How to push harder in races?

conavitzky

Hi Guys. Long time lurker, first time poster.
I was wondering what kind of strategy people use in races. Do you target someone you know is in or around your time or slightly better for recent races or do you run your own race. I ran a race recently where I caught up with a group of runners at the 3/4 mark who would historically have been quicker than me and they were running slightly slower than I felt I could run at that time in the race. I tucked in behind them for 500m before I picked up the confidence to pass them and even at that I was apprehensive / nervous about doing it. I managed to put a nice bit of time on them between then and the finish. It got me thinking does the mind sometimes act as an obstacle to your potential. I know your goals have to be realistic and comparible to your interval training paces and it could invariably end up with you blowing up half way through a race if you overstretch. Is it worthwhile for one race picking out some guy or girl who you know finishes one minute ahead of you regularly and just try to sit in on them and hope you can hang on to their coat tails? I suppose what Im trying to say is I lack confidence in races and wonder if you set your goals a bit higher and get tougher mentally how much more scope for improvement is there within an individual. All comments welcome. Thanks in advance.

pconn062

Good point, there was a bit of discussion about confidence in racing going on in some of the logs. I think it's definitely a worth while thing to try and ignore the watch and tag on to someone who is that bit quicker and hope to hold on and get dragged to a better result. Of course it takes balls to do this and you always run the risk of blowing up, so I would only considering doing it in a shorter race because if it goes wrong you can just turn around and give another one a bash the following week. I am going to do this for my next 1500m race, this week I ran in the lowest grade at the graded meets and had a good run but next month I will go up a grade and hope to get a better result by tagging onto some of the quicker runners. Most of us (including myself) are obsessed with times and will sometimes sacrifice a performance or result (ie placing) for a time.

Timmaay

Mental strength training is just as important as training your body/improving fitness etc etc!! I try to approach every single session and all races, despite how irrelevant, from the point of view that I'm trying to mentally be as focused as possible. Even if I'm doing an easy session, I still try to focus on just that, running as fluidly as possible and conserving energy, which in the early stages of many races is precisely what you want to do. While doing harder sessions then, I envisage that its how I feel during the later stages of races, and mentally I try to be a focused as possible on pushing the pace for as long as I can while in a moderate level of pain.

Going directly on to your question about what sort of strategy I use in races, as you can probably guess from what I do in training, the aim is to have dug so deep mentally during a race that I'm not able to walk for a week afterwards :P I try to have my homework fairly well done, know what shape I'm in and roughly what sort of splits to be hitting in the early stages of races so as I'm comfortably quick as such, without killing myself, but there will be a point about 1/2 way through the race where I'm (hopefully) pushing at my limit and digging mentally fairly deep, with almost zero regard for the closing stages of the race, which are all totally about digging as deep into the reserves as possible! That's how the ideal race goes for me, if I bag a PB/beat a target competitor etc at the end of it its a bonus!

conavitzky

pconn062 wrote: »

Good point, there was a bit of discussion about confidence in racing going on in some of the logs. I think it's definitely a worth while thing to try and ignore the watch and tag on to someone who is that bit quicker and hope to hold on and get dragged to a better result. Of course it takes balls to do this and you always run the risk of blowing up, so I would only considering doing it in a shorter race because if it goes wrong you can just turn around and give another one a bash the following week. I am going to do this for my next 1500m race, this week I ran in the lowest grade at the graded meets and had a good run but next month I will go up a grade and hope to get a better result by tagging onto some of the quicker runners. Most of us (including myself) are obsessed with times and will sometimes sacrifice a performance or result (ie placing) for a time.

Thanks for reply. Think Im going to leave the watch at home for next one and just push hard!

conavitzky

Timmaay wrote: »

Mental strength training is just as important as training your body/improving fitness etc etc!! I try to approach every single session and all races, despite how irrelevant, from the point of view that I'm trying to mentally be as focused as possible. Even if I'm doing an easy session, I still try to focus on just that, running as fluidly as possible and conserving energy, which in the early stages of many races is precisely what you want to do. While doing harder sessions then, I envisage that its how I feel during the later stages of races, and mentally I try to be a focused as possible on pushing the pace for as long as I can while in a moderate level of pain.

Going directly on to your question about what sort of strategy I use in races, as you can probably guess from what I do in training, the aim is to have dug so deep mentally during a race that I'm not able to walk for a week afterwards :P I try to have my homework fairly well done, know what shape I'm in and roughly what sort of splits to be hitting in the early stages of races so as I'm comfortably quick as such, without killing myself, but there will be a point about 1/2 way through the race where I'm (hopefully) pushing at my limit and digging mentally fairly deep, with almost zero regard for the closing stages of the race, which are all totally about digging as deep into the reserves as possible! That's how the ideal race goes for me, if I bag a PB/beat a target competitor etc at the end of it its a bonus!

I would be pretty good at pushing in training (possibly pushing a bit too hard, i.e. sometimes faster than the recommended split range) and find it harder to push in races for whatever reason. Maybe need to learn to train smarter and lose inhibitions during racing!

Timmaay

Ya probably just need to race more so, afew of the younger lads that I'd coach and train with are every bit as quickly as me in sessions, but are a good bit off my times in races. Mostly down to inexperience and abit of nerves, think of your next races as just another training session, push the same way, when the going gets tough towards the end just think of it as another rep in training and don't give up till the end.

wrstan

+1 to race more!

