Are the Nordic countries paradise on earth.

06-09-2013 4:42pm #1

Are the Nordic countries and Iceland paradise on earth? A paradise of subsidised childcare, wonderful health care, welfare, high education standards, good government where the bankers were held to account and prison that work. A society of complete equality and sexual tolerance.

I ask as anytime I get in to a discussion on social issue someone will say it works in the Nordic countries as if the social policies of the Nordic countries is the answer to every problem.

Mr Benevolent · 06-09-2013 4:43pm

No. I can confirm this by personal experience.

wp_rathead · 06-09-2013 4:45pm

ah but the weather can be bit nippy

Legs.Eleven · 06-09-2013 4:47pm

Mr Benevolent wrote: »

No. I can confirm this by personal experience.

I'm interested so could you elaborate?

Frosty McSnowballs · 06-09-2013 4:48pm

No,

Haven't you been to Carlow?!

My name is URL · 06-09-2013 4:48pm

Depends on your definition of paradise

Festy · 06-09-2013 4:48pm

mariaalice wrote: »

Are the Nordic countries and Iceland paradise on earth? A paradise of subsidised childcare, wonderful health care, welfare, high education standards, good government where the bankers were held to account and prison that work. A society of complete equality and sexual tolerance.

I ask as anytime I get in to a discussion on social issue someone will say it works in the Nordic countries as if the social policies of the Nordic countries is the answer to every problem.

Good looking too.

4zn76tysfajdxp · 06-09-2013 4:49pm

€7 for a pint of Guinness doesn't sound like paradise to me.

MadsL · 06-09-2013 4:50pm

Bah, who wants to live in a world populated by healthy, good looking people, with tolerant attitudes, excellent public transport, superb pension benefits and great cuisine?

Frosty McSnowballs · 06-09-2013 4:53pm

MadsL wrote: »

Bah, who wants to live in a world populated by healthy, good looking people, with tolerant attitudes, excellent public transport, superb pension benefits and great cuisine?

Yeah! And reindeer that aren't just for Christmas!

Oranage2 · 06-09-2013 4:56pm

MadsL wrote: »

Bah, who wants to live in a world populated by healthy, good looking people, with tolerant attitudes, excellent public transport, superb pension benefits and great cuisine?

Arent they known for their terrible cusine?

Seachmall · 06-09-2013 4:56pm

Oslo has one of, if not the, highest rates of rape in Europe and Norway in general, according to a few Norwegians I've spoken to, is one of the most racist countries in Europe.

It also has a particularly high rate of depression (probably due to the extensive period of darkness they suffer through).

While that's only one of the Nordic countries it's probably not some drastic outlier in terms of those issues.

06-09-2013 4:57pm

MadsL wrote: »

Bah, who wants to live in a world populated by healthy, good looking people, with tolerant attitudes, excellent public transport, superb pension benefits and great cuisine?

So if adopt their social policies, and public transport policies will we become a tolerant people more interested in public wealth than personal wealth or could that have some thing to do with culture and history.

EdenHazard · 06-09-2013 5:00pm

Not really tbh, I think these are the type of countries that appeal to the typical depressed Boards user who live their life based on ideals rather than experiences(Overthing issues that have no impact on day to day life, for example 'complete equality and sexual tolerance) I don't know about most people here but have you ever woke up and thought about the (perceived) lack of equality and sexual tolerance in Ireland? . They are countries run well and they are an example to follow but at end of the day most of the positives about the countries don't make them amazing places to live.

the keen edge · 06-09-2013 5:00pm

In a country you can have an environment conducive for prudent fiscal policy and personal finances; or one conducive for having the craic. I don't think you can have both.

My name is URL · 06-09-2013 5:01pm

Oranage2 wrote: »

Arent they known for their terrible cusine?

The world's 'best' restaurant happens to be in Copenhagen, which for some people means that Nordic countries must have the best cuisines.

crockholm · 06-09-2013 5:03pm

mariaalice wrote: »

Are the Nordic countries and Iceland paradise on earth? A paradise of subsidised childcare, wonderful health care, welfare, high education standards, good government where the bankers were held to account and prison that work. A society of complete equality and sexual tolerance.

I ask as anytime I get in to a discussion on social issue someone will say it works in the Nordic countries as if the social policies of the Nordic countries is the answer to every problem.

It's alright here,no paradise though.Childcare is cheap-about 150 euro per month per kid,then it works on a sliding scale-the idea of a stay at home mom is an anathema here though.
Welfare is a seperate thread,it is byzantine in it's intricacies-for a worker,you pay seperately for unemployment insurance (55 e per month for me) otherwise you get squat until you sell anything you have of value.
Health care is nothing to write home about,nurses unhappy about their wages,so the govt. brings in hundreds from Germany on contract work.

