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Not Deviling

  • 09-05-2013 8:41pm
    #1
    Uriel.
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,062 ✭✭✭


    Hi all

    I'm coming to the end of a penultimate year of an LLB and I was just wondering about the BL in the Inns.

    Can you do the course and decide not to devil? Or is it a prerequisite for completing and being awarded the degree? I appreciate you can't practice without completion of same.

    I'd like to do the course but I doubt, for financial reasons that'd I'd pursue a life long career as a barrister, but wouldn't rule out practicing (more for interest and love of the law rather than a career) later in life.

    I have a full time job at the moment and a business interest (and a mortgage ) so couldn't take a year (or more) out to devil. I would be intending to do the BL on the "part time" program.

    Nonetheless I would still very much like to do the course and hopefully have reward from it.

    Cheers.


Comments

  • #2
    ResearchWill
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,111 ✭✭✭ResearchWill


    You only need to Devil if you intend to practice.


  • #3
    Uriel.
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,062 ✭✭✭Uriel.


    ResearchWill wrote: »
    You only need to Devil if you intend to practice.

    That's great thanks for the prompt reply.
    Just a follow up if you don't mind. If you finished the course, didn't devil could you come back to devil in say 10yrs time or would a master not consider you


  • #4
    ResearchWill
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,111 ✭✭✭ResearchWill


    Uriel. wrote: »
    That's great thanks for the prompt reply.
    Just a follow up if you don't mind. If you finished the course, didn't devil could you come back to devil in say 10yrs time or would a master not consider you

    Yes you can I know a person who started delving about 30 years after finishing the BL.


  • #5
    The_Minister
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,255 ✭✭✭✭The_Minister


    I think it's more complex than that - I seem to remember that after a certain amount of time you need permission to defer.


  • #6
    ResearchWill
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,111 ✭✭✭ResearchWill


    The_Minister wrote: »
    I think it's more complex than that - I seem to remember that after a certain amount of time you need permission to defer.

    Solicitors have 5 years there is no regulation about the bar, as I said I know a person who did so he did the BL in his mid 20's started Deviling in his early 50's, it's funny he did the inns with people who are now SC's and Judges.


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  • #7
    Fred Swanson
    Closed Accounts Posts: 21,730 ✭✭✭✭Fred Swanson


    This post has been deleted.


  • #8
    NoQuarter
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,632 ✭✭✭NoQuarter


    Fred Swanson wrote: »
    This post has been deleted.

    No.


  • #9
    Fred Swanson
    Closed Accounts Posts: 21,730 ✭✭✭✭Fred Swanson


    This post has been deleted.


  • #10
    NoQuarter
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,632 ✭✭✭NoQuarter


    Whats to stop a non doctor doctoring?


  • #11
    Fred Swanson
    Closed Accounts Posts: 21,730 ✭✭✭✭Fred Swanson


    This post has been deleted.


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  • #12
    hullaballoo
    Administrators, Entertainment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 18,774 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭hullaballoo


    So, the Bar Council...?


  • #13
    NoQuarter
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,632 ✭✭✭NoQuarter


    Fred Swanson wrote: »
    This post has been deleted.

    Thank you. That worked out easier than I thought it would. ;)


  • #14
    Uriel.
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,062 ✭✭✭Uriel.


    Thanks all for the replies. I've learned a little more... Now back to the study, last exam of the year coming up. :-)


  • #15
    Kosseegan
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 987 ✭✭✭Kosseegan


    hullaballoo wrote: »
    So, the Bar Council...?

    It is a criminal offence for a person not qualified to hold themselves out as a doctor if they are not qualified and on the register. Likewise with solicitors.
    There is no offence of practising as a barrister after being called to the bar. It is the call that gives a right of audience. The Bar Council only control admission to the Law Library. The Bar Council has no role with regard to the right to practise.
    It is not essential to be a member of the Law Library to practise.


  • #16
    Fred Swanson
    Closed Accounts Posts: 21,730 ✭✭✭✭Fred Swanson


    This post has been deleted.


