Whatever happened to the hole on the Ozone Layer

Roger_007

I remember when the greatest threat to life on earth was the so-called hole in the Ozone Layer. This apparently was discovered in Antarctica and was of such importance that worldwide action was decided at a major summit in Montreal in the mid 1990s, (Montreal protocols). It was decided to ban the use of CFC gases to save us all from being destroyed by UV radiation.
Since then nothing much has been heard about the Ozone hole. I decided to do a bit of research and discovered that, as Gerry Adams might have put it, it hasn't gone away. It still appears over Antarctica every year but is now generally accepted that it is just a seasonal phenomenon.
Was the whole thing a panic born of ignorance, (like the swine flu 'pandemic' that was supposed to wipe us out).

Sam Kade

They discovered climate change instead :rolleyes:

Mr Benevolent

Fcuk that. An X30 solar flare would cause far more damage.

WIZE

Cow farts caused it

Roger_007

Sam Kade wrote: »

They discovered climate change instead :rolleyes:

You could be right. It's whatever cause is the flavour of the month/year/decade. Also, I've noticed that the term 'climate change' has gradually replaced 'global warming'. This is because the climate has always been changing anyway so climate change is undeniable.

bleg

CFCs were banned before it became too much of a problem and the hole is gradually closing up.

DEFTLEFTHAND

Roger_007 wrote: »

You could be right. It's whatever cause is the flavour of the month/year/decade. Also, I've noticed that the term 'climate change' has gradually replaced 'global warming'. This is because the climate has always been changing anyway so climate change is undeniable.

Yes, the Earth moves through different cycles that we've no control over.

ninebeanrows

No, you're wrong. You obviously didn't do much investigation. Perhaps a read of a wikipedia page on the matter might inform you.

The CFCs were increasing the rate of a natural reaction in the stratosphere that depletes ozone.

And yes a natural ozone 'hole' occurs over the Antarctica each Spring(?). Something to do with Polar Stratospheric Clouds (PSCs) which form at really cold temperatures only recorded in this region.

I can't remember specifics, but you are totally wrong in your assertions.

bleg

Roger_007 wrote: »

You could be right. It's whatever cause is the flavour of the month/year/decade. Also, I've noticed that the term 'climate change' has gradually replaced 'global warming'. This is because the climate has always been changing anyway so climate change is undeniable.

I thought it was called climate change because in some locales it may result in periodical cooler temperatures thus it's a more accurate term. The average world temperatures are increasing, and the vast scientific consensus is that this is due to the activities of humans.

The Backwards Man

It's all balls. The dinosaurs and mammoths all died and they didn't use fridges or Lynx bodysprays.

kasper

they fixed it with some carbon tacks

Sulla Felix

CFCs are still being made OP, just not in the West.

Corkbah

bleg wrote: »

CFCs were banned before it became too much of a problem and the hole is gradually closing up.

really ... aerosols are CFC's are they not ??

I still see cans of lynx on sale.

(Maybe I'm just wrong but .... )

Roger_007

bleg wrote: »

CFCs were banned before it became too much of a problem and the hole is gradually closing up.

I'm afraid you are wrong there. The 'hole' is the same as ever it was. It is just now recognised that it is a natural occurrence.

RachaelVO

Scientists congratulated us humans with being able to adapt, take CFCs outta products, seen the ozone layer got fixed and then told us the next bold thing we did...

Or some such ****e...

wendell borton

The creature in the sky got sucked in the hole.

endacl

Corkbah wrote: »

really ... aerosols are CFC's are they not ??

I still see cans of lynx on sale.

(Maybe I'm just wrong but .... )

Nope. Chlorofluorocarbons were the agents used to make the lynx or whatever 'spray'. Not used for these applications any more.

Hydrofluorocarbons (HFCs) and perfluorocarbons (PFCs) are alternative halocarbons being used to replace CFC in industrial and commercial applications and their use is becoming more widespread. Other alternatives to CFC include ammonia, carbon dioxide and hydrocarbons.

endacl

Roger_007 wrote: »

You could be right. It's whatever cause is the flavour of the month/year/decade. Also, I've noticed that the term 'climate change' has gradually replaced 'global warming'. This is because the climate has always been changing anyway so climate change is undeniable.