Uni's remain good,but the standards in the gymnasiet (secondary schools) are declining.
Politics is politics-there's always something to be ripping out the hairs about.

HalloweenJack · 06-09-2013 5:04pm

You forgot to mention military service for males. I know it exists in Finland and I think Norway. Definitely not a bonus point. You can swap military service for community service (in Finland, at least) but people who do this are seen as a bit odd.

crockholm · 06-09-2013 5:05pm

Collin Zealous Ballet wrote: »

€7 for a pint of Guinness doesn't sound like paradise to me.

Where can I get one of these cheap pints?;)

Seaneh · 06-09-2013 5:12pm

Collin Zealous Ballet wrote: »

€7 for a pint of Guinness doesn't sound like paradise to me.

Compared to the average income that's not actually very expensive.

06-09-2013 5:13pm

EdenHazard wrote: »

Not really tbh, I think these are the type of countries that appeal to the typical depressed Boards user who live their life based on ideals rather than experiences(Overthing issues that have no impact on day to day life, for example 'complete equality and sexual tolerance) I don't know about most people here but have you ever woke up and thought about the (perceived) lack of equality and sexual tolerance in Ireland? . They are countries run well and they are an example to follow but at end of the day most of the positives about the countries don't make them amazing places to live.

It is just that any discussion on social issues will inevitable have some one saying it so wonderful in the Nordic countries and by implication if only we were like them life would be great, highly rational and intelligent people will not accept that culture is largely the reason they are like they are, you simply cant say do it here and we will get the same result.

clairefontaine · 06-09-2013 5:14pm

MadsL wrote: »

Bah, who wants to live in a world populated by healthy, good looking people, with tolerant attitudes, excellent public transport, superb pension benefits and great cuisine?

I don't. Booorrrring. Come on madsl....embrace diversity....

Legs.Eleven · 06-09-2013 5:16pm

crockholm wrote: »

It's alright here,no paradise though.Childcare is cheap-about 150 euro per month per kid,then it works on a sliding scale-the idea of a stay at home mom is an anathema here though.
Welfare is a seperate thread,it is byzantine in it's intricacies-for a worker,you pay seperately for unemployment insurance (55 e per month for me) otherwise you get squat until you sell anything you have of value.
Health care is nothing to write home about,nurses unhappy about their wages,so the govt. brings in hundreds from Germany on contract work.

Uni's remain good,but the standards in the gymnasiet (secondary schools) are declining.
Politics is politics-there's always something to be ripping out the hairs about.

Which country is this?

Lawrence1895 · 06-09-2013 5:17pm

A few of the best Black Metal and Death Metal bands come from Scandinavia. lovely landscapes, not over populated, and I like the weather

crockholm · 06-09-2013 5:20pm

MadsL wrote: »

Bah, who wants to live in a world populated by healthy, good looking people, with tolerant attitudes, excellent public transport, superb pension benefits and great cuisine?

I'd give you 2.5 out of those 6 points Mad.

Lot of diversity in the nordic countries-even among the natives themselves.

losthorizon · 06-09-2013 5:20pm

the keen edge wrote: »

In a country you can have an environment conducive for prudent fiscal policy and personal finances; or one conducive for having the craic. I don't think you can have both.

You have never been on the Runtur

Seaneh · 06-09-2013 5:21pm

Legs.Eleven wrote: »

Which country is this?

From his name, I'm guessing Sweden.

Nodin · 06-09-2013 5:21pm

losthorizon wrote: »

You have never been on the Runtur

...is that like being on the batter?

crockholm · 06-09-2013 5:23pm

Legs.Eleven wrote: »

Which country is this?

The blue and yellow one.
The wealthies one at the moment is Norway,and the one with the best education is Finland(even though all the others laugh at them for their accent when speaking english-you would have your work cut out for you there;))

My name is URL · 06-09-2013 5:24pm

HalloweenJack wrote: »

You forgot to mention military service for males. I know it exists in Finland and I think Norway. Definitely not a bonus point. You can swap military service for community service (in Finland, at least) but people who do this are seen as a bit odd.

Yeah, that'd be a big put-off for me too. I mean how 'liberal and progressive' can a place be if you're virtually forced into the military, regardless of what you believe in, for 2 years as a young adult?

losthorizon · 06-09-2013 5:25pm

Nodin wrote: »

...is that like being on the batter?

