Bleak future for Inter-City rail services? (Speculation)

Judgement Day

I have it on good authority that the No Trains Authority are seriously contemplating a future Inter-City rail network that would consist solely of Belfast/Dublin/Cork with 'possibly' the direct line to Limerick also being retained. Some future - better that they resign en masse and let Varadkar carry the can.

Whatever happened to opening up the network to other operators? What ever happened to the National Spatial Strategy? Whatever happened to any sort of long term planning? Time for this useless tier of bureaucracy to be got rid of?

Still the NTA will leave behind a rich legacy - we are all going to have cycleways to our front doors whether we want them or not. :rolleyes:

LXFlyer

And where is this information coming from?

Nothing that has been published even suggests such a policy.

This would be the same NTA that has sanctioned increased rail services to Portlaoise and Galway. Hardly a no trains policy there.

Judgement Day

lxflyer wrote: »

And where is this information coming from?

Nothing that has been published even suggests such a policy.

This would be the same NTA that has sanctioned increased rail services to Portlaoise and Galway. Hardly a no trains policy there.

Do you really expect me to reveal my sources? Anyway, I'm putting it out there and you can make what you will of it. In my opinion the NTA have thrown in the towel with trying to improve the railway and their attitude is that we now have a motorway network and that's that.

Cookie_Monster

Shure we don't even need trains anymore, the buses are faster and better and cheaper, we could put the buses on the tracks greenways and all. They might squash a load of cyclists but at least they'll be off the roads so we can all drive quicker to the provinces too.

Banjoxed

Judgement Day wrote: »

I have it on good authority that the No Trains Authority are seriously contemplating a future Inter-City rail network that would consist solely of Belfast/Dublin/Cork with 'possibly' the direct line to Limerick also being retained. Some future - better that they resign en masse and let Varadkar carry the can.

Whatever happened to opening up the network to other operators? What ever happened to the National Spatial Strategy? Whatever happened to any sort of long term planning? Time for this useless tier of bureaucracy to be got rid of?

Still the NTA will leave behind a rich legacy - we are all going to have cycleways to our front doors whether we want them or not. :rolleyes:

The long time pipe dream of the Doheny and Nesbitt School of Economics. I would not be a bit surprised if this ultimately came to pass.

LXFlyer

Judgement Day wrote: »

Do you really expect me to reveal my sources? Anyway, I'm putting it out there and you can make what you will of it. In my opinion the NTA have thrown in the towel with trying to improve the railway and their attitude is that we now have a motorway network and that's that.

I actually do expect some form of substance to an allegation of this sort - it's a fairly serious allegation to make.

Nothing yet, other than your rumours, has suggested an anti-rail policy at the NTA.

Judgement Day

lxflyer wrote: »

I actually do expect some form of substance to an allegation of this sort - it's a fairly serious allegation to make.

Nothing yet, other than your rumours, has suggested an anti-rail policy at the NTA.

I'm not suggesting so much as an 'anti-rail' policy, more a case of throwing in the towel.

LXFlyer

Judgement Day wrote: »

I'm not suggesting so much as an 'anti-rail' policy, more a case of throwing in the towel.

Well there has been nothing to suggest that either.

It's a fairly wild accusation to make.

foggy_lad

Judgement Day wrote: »

I'm not suggesting so much as an 'anti-rail' policy, more a case of throwing in the towel.

You have it on good authority....whose authority? Is it your own "suggestion"? Do you consider yourself an authority?

W123-80's

Judgement Day wrote: »

I have it on good authority that the No Trains Authority are seriously contemplating a future Inter-City rail network that would consist solely of Belfast/Dublin/Cork with 'possibly' the direct line to Limerick also being retained. Some future - better that they resign en masse and let Varadkar carry the can.

Whatever happened to opening up the network to other operators? What ever happened to the National Spatial Strategy? Whatever happened to any sort of long term planning? Time for this useless tier of bureaucracy to be got rid of?