Other way round, actually. Once we all know what we're referring to though, what harm in variable nomenclature?

Sam Kade

Roger_007 wrote: »

You could be right. It's whatever cause is the flavour of the month/year/decade. Also, I've noticed that the term 'climate change' has gradually replaced 'global warming'. This is because the climate has always been changing anyway so climate change is undeniable.

Now we have to pay tax because the climate is changing :mad:
In America the state using the most solar energy is Arizona now the US government want to cash in and made a decision to tax solar energy (tax the sun :eek:) You can't win.

bleg

Roger_007 wrote: »

I'm afraid you are wrong there. The 'hole' is the same as ever it was. It is just now recognised that it is a natural occurrence.

Nope. Completely false.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ozone_depletion#Observations_on_ozone_layer_depletion

I know it's a Wiki article but it's well researched and referenced and will give you a nice starting point to get some correct information.

PizzamanIRL

They put a plaster over it.

endacl

Roger_007 wrote: »

I'm afraid you are wrong there. The 'hole' is the same as ever it was. It is just now recognised that it is a natural occurrence.

It was never disputed as a natural occurrence. It is widely accepted though that man made ozone depleting agents have had a measurable damaging effect since monitoring technology has been developed to keep an eye on it.

The Antarctic ozone hole, for example, is an area of the Antarctic stratosphere in which the recent ozone levels have at points dropped to as low as a third of their pre-1975 values.

Ozone depletion is a naturally occurring cyclical event, but its severity is what is concerning. It's never recovered to pre-1970's levels - when records began, and last year was the lowest recorded level since 2002.

Grayson

Sam Kade wrote: »

Now we have to pay tax because the climate is changing :mad:
In America the state using the most solar energy is Arizona now the US government want to cash in and made a decision to tax solar energy (tax the sun :eek:) You can't win.

Well, either way you have taxes but with one you help stop climate change.





Regards the OP, the ozone hole is still there. A quick google shows that.

This is from the wiki page. There's a few reasons why the hole is only there half the year. It's because you need sunlight to start the reaction and in winter the antarctic is dark. And it is mainly caused by man made CFC's

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ozone_depletion#Ozone_hole_and_its_causes

the primary cause of ozone depletion is the presence of chlorine-containing source gases (primarily CFCs and related halocarbons). In the presence of UV light, these gases dissociate, releasing chlorine atoms, which then go on to catalyze ozone destruction. The Cl-catalyzed ozone depletion can take place in the gas phase, but it is dramatically enhanced in the presence of polar stratospheric clouds (PSCs).[17]
These polar stratospheric clouds(PSC) form during winter, in the extreme cold. Polar winters are dark, consisting of 3 months without solar radiation (sunlight). The lack of sunlight contributes to a decrease in temperature and the polar vortex traps and chills air. Temperatures hover around or below −80 °C. These low temperatures form cloud particles. There are three types of PSC clouds—nitric acid trihydrate clouds, slowly cooling water-ice clouds, and rapid cooling water-ice (nacerous) clouds—provide surfaces for chemical reactions whose products will, in the spring lead to ozone destruction.[18]
The photochemical processes involved are complex but well understood. The key observation is that, ordinarily, most of the chlorine in the stratosphere resides in "reservoir" compounds, primarily chlorine nitrate (ClONO
2) as well as stable end products such as HCl. The formation of end products essentially remove Cl from the ozone depletion process. The former sequester Cl, which can be later made available via absorption of light at shorter wavelengths than 400 nm.[19] During the Antarctic winter and spring, however, reactions on the surface of the polar stratospheric cloud particles convert these "reservoir" compounds into reactive free radicals (Cl and ClO). The process by which the clouds remove NO
2 from the stratosphere by converting it to nitric acid in the PSC particles, which then are lost by sedimentation is called denitrification. This prevents newly formed ClO from being converted back into ClONO
2.
The role of sunlight in ozone depletion is the reason why the Antarctic ozone depletion is greatest during spring. During winter, even though PSCs are at their most abundant, there is no light over the pole to drive chemical reactions. During the spring, however, the sun comes out, providing energy to drive photochemical reactions and melt the polar stratospheric clouds, releasing considerable ClO, which drives the hole mechanism. Further warming temperatures near the end of spring break up the vortex around mid-December. As warm, ozone and NO
2-rich air flows in from lower latitudes, the PSCs are destroyed, the enhanced ozone depletion process shuts down, and the ozone hole closes.[20]

EDITING to put some of the text in bold.

endacl

Sam Kade wrote: »

Now we have to pay tax because the climate is changing :mad:
In America the state using the most solar energy is Arizona now the US government want to cash in and made a decision to tax solar energy (tax the sun :eek:) You can't win.

