CI Presidency

Beasty

The CI AGM will be held in Monaghan on 26 October. At that AGM a new President will be elected to replace the outgoing Rory Wyley. So far I am aware current Board member (elected last year) Denis Toomey has put his hat in the ring. He sent a letter out which is reproduced here

The vote will be taken on the same basis as the recent EGM - basically votes go to Club Delegates, Board Members, Commissions and Provincial Executives

I know others have mentioned there will be at least one other candidate but at this time I don't know of any who have officially announced their intention to stand (if anyone knows differently then please post details). Hopefully there will be more candidates allowing a healthy debate and giving the opportunity for members to choose from candidates with alternative visions for Cycling in Ireland.

This is the most important job within Cycling in Ireland. A lot of posters here have expressed concerns about the way CI has been run and this is an opportunity for members to influence the way the organisation is run going forward.

Cookie_Monster

Beasty wrote: »

I know others have mentioned there will be at least one other candidate but at this time I don't know of any.

Pat maybe? Will he be booted out of the UCI race by then?:pac:

morana

the office of president is a tricky one. If you look at the last 2 incumbents Mr Concannon and Mr Wyley they were both in a position to devote a large amount of time to the position. Even as a former Vice President (sounds Troy Mclure-ish!) the majority of the work was done by Rory, Geoff and the Secretary Mr Watson.

I think the fact that Denis is retired is a big plus but on the other hand I would question whether the amount of work that the former presidents put into it means that a good working person could take up the office.

I dont want to start to go into the issues that need to be addressed but I think a new president should stand back and evaluate where we are and where we need to get too. Differentiate between the strategic objectives and the work that needs to be done by the CEO and paid employees.

anyway there will be a handful in Monaghan so if you can get 30 votes you should get the position if you want it!

wav1

There are also up to 3 board positions available this year in addition to the Presidential election.
Morana has to be replaced
John Horgans 2 yr stint is up and his position is to be voted on.[i assume he's standing again]
If Denis Twomey is successful in his presidency bid,then he too would have to be replaced as an ordinary director.
AFAIK there is a Leinster based nominee for the presidency,but this has to be confirmed.
I do hope there is at least a contest for the position because there hasn't been one for a long time.

morana

wav1 wrote: »

T
Morana has to be replaced

IRREPLACEABLE!!!!!!!

I think there are 2 Leinster based possibles

wav1

More or less agree with what marana has to say.
I dont think anybody with a full time job could do this role justice.
What i would love to see from whoever it is,that gets the position,is more genuine contact and communication with the grassroots,and listen to what the grassroots have to say.
Of the essence to the incoming President should be the re establishment of the key commissions that have been let go in the past couple of years.Youth being one of the very key ones.As i have posted many times the current crop of juniors didn't happen by accident and without a hard working youth commission,things will strt to go in the oppisite direction again.The same is true of all the other key commissions.
Let him select people who are suited to these roles,listen to their conerns etc,and then let these people get on with their roles,without constant interfering from the board.If the right people are put on these commissions they will work like clockwork,and benefit all the members in the different sectors of the sport.

morana

wav1 wrote: »

More or less agree with what marana has to say.
I dont think anybody with a full time job could do this role justice.
What i would love to see from whoever it is,that gets the position,is more genuine contact and communication with the grassroots,and listen to what the grassroots have to say.
Of the essence to the incoming President should be the re establishment of the key commissions that have been let go in the past couple of years.Youth being one of the very key ones.As i have posted many times the current crop of juniors didn't happen by accident and without a hard working youth commission,things will strt to go in the oppisite direction again.The same is true of all the other key commissions.
Let him select people who are suited to these roles,listen to their conerns etc,and then let these people get on with their roles,without constant interfering from the board.If the right people are put on these commissions they will work like clockwork,and benefit all the members in the different sectors of the sport.

