Detroit, Bankrupt. Any sympathy ?

stefan idiot jones

Detroit has declared itself bankrupt.

I have a great deal of sympathy for the citizens and the American people, but not a lot for the Country itself as they had a huge part in starting the global recession in the first place.

What do you think ? Will you shed a tear for the mighty and powerful warmongering Nation ?

Killer Wench

It's one city in a vast nation. Are you from Detroit or have relatives that live there? Will it impact you as an individual?

McLoughlin

Tigers are doing well so not all bad in Detroit.

Conway635

I thought Detroit was a city, not a nation. And I wasn't aware Detroit was doing any warmongering. :-)

I wouldn't be shedding a tear for the city fathers though - decades of poor decisions have brought them to where they are.

C635

I look forward to New Detroit patrolled by ED109.

kneemos

stefan idiot jones wrote: »

Detroit has declared itself bankrupt.

I have a great deal of sympathy for the citizens and the American people, but not a lot for the Country itself as they had a huge part in starting the global recession in the first place.

What do you think ? Will you shed a tear for the mighty and powerful warmongering Nation ?

Trying to figure how you seperate the people from the country.

IvySlayer

Obama so proudly refused to let Detroit go bankrupt in 2012 and 89 billion was spent saving it. The knock on effect of Detroit not able to pay its 15 billion in debt will hurt.

Republicans are going to have a field day.

Sinfonia

kneemos wrote: »

Trying to figure how you seperate the people from the country.

Trying to figure how you don't..?

PeteEd

too much of the Good Life

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KJxJxr9RlKM

conorhal

Detroit has my sympathy indeed. It's slow death is a symptom if western industrial decline.

It was a dumb idea to make China the worlds manufacturer, besides the fact that it gives a rather unplesant nation huge power (when was the last time anybody heard about the once popular cause of Tibet?), it's a fallacy to imagine that everybody can work in the ICT sector and those that don't can make money selling capuchino's to those that do.

Seaneh

the groutch

and we all know who's to blame

http://www.zodiakrights.com/Content/Images/Brand/hardcore-pawn-series-2-4699.jpg

Turtyturd

Henry Ford would be travelling around a prodiction line in his grave.

Sunnyisland

What will that actually mean for the people living there ?

Cee-Jay-Cee

People should simply move to outside the city limits. Problem solved.

seamus

realies wrote: »

What will that actually mean for the people living there ?

Massive cutbacks as the city restructures its costs and debts to something more sustainable.

It's an irreversible spiral for Detroit I feel. The city was so heavily dependent on one single industry, that once that industry pulled out, there was little incentive for other industries to come in because Detroit doesn't have the skills available. As unemployment gets worse, crime increases and government keeps cutting back, those who have any money and relevant skills are quickly leaving for better places, compounding the problem.

Unemployment is high, which means social assistance is high and tax take is low. Unless they can find a way to reverse the trend, it won't be long before detroit is a mostly unemployed ghetto, relying on federal funding to keep going and requiring military and state trooper assistance to police itself.

That said, the days of heavy manufacturing being a country's bread-and-butter, and a person being confined to one industry are long gone. With the right incentives and federal assistance, they should be able to convince low-skill clean industry jobs like call centres to locate themselves in Detroit and provide employment to the existing population.

Banjo String

Les Gold is gonna make a fortune now.

This show is much better than pawn stars!

SEPT 23 1989

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vVluugKYo3I

Augmerson

Seaneh wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LvgBbJoSsVg

Ray Palmer

conorhal wrote: »

Detroit has my sympathy indeed. It's slow death is a symptom if western industrial decline.

It was a dumb idea to make China the worlds manufacturer, besides the fact that it gives a rather unplesant nation huge power (when was the last time anybody heard about the once popular cause of Tibet?), it's a fallacy to imagine that everybody can work in the ICT sector and those that don't can make money selling capuchino's to those that do.

Western production has actually been increasing steadily for years. It just hires less people and doesn't tend to deal in consumer goods that general public notice.