But madder. Its what they do in Iceland. There is a reason Icelandic people have sex earlier than anyone else in the world and they love foreigners.

dj jarvis · 06-09-2013 5:26pm

the life expectancy of the Nordic country's is the same as here , its down to the quality of that life,

I spend a month a year ( at least ) in Finland , and i have to say , it might not be paradise , but socially its light years ahead of here,

best education system in the world,
one of, if not the best health care in the world,
good social welfare for those that deserve it ( you pay in , you get back)
a union for self employed people ( not like the slavery heaped onto self employed people here )
a good example of this union is this , if your business is failing or the work stops , the union will pay you 80% of your avg wage for 2 year , while paying for you to up skill of change career - while here you get a kick in the balls and told to jog on

forward thinking family friendly policy's - not like the crap here.

as for the military service in Finland - most people choose to do it
not just for the buzz but out of civic pride, and the national memory of the Russians attacking. ( the winter war and the continuation war)
My son is a Finnish citizen and will be asked to do his service , and i will encourage this - it will be good character building activity.

i wish i was asked at 18 to head off to Finland to do military service , in a country full of gorgeous women who love the Irish and the Irish accent,
happy days indeed

fits · 06-09-2013 5:29pm

My name is URL wrote: »

Yeah, that'd be a big put-off for me too. I mean how 'liberal and progressive' can a place be if you're virtually forced into the military, regardless of what you believe in, for 2 years as a young adult?

Hmm when your neighbour is Russia, who have tried it on before, you can understand the military service thing. I'm in Finland the last year and its a grand spot tbh.

4zn76tysfajdxp · 06-09-2013 5:29pm

My name is URL wrote: »

Yeah, that'd be a big put-off for me too. I mean how 'liberal and progressive' can a place be if you're virtually forced into the military, regardless of what you believe in, for 2 years as a young adult?

Military service in Finland can sometimes be as short as four months, though.

dj jarvis · 06-09-2013 5:30pm

My name is URL wrote: »

Yeah, that'd be a big put-off for me too. I mean how 'liberal and progressive' can a place be if you're virtually forced into the military, regardless of what you believe in, for 2 years as a young adult?

rubbish

its one year and you can opt out , you can do all sorts of community work instead .
the Finns had the option to remove this and didn't - becasue they can see the social benefits of having healthy trained young people with civic pride

compared to Ireland socially its utopia - Ireland looks backward the way it treats it citizens

Lawrence1895 · 06-09-2013 5:31pm

If they do community service in Finland, do they serve the same period, as the soldiers do?

I didn't go to the army way back in Germany, and the community service was always three months longer :mad:

dj jarvis · 06-09-2013 5:37pm

Lars1916 wrote: »

If they do community service in Finland, do they serve the same period, as the soldiers do?

I didn't go to the army way back in Germany, and the community service was always three months longer :mad:

they do the same time as they would have in the army , but the time spent in the army can differ hugely for a large amount of reasons

its not as one poster alluded to - you are not frog marched off to a army camp against your will for 2 years - that just does not happen

both my sisters are married to Germans , and their husbands both had the option of community service , one took the navy one took helping old people
The one that done the social work regretted it , the one that went to the navy developed a fondness for beer :-)

inocybe · 06-09-2013 5:37pm

Where I worked I had a window looking out on to an idyllic nordic city park. Fantastic view of the heroin addicts shooting up, and of the ambulance-a-day coming to cart away the overdoses. Was mugged at a cashpoint, always scared walking home as there had been a lot of rapes. Bus drivers would regularly skip stopping at my local bus stop when there was a big group of African students waiting.
Found the locals to be quite inward looking, bordering on xenophobic and arrogant. Cost of living was horrific, very difficult to afford basics. All discounts for travel were for norwegians only.
And at a certain time of year marching bands of boys would come by at a ridiculously early hour of sunday morning, banging drums and making a racket in the name of patriotism. Now can anyone guess the city?

Legs.Eleven · 06-09-2013 5:38pm

Seaneh wrote: »

From his name, I'm guessing Sweden.

Ah!

Oooh silly me! Norway appeals to me more.

Nodin · 06-09-2013 5:40pm

dj jarvis wrote: »

they do the same time as they would have in the army , but the time spent in the army can differ hugely for a large amount of reasons

its not as one poster alluded to - you are not frog marched off to a army camp against your will for 2 years - that just does not happen

both my sisters are married to Germans , and their husbands both had the option of community service , one took the navy one took helping old people
The one that done the social work regretted it , the one that went to the navy developed a fondness for beer :-)

Note to self - Take "beer connosieur" option, not training for Enforced Euthanasia Advocate...

dj jarvis · 06-09-2013 5:41pm

inocybe wrote: »

Where I worked I had a window looking out on to an idyllic nordic city park. Fantastic view of the heroin addicts shooting up, and of the ambulance-a-day coming to cart away the overdoses. Was mugged at a cashpoint, always scared walking home as there had been a lot of rapes. Bus drivers would regularly skip stopping at my local bus stop when there was a big group of African students waiting.
Found the locals to be quite inward looking, bordering on xenophobic and arrogant. Cost of living was horrific, very difficult to afford basics. All discounts for travel were for norwegians only.
And at a certain time of year marching bands of boys would come by at a ridiculously early hour of sunday morning, banging drums and making a racket in the name of patriotism. Now can anyone guess the city?