Still the NTA will leave behind a rich legacy - we are all going to have cycleways to our front doors whether we want them or not. :rolleyes:

I'm not doubting your sources, but I don't ever see that happening. Far too many vested interests in the upper echelons of CIÉ to allow it occur. The unions would also have something to say considering the amount of job losses that would result.

Even it it was openly proposed as something that was going to be persued it would take years to come to pass.
I don't think it will ever be anything other than something that the NTA are seriously contemplating.

_Kaiser_

To be fair, is it that surprising? With the rise in motorways and decent(ish) national routes in most of the country and expansion of private bus services, we have to ask ourselves DO we really need a full intercity train service in a country that is what? 5/6 hours by car end-to-end?

The cost of tickets has to be a big factor but this is driven by the cost in fuel, maintenance, rolling stock and let's not forget wages. Plus there's the point that most people don't appreciate being dumped out on the edge of town in most cases when they can get a bus or just drive to wherever they need to be.

I'm just not sure that the country is big enough to really need it - especially given the population is mainly concentrated into Dublin, Cork and their commuter towns.

Contrary to what certain groups believe in this country (and it was reflected in the proposed plans for Dublin City Centre this week too), Ireland is not a public transport friendly nation - mostly because (like renting for example) it's seen as the poor man's alternative! To be used by those with no better option. When you then put that mindset in the position of policy makers, is it really that surprising that public transport suffers as a result?

To force a REAL shift in this attitude the first thing you'd have to do is scrap CIE and it's legacy attitudes and mindset to change entirely. Then you'd have to provide a service that people WANT (not what they're told they want) at a competitive price that takes very little thought to actually use (from a joined-up multi-mode AND ticketing perspective - and LEAP ain't that!).

If you did that then maybe more people would be tempted out of their cars and once word of the good service spread, you'd get still more people using it until you get to a point where "pro-public transport" measures can be introduced with minimal resistance.

But given the threat of strike still hangs over Dublin Bus and our government's response to setup another committee to investigate what they want (at our expense of course!), does anyone actually think this "utopia" will ever happen?

You'd get better odds on Trappatoni being reinstated I'd bet!

Grandeeod

Kaiser2000 wrote: »

To be fair, is it that surprising? With the rise in motorways and decent(ish) national routes in most of the country and expansion of private bus services, we have to ask ourselves DO we really need a full intercity train service in a country that is what? 5/6 hours by car end-to-end?

The cost of tickets has to be a big factor but this is driven by the cost in fuel, maintenance, rolling stock and let's not forget wages. Plus there's the point that most people don't appreciate being dumped out on the edge of town in most cases when they can get a bus or just drive to wherever they need to be.

I'm just not sure that the country is big enough to really need it - especially given the population is mainly concentrated into Dublin, Cork and their commuter towns.

Contrary to what certain groups believe in this country (and it was reflected in the proposed plans for Dublin City Centre this week too), Ireland is not a public transport friendly nation - mostly because (like renting for example) it's seen as the poor man's alternative! To be used by those with no better option. When you then put that mindset in the position of policy makers, is it really that surprising that public transport suffers as a result?

To force a REAL shift in this attitude the first thing you'd have to do is scrap CIE and it's legacy attitudes and mindset to change entirely. Then you'd have to provide a service that people WANT (not what they're told they want) at a competitive price that takes very little thought to actually use (from a joined-up multi-mode AND ticketing perspective - and LEAP ain't that!).

If you did that then maybe more people would be tempted out of their cars and once word of the good service spread, you'd get still more people using it until you get to a point where "pro-public transport" measures can be introduced with minimal resistance.

But given the threat of strike still hangs over Dublin Bus and our government's response to setup another committee to investigate what they want (at our expense of course!), does anyone actually think this "utopia" will ever happen?

You'd get better odds on Trappatoni being reinstated I'd bet!

I agree.

BuffyBot

"I have it on good authority.." isn't really the basis for discussion.

Perhaps when, and if, this actually becomes a thing and there is a source to support it, then the discussion can be reopened.