It wasn't an idea to move productions it was simple competition. Detroit car manufacturers were terrible and brought about their own fall. Cars they produced were.

Cities do fail and Detroit has been dying for a long time. It suffers from the doughnut effect. The centre has effectively been evacuated as people moved to the suburbs. The same thing happened in Dublin when the wealth moved to Southside suburbs to avoid rates.

I was reading about their private security business now, and private bus services and the efforts people were making to take over these things to run life as normal, it was very much a case of "good for them". Especially since they could still stop charging people who were really badly off
Hope they all get by though

Jonny7

conorhal wrote: »

It was a dumb idea to make China the worlds manufacturer,

China with a population of 1.3 billion and cheap labour made itself a huge exporter and manufacturer. No one sat in a room and decided.

Radiosonde

Man, hang out on some German msg boards they probably have the same views on us as the op does on Americans/

Jester252

Eminem to buy 8 mile and turn it into slim shady land.

Einhard

IvySlayer wrote: »

Obama so proudly refused to let Detroit go bankrupt in 2012 and 89 billion was spent saving it. The knock on effect of Detroit not able to pay its 15 billion in debt will hurt.

Republicans are going to have a field day.

Nooooo. Obama refused to let GM and Ford and the like go bankrupt. Bit of a difference I would have thought.

And considering the tens of thousands of jobs saved, and the fact that the bailout has been repaid in full with interest, I can't see how Obama could be criticsed for it. Companies profitable again, jobs saved, profit made by federal government- only a very peculiar individual could possibly construe this as a failure. But the the GOP is full of peculiar individuals.

stoneill

Not the first time a US city faces bankruptcy. New York was on the brink in 1975, even to the extent that city lawyers served bankruptcy papers to the courts, and it recovered stronger and better.
Who knows - it might be the kick in the arse that the city needs.

Chucken

CJC999 wrote: »

People should simply move to outside the city limits. Problem solved.

Yes, because life is that easy.

anncoates

stefan idiot jones wrote: »

Detroit has declared itself bankrupt.

I have a great deal of sympathy for the citizens and the American people, but not a lot for the Country itself as they had a huge part in starting the global recession in the first place.

What do you think ? Will you shed a tear for the mighty and powerful warmongering Nation ?

Like Ireland can smugly pontificate about finaNcial basket case nations.

Sky King

Who is John Galt?

Amirani

Chucken wrote: »

Yes, because life is that easy.

A lot easier to do it in the US because they have strategic foreclosure. There's not much keeping people from leaving Detroit to be honest.

Fred Swanson

This post has been deleted.

conorhal

Jonny7 wrote: »

China with a population of 1.3 billion and cheap labour made itself a huge exporter and manufacturer. No one sat in a room and decided.

That's not strictly true, there was a policy of open engagement that encouraged trade and included reducing tarrifs and trade agreements that encouraged the active engagement by western powers with China's economy.

This was designed to encourage more international economic engagement by the Chinese in the hope that a positive response to Deng Xiaoping's economic reforms might lead to social and political reform, a misguided aspiration prompted by Francis Fukuyama's post 1989 optimism in his book 'The End of History', and it's flawed thesis that Capitalism was the driving force that would overcome despotic regimes in places like Russia and East Germany as well as the former Soviet Union states.
Fukuyama's utopianism badly underestimated how well repressive states like China and Russia would do 'capitalism their way' and still maintain their regimes grip on power.

Chucken

NiallSparky wrote: »

A lot easier to do it in the US because they have strategic foreclosure. There's not much keeping people from leaving Detroit to be honest.

How does that work?

Problem123456

CJC999 wrote: »

People should simply move to outside the city limits. Problem solved.

yeah but who is going to buy there house?

daveirl

This post has been deleted.

Sir Humphrey Appleby

conorhal wrote: »

That's not strictly true, there was a policy of open engagement that encouraged trade and included reducing tarrifs and trade agreements that encouraged the active engagement by western powers with China's economy.

