Advice on crash with cyclist

designbydan

So I was involved in a crash with a cyclist today. Details of what happened below, But my question is : Does anyone have any past experience with this? when I got into work everyone (All bikers) told me that between them they've never heard of a court saying a cyclist was in the wrong. . It leaves me unsure on what to do.


What happened:
I was heading to work this morning just before 9, going through Phibsborough in the Finglas direction.
Went through the lights just at the bridge in the middle of the right hand lane of two in that direction. There was no traffic ahead except for a cyclist who was on the left hand side of the right lane, ( basically in between the two lanes just right of the broken white line) on the right hand side of me was oncoming traffic (although stopped due to heavy traffic)

I went to overtake the cyclist and was in the right hand side of the right lane.

Exactly as I was passing him he veered right and his body (not the bike itself) hit into mine. He went down with his bike and I went flying and rolling down the road with the bike sliding behind me.

I think had there of been no oncoming traffic I most likely could've stabalised the bike but as it happened I didn't feel like going through a car windscreen and ended up just on the road instead. Luckily no cars or anyone else was involved.

The cyclist wasn't wearing a helmet so he sustained head damage (I've no idea to what extent) but was walking and talking a bit. I was thankfully wearing all my gear so just damaged my left shoulder from when I smacked into the ground.


some passer bys called an ambulance for the cyclist but I said I didn't want to go to hospital, I got their phone numbers from them but they said that honestly they didn't see what happened. I called the police and a motorcycle cop came but by the time he arrived the ambulance had already gone.

I told the garda what happened and he walked into the road with me and took a look at my tyre marks and the broken glass blood stains etc.

He asked was the cyclist planning to turn right but there was nowhere for him to turn so he couldn't have been. he just kept asking me why would the cyclist be in the middle of the road but I had no answer for him, but from the tyre marks he could see I wasn't lying about my positioning.

I called the portorhouse and des kellys but no cameras caught what happened as it seemed to happen in a blind spot for all of them :mad:

I haven't called the insurance yet, I know I should have already but I was just kind of flustered today and will first thing in the morning to report it. I called the guy to see if he was badly injured / how he was doing, but got no answer so just left a voicemail.


My main concern is : I have insurance, this guy doesn't. does that mean it's my premium thats gonna sky rocket from this? I apparently have no witnesses, but did take numbers and give them to the garda. No cameras seen what happened either. So it's just my word against his. . . . .


Any advice would be appreciated. I took pictures of all the damage on my bike, it's not drivable right now after the crash. Ideally I'd like to get him to pay for the damage since he caused the accident by not looking before turning for no bloody reason. But since he has no insurance and apparently cyclists are never in the wrong I'm worried to try and make a claim incase he counter claims and wins "since I've been told they always do"


For now tho it's a sore shoulder, stiff arm and neck, and bus travel for me :mad:



Sorry for this extremely long post. and thanks for reading it.

Tigger

Hey, sorry for your troubles. The truth is cyclists and pedestrians can do whatever and still win these cases.
I'm sure I've done what you did but you overtook the cyclist in his lane. Same as when we filter its all grand till a car clips us. My gut says that you will be claimed against and that your insurance will pay out. I wish it wasn't the case.
Good luck.

Victor

May have been heading for the red office building or either of the paths along the canal.

http://maps.google.com/maps?q=Phibsborough,+Dublin,+Ireland&hl=en&ll=53.364261,-6.271852&spn=0.004059,0.011362&sll=37.0625,-95.677068&sspn=43.934478,93.076172&oq=phibsborough&t=h&hnear=Phibsborough,+Dublin,+County+Dublin,+Ireland&z=17&layer=c&cbll=53.364859,-6.271751&panoid=V3P9VwjkqHLdyHWm8WzYEQ&cbp=12,193.12,,0,11.37

It is generally good to move out of the lane when over-taking someone.

kaimera

**** one.

get a good solicitor tbh.

more vulnerable road user will generally win.

