Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie
Help Keep Boards Alive. Support us by going ad free today. See here: https://subscriptions.boards.ie/

FAO those Paying Property Tax

  • 21-05-2013 09:00AM
    #1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,234 ✭✭✭✭


    I'm paying the tax in the next day or so however the value as indicated on the form from Revenue undervalues the house. They have it in the 100-150k group whereas it should be in the next group. I'm still undecided on whether just to pay the amount given by Revenue or pay the higher amount. What are those in similar situations doing?

    This is not a property tax discussion, it's more a moral thing and I just want to see what the majority are doing.


«1

Comments

  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 32,865 ✭✭✭✭MagicMarker


    I'm not falling for that one OP!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 68,173 ✭✭✭✭seamus


    It's your call. If revenue value your home lower than you do, I see no moral issue in paying the revenue valuation. Assessing property value is half fact, half opinion, so you can't say for certain that revenue are wrong, unless they're undervalued it by €500k or something.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,332 ✭✭✭Guill


    OP is not a revenue officer...


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 9,048 ✭✭✭Ficheall


    CJC999 wrote: »
    it's more a moral thing

    EH?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,666 ✭✭✭Corkbah


    if they have undervalued it - pay the undervalued price - its gonne be at that value in a year or two anyway.

    (you are supposed to pay the current market value you believe it to be at - so if their assessment is wrong you are supposed to correct it ..... its just another way of discovering how lazy civil servants are - we are too lazy to actually do proper calculations so we'll send out a generic bill to everyone and tell them if they underpay they'll get in trouble.)

    A friend of mine got a letter from revenue saying his home is in the 100-150K bracket - so the amount due by him is €90 (or something like that) ... he purchased his house 2yrs ago for over €600K and other houses near him are selling for around that price.

    I dont own a home - was not earning enough to get a mortgage in the good days !!


  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,058 ✭✭✭Uriel.


    Why not just pay double what the Revenue have you down for? Just to be sure like. And for the Craic also.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 68,173 ✭✭✭✭seamus


    You could actually argue that there's a touch of the Heisenberg principle in it.

    Let's say you value your property at €170k, but revenue value it in the 100-150k bracket.

    You could very reasonably argue that by publishing (via their website) a valuation of 100k to 150k for your home, they have effectively devalued it - any buyer will check the website before putting in an offer - so even if you previously would have honestly valued your property at €170k, you now believe that the property tax has caused the value to drop. :)

    Though you couldn't really play that card for the €600k example given above.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,366 ✭✭✭✭Kylo Ren


    seamus wrote: »
    You could actually argue that there's a touch of the Heisenberg principle in it.

    Are you saying Op is a meth dealer?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,089 ✭✭✭✭P. Breathnach


    seamus wrote: »
    It's your call.
    Yes. It's self-assessment. You are expected to submit an honest valuation.
    If revenue value your home lower than you do, I see no moral issue in paying the revenue valuation....
    Revenue don't value your house; they make a suggestion.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 4,296 ✭✭✭Frank Black


    It's up to you, but I would (and have) paid the revenue estimate figure.
    I'm pretty certain my property is worth more than estimate, but I'm not an expert and have used the info revenue has provided.


  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,091 ✭✭✭Antar Bolaeisk


    Out of curiosity, hands up all those who have received an accurate valuation. Mine was two tiers above the actual price despite it only being bought recently, you can even pull up the price online.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,234 ✭✭✭✭Cee-Jay-Cee


    Out of curiosity, hands up all those who have received an accurate valuation. Mine was two tiers above the actual price despite it only being bought recently, you can even pull up the price online.

    My valuation is one group out. I honestly can't afford to pay the higher amount at the moment and so am veering towards the amount suggested by revenue.

    Will they perform spot checks or actual valuations on houses in the future and actually fine those who undervalued their homes initially?


  • Posts: 17,847 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    OP, unless you intend selling the house in the next few years, I'd go with their valuation.


  • Posts: 3,226 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Go with the lower valuation, obvz


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,095 ✭✭✭OU812


    Check the national property price register. This was instigated by the government two years ago & gives the actual price paid for property in your area.

    Find out what properties have sold for & then pay it based on that.

    It's a true valuation & the site is an official government one, so no reason not to go by it & for them to argue against it.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 14,380 ✭✭✭✭Banjo String


    I'm going with the 'taken by force' option.

    FG stated that a recurring property tax was unfair in their manifesto that they published just before getting voted into govt.

    Labour had a site valued tax in their manifesto, but it contained various exemptions for those in negative equity, stamp duty paid etc.

    We got the tax, but none of the exemptions, even the number of unfinished/ghost estates was slashed by 90% post hhc data phishing exercise.

    Make up your own mind which party blatantly lied.


    I don't want to hear the morals and merits of my decision, but that's what I'm doing.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,359 ✭✭✭✭kneemos


    SamHall wrote: »
    I'm going with the 'taken by force' option.

    FG stated that a recurring property tax was unfair in their manifesto that they published just before getting voted into govt.

    Labour had a site valued tax in their manifesto, but it contained various exemptions for those in negative equity, stamp duty paid etc.

    We got the tax, but none of the exemptions, even the number of unfinished/ghost estates was slashed by 90% post hhc data phishing exercise.

    Make up your own mind which party blatantly lied.


    I don't want to hear the morals and merits of my decision, but that's what I'm doing.

