Worried that my younger brother is trying to have a baby

LegacyUser

Going unreg for this one.

To cut a long story short, I read a few of my brother's Facebook messages. He hadn't logged out, and I only realised when I noticed a conversation still open from his girlfriend, and wondered when on earth I'd started that. I'm aware that I should have logged out straight away, and I'm aware I was in the wrong, but I glanced through the chat, and discovered that they're planning to get pregnant by the end of the year.

My brother and his girlfriend are 21, and she already has a two year old child from a previous relationship. He still has two years of college left to go, and he lives at home with our parents and has no job and no savings. She has a small council apartment, she's doing a Fas computer course, has no job and is mostly on benefits. They've been together for about a year and a half.

I'm really worried about this. I know plenty of people have kids young and they manage, but I really don't think this is a good idea. My brother has the option of progressing to a higher level in college after this course is finished, and I really don't see him taking it if he has a new baby. He's often talked about travelling, and I know he won't if he has a new family to look after at 22 years of age. He's already stopped going out with his friends and stopped going on trips away, and mostly just stays at home with her because she can't afford to go anywhere.

I know at 21 he's a fully grown adult and capable of making his own decisions, but he'd be pretty on his own with this if they do follow through and have a baby. Her family are all on benefits aswell, and while both my parents work, they certainly don't have much spare cash, or free time to watch a baby while my brother is in college. The only reason the girlfriend manages now is because the kid is old enough for pre school, so she is able to do her Fas course.

Should I tell him I know what he's planning? I'm torn here because if I admit I read the messages he'll never trust me again, and as far as siblings go we have a really great relationship and I don't want to ruin it. I don't want to seem like a nosey older sister, but I don't think he realises the magnitude of having a baby, he just sees the fun times playing with her cute little two year old. It's also his first serious relationship, and in the messages they were talking about what their wedding would be like and how many kids they wanted to have.

Do I try and talk him out of it, or accept that it's not my business and I'd be sticking my nose in? My parents would absolutely hit the roof if they found out, they do like the girlfriend but they already worry that the relationship is too intense at such a young age.

Any advice, even if it's telling me to keep out of other people's business, is welcome!

username123

While your concern is understandable, you cannot make someone live the life YOU think they should live.

You are not in their relationship, they are adults.

A general conversation with your brother regarding the value of further education and travel is fine, telling him how to live is not.

What you consider a good life may not be what he considers a good life and it is unfair of you to belittle his choice by assuming he doesn't understand parenthood.

So I think you'd be best to leave him at it.

Chattastrophe!

You say you have a really great relationship with him at the moment ... a good place to start might be to sit down and have a chat with him about how things are going in general with his girlfriend. Ask him about what sort of future he sees with her, etc. And see what info you can get out of him, without ever having to confess to having read his messages.

If he tells you they're planning on starting a family, and sooner rather than later, you'll then have the opportunity to discuss your concerns about his education, prospects, etc.

Even if he doesn't, you can still use the chance to give him a big-sister talk about all of it. I've often done the same with my younger siblings, even when I'd no specific reason to be suspicious! Just make sure you've all your points prepared in advance, and keep it casual and good-natured, rather than making him feel like you're accusing him of anything.

Good luck!

ABajaninCork

I was in that position with my little brother who had a child at the same age. And all I can say is leave him to it. If you try to advise or talk to him about it, then he'll dig his heels in. Trust me on that one.

It turned out OK in the end, my brother is an excellent father to ALL his kids. It hasn't been plain sailing though, let me make that clear.

If the bomb drops, all you can do is be there.

LegacyUser

OP here, thanks for the replies guys.

Yeah I think casually bringing up the subject about "his future" and whatnot might be the best way forward. I'd never want to 'accuse' him of something or belittle him, but I do feel like he'd be giving up an awful lot at a young age to have a child. And as I said, he is no where near financially stable enough and still lives at home without a job - this is where my main concern comes in, I could see him struggling a lot trying to support a baby, his girlfriend can barely support the child she has already.

I'm doing my best to stay out of it because I know I'll probably come across as an interfering older sister!

woodchuck

username123 wrote: »

While your concern is understandable, you cannot make someone live the life YOU think they should live.

You are not in their relationship, they are adults.

A general conversation with your brother regarding the value of further education and travel is fine, telling him how to live is not.

What you consider a good life may not be what he considers a good life and it is unfair of you to belittle his choice by assuming he doesn't understand parenthood.

So I think you'd be best to leave him at it.