sounds like he didn't even look before changing position ( ah you even say so yourself!)

hope you're ok, the pains will take a bit of time.

designbydan

Victor wrote: »

May have been heading for the red office building or either of the paths along the canal.

http://maps.google.com/maps?q=Phibsborough,+Dublin,+Ireland&hl=en&ll=53.364261,-6.271852&spn=0.004059,0.011362&sll=37.0625,-95.677068&sspn=43.934478,93.076172&oq=phibsborough&t=h&hnear=Phibsborough,+Dublin,+County+Dublin,+Ireland&z=17&layer=c&cbll=53.364859,-6.271751&panoid=V3P9VwjkqHLdyHWm8WzYEQ&cbp=12,193.12,,0,11.37

It is generally good to move out of the lane when over-taking someone.

Couldn't move due outside the right lane to back up oncoming traffic. I had the choice to overtake on the right, or try to get into the left lane and undertake (which I'm figured was worse) he was headed straight as far as I knew. No signal to turn, no head even turning as an indication. I wasn't flying along by any means as I'd slowed for the previous traffic lights, but I didn't think it was safe to slow to a crawl behind him as he was hugging the middle broken white line and there was traffic behind me.

arybvtcw0eolkf

I've posted lots of times. I was knocked off my bike on Aisling Quay (Dublin) by a cyclist cycling against the flow of traffic, I broke both my elbows and my left wrist and the little fu*ker got the cost of repairs to his bike from me (after legal advice!!).

Shower of bastards, be careful he's probably being coached by barrack room lawyers!.

paddy147

kaimera wrote: »

**** one.

get a good solicitor tbh.

more vulnerable road user will generally win.

sounds like he didn't even look before changing position ( ah you even say so yourself!)

hope you're ok, the pains will take a bit of time.

Exactly what a motorcycle garda told me when he pulled me over around 5 years ago.




Young one (about 18-19 years of age) ran out in from of me and I slammed on the brakes to avoid hitting her.

Shouted at her to watch where the fcuk she was going,as next time she might end up dead.


Garda on bike on far side of junction saw me shout to her and he turned his bike around,came after me and pulled me in on the roadside.

He gave me the lecture that "Im on the machine and wearing all the bike gear and she being on her legs is more in the right than I am or was".


Tried to ask the garda where the logic in that was for a girl to just run out in front of me,and he wouldnt entertain my question.

So basicly the garda was defending the young one for running out in front of me,and I was getting the bollicking for it,because I jammed on the brakes to avoid hitting her and then shouted at her.


Biker 0-Young One 1......:(:(

kaimera

can one take a personal injury claim against a cyclist?

General query but might be useful to the op.

arybvtcw0eolkf

He was right too Paddy, according to the book we're suppose to give way to pedestrians I know, its silly that people can not take responsibilty for their own actions. It drives me nuts too.

Wonda-Boy

The way this country is going one could take a personal injury claim out against yourself!!!!!

arybvtcw0eolkf

kaimera wrote: »

can one take a personal injury claim against a cyclist?

General query but might be useful to the op.

I tried to because he said he was sent on a errand for his job, I tried suing his employer.. My solicitors told me not to waste my time and money.

Drove me nuts because when my daughter was born I was still in plaster and wasn't allowed hold her in the delivery room.

lazywhole

was there any dublin buses facing the incident ? if so, they all have cctv looking out from the front of the bus.if you contacted the depots and asked if any drivers seen this incident,if so, they could then say which bus they were driving and then remove the cctv from the said bus.. i think its only buses from harristown and phibsboro depots that go through phibsboro.

designbydan

lazywhole wrote: »

was there any dublin buses facing the incident ? if so, they all have cctv looking out from the front of the bus.if you contacted the depots and asked if any drivers seen this incident,if so, they could then say which bus they were driving and then remove the cctv from the said bus.. i think its only buses from harristown and phibsboro depots that go through phibsboro.

