.223 Application

087.k.doyle

Some inspector rang today and said he won't let me have 2 rifles but can sub the .22 for the .223. No reason given. Very short and blunt on the phone. Really want to keep the .22 but want the .223 too. Any ideas?

rowa

087.k.doyle wrote: »

Some inspector rang today and said he won't let me have 2 rifles but can sub the .22 for the .223. No reason given. Very short and blunt on the phone. Really want to keep the .22 but want the .223 too. Any ideas?

Its not down to the inspector, but the superintendent. Ask for a written refusal with the reason for him refusing the application. Not letting you have two rifles isn't a valid reason for refusal.

cushcam

arrange a meeting with your local superintendent to see what he has to say about it

087.k.doyle

Thanks lads. May wait til Monday now. Can't figure it. No problem getting the shotgun or .22. Are they clamping down on how many guns lads have?

garv123

Isnt the super/chief super the only person whos allowed deny the app and must refuse you in writing?

I wouldn't go for the sub because then you're not actually getting refused just being pressured into changing.

What county are you in?

087.k.doyle

garv123 wrote: »

Isnt the super/chief super the only person whos allowed deny the app and must refuse you in writing?

I wouldn't go for the sub because then you're not actually getting refused just being pressured into changing.

What county are you in?

I'm in Carlow. He said he was inspector whatever. Didn't catch his name cos of the kids but got everything else. Just puzzled cos some of my friends have 3 rifles and a shotgun. I wouldn't even mind handing over the shotgun cos it's never used but not the .22.

1shot16

087.k.doyle wrote: »

I'm in Carlow. He said he was inspector whatever. Didn't catch his name cos of the kids but got everything else. Just puzzled cos some of my friends have 3 rifles and a shotgun. I wouldn't even mind handing over the shotgun cos it's never used but not the .22.

Mabye outline the reasons why you need a .223 and a .22.Its not like your going to be after crows,magpies and rabbits with a .223 at close range :rolleyes:

087.k.doyle

1shot16 wrote: »

Mabye outline the reasons why you need a .223 and a .22.Its not like your going to be after crows,magpies and rabbits with a .223 at close range :rolleyes:

I had a letter in with the forms stating I wanted it for longer range shots for foxes. Maybe my forms reached him on a bad day!! May go looking for answers on Monday. Thanks for the replies lads.

1shot16

087.k.doyle wrote: »

I had a letter in with the forms stating I wanted it for longer range shots for foxes. Maybe my forms reached him on a bad day!! May go looking for answers on Monday. Thanks for the replies lads.

Mabye say the .223 is for deer and u cant use a .22lr for deer!

deano2882

1shot16 wrote: »

Mabye say the .223 is for deer and u cant use a .22lr for deer!

say that and u def wont get it ya cant use 223 for deer...wat he said is bull if u have complied wit safe storage and all tell him u want a written refusal and ur not subbing .22 for it...problem is people dat no jack are left in charge... fo in town half hour from me does be shootin himself so no.s why lads want this gun and dat n all

1shot16

deano2882 wrote: »

say that and u def wont get it ya cant use 223 for deer......problem is people dat no jack are left in charge... fo in town half hour from me does be shootin himself so no.s why lads want this gun and dat n all

Well sure he knows jack **** anyway..why not?

Cass

087.k.doyle wrote: »

Are they clamping down on how many guns lads have?

They cannot. If you have the requisite security for the amount of guns you hold/seek then the law states there is no limit on the amount of firearms or how often you can apply.

garv123 wrote: »

Isnt the super/chief super the only person whos allowed deny the app and must refuse you in writing?

Ordinarily yes.

However with recent man power shortages, Supers retiring early or "going sick" having enough Super and Chief Supers to do the work is not an option. Recently my last two applications were signed off by an Inspector, in a different district, acting on behalf of the absent Super.

I wouldn't go for the sub because then you're not actually getting refused just being pressured into changing.

Accept nothing over the phone. As for the refusal in wirting as you cannot appeal a refusal over the phone, only one supplied in writing. As i've said to countless lads when they are told at the desk (when handing in their application) do not accept what is said to you by word of mouth. Get it in writing.

1shot16 wrote: »

Mabye say the .223 is for deer and u cant use a .22lr for deer!

.223 is not deer legal so that's not going to work.



Simple fact is this. To refuse you he must have a valid reason. As a firearm owner it cannot be about public safety, and as there is no law against how many guns it cannot be the amount.

As for the refusal in writing. All refusals must be supplied in writing whether you ask for it or not. That is law too. So do not entertain any conversation about subbing the shotgun or .22. Technically you cannot even sub the shotgun as it's not like for like, so it sounds to me like he does not want you with more than 2 guns and is bluffing you into getting rid of one to remain with two.

If you get no joy, and he refuses to give the refusal (which he must) then contact the FPU on 01-6661911 or 01-6661916. Ask for Paul Green or Tim O'Maheny. Two Gardaí whose job is to deal with situations such as this. Before you ring make sure you have the name of, and station the Inspector is in.

One shot on kill

The sad thing is they can delay it as long as they want to.

If you say your 22 is for small vermin and target shooting and its also going to be your rifle for practicing with because its economical to run. And your 223 is for large vermin control (foxs). Where the 22 can't always provide a humane kill because of its limitations.

There should be no reason to be refused. Once you haven't been in trouble since you got your other licenses. But always try get the refusal in writing.

bravestar

Just to add, regardless of man power shortages, often an inspector will act on behalf of a superintendent.

insignia33

I was im a similar situation when applying for a 223 he said he didnt feel comfortable letting me have 3 guns and to get rid of 1 first.

In short the secure accommodations are only minimum standards or AKA guidelines which meanshe can impose his own ideas.

If he wanted to play hardball he can say he'll grant the third licence when you get yourself a bank vault buried 20 foot under ground and guarded 24/7 by a pack of vicious rottweiliers.

That way the onus falls back on you for failing to comply with security and all he has to say in his refusal is that he believes you live in a high risk area and worries that you may be robbed blah blah its a threat to the public safety and peace of mind blah blah and then he sits back and waits for you to take him to court.

When it happened me the legal advice I was given was that its a minefield and could literally go either way, but that I would have a very good case all the same.

However, court case and money issues aside, we thought it may be a pyrrihic victory (well, providing I won) and that it might be best just to get rid of 1 and keep him happy.

087.k.doyle

All very helpfull and thanks for the comments. Don't want to go down the road of going to court. Would like a good reason from him. Hopefully I'll get some answers on Monday.

One shot on kill

I wouldn't get rid of one nor would I substitute it either. Just ask him to kindly process your application and if its refused so be it once its in writi g and the reasons outlined. Then try meet the reasons and go from there.

You were saying you don't use the shotgun any more that might be an easy way out. If so call in and have a chat. But keep asking for paper work.

087.k.doyle

Ok. The inspector went on holidays and super came back and in less than 2 weeks after resubmitting the application I have the grant letter!! Now time to pick a scope. Happy days!!