converting to dairying, so much more profit per hectare and how this is the way to go.
I think in the end that while many will join dairying, most of the expansion will come from existing dairy farmers, mainly from dairy farmers who had mixed enterprises but not the quota.
I just hope and wish all those new dairy farmers, that they like milking cows, and this was the number 1 thing that made them want to be dairy farmers.
Otherwise Teagasc and others will have led many down a garden path that will be a costly one.

maxxuumman

delaval wrote: »

The problem I feel is that some doomsdayers are really only worried about losing their asset value

Wheather we like it or not we are on the world market and have no influence on it. Price flucuation and quota double whammy. I'm all for quota if I'm guaranteed a price, now which EU government is going to give me this? Germany want them gone, France can support their own suppliers if they please.

Nobody has mentioned an Eu wide quota, I'd say the French would love that too and they not filling their quota. Asbsolute protectionism[\quote]

If the asset value statement is pointed at me, don't worry, once quotas were going to go, the quota value was written of the books and it's value was put to very good use.
Still cant see what you concern is with the French proposal. If your saying you are maxed out, then all this proposal means is that if you want to decrease your herd by 5% in a very bad year, you'll get milk price support.

st1979

rancher wrote: »

The population is there to eat the food already, the money to buy it isn't

Glanbia board went to west africa. They buy a good bit of product from us. At the moment it is a bit dear for them as there government has a cap on food inflation. But they are quite happy to pay equivalent of 34c/l. French and german farmers are finding it hard to get that for standard milk products being sold to there own population. Which would be one of the richer nations on earth.
I reckon the poor appreciate food more than the rich. And dont have supermarkets sscrewing the primary producer.
This thread is seriously negative. Post quota will be a roller coaster. And I hope to survive it and prosper. I have building's built and parlour done. Have enough land to double production easy. The shortfall for me is capital for stock. Quota has not protected anyone in the last 5 years. Only hampered some. How great was it in 09

keep going

Lambofdave wrote: »

Its only crap because it don's suit your expansionist idea. Some farms need to be protected from neighbors who have taken up all land around

I suppose i fall into category of one of these land grabing dairy men but the truth is most people approach me with their land, I dont pay the most money but I always pay on time (except maybe this spring), I mind it well and have it looking well.starting to notice abit of mumbling from other lads about it, most of these lads have a skelton or two in their closet.and I might be gone out these places soon who knows.

delaval

maxxuumman wrote: »

delaval wrote: »

The problem I feel is that some doomsdayers are really only worried about losing their asset value

Wheather we like it or not we are on the world market and have no influence on it. Price flucuation and quota double whammy. I'm all for quota if I'm guaranteed a price, now which EU government is going to give me this? Germany want them gone, France can support their own suppliers if they please.

Nobody has mentioned an Eu wide quota, I'd say the French would love that too and they not filling their quota. Asbsolute protectionism[\quote]

If the asset value statement is pointed at me, don't worry, once quotas were going to go, the quota value was written of the books and it's value was put to very good use.
Still cant see what you concern is with the French proposal. If your saying you are maxed out, then all this proposal means is that if you want to decrease your herd by 5% in a very bad year, you'll get milk price support.

Mxman, not directed at you. I am maxed out in the land I have available at the moment but that doesn't mean I am not looking for more and will put on more cows. Whether I do or not I don't want any politician interfering with my business.

bob charles

delaval wrote: »

Mxman, not directed at you. I am maxed out in the land I have available at the moment but that doesn't mean I am not looking for more and will put on more cows. Whether I do or not I don't want any politician interfering with my business.

Delaval, just from some of the pictures you post on here, It looks to me like you have loads of spare capacity and I think I mentioned it back then if I was starting out in milk I would be frightened with the amount of spare capacity allot of you established lads seem to have. You were knocking grass at the shoulders of the grazing season mean that your surplus during the main season must be massive.