Radio station broadcast repeating itself intermittently

ddlong

When I'm listening to 2FM on my car radio, every so often it will jump back and repeat the last 4 or 5 seconds of the broadcast and then carry on as normal and this could happen several times on my 30 min journey home. For example, the DJ could be talking and what I'll hear is
"Today is Monday and it is a sunny day. (*jumps back*) Monday and it is a sunny day....". I don't understand how this happens if the broadcasting is live.

Does anyone know why this happens ?

Trick of the Tail

Yep. Its because your radio is switching frequency automatically to another transmitter, and the audio feed to the second transmitter is not in synchronisation with thew first.

The frequency switching is the AF function of the RDS system. AF=Alternative Frequency, RDS=Radio Data System - the most obvious function of which is to cause your radio to display the station name.

It's unusual to hear this on RTE, as all their transmitters should be receiving simultaneous audio; however some of their sites have a backup feed from satellite, which will be delayed.

Whichever is the delayed transmitter must have lost it's primary link.

Where are you when this is happening?

RTENL would probably like to know about this, if they don't know already.

You'd often hear this with NewsTalk, since they use an IP satellite stream to deliver their audio and there is different latency between transmitters. It can be annoying.

Bard

2FM's RDS seems out of sync today as well... keeps telling me that Craig Doyle presenting for Tubridy is on now and Colm Hayes is next. ... but Rick O'Shea is on now...

ddlong

Thanks for that. It only seems to happen me when I'm in the Midlands. I don't think I've ever had it when in the East of the country. Good to finally know what causes it as it's a bit annoying ! Thanks.

marno21

Does 2FM broadcast traffic announcements with the TP-INFO flag set? Could be that, on Audi radios anyway all TAs are recorded and you can play them back. It could be playing them back automatically (unlikely but the TP flag could be spuriously turned on during normal programming)

msg11

AF is so annoying, East Coast transmitters are all at different audio levels.

Greyham

ddlong wrote: »

When I'm listening to 2FM on my car radio, every so often it will jump back and repeat the last 4 or 5 seconds of the broadcast and then carry on as normal and this could happen several times on my 30 min journey home. For example, the DJ could be talking and what I'll hear is
"Today is Monday and it is a sunny day. (*jumps back*) Monday and it is a sunny day....". I don't understand how this happens if the broadcasting is live.

Does anyone know why this happens ?

Dont think anyone has mentioned it , but to stop this simply turn off RDS once you're on the station you want, it shouldnt happen all the time, but whenever it is happening just press the RDS button on your cars radio. A lot of cars have it

Trick of the Tail

Don't blame AF, blame the station's engineer that set up the transmitters' deviation. They should all be at the same level.

If they're not, he's an idiot.

Fuzzy Clam

Trick of the Tail wrote: »

Don't blame AF, blame the station's engineer that set up the transmitters' deviation. They should all be at the same level.

If they're not, he's an idiot.

This ^^^^

Has been a problem with Eastcoast for years. They were informed of this many years ago. I thought it was sorted.

But then, they won't employ a decent engineer........;)

marno21

Same with 96FM in Cork.

95.8 (Nowen Hill)'s audio was up until recently very low compared with 96.1 and 96.4. Now they reinstalled the transmitter and it's even quieter (it's also missing it's TP flag and has an á on the RDS so the RDS reads __96FMá_). One of it's relays (Clonakilty - 96.2) was in mono for a few years, not sure if it's been corrected since.

JonathanAnon

My radio started doing similar.. every so often it will jump back and repeat a part of the broadcast, then the display on my radio would start to flicker on and off, then sometimes change channel all on it's on... Then I realised I was in ....

mbur

marno21 wrote: »

Same with 96FM in Cork.

Used to get this delay/repeat thing when driving from Cahir to Mitchelstown. No problem with levels. Guessed it was an RDF/AF issue. Not totally sure but I think it was either RTE1 or Newstalk.

marno21

My guess that there is in Cahir you're getting the Clonmel transmitter (88.3) which is fed from Mount Leinster (89.6). In Mitchelstown you're getting the Mitchelstown transmitter (88.6) which is fed from Mullaghanish (90.0). Seeing as they're fed from different transmitters there's probably a delay between them

Trick of the Tail

No that wouldn't do it, RTE's link system is cohesive in that there's virtually no delay throughout it.

As I mentioned before, if you're hearing a couple of seconds delay, it's probably because one of the TXs is on satellite backup due to a link failure.

NewsTalk's link system however, is not time cohesive, and you often hear substantial delays between transmitters.

marno21

That's what I thought about them being time linked, but at the same time, should Newstalk's not be time cohesive too to prevent issues with the tight seperation? eg in North Cork, 107.0, 107.2 and 107.4 can be received in a lot of places at full strength and they don't interfere with each other, and the time is usually only off between them by a couple of milliseconds (in Killarney on 107.3 there is never a large delay and both 107.2 and 107.4 are at top strength)

I also thought RTE radio had no satellite backup, eg when RTE's main transmitters went down during bad weather a few years ago the TV signals switched to RBR/satellite but the radio remained silent.

Bejubby

Bard wrote: »

2FM's RDS seems out of sync today as well... keeps telling me that Craig Doyle presenting for Tubridy is on now and Colm Hayes is next. ... but Rick O'Shea is on now...

phew!!! thought i was the only one ,its the same on mine with no music listings,im in co wexford.:)

Antenna

Maybe the OP having a DAB car radio could be an explanation??

2FM was tuned in on DAB,
and when DAB reception fails the car radio is able to 'fall-back' to FM (and DAB significantly timelags FM) ??

Greyham

Antenna wrote: »

Maybe the OP having a DAB car radio could be an explanation??

2FM was tuned in on DAB,
and when DAB reception fails the car radio is able to 'fall-back' to FM (and DAB significantly timelags FM) ??

no, it's probably just in an area where 2fm broadcasts on more than one frequency and the radio cant decide which one is stronger

Trick of the Tail

It is very possible that the OP has a DAB/FM radio, that facility does exist within DAB car radios, so long as the stations use the same FM RDS PI code as the DAB SID code.

If we had a proper DAB/FM simulcast network here, the broadcasters could also delay their FMs by a certain time so the DAB to FM switchover doesn't involve loss or gain of programme time.

But we don't.

However, although it's possible, I think the OP's experience was because of the explanation I gave previously.

Antenna

Trick of the Tail wrote: »

If we had a proper DAB/FM simulcast network here, the broadcasters could also delay their FMs by a certain time so the DAB to FM switchover doesn't involve loss or gain of programme time.

.

How does RTE link RTE Radio 1 to the LW252 transmitter ?
I ask as there is an approx 2 seconds delay of RTE R1 on 252 LW compared to FM, its in contrast to BBC R4 which (last time I checked) has matching audio on FM, 198LW (and MW fillers - 756 etc)

zg3409

Antenna wrote: »

How does RTE link RTE Radio 1 to the LW252 transmitter ?
I ask as there is an approx 2 seconds delay of RTE R1 on 252 LW compared to FM, its in contrast to BBC R4 which (last time I checked) has matching audio on FM, 198LW (and MW fillers - 756 etc)

As RTE Radio 1 sometimes has different content to LW252 I suspect they have a seperate feed. The delay could mean they are using a satellite feed from Astra, but that is only a guess.

Fuzzy Clam

zg3409 wrote: »

As RTE Radio 1 sometimes has different content to LW252 I suspect they have a seperate feed. The delay could mean they are using a satellite feed from Astra, but that is only a guess.

They have a sat feed but its only a back up along with an RBR.
There is a delay on the main feed to 252.