That's a great Idea, there was a bus behind me but Im not sure how far behind. I'll give them a call first thing tomorrow and see if they can help me out.

designbydan

Zuri Fat Power wrote: »

I tried to because he said he was sent on a errand for his job, I tried suing his employer.. My solicitors told me not to waste my time and money.

Drove me nuts because when my daughter was born I was still in plaster and wasn't allowed hold her in the delivery room.

that's f*****g harsh ! . Sorry man.

purpur1

Sorry to hear about your incident OP. FYI, had a friend that was driving his bike at about 40kph along the quays several years ago. A pedestrian - basically J walked - out in front of him. The bike swerved and the mirror smacked the pedestrian in the arm. Friend flew off the bike, broke elbow and wrist and the bike was basically wrote off. Pedestrian was going ape rolling around the ground holding his neck. Ambulance came, pedestrian leaves on a backboard & neckbrace. 5 years later, it ends up in court because pedestrian kept rejecting insurance company settlement. Got 12k in the end but there was no obvious neck injury in the end, it was an instant whiplash. Anyway, friend decided to pursue pedestrian through the Personal Injuries Board. Case was lost, friend had to pay costs. The ruling was that the fault was my friends, not the pedestrian, because he should have been driving much slower because of the highly populated area. He was10kph under the speed limit (at the time). In other words, in that split second, u try figure out the right thing and do it, but you will still be wrong.
My advice to you is just hand it over to the insurance company and try forget about it.

BrokenArrows

purpur1 wrote: »

Sorry to hear about your incident OP. FYI, had a friend that was driving his bike at about 40kph along the quays several years ago. A pedestrian - basically J walked - out in front of him. The bike swerved and the mirror smacked the pedestrian in the arm. Friend flew off the bike, broke elbow and wrist and the bike was basically wrote off. Pedestrian was going ape rolling around the ground holding his neck. Ambulance came, pedestrian leaves on a backboard & neckbrace. 5 years later, it ends up in court because pedestrian kept rejecting insurance company settlement. Got 12k in the end but there was no obvious neck injury in the end, it was an instant whiplash. Anyway, friend decided to pursue pedestrian through the Personal Injuries Board. Case was lost, friend had to pay costs. The ruling was that the fault was my friends, not the pedestrian, because he should have been driving much slower because of the highly populated area. He was10kph under the speed limit (at the time). In other words, in that split second, u try figure out the right thing and do it, but you will still be wrong.
My advice to you is just hand it over to the insurance company and try forget about it.

Madness.

daenerysstormborn3

kaimera wrote: »

can one take a personal injury claim against a cyclist?

General query but might be useful to the op.

Yes. You can take a personal injury claim against anyone you believe might be at fault in an accident, doesn't mean you'll win though.

OP, stop ringing him, do not contact him at all until you speak to your own insurance company and obtain impartial legal advice. A first consultation with a solicitor is generally free of charge. You probably know someone who knows someone somewhere who knows a solicitor or works in a solicitor's office or something. There are no absolutes in law, there is no "cyclists are always right" precedent, there is no "pedestrians are always right" precedent, thankfully. Get legal advice about your situation.

Also, get yourself to the doctor, you're probably in shock and the pain will hit you tomorrow. Damage to your brachial plexus nerve is one of the most common injuries from motorbike accidents and can cause a significant amount of pain if it goes untreated.

paddy147

I wouldnt be talking about it here anymore until you have sought correct legal advice too.

RasTa

If his body hit yours how did you come off?

Hotblack Desiato

Sorry to hear this. Had a very near miss a few years back although in that case the guy was actually in the left lane, and I was in the right lane. Just swung right across the road for no reason, completely without looking, there was nowhere he could have been going because there was a continuous barrier down the middle of the road, just to my right.

Too many cyclists behave completely irresponsibly on the road and it's simply not fair that the courts always seem to see them as the wronged party no matter what. I know of 2 guys who had large repair bills for their bikes (over a grand each) because of cyclists changing lane without looking / going right through a red light. One was a student and the other a junkie, no point sueing either...