It could be ANY city in any Nordic country , no one said this did not happen,
they are not perfect by any stretch of the imagination

thing is , this ALSO happens here in Ireland , but we dont have the benefits of the social care they have

lose lose for us really

( as for name the city - i'll go Helsinki

)

Reiketsu · 06-09-2013 5:43pm

I have friends in Gothenburg so I have been there a couple of times. Lovely city and nice people but pricey compared to here even for basics like bread. My friends that live there say it isn't as good as it used to be.

EB_2013 · 06-09-2013 5:45pm

inocybe wrote: »

Where I worked I had a window looking out on to an idyllic nordic city park. Fantastic view of the heroin addicts shooting up, and of the ambulance-a-day coming to cart away the overdoses. Was mugged at a cashpoint, always scared walking home as there had been a lot of rapes. Bus drivers would regularly skip stopping at my local bus stop when there was a big group of African students waiting.
Found the locals to be quite inward looking, bordering on xenophobic and arrogant. Cost of living was horrific, very difficult to afford basics. All discounts for travel were for norwegians only.
And at a certain time of year marching bands of boys would come by at a ridiculously early hour of sunday morning, banging drums and making a racket in the name of patriotism. Now can anyone guess the city?

Still sounds better than Dublin.

inocybe · 06-09-2013 5:45pm

dj jarvis wrote: »

It could be ANY city in any Nordic country , no one said this did not happen,
they are not perfect by any stretch of the imagination

thing is , this ALSO happens here in Ireland , but we dont have the benefits of the social care they have

lose lose for us really

( as for name the city - i'll go Helsinki )

oh sorry, I misread the thread title then:p
wrong city, unless other places have those annoying, male only, drumming, crossbow bearing, noise makers.:mad:

crockholm · 06-09-2013 5:49pm

Legs.Eleven wrote: »

Ah! Oooh silly me! Norway appeals to me more.

Norway is an insanely beautiful country,not sure they would have the need for English language teachers though:oAnd no-one has yet mentioned Legoland in Denmark:mad:

MadsL · 06-09-2013 5:54pm

Oranage2 wrote: »

Arent they known for their terrible cusine?

My name is URL wrote: »

The world's 'best' restaurant happens to be in Copenhagen, which for some people means that Nordic countries must have the best cuisines.

I happen to like herring.

_Redzer_ · 06-09-2013 5:56pm

HalloweenJack wrote: »

You forgot to mention military service for males. I know it exists in Finland and I think Norway. Definitely not a bonus point. You can swap military service for community service (in Finland, at least) but people who do this are seen as a bit odd.

I don't see the issue. Builds you up and makes you a more independent person. I think it's a good foundation to have when you're a young adult and that will stand to you throughout your life.

06-09-2013 6:01pm

_Redzer_ wrote: »

I don't see the issue. Builds you up and makes you a more independent person. I think it's a good foundation to have when you're a young adult and that will stand to you throughout your life.

Being forced to do something by the state makes you more independent yea

questionmark? · 06-09-2013 6:02pm

My name is URL wrote: »

The world's 'best' restaurant happens to be in Copenhagen, which for some people means that Nordic countries must have the best cuisines.

At least with the worlds best restaurant it has a least one good thing going for it. Dirty, smelly, noisy city.

My name is URL · 06-09-2013 6:03pm

dj jarvis wrote: »

rubbish

its one year and you can opt out , you can do all sorts of community work instead .
they Finns had the option to remove this and didn't - becasue they can see the social benefits of having healthy trained young people with civic pride

compared to Ireland socially its utopia - Ireland looks backward the way it treats it citizens

Where are you speaking of? I assume Finland.

In Norway, the minimum and mandatory term is 18 months, and that can be extended for any number of reasons. There are certain ways in which you can 'opt-out', but it's something which is still socially frowned upon to a very large degree.

Not sure what the situation is regarding swapping military service for community service.. in any event it's one of the least attractive aspects of it. The state should not be in a position to take away any of your liberties (once you have not signed them away by being a criminal), however big or small they are, if you are to truly regard yourself as a free individual.

Legs.Eleven · 06-09-2013 6:04pm

crockholm wrote: »

Norway is an insanely beautiful country,not sure they would have the need for English language teachers though:oAnd no-one has yet mentioned Legoland in Denmark:mad:

I'd work in my other profession - Lollipop Lady.

Are the Nordic countries paradise on earth.

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