Well..... All energy is ultimately solar energy. That's really just taxing at source!

Gmol

The recession fixed it, no one has the money to care anymore

kc90

Roger_007 wrote: »

I remember when the greatest threat to life on earth was the so-called hole in the Ozone Layer. This apparently was discovered in Antarctica and was of such importance that worldwide action was decided at a major summit in Montreal in the mid 1990s, (Montreal protocols). It was decided to ban the use of CFC gases to save us all from being destroyed by UV radiation.
Since then nothing much has been heard about the Ozone hole. I decided to do a bit of research and discovered that, as Gerry Adams might have put it, it hasn't gone away. It still appears over Antarctica every year but is now generally accepted that it is just a seasonal phenomenon.
Was the whole thing a panic born of ignorance, (like the swine flu 'pandemic' that was supposed to wipe us out).

There is and always has been seasonal thinning of the ozone layer over the poles. As the temperatures increase in spring, chemical deposits in the ice are released and react with the ozone. This happens at the poles due to unusual cloud systems that allow the ozone and other chemicals to react in water droplets.
The problem with CFCs is that they regenerate and can react 1000s of times destroying a huge amount of ozone while most other gases are, by comparison, inert. So, it went from a situation where there's a small hole for a few months to a large permanent hole that was continuing to grow. While it's not back 'normal' yet, the ozone is replenishing.

Sam Kade

Grayson wrote: »

Well, either way you have taxes but with one you help stop climate change.




.

Taxes stop the climate changing

Ilik Urgee

bleg wrote: »

CFCs were banned before it became too much of a problem and the hole is gradually closing up.

Like when a cow has a shit puckering shut? Or a clapperboard kind of slap shut?

zenno

WIZE wrote: »

Cow farts caused it

Yeah, i remember the cows farting damaging the ozone layer :pac:

Cows' farting and burping must be brought under control because they're causing global warming problems, a climate change expert has warned.

Just one cow gives off enough harmful methane gas in a single day to fill around 400 litre bottles, which is really bad for the environment.

The gas goes up into the atmosphere and makes the hole in the ozone layer bigger, worsening global warming.

Dr Chris Jardine says the government must do more to halt the gassy problem.

Get a moo-ve on and try our cow quiz!

And it's not just cows - sheep and goats also produce methane, which is 20 times more harmful to the environment than carbon dioxide.

Dr Jardine, from Oxford University, said that the government needs to give more help to farmers.

What is global warming? Find out here

Cutting the gas would also be good news for farmers, because it's thought if the animals aren't burping and farting then they would be able to grow more quickly.

But the government says its plans include ways to help farmers protect the environment.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/cbbcnews/hi/newsid_6040000/newsid_6046900/6046962.stm

Sam Kade

endacl wrote: »

Well..... All energy is ultimately solar energy. That's really just taxing at source!

Yeah, maybe they should tax people for using windup flashlights next.

endacl

Sam Kade wrote: »

Yeah, maybe they should tax people for using windup flashlights next.

You pay VAT on the food that provides the muscle power to turn the handle...

Cookie_Monster

it's still around, just not topical or as large. It'll take a while for it to recover fully.
It's very noticeable down here in NZ, the sun is far stronger and you burn much much quicker compared to say Spain.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ozone_depletion

endacl

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

it's still around, just not topical or as large. It'll take a while for it to recover fully.
It's very noticeable down here in NZ, the sun is far stronger and you burn much much quicker compared to say Spain.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ozone_depletion

You're in NZ?!? I always read you as being just outside of Mullingar!

Sam Kade

endacl wrote: »

You pay VAT on the food that provides the muscle power to turn the handle...

What about if you live off wild berries and forage from other peoples rubbish bins?