    A good chance you'll end up paying more.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,925 ✭✭✭✭anncoates


    CJC999 wrote: »
    it's more a moral thing .

    lol


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,925 ✭✭✭✭anncoates


    Out of curiosity, hands up all those who have received an accurate valuation. Mine was two tiers above the actual price despite it only being bought recently, you can even pull up the price online.

    Mine was one tier above despite the fact that a larger house on my street sold just before Christmas for an amount within the tier below so they can whistle for the amount they want.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,375 ✭✭✭DoesNotCompute


    CJC999 wrote: »
    I'm paying the tax in the next day or so however the value as indicated on the form from Revenue undervalues the house. They have it in the 100-150k group whereas it should be in the next group. I'm still undecided on whether just to pay the amount given by Revenue or pay the higher amount. What are those in similar situations doing?

    This is not a property tax discussion, it's more a moral thing and I just want to see what the majority are doing.

    First off, the Notice of Estimate is meaningless. It is simply a number that Revenue can enforce against you, if you decide not to register your property.

    Second, it's impossible for us to be able to provide advice without knowing finer details about your house - is it a standalone property with nothing else around for miles, like a farmhouse? Is it in an estate with similar properties? If so, does it have any unique features that sets it apart from those properties? Do you have a sunning room, granny flat, porch, etc, that the other houses don't have? Do you have a side entrance or a bigger garden than your neighbours? Is your attic or garage converted? Have any similar properties in your area sold on the Property Price Register since Jan 2010? Are there any houses currently for sale in your area? If so, did/do these properties have any features that set them apart from yours?

    All of these things need to be taken into account when deciding whether or not the Revenue's Notice of Estimate is a fair representation of how much tax you think you should pay.

    Also be aware that (assuming you live on an estate) if every other neighbour on your road values their houses signifigcantly higher than yours, then Revenue may seek an explanation as to why you valued your house so low. Keep copies of all supporting evidence to back up your case.


  • Advertisement
  • Closed Accounts Posts: 14,380 ✭✭✭✭Banjo String


    kneemos wrote: »
    A good chance you'll end up paying more.

    That's fine by me, it seems to be fine by over 50% of others ignoring revenue and the govt bullying tactics, as of last week.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,375 ✭✭✭DoesNotCompute


    SamHall wrote: »
    FG stated that a recurring property tax was unfair in their manifesto that they published just before getting voted into govt.

    Labour had a site valued tax in their manifesto, but it contained various exemptions for those in negative equity, stamp duty paid etc.

    ..........

    Make up your own mind which party blatantly lied.


    Individual parties' election manifestoes go out the window once two parties decide to form a coalition. They negotiate a Programme For Government, which becomes the mandated manifesto.

    Neither "blatantly lied" - they both came to a compromise.


  • Posts: 17,847 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    SamHall wrote: »
    That's fine by me, it seems to be fine by over 50% of others ignoring revenue and the govt bullying tactics, as of last week.

    Have you a link to that, Sam? 50% registered with 6 weeks to go is good.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,234 ✭✭✭✭Cee-Jay-Cee


    The house is a stand alone house built in 2008. We bought it 2010 for significantly less than its original asking price of 399. It's still worth 200k and for arguments sakes i'll value it at €199,999. We bought it for slightly more than that but nothing is selling for those prices here in donegal anymore and so it probably has dropped in value on the housing market. To what level I don't know. It's our family home and we will probably never sell it and see out our days here so market value is if little importance to us at this stage. However if we were to sell then it may be the case we'd get 150k or less for it.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,427 ✭✭✭RustyNut


    Revenues guess is as valid as yours OP, its not like there is a price tag on it.

    Tax and morals in the same sentence, I laughed. :D


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 14,380 ✭✭✭✭Banjo String


    Have you a link to that, Sam? 50% registered with 6 weeks to go is good.
    Revenue said that with just two weeks to go until the online registration deadline - A total of 845,000 people have now filed for the tax.

    http://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/ireland/separated-couples-both-liable-for-property-tax-594648.html

    That was last week, there is now only ten days left to register.

    Depending on whose figures you believe, there is close to a million homeowners ignoring revenue as of that article.

    500,000 per week to register?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 45 mynameismud


    I Inherited my house back in 2006 and had it valued at 650,000 (band 12).Now with roughly a 50% fall in prices since then it should only be worth 325,000 (band 6).However the letter I received from revenue they have it valued at 370,000 (band 7)

    Now the thing is I plan to sell it within the next 7-10 years and will be hoping to get as much as possible for it,therefore I'll value it at probably at 500,001 - 550,000 (band 10) to keep the price inflated


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,641 ✭✭✭bgrizzley


    I Inherited my house back in 2006 and had it valued at 650,000 (band 12).Now with roughly a 50% fall in prices since then it should only be worth 325,000 (band 6).However the letter I received from revenue they have it valued at 370,000 (band 7)

    Now the thing is I plan to sell it within the next 7-10 years and will be hoping to get as much as possible for it,therefore I'll value it at probably at 500,001 - 550,000 (band 10) to keep the price inflated


    that's mad, Ted...


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,744 ✭✭✭✭kylith


    They've done the opposite to the OP to my house. Houses on my side of the street have been valued at 100-150K, while the ones on the other side of the road, literally 5 metres away, are valued at 0-100K. I'm waiting to hear back from them on why that is. I'll only be paying the cheaper rate though.


  • Advertisement
  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,641 ✭✭✭bgrizzley


    OP, unless you intend selling the house in the next few years, I'd go with their valuation.


    if you are encouraging him to go with an incorrect lower valuation you are encouraging him to break the law by tax evasion

    its interesting to see the mindest of people who are actually paying this tax.


Advertisement