Normally I would agree with this, but while her brother is an adult he's obviously not independent (financially or otherwise). I don't think anyone who is still financially dependent on their parents should be planning to raise a child, regardless of their age.

Presumably he's planning on moving in with her? So if she's unemployed and looking after the kids they only have two options available (that I'm aware of):
1. They both survive on the dole.
2. He gets a job that is enough to support them all (very difficult considering the state of the economy atm). If they're living together they will be seen as cohabitating, therefore even if he has a job she will be means tested against him so a lot / most of her social welfare will be cut. Do you know if he is aware of any of this? He should seriously research this in full.

Tlachtga wrote: »

You say you have a really great relationship with him at the moment ... a good place to start might be to sit down and have a chat with him about how things are going in general with his girlfriend. Ask him about what sort of future he sees with her, etc. And see what info you can get out of him, without ever having to confess to having read his messages.

If he tells you they're planning on starting a family, and sooner rather than later, you'll then have the opportunity to discuss your concerns about his education, prospects, etc.

Even if he doesn't, you can still use the chance to give him a big-sister talk about all of it. I've often done the same with my younger siblings, even when I'd no specific reason to be suspicious! Just make sure you've all your points prepared in advance, and keep it casual and good-natured, rather than making him feel like you're accusing him of anything.

Good luck!

I think this is the probably the best tactic to take. You don't want to come on full force or he'll dig his heels in. But if you ask about his relationship and future plans in general he may volunteer the information. Or at the very least you could press him a bit about his plans to travel etc after college. Hopefully it will make him rethink things.

I think you're perfectly entitled to be worried in this case and I don't think I could just sit on my hands either if it was my brother.

ABajaninCork

No, I don't agree with the above advice. I've been there. Ask yourself this: What were YOU like as a 21 year old? If you were in the same position would you listen to advice/big sibling talk however well-meaning? Be honest.

Independent or not, at 21 the law says you're an adult. A lot of 21 year olds, especially the male of the species aren't very good at listening to advice, far less taking it. With the arrogance of youth, they think they know it all. We were the same at that age.

The only way forward is to take a step back. All you can do is be there to support him. That's it. Let him make and learn from his own mistakes.

woodchuck

ABajaninCork wrote: »

No, I don't agree with the above advice. I've been there. Ask yourself this: What were YOU like as a 21 year old? If you were in the same position would you listen to advice/big sibling talk however well-meaning? Be honest.

I may not have listened; it would depend on the advice and how the situation was approached though. Like I said, some general queries about the relationship and future plans might be enough just to get him thinking without giving him a full on lecture. He probably won't listen, but I think it's worth trying.

ABajaninCork wrote: »

All you can do is be there to support him. That's it. Let him make and learn from his own mistakes.

If it comes to it, then yes of course the OP should support her brother (emotionally; not financially mind!). But this isn't like learning that drinking too much is bad for you or something. This will impact on his entire future. Not to mention the potential child in question; what will their quality of life be like with a parent who doesn't even know how to take care of themselves yet? Most time I think leave well enough alone, but considering the sitation (living at home, still in college, no money etc) I personally could not in good conscience not at least try to steer him in the 'right' direction.

OP if he does end up having a baby in the near future and you said nothing to him, would you regret it?

ABajaninCork

woodchuck wrote: »

I may not have listened; it would depend on the advice and how the situation was approached though. Like I said, some general queries about the relationship and future plans might be enough just to get him thinking without giving him a full on lecture. He probably won't listen, but I think it's worth trying.

Girlfriend. Sibling. Probably the first serious relationship he's had. He's young, frisky and in lurve. Who's he going to listen to? Tough one that. Believe me, if you step into their relationship, guess who'll win?

woodchuck wrote: »

If it comes to it, then yes of course the OP should support her brother (emotionally; not financially mind!). But this isn't like learning that drinking too much is bad for you or something. This will impact on his entire future. Not to mention the potential child in question; what will their quality of life be like with a parent who doesn't even know how to take care of themselves yet? Most time I think leave well enough alone, but considering the sitation (living at home, still in college, no money etc) I personally could not in good conscience not at least try to steer him in the 'right' direction.

OP if he does end up having a baby in the near future and you said nothing to him, would you regret it?

What's the right direction? The OP's way or her brother's? Not our place to judge. Perhaps the brother will see sense in his own time. Perhaps not. Like I say. He's 21. He's not fully cooked (to use a JJ term). But he needs to make and learn from his own mistakes.

woodchuck

ABajaninCork wrote: »

What's the right direction? The OP's way or her brother's? Not our place to judge. Perhaps the brother will see sense in his own time. Perhaps not. Like I say. He's 21. He's not fully cooked (to use a JJ term). But he needs to make and learn from his own mistakes.