Get good legal advice though and the only communication he should be getting from you, or to you from him, should be through your solicitor.

hwap

happened to a friend of mine last year, riding at about 10kph filtering thru traffic and a pedestrian came from the side, in between cars and knocked him off the bike, breaking his collarbone and damaging the bike, then he gets a letter in the post, the ****ing wanker is suing my mate for damages! and the padestrian is completely at fault. go figure

KamiKazi

From hearing of past experience of cases vs. pedestrians & cyclists you would have gotten more satisfaction by picking him up off the road and giving him a few slaps - you're unlikely to ever see any money from him to cover your losses IMHO.

Sh1t but that's the way it is in Ireland, pedestrians & cyclists = angels, bikers = devil incarnate.

ozt9vdujny3srf

While the cyclist should have checked before swerving for his own good, he was in that lane, so I'd have thought that even if it were a case of an accident between two Motorbikes, OP would still be at fault?

(I'm framing that as a question, I don't know enough to have an informed opinion)

deandean

Sorry to hear that, OP.

From your description, the incident was at best 50:50 and at worst (because you were coming from behind) 0:100 against you.

You're insured and the cyclist isn't.

You're not injured and the cyclist is.

It's one of these times to give thanks for being insured. You'll have to drop your trousers, but only for any excess.

arybvtcw0eolkf

deandean wrote: »

It's one of these times to give thanks for being insured. You'll have to drop your trousers, but only for any excess.

I'm stealing that line for future use :pac:

endacl

Sorry for your trouble OP. As a cyclist I'm glad to see this isn't turning into a cyclist-bashing thread, as it would have by post #3 in a motoring thread. Four wheels bad, two wheels good!

I understand the courts take the position that as cyclists/pedestrians aren't insured, the cost of sticking them back together is down to the driver, without considering fault too much. Pity (I drive too). Wisdom=knowledge+experience. I'd say you've lefet him wiser. Its a hard way to learn a lesson, but I'll bet he won't be veering across lanes again in the future...

Hope you recover soon and this doesn't cost you too much.

johnnydeep

herad one lately where a couple of women pissed were walking up the street a girl driving with her mother in the car. one of the pissed women pushed the other one into the side of the car. the mother advised the daughter to report it to gardai which she did, to be on the safe side.
then while she is driving out the road she gets pulled by gardai for a hit and run. she explains that she already reported it. cut along story short it was in court and the one that was claiming told the court she hit the car with her right knee. but her left ankle was sore and she still walked away with 15k.

Zoo4m8

Just a small thing... I remember after being involved in an accident years ago being advised not to contact the other party to ask after their health as it could be seen as an admission of guilt, I'd say you won't find your phone jammed with messages from the cyclist!

I'd be inclined to agree with the line taken by others, take a deep breath, suck it up and hand it to the insurers,

Cienciano

Jasus, a cyclist hit me once, judging from this thread it's lucky he climbed back on and cycled off even though it was his fault!

designbydan

Called the relevant people I needed to today, I'm going to take paddys advice and not say anymore on the matter until it's resolved / finished.

Thanks for the input and advice guys, Very interesting to read about other peoples experiences on the road with this sort of thing.

cantdecide

I'd advise you that if you're fully comp, claim for your bike straight away and get that sorted quickly at least. Assuming you, as it were, will have to drop your trousers, no point in being noble for the benefit of the insurance company by being out of pocket yourself.

It happens routinely with cages for example when people are involved in accidents they will claim on their own insurance for the damage to their car and a courtesy car so they are at least mobile while the insurance companies biff it out. No point getting the bus for three months if you are going to have a claim against you anyway.

brian plank

could have been worse, this video went up a few days ago. believe it or not most of the retards in the comments blame the cyclists.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dNFaAqS2f18

daenerysstormborn3

^^ that is mad! What the hell was he at there? He had plenty of time to brake or move over. Is he blind??