This was designed to encourage more international economic engagement by the Chinese in the hope that a positive response to Deng Xiaoping's economic reforms might lead to social and political reform, a misguided aspiration prompted by Francis Fukuyama's post 1989 optimism in his book 'The End of History', and it's flawed thesis that Capitalism was the driving force that would overcome despotic regimes in places like Russia and East Germany as well as the former Soviet Union states.
Fukuyama's utopianism badly underestimated how well repressive states like China and Russia would do 'capitalism their way' and still maintain their regimes grip on power.

That has to be the most misrepresentative review of Fukuyama ever.:mad:

The End of History was neither utopianistic nor was particualary wrong in its thesis.

anncoates

Chucken wrote: »

How does that work?

You hand back the keys to your mortgaged property and the bank doesn't chase you for the balance thereafter.

Amirani

Chucken wrote: »

How does that work?

You can basically walk out of your negative equity house and leave the keys in the letterbox. No longer need to pay the loan, but no longer have any stake in the asset.

Smiles35

SEPT 23 1989 wrote: »

Nowhere to Run - Martha and the Vandellas

/COUGH/ The car factory vid

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=17yfqxoSTFM

conorhal

Old and grey wrote: »

That has to be the most misrepresentative review of Fukuyama ever.:mad:

The End of History was neither utopianistic nor was particualary wrong in its thesis.

Well I wasn't going to delve too deeply but I can't see how anybody isn't laughing at Fukuyama these days, I was more generally talking about the post '98 feeling that 'a McDonalds on every street corner in Moscow is an indicator of freedom', which was a thesis at the time which was woefully simplistic. Homogeneity of consumption is just that.

Dravokivich

NiallSparky wrote: »

A lot easier to do it in the US because they have strategic foreclosure. There's not much keeping people from leaving Detroit to be honest.

You need money to move... The explanation of strategic foreclosure by Ann Coates doesn't magic the money someone needs to move.

furtzy

Not surprised by this news. I spent a weekend there back in 1999 when working over in Lansing Michigan and was absolutely shocked by the poverty and number of abandoned neighbourhoods. It was like a scene from a zombie movie.

Fred Swanson

This post has been deleted.

Chucken

:eek: http://homes.yahoo.com/Michigan/Detroit/4700-saint-clair-st:8e2131f4e774bb2c43146e6a72cffce9/

miller82

Chucken wrote: »

:eek: http://homes.yahoo.com/Michigan/Detroit/4700-saint-clair-st:8e2131f4e774bb2c43146e6a72cffce9/

a quick google search and that part of Detroit seems to be one of the worst going

Dravokivich

Chucken wrote: »

:eek: http://homes.yahoo.com/Michigan/Detroit/4700-saint-clair-st:8e2131f4e774bb2c43146e6a72cffce9/

haha, offering a Mortgage on it as well!

Amirani

Dravokivich wrote: »

You need money to move... The explanation of strategic foreclosure by Ann Coates doesn't magic the money someone needs to move.

Yeah of course, so unless you have savings/job opportunities it's going to be quite difficult. I'm just highlighting the fact that it's a lot easier to up and move in the US than in Ireland.

anncoates

Dravokivich wrote: »

The explanation of strategic foreclosure by Ann Coates doesn't magic the money someone needs to move.

Nor was it supposed to. I was just explaining what strategic foreclosure is, in answer to a quesdtion.

I personally detest these Get On Your Bike homlies - usually from people with no respiosnbilites - to people looking for work.

Guy:Incognito

seamus wrote: »

Massive cutbacks as the city restructures its costs and debts to something more sustainable

Surely they should have been doing that long before it got to the bankrupt stage?

Chucken

miller82 wrote: »

a quick google search and that part of Detroit seems to be one of the worst going

I guessed that but its still someones home.

Dravokivich

anncoates wrote: »

Nor was it supposed to. I was just explaining what strategic foreclosure is, in answer to a quesdtion.

I personally detest these Get On Your Bike homlies - usually from people with no respiosnbilites - to people looking for work.

Which is why I responded to Niall...