Wav1 Communication has to be a major component of any manifesto. If I were going for it I would offer that the phone would be answered. Simple as that. and thats not a criticism of the staff btw. Why cant it be given to a 3rd party to manage calls etc.

wav1

morana wrote: »

Wav1 Communication has to be a major component of any manifesto. If I were going for it I would offer that the phone would be answered. Simple as that. and thats not a criticism of the staff btw. Why cant it be given to a 3rd party to manage calls etc.

Feel a rant coming on but i wont.I agree even if a 3rd party had to be brought in.The office is quick enough to bring in 3rd party people to do other stuff such as the on line provider for race applications etc.The latest one [and one that our club and many more are totally opposed to]is the mandatory on line entry for all races in 2014.Before i vote for anyone i want to know where they stand on this one.Will change the racing landscape as we know it,and i believe do away with the sunny day rider who might only make their mind up on the night before a race.

Beasty

From what I have seen there is a wealth of untapped talent within CI. Too much currently falls on too few people, making it difficult for them to find the time to actually deliver signicant progress

A lot of us on here contributed to getting the EGM and were prepared to put some effort in to see democracy prevail within CI. What I would like to see is a CI President who is fully inclusive of all disciplines (and not primarily focussed on male road racing). As mentioned by wav1 and morana, communication is key. Get people of trust in positions to properly oversee the various disciplines, provinces and groups (women, juniors, vets etc). People who can put in place their own structures to deliver benefits to all the stakeholders. The grassroot members are key to this - they are the ones that have got to do a lot of leg work, be it organising events/races, petitioning local authorities, turning up to marshal etc.

RobFowl

FWIW I think Rory has been a dedicated and extremely good president. He has done a lot that hasn't been publicly acclaimed such as finally bringing in cardiac screening and joining the MPCC.
I think Denis Twoomey would be a great choice but like the posters above I'd like an election and debate on the future path CI is going to take.

mark kiernan

there are no women on the board ,this needs to change
a voice of reason would go a long way
failing that ,we could all chip in for a makeover for morana and buy a few dresses for him

wav1

mark kiernan wrote: »

there are no women on the board ,this needs to change
a voice of reason would go a long way
failing that ,we could all chip in for a makeover for morana and buy a few dresses for him

Would love to see a woman on the board,but they have to put themseves forward for nomination first.
As for morana the beard would be a giveaway.

morana

mark kiernan wrote: »

there are no women on the board ,this needs to change
a voice of reason would go a long way
failing that ,we could all chip in for a makeover for morana and buy a few dresses for him

I hope Val Considine could be persuaded to stand. I would be too pretty to be a woman!!!

12 sprocket

wav1 wrote: »

Feel a rant coming on but i wont.I agree even if a 3rd party had to be brought in.The office is quick enough to bring in 3rd party people to do other stuff such as the on line provider for race applications etc.The latest one [and one that our club and many more are totally opposed to]is the mandatory on line entry for all races in 2014.Before i vote for anyone i want to know where they stand on this one.Will change the racing landscape as we know it,and i believe do away with the sunny day rider who might only make their mind up on the night before a race.

Wav, will it not take some of the workload from the clubs a and prevent clubs who might get caught out with low fields from losing money on their races.. will it also make collection of race levies easier? Surely theres more benefits to be had for the clubs than negatives.

CramCycle

wav1 wrote: »

is the mandatory on line entry for all races in 2014.Before i vote for anyone i want to know where they stand on this one.Will change the racing landscape as we know it,and i believe do away with the sunny day rider who might only make their mind up on the night before a race.

Will this mean that no on the line entry will be available in any circumstances?

wav1

12 sprocket wrote: »

Wav, will it not take some of the workload from the clubs a and prevent clubs who might get caught out with low fields from losing money on their races.. will it also make collection of race levies easier? Surely theres more benefits to be had for the clubs than negatives.

Couple of different issues here.
A lot of promoters depend on the cash flow on the day for prizes,expenses,etc.With the on line provider the money could come a week later.
As far as clubs getting caught out with small fields is concerned.What will happen under the new proposed system,i fear,is that promoters who see they have small entries in the days leading up an event,will simply pull the plug.So you're right they wont get caught out,but the nett result could be no event.

wav1

CramCycle wrote: »

Will this mean that no on the line entry will be available in any circumstances?