Wonda-Boy

brian plank wrote: »

could have been worse, this video went up a few days ago. believe it or not most of the retards in the comments blame the cyclists.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dNFaAqS2f18

That'll teach him to sleep with his missus.....it actual looks like he was aiming for him. :eek::eek:

minidazzler

There are dozens of those video's taken in the same place on Mulholland, what the fcuk?

Bikerguy

minidazzler wrote: »

There are dozens of those video's taken in the same place on Mulholland, what the fcuk?

Thats the showing of spot. All cameras focusing on that curve.


Btw in this case the biker is inded a dickhead and he should be driving bycicle and not be put on the bike again. That could end up much worse.

Pique

Can you say 'Target fixation' ?

RasTa

That's the worst riding I've ever seen. He puts his feet down ffs.

arybvtcw0eolkf

Pique wrote: »

Can you say 'Target fixation' ?

That and inexperience I think.

The road rash on the cyclists arse looks bloody sore

Wonda-Boy

Thanx **** he was not on an R1 showing off......jeeez!

650gs

You haven't a hope of suing the cyclist I hit one two years ago lot of people on my side she came through a red light and across three lanes of traffic and my insurance still payed just move on or buy a push bike

Thinkingaboutit

designbydan wrote: »

Called the relevant people I needed to today, I'm going to take paddys advice and not say anymore on the matter until it's resolved / finished.

Thanks for the input and advice guys, Very interesting to read about other peoples experiences on the road with this sort of thing.

Yes, say nothing to anyone except expert helpers like a solicitor.

markad1

brian plank wrote: »

could have been worse, this video went up a few days ago. believe it or not most of the retards in the comments blame the cyclists.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dNFaAqS2f18

cyclist in the way again :rolleyes:
poor fella on the bike got an awful smack :eek:

markad1

This is true.... a cyclist was moving between stationery cars in a jam.
The cyclist hit a mirror on a car and the driver caught up with the cyclist and lashed him out of it for hitting the mirror.
Later the cyclist put a claim in against the driver claiming the car hit him.
The cyclist got € out of it.

rat_race

We on motorbikes all go on about how vulnerable we are, etc., etc., compared to cars, and how cars don't give use consideration, blah, blah, blah...

I am a cyclist also, and you're far more vulnerable on a bicycle, obviously, in terms of protection and being bullied by larger vehicles, including motos. It can also be quite hard to keep a bicycle in a straight line in some circumstances on some roads -- something a lot of people don't know.

So just as car drivers p*ss me off when I'm on the motorbike, motorbikes *and* cars p*ss me off when I'm on the bicycle.

We can all call each other a "shower of b*$tards" until the end of time, but the fact is there'll always be idiots out there, no matter what they drive/cycle.

While it is the case that cyclists often don't look, and do in fact cause the accident, it's also up to us to expect the unexpected, and avoid or lessen the impact of a potential collision by not driving unnecessarily fast, or making risky overtakes just because we have the faster bigger vehicle.

Not saying that's what happened here, at all. It sounds like a freak accident that was probably not avoidable by the OP, if the cyclist truly verred right that suddenly and without warning.

But, personally, I always expect cyclists to move at least .5 of a metre in either direction at *any* point...there is also legally a minimum of a 1 metre (1.5?) gap that vehicles must always give before overtaking, I believe. People on bicycles can fall off, hit a rock or pothole, slip off a pedal, be blown off course, etc., etc., and end up 1 metre away from where they intended, very easily.

And in that situation where they're already in the right hand lane, I'd be particularly cautious of their next intentions.

And I'm not overly cautious on my moto, I filter like crazy, go fast when it's safe, drive in bike lanes & bus lanes, etc., etc.

Not saying I am perfect, but I have seen a lot of bikers everyday on my commute, who simply ride in ways that I wouldn't; if something unexpected happens -- and it will -- they're going down for sure.

Cienciano

I don't know about you, but I commuted by bicycle too, and other cyclists were 100 times more annoying than motorcyclists.