Exactly... he's 21 and not 'fully cooked' as you said; does that sound like somebody who should be having a baby? For the majority of mistakes young people make, yes, they should just get on with it and learn from it. But when it comes to the big things (having a baby, buying a house etc) sometimes they need to be pointed in the right direction! It probably won't work, but I'd feel I'd have to try.

I suppose I'm thinking if this was my older sister posting this about our younger brother; I'd sure as hell want her to act on this information!

Chattastrophe!

ABajaninCork wrote: »

No, I don't agree with the above advice. I've been there. Ask yourself this: What were YOU like as a 21 year old? If you were in the same position would you listen to advice/big sibling talk however well-meaning? Be honest.

Independent or not, at 21 the law says you're an adult. A lot of 21 year olds, especially the male of the species aren't very good at listening to advice, far less taking it. With the arrogance of youth, they think they know it all. We were the same at that age.

The only way forward is to take a step back. All you can do is be there to support him. That's it. Let him make and learn from his own mistakes.

He certainly may not listen - but, if I were in his sister's position, I'd at least have to know that I tried.

She should do her best to make him be realistic and see that now's not a good time to become a parent - but, having said that, of course she should also support him as best she can if/when the time comes.

Of course, it would be best to talk to him in a non-confrontational way. No point falling out over it. As they have a good relationship to begin with, this should be very doable.

And yeah, of course there's a good chance he'll just nod and smile, and let it go in one ear and out the other. But I still think it's important to at least have that discussion ... and, you never know, it might make him think a bit more about the whole thing!

LegacyUser

OP here, thanks again for all the replies guys I really appreciate the advice.

woodchuck wrote: »

Presumably he's planning on moving in with her? So if she's unemployed and looking after the kids they only have two options available (that I'm aware of):

1. They both survive on the dole.
2. He gets a job that is enough to support them all (very difficult considering the state of the economy atm). If they're living together they will be seen as cohabitating, therefore even if he has a job she will be means tested against him so a lot / most of her social welfare will be cut. Do you know if he is aware of any of this? He should seriously research this in full.

I doubt he's aware of this. Judging by the conversation, she'll look after the kids and he'll finish college and then he'll get a job and they'll move into a nice house together. I think she's savvy enough to know her dole entitlements, I'd say she has it worked out how much money they can get with two children. I still think they're living in fairy land though if he thinks he's going to walk out of college and straight into a job that pays enough to support a girlfriend and two children at 23 years of age.

ABajaninCork wrote: »

All you can do is be there to support him.  That's it.  Let him make and learn from his own mistakes.

I do get that, but this isn't like making the mistake of blowing all your savings buying an expensive car. This is a life changing decision, and it's also not fair to bring a kid in to the world when you can't financially support it.


I'm going to try and casually bring it up over the next few weeks I think, according to their conversation they don't plan on bringing pregnant until the end of the year. I'll be there for him of course if it does happen, but I'd like to at least know I tried to make him aware of the difficulties and realities of this idea, and what he'd be giving up.

LegacyUser

I would have a very serious conversation with him about this.

I would tell him that if he has a child with her and they brake up he will end up support this child for the rest of his life. Also that due the jobs market he may need to do a post grad course or leave Ireland to get a job which he won't be able to do if he is support her and a baby.
His girlfriend knows that she is on to a good thing with him long term once he finishes college so this is why she is keen to get pregnant with him.
If your brother is still living at home your parents and they are supporting him through college and he has no job or savings he can't afford a baby.
At this stage he need's to be thinking of college exams and making plans for his life after college that don't include a partner and child.

When he is in your parents house ask him is his girlfriend pregnant yet as you know that they are planning to have a baby.
He may not thank you for telling your parents but they need to know what he is planning.
Your brother may not like you after this but if you don't step in he could be stuck with this woman long term without any job prospects and a baby they can't afford

username123

WorriedSister wrote: »

This is a life changing decision, and it's also not fair to bring a kid in to the world when you can't financially support it.

Just a thought on this. Although not legally on the hook, by sheer dint of the fact that his relationship is with someone who has a child - he is already in the position that his future will see him directly or indirectly supporting a child - if himself and his partner stay together. Presumably if they stay together the day will come when they move in and are a family. I know he is not legally under obligation, but he presumably feels himself under moral obligation.

You could say most decisions have far reaching and life changing consequences - but people do have to make their own decisions.