Cramcycle as i understand unless this is opposed there will def be no ''on the line'' entries anymore and i think it would be a real shame.

ragazzo

12 sprocket wrote: »

Wav, will it not take some of the workload from the clubs a and prevent clubs who might get caught out with low fields from losing money on their races.. will it also make collection of race levies easier? Surely theres more benefits to be had for the clubs than negatives.

There is no race levy. This was discontinued some years ago. The provincial levy is now paid by all clubs when they affiliate to CI each year.

I agree with Wav1 and think the pre-entry system will prove to be more negative than positive.

Beasty

I personally would favour compulsory advance online entry. Fields have got to be limited if road racing is going to flourish in Ireland (as highlighted by the Kilmessan "experience"), and if you don't take entries in advance you risk turning away riders on the day. It should be no big deal if riders have to plan ahead for a few days.

If promoters are concerned about losing money, they should simply reduce the prizes.

CramCycle

ragazzo wrote: »

There is no race levy. This was discontinued some years ago. The provincial levy is now paid by all clubs when they affiliate to CI each year.

I agree with Wav1 and think the pre-entry system will prove to be more negative than positive.

I think it is a good idea to have an online option for races where possible, the obvious ones that may struggle are those that are created on short notice to fill a gap but getting rid of on the day entry means my limited entry this year will be lower next year as with my work schedule I would not know until the day before in alot of cases if I could get out.

This is getting way off topic but is it something that could be brought up at the Provincial AGM or is it the CI AGM only for this sort of thing. Apologies for my lack of knowledge on such things. Would a counter motion need to be submitted now or can it be brought up as AOB?

Beasty

It was made clear at last year's AGM that no motions may be submitted from the floor. I think there remains scope to propose amendments to any motions that are submitted ahead of the specified deadline

I would add though that this is something which, although could be subject to a resolution at the AGM, would normally be left to be agreed at Board or Commission level. It's certainly not a rule that has to be brought before the membership for a vote

morana

to get back on topic if I was an incoming president I would assure promoters that they would have the cash in their accounts when the online entry for their race closes via a bank transfer.

DubVelo

I've a question, this seems a good a place as any to ask;

Does a CI president get paid?
What about the other members of the board, and other staff?
Is the budget or summary accounts published each year?

wav1

DubVelo wrote: »

I've a question, this seems a good a place as any to ask;

Does a CI president get paid?
What about the other members of the board, and other staff?
Is the budget or summary accounts published each year?

President and board members dont get paid
CEO and various other staff do get paid
Yes accounts are published at the AGM.

Beasty

wav1 wrote: »

Yes accounts are published at the AGM.

And are available to view on the CI website

wav1

2 x confirmed canditates now Denis Toomey and Ciaran Mc Kenna.First time since 90s there will be a contest.Thats good to see at least.
Whos the smart money on now for the position?

morana

wav1 wrote: »

2 x confirmed canditates now Denis Toomey and Ciaran Mc Kenna.First time since 90s there will be a contest.Thats good to see at least.
Whos the smart money on now for the position?

Its Ciaran Twomey for me!

It depends how the canvass. I have no idea and would like to hear what Ciaran says before I vote.

wav1

morana wrote: »

Its Kieran Twomey for me!

It depends how the canvass. I have no idea and would like to hear what Kieran says before I vote.

Ciarans letter went out to the clubs yesterday and Denis's went out a few weeks ago so their both out there now.

Beasty

wav1 wrote: »

Ciarans letter went out to the clubs yesterday and Denis's went out a few weeks ago so their both out there now.

I look forward to seeing what he has to say - I found Denis very forthcoming when I questioned him on some of his policies.