There are so many possible strategies and approaches that you can take depending on the form you are in, your confidence levels, freshness, conditions, the competition etc. etc. Sometimes it is good to go out conservatively and leave lots in the tank to negative split and take confidence from feeling strong in the second half while passing people. But every now and again you just need to test yourself from the start, go out hard and find out what form you are really in.

Execution can be everything in a race, whether you are chasing a time and your placing is unimportant, or chasing a podium finish and your time is not that important. For sure the best way to learn what decisions to make before and during a race, is to get more racing experience. One of the great things about racing is that you always learn something from a race. After every race you should ask yourself "what have I just learnt?" - once you get your breath back

wrstan

conavitzky wrote: »

I would be pretty good at pushing in training (possibly pushing a bit too hard, i.e. sometimes faster than the recommended split range) and find it harder to push in races for whatever reason. Maybe need to learn to train smarter and lose inhibitions during racing!

I think you might have answered your own question there!

There is nothing to be gained from pushing your training at paces that you are really not in the form for. All you are doing is borrowing from future sessions and possibly races.

Also make sure you are getting enough recovery between sessions. Think of your hard sessions like withdrawing cash from the bank. Once you max out on your overdraft limit you have to start paying it back in terms of recovery. Otherwise when you go to dig deep, you will find there is nothing there. You have to earn the right to increase your overdraft limit by sensible recovery between hard sessions.

There is no pride in over performing in training and under performing in competition!

ecoli

Currently in the same situation as you. Recent races have been sub par and it has been noted from some people that I am mentally holding back to some extent. The first step I took to combat this is I have been racing regularly the last few weeks in order to get my body used to hurting again and not shutting down when i start to hurt.

Racing on Tuesday as well and this time I will be leaving the watch behind and see whether or not that makes a difference as the last few races I have be too focused on it and not enough on the people around me

wrstan

ecoli wrote: »

Racing on Tuesday as well

Enfield?

ecoli

wrstan wrote: »

Enfield?

Yep

Timmaay

Love the analogy about the bank overdraft wrstan, will be robbing it for definite!

wrstan

ecoli wrote: »

Yep

Might see ya there, conditions are looking good! :cool:

ecoli

wrstan wrote: »

Might see ya there, conditions are looking good! :cool:

Knowing my luck this year with races a gale force storm will sweep in over the course of the night:D

Ceepo

ecoli wrote: »

Knowing my luck this year with races a gale force storm will sweep in over the course of the night:D

It will help focus your mind on racing more then.

Ceepo

Timmaay wrote: »

Ya probably just need to race more so, afew of the younger lads that I'd coach and train with are every bit as quickly as me in sessions, but are a good bit off my times in races. Mostly down to inexperience and abit of nerves, think of your next races as just another training session, push the same way, when the going gets tough towards the end just think of it as another rep in training and don't give up till the end.

Maybe they are running the reps to hard ?

Timmaay

Ceepo wrote: »

Maybe they are running the reps to hard ?

One defo does ha, still trying to hammer it into his head that he should be holding back and finishing the sessions strong! Middle distance races by him tend to be a sub30sec 1st 200 then tail off badly!

Ceepo

Timmaay wrote: »

One defo does ha, still trying to hammer it into his head that he should be holding back and finishing the sessions strong! Middle distance races by him tend to be a sub30sec 1st 200 then tail off badly!

With age come's wisdom;)

conavitzky

conavitzky wrote: »

Hi Guys. Long time lurker, first time poster.
I was wondering what kind of strategy people use in races. Do you target someone you know is in or around your time or slightly better for recent races or do you run your own race. I ran a race recently where I caught up with a group of runners at the 3/4 mark who would historically have been quicker than me and they were running slightly slower than I felt I could run at that time in the race. I tucked in behind them for 500m before I picked up the confidence to pass them and even at that I was apprehensive / nervous about doing it. I managed to put a nice bit of time on them between then and the finish. It got me thinking does the mind sometimes act as an obstacle to your potential. I know your goals have to be realistic and comparible to your interval training paces and it could invariably end up with you blowing up half way through a race if you overstretch. Is it worthwhile for one race picking out some guy or girl who you know finishes one minute ahead of you regularly and just try to sit in on them and hope you can hang on to their coat tails? I suppose what Im trying to say is I lack confidence in races and wonder if you set your goals a bit higher and get tougher mentally how much more scope for improvement is there within an individual. All comments welcome. Thanks in advance.

Thanks to Timmaay, pconn062, wrstan and ecoli for your thoughts and advice. I have done two races since I posted the initial question both with very different outcomes and strategies.
Race 1 - 10k
Finish time - 41.51
Kept an eye on my watch and ran my own race. Went through 5k in 19.30 approx, feeling very strong and breathing easy. Got stitch at 6k, had to stop and get sick for 1.5 mins:eek: and finished it out not pushing hard.:mad:

Race 2 - 5k
Finish Time - 17.52
Wore watch but did not look at it. Picked a guy who was hoping to run between 17.30 and 18.15 for the race and tracked him from 20m back for the race (before passing him on the line). Felt I was running faster than usual but did not look at the watch because I knew that if it said I was running faster than I thought I should have been that I would have slowed down! Ended up knocking 50 secs off PB.

Will maybe use this tactic of not looking at watch for my next 10k although greater scope for overreaching at this distance!
Thanks again guys.