Roger_007

kc90 wrote: »

There is and always has been seasonal thinning of the ozone layer over the poles. As the temperatures increase in spring, chemical deposits in the ice are released and react with the ozone. This happens at the poles due to unusual cloud systems that allow the ozone and other chemicals to react in water droplets.
The problem with CFCs is that they regenerate and can react 1000s of times destroying a huge amount of ozone while most other gases are, by comparison, inert. So, it went from a situation where there's a small hole for a few months to a large permanent hole that was continuing to grow. While it's not back 'normal' yet, the ozone is replenishing.

There is not sufficient historical to state one way or the other what the long-term status of the ozone layer is. Nobody knows what the levels of ozone were 50 or 100 or 1000 years ago. Therefore it is impossible to say what is, or is not, a normal level.
There is a worrying tendency amongst attention-seeking scientists to make definitive and dramatic statements about the state of the world as if the world began 50 or 100 years ago. How often have we heard that something is the most extreme occurrence "since records began". The records on the ozone layer are only available for the past 30 years or so. No accurate assessment or prediction can be made with such paltry data.

endacl

Sam Kade wrote: »

What about if you live off wild berries and forage from other peoples rubbish bins?

Yeah. That works. I'm starting next week.

losthorizon

People get mixed up with climate change and the hole in the ozone layer they are two completely different things. One is also a short term fix (ozone layer) and Climate change is long term.

They have nothing absolutely nothing to do with each other. The reason you dont hear about the ozone layer any more is that human interference with it has been stopped. I cant remember off the top of my head how long it takes to replenish the damage done from CFCs etc but I think it only takes about 25 -100 years which is tiny in earth terms.

The ozone problem has been solved thankfully.

Roger_007

losthorizon wrote: »

?.........

The ozone problem has been solved thankfully.

Not in New Zealand apparently according to Cookie-Monster.....

galwayrush

What caused all the Ice Ages on Earth over the last few million years?. It's a natural cycle we can't do anything about.

keith16

Try to think of the hole in the ozone layer like earths "sunroof".

Duiske

bleg wrote: »

I thought it was called climate change because in some locales it may result in periodical cooler temperatures thus it's a more accurate term. The average world temperatures are increasing, and the vast scientific consensus is that this is due to the activities of humans.

How much has the global average temperature increased by since the year 2000 ?

losthorizon

galwayrush wrote: »

What caused all the Ice Ages on Earth over the last few million years?. It's a natural cycle we can't do anything about.

That has nothing to do with the ozone layer. Thats either climate change or a change in the Sun

kc90

galwayrush wrote: »

What caused all the Ice Ages on Earth over the last few million years?. It's a natural cycle we can't do anything about.

Probably not a hole in the ozone layer.

losthorizon

Duiske wrote: »

How much has the global average temperature increased by since the year 2000 ?

Again they are two totally different things.

Israeli Superiority

galwayrush wrote: »

What caused all the Ice Ages on Earth over the last few million years?. It's a natural cycle we can't do anything about.

There's a few theories. The one I believe is that the Sun goes through periods of releasing less energy, which would cause the temperature to drop temporarily.

If another Ice Age happens, we'll know if it's the Sun that caused the Ice Ages because of modern technology.

Hilly Bill

I read something about it in the Herald 2 years ago. Some Polish builders filled it in.

Duiske

losthorizon wrote: »

Again they are two totally different things.

What is two different things ?? Bleg made a statement that "The average world temperatures are increasing". I'm simply asking the question how much has the average world temperature increased by in the last 13 years.

bleg

Duiske wrote: »

What is two different things ?? Bleg made a statement that "The average world temperatures are increasing". I'm simply asking the question how much has the average world temperature increased by in the last 13 years.

http://www.nasa.gov/topics/earth/features/2012-temps.html

bleg

Israeli Superiority wrote: »

There's a few theories. The one I believe is that the Sun goes through periods of releasing less energy, which would cause the temperature to drop temporarily.

That's grand. You're going against scientific consensus on the issue though.

It's like saying you're going to have homeopathic treatment rather than evidence based medicine.

Cork24

O zone layer hole is still their science reckon in about 30 years 2/3 of earth will have no cover from sun rays,

And you will be able to see the northern lights from London city

Phoeey

losthorizon wrote: »

That has nothing to do with the ozone layer. Thats either climate change or a change in the Sun

A change in the tilt and orbit of our planet contributes to it as well.