EDIT - just found his letter here

wav1

Both canditates letters/pitches are now up on www.stickybottle.com

morana

As well as the presidency the Office has released the documentation for the AGM download from cyclingireland.ie. a good few motions up for discussion as well as board elections and the Presidential election. I glanced thru it today but couldnt really digest it,. One that that did stand out was the grading review and in particular the IVCA bit.
I have some views on the grading but it seems ok in general.

wav1

morana wrote: »

As well as the presidency the Office has released the documentation for the AGM download from cyclingireland.ie. a good few motions up for discussion as well as board elections and the Presidential election. I glanced thru it today but couldnt really digest it,. One that that did stand out was the grading review and in particular the IVCA bit.
I have some views on the grading but it seems ok in general.

Yes.Some improvements proposed in there i believe.You def wont please everybody but i feel it will be a good start.Some good stuff there that will improve the lot of our over 50s riders and the Woman.

wav1

6 X days to go to the AGM folks.This is the platform for a rant that can count towards the future.
2 X Contestants for the Presidency

Forum on Future commissions and HP etc

Some interesting motions re grading,masters category,on line entry system etc.
Full AGM pack including,reports,financial reports,etc now on cyclingireland.ie .
Interesting to see how many will show up to this on the day.About 180 at the EGM.Imagine attendance wont even come close to that.First time since the 90s that there has been a contest for the president.2 good candidates who have been working for the votes.Interesting to see how it goes.

fat bloke

morana wrote: »

I hope Val Considine could be persuaded to stand. !!!

I have a smear campaign ready to launch, just in case...

Beasty

There are also Board seats up for grabs, with 4 people going for 3 places. However I heard the other day that one of them has withdrawn, which would mean on the face of it Messrs Horgan, Toomey and Mitchell will automatically get in. The situation is complicated though as Toomey is going for the Presidency and if he gets it that would leave a vacancy. In those circmstances I understand nominations may be made for the vacancy from the floor on the day.

wav1

Beasty wrote: »

There are also Board seats up for grabs, with 4 people going for 3 places. However I heard the other day that one of them has withdrawn, which would mean on the face of it Messrs Horgan, Toomey and Mitchell will automatically get in. The situation is complicated though as Toomey is going for the Presidency and if he gets it that would leave a vacancy. In those circmstances I understand nominations may be made for the vacancy from the floor on the day.

As i understand it your information is spot on Beasty.If Toomey gets the chair they have 2 options as i understand it.
1 Take nominations from the floor for the vacant position.
2 Leave it open and co opt somebody at a later stage.
For me,id like to see it filled on the day,and that way at least the membership will have some say on who it is.

CramCycle

Slightly off topic but what is the expected (I realise this can be way off) end time for the AGM? I know it starts at 11. How long would it go on for, roughly, based on previous years.

wav1

CramCycle wrote: »

Slightly off topic but what is the expected (I realise this can be way off) end time for the AGM? I know it starts at 11. How long would it go on for, roughly, based on previous years.

There is a forum/presentation at the end of the meeting on a few different items.I'd say it will be done and dusted by 5pm or not much after.

wav1

2 x days to go.Have to say at this stage i like what Ciaran Mc Kenna seems to be about.He is adamant that powers and more importantly finance,will be returned to the commissions at the different specifics.Communications with the office for members is also high on the agenda.I think and hope he could bring about positive actions in these areas.I have known him a long time and i think his experience in dealing with the sports council in the past could also yield benefits.

Beasty

Well I'm keeping my cards close to my chest on this one, but from my interaction with the pair of them I can see positives in both options

I think Denis may have more time to devote to the role, and brings experience from outside the traditional male-dominated road racing side of the sport. He has shown his delivery capabilities with his management of the paracycling squad

Ciaran has been there before and does have experience of working within the Board environment in the past. I was also pleased to see him turn up to the Track Commission AGM last week and listen to some of the grass root concerns

They both see shortcomings in the Commission structure and coming up with something that works better seems to be a priority

The most important skill to me though is communication and actually building on what we achieved with getting the EGM called earlier this year. In my view there is a wealth of untapped talent within CI, and the Board, Commissions, Provinces and clubs need to make the regular members realise they are as important as everyone else in the organisation. Not only do their views count, but everyone can contribute to the growth in Cycling in Ireland in different ways. That may be helping out with events, taking on responsibility within the organisation, marshalling the local club race etc. I feel there is definitely a disconnect with the membership at present, and sometimes the membership perhaps expects too much of their elected representatives. None of us should expect our races or sportives to be presented on a plate to us. If we want to get something out of cycling we need to be prepared to put something in and not rely on the likes of wav1 and a relatively small number of others to do it all for us.