  • #17
    hullaballoo
    Administrators, Entertainment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 18,774 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭hullaballoo


    Kosseegan wrote: »
    It is a criminal offence for a person not qualified to hold themselves out as a doctor if they are not qualified and on the register. Likewise with solicitors.
    There is no offence of practising as a barrister after being called to the bar. It is the call that gives a right of audience. The Bar Council only control admission to the Law Library. The Bar Council has no role with regard to the right to practise.
    It is not essential to be a member of the Law Library to practise.

    Omfg. No one mentioned criminal offences.

    The Bar Council regulates people who are called to the bar. They have a variety of sanctions available to them including referring the matter to the King's Inns etc. which would ultimately get your degree revoked at which point it is criminal to continue to practice. The Bar Council requires every barrister who wishes to practice to complete a year under a master.

    The idea that the Bar Council is somehow impotent to regulate the bar is a myth. Sure, the penalty for not paying your fees is revocation of your right to use the law library, and you can still practice without being a member of the law library.


  • #18
    Marcusm
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,632 ✭✭✭✭Marcusm


    hullaballoo wrote: »
    Omfg. No one mentioned criminal offences.

    The Bar Council regulates people who are called to the bar. They have a variety of sanctions available to them including referring the matter to the King's Inns etc. which would ultimately get your degree revoked at which point it is criminal to continue to practice. The Bar Council requires every barrister who wishes to practice to complete a year under a master.

    The idea that the Bar Council is somehow impotent to regulate the bar is a myth. Sure, the penalty for not paying your fees is revocation of your right to use the law library, and you can still practice without being a member of the law library.

    If one is going to practise pedantry, greater effort will be required!


  • #19
    hullaballoo
    Administrators, Entertainment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 18,774 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭hullaballoo


    Marcusm wrote: »
    If one is going to practise pedantry, greater effort will be required!
    Balls. :(


  • #20
    LowKeyReturn
    Closed Accounts Posts: 934 ✭✭✭LowKeyReturn


    Might I be so rude as to ask you why you would do this? The only reason I ask is I am in a similar situation to you and always looking at all the options, in an effort not to miss a trick as it were. I know there are some fairly attractive civil service jobs for people with the BL but I wonder if a few years of practise would better place someone in a competitive selection process?

    13K would get you a half decent MBA or see you through a masters. Please don't for one moment think I am belittling doing the course for its own sake, that is not my intention.


  • #21
    Fred Swanson
    Closed Accounts Posts: 21,730 ✭✭✭✭Fred Swanson


    This post has been deleted.


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  • #22
    Tom Young
    Legal Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 4,338 Mod ✭✭✭✭Tom Young


    1 year? Try about 5 years. Lest we be suffering delusions of grandeur.


  • #23
    NoQuarter
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,632 ✭✭✭NoQuarter


    LowKeyReturn wrote: »
    but I wonder if a few years of practise would better place someone in a competitive selection process?
    .

    But of course it would.
    LowKeyReturn wrote: »
    13K would get you a half decent MBA or see you through a masters. Please don't for one moment think I am belittling doing the course for its own sake, that is not my intention

    This is true, however the BL gives you a professional qualification, which is to say that at the end of it you ARE a qualified lawyer. BUT, that said, if you are looking at a different working area, a specific masters or an MBA may well be the better option. It really depends on where you see yourself. There is no carved path, each to their own.


  • #24
    Kosseegan
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 987 ✭✭✭Kosseegan


    hullaballoo wrote: »
    Omfg. No one mentioned criminal offences.

    The Bar Council regulates people who are called to the bar. They have a variety of sanctions available to them including referring the matter to the King's Inns etc. which would ultimately get your degree revoked at which point it is criminal to continue to practice. The Bar Council requires every barrister who wishes to practice to complete a year under a master.

    The idea that the Bar Council is somehow impotent to regulate the bar is a myth. Sure, the penalty for not paying your fees is revocation of your right to use the law library, and you can still practice without being a member of the law library.


    The right of audience comes from the call to the bar by the Chief Justice. Nothing to do with devilling. The bar council require barristers who wish to practise as members of the law library to devil. The bar council has no control over non members. The kings inns revoking the degree, even if that can be done, would not make it a criminal offence to practise. The call to the bar has already been made and right of audience in the courts granted. Appearing in the courts without a right of audience is contempt but is not the subject of a criminal offence known to law.


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