12 sprocket

Beasty wrote: »

Well I'm keeping my cards close to my chest on this one, but from my interaction with the pair of them I can see positives in both options

I think Denis may have more time to devote to the role, and brings experience from outside the traditional male-dominated road racing side of the sport. He has shown his delivery capabilities with his management of the paracycling squad

Ciaran has been there before and does have experience of working within the Board environment in the past. I was also pleased to see him turn up to the Track Commission AGM last week and listen to some of the grass root concerns

They both see shortcomings in the Commission structure and coming up with something that works better seems to be a priority

The most important skill to me though is communication and actually building on what we achieved with getting the EGM called earlier this year. In my view there is a wealth of untapped talent within CI, and the Board, Commissions, Provinces and clubs need to make the regular members realise they are as important as everyone else in the organisation. Not only do their views count, but everyone can contribute to the growth in Cycling in Ireland in different ways. That may be helping out with events, taking on responsibility within the organisation, marshalling the local club race etc. I feel there is definitely a disconnect with the membership at present, and sometimes the membership perhaps expects too much of their elected representatives. None of us should expect our races or sportives to be presented on a plate to us. If we want to get something out of cycling we need to be prepared to put something in and not rely on the likes of wav1 and a relatively small number of others to do it all for us.

Beasty
They are all very fine and laudable sentiments about getting people involved, and their are some great people involved and hopefully more new people will participate. But the facts are that most members of cycling Ireland only want to ride their bikes and have no interest in what goes on unless it affects them directly. I imagine most organisations are the same.
Best wishes to Outgoing President Rory Wyley who leaves a strong legacy behind him

Beasty

12 sprocket wrote: »

Beasty
They are all very fine and laudable sentiments about getting people involved, and their are some great people involved and hopefully more new people will participate.

You seem happy with the "Old guard" continuing to exert major influence and shape the direction of CI. TBH, I am not. I think there is a major diconnect at present, which was highlighted in this summer's events. CI should not be in the business of telling everyone what is good for them - they should be engaging with the membership and taking on board the feedback they get

I am the first to praise the Board for their efforts in what is a pretty thankless task, but I genuinely believe there is room for massive improvement and hope a change in presidency can give the sport a direction it has, frankly, been missing

12 sprocket

Beasty wrote: »

You seem happy with the "Old guard" continuing to exert major influence and shape the direction of CI. TBH, I am not. I think there is a major diconnect at present, which was highlighted in this summer's events. CI should not be in the business of telling everyone what is good for them - they should be engaging with the membership and taking on board the feedback they get

I am the first to praise the Board for their efforts in what is a pretty thankless task, but I genuinely believe there is room for massive improvement and hope a change in presidency can give the sport a direction it has, frankly, been missing

Beasty
Why do you feel the need to attack me and misinterpret what I have written,read my post !! I have no interest in keeping old guards as you call them going. I am interested in Cycling! Whoever does a good job for cycling is fine by me. I was merely stating what is my experience that most people just want to ride their bikes, and have no interest in working as volunteers or committing to take responsibility for some section of cycling..
Did Wav not say that in an earlier post about getting people to commit to work for leinster at the agm..
And in fact I do think new blood is always good especially people who might not have a totally cycling background and who might bring new ideas to the sport. I hope if you do get involved with working for cycling that a more open minded approach is possible from you.

Beasty

To be clear I was not attacking you and indeed do not feel I have ever attacked you. I was simply trying to interpret your comments in what I considered a rational manner

I do feel there is a disconnect with the membership, and I have been in touch with both candidates to explain this and provide one or two ideas on how this may be addressed (as well as comments on other aspects of the role). In my view the rapid rise in memberhip means that a new approach is needed and I am hopeful that a new president can help deliver that.

Whoever gets in will have my support, and I hope they will engage better with the membership (indeed as morana did when he was on the Board).

RobFowl

When cyclists fight it's not a good look.......

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rRTlStScolw

Lusk_Doyle

12 sprocket wrote: »

Beasty
They are all very fine and laudable sentiments about getting people involved, and their are some great people involved and hopefully more new people will participate. But the facts are that most members of cycling Ireland only want to ride their bikes and have no interest in what goes on unless it affects them directly. I imagine most organisations are the same.
Best wishes to Outgoing President Rory Wyley who leaves a strong legacy behind him

Can you elaborate by what you mean in relation to this statement?

12 sprocket wrote: »

Beasty
Why do you feel the need to attack me and misinterpret what I have written,read my post !! I have no interest in keeping old guards as you call them going. I am interested in Cycling! Whoever does a good job for cycling is fine by me. I was merely stating what is my experience that most people just want to ride their bikes, and have no interest in working as volunteers or committing to take responsibility for some section of cycling..
Did Wav not say that in an earlier post about getting people to commit to work for leinster at the agm..
And in fact I do think new blood is always good especially people who might not have a totally cycling background and who might bring new ideas to the sport. I hope if you do get involved with working for cycling that a more open minded approach is possible from you.

The last thing that I would label Beasty as being is close-minded. I'm sure many on here and within our club would agree that he has been very forthright, up front and clear in his opinions regarding the management of the cycling bodies both national and international. I for one, thank his efforts and would consider him to be very open minded in his efforts to help deliver a better future for cycling both here and abroad.

Lusk_Doyle

Beasty wrote: »

To be clear I was not attacking you and indeed do not feel I have ever attacked you. I was simply trying to interpret your comments in what I considered a rational manner

I do feel there is a disconnect with the membership, and I have been in touch with both candidates to explain this and provide one or two ideas on how this may be addressed (as well as comments on other aspects of the role). In my view the rapid rise in memberhip means that a new approach is needed and I am hopeful that a new president can help deliver that.

Whoever gets in will have my support, and I hope they will engage better with the membership (indeed as morana did when he was on the Board).

^^^This.

wav1

I dont think the President can bring huge change all at once,but what they can do is to start communications with the relevent sectors within the sport,and with his help and support,these people can make change on the ground.This i feel is where the breakdown has been for the past number of years.The commissions or call them what you want,given real leadership and funding can make change.In the AGM reports for tomorrow there has been no reports submitted by either the road or youth commission.Not on in my opinion.28k allocation in 2013 across all commissions.Nothing or very little can be done with this type of funding.Youth is a really important one.Keep saying it,but the current crop of Juniors will all go on to what we all hope will be successful senior riders,another crop needs to be coming through all the time.This worries me at present,as there appears to be nothing happening for the youth at National level except fpr the Talent Team 2020 which is only for a very few.The rest of the kids must be looked after as well,as facts proove that a lot of them who show little talent at youth level,mature as riders a little later,and come in to their own as juniors and beyond.So its hugely important that these type of kids are encouraged and retained in the syste.I will be hoping for that type of support and input from the incoming president.I think we have 2 good candidates tomorrow,and i wish whoever comes through all the very best.For me and our clubs 4 votes we're with Ciaran this time.

RobFowl

wav1 wrote: »

For me and our clubs 4 votes we're with Ciaran this time.

Just to re iterate that clubs are granted a number of delegates/votes but for example Swords have 4 but we'd have to send 4 delegates to actually vote. If we only send 2 we only get 2 votes.

RobFowl

Obe quick point re funding for commissions etc.
CI have very, very limited funds and with most if not all the HP funding there is next to no flexibility or discretion as to where it goes.
I'd take any promises of increased funding with a grain of salt unless it's accompanied by details of where it's going to come from.....

RobFowl

12 sprocket wrote: »

Best wishes to Outgoing President Rory Wyley who leaves a strong legacy behind him

I'd like to echo 12 sprockets comments.
Rory has done an outstanding job over his 2 terms.