NCT and VIN

georgefalls

Wifes car just failed because examiner couldn't see VIN on the block.
Clearly visible on the VIN plate though.

When did this come into practise.? Never had a problem previously...

johnnydeep

happened me. just had to stamp it on to chassis

Chippy01

Isn't the VIN the chassis number? Why would it be on the block? It's the engine number that is stamped on the block.

georgefalls

Chippy01 wrote: »

Isn't the VIN the chassis number? Why would it be on the block? It's the engine number that is stamped on the block.

Well, that's what he told her. She's not back home yet. I'll have a closer look when she gets in.

Xpro

Sure on most cars would be impossible to read an engine number unless you start stripping parts of it.
N47 bmw engine for example.

DannyBuoy

Confusion between block and chassis me thinks.

georgefalls

I could understand suspicion if it was a four year old super car , that might be a ringer. But, an 01 Suzuki Ignis, that's been to the same NCT centre before. It's just nit picking.

harg90

georgefalls wrote: »

I could understand suspicion if it was a four year old super car , that might be a ringer. But, an 01 Suzuki Ignis, that's been to the same NCT centre before. It's just nit picking.

id be suprised if he told her it was the block, its more likly your wife got it wrong.

as far as im aware the vin is under the bonnet printed on the bulkhead facing towards you.

you either got an ejit of a tester of it well covered up, would you have got any work done in around the bulkhead since your last test? wiper linkages or anything?

georgefalls

No difference under the bonnet since last NCT. Crazy examiner maybe.
I'll have a proper look in the daylight.

Xpro

Well, what was the outcome?

ION08

This is bizzare and just happened to a mate of mine who is in the trade.

He has brought hundreds of cars in to various test centres and never encountered this until a few days ago in Deansgrange test centre.

The car failed because tge VIN was not clearly visible on the chassis.. Even though its clearly visible on the plate in the engine bay! (But apparently this doesnt count because it can be removed and replaced! It needs to be grafted into the actual chassis)

Never even heard of this before. It definiteley seems like theyre just looking for a reason to needlessly fail people on.

I mean it hardly makes a car unroadroadworthy or a danger to drive.

If there was no VIN visible anywhere id understand but it visible in two other places, all you have to do is cross reference it with the log book

Its crap like this that gives nct centres a bad reputation and has people thinking its nothing but a money making racket.

bitburger

ION08 wrote: »

If there was no VIN visible anywhere id understand but it visible in two other places, all you have to do is cross reference it with the log book

Its crap like this that gives nct centres a bad reputation and has people thinking its nothing but a money making racket.

well if you cross referenced it with the log book there is still no way of telling the vin belongs to that car unless you see it stamped into the chassis

harg90

ION08 wrote: »

This is bizzare and just happened to a mate of mine who is in the trade.

He has brought hundreds of cars in to various test centres and never encountered this until a few days ago in Deansgrange test centre.

The car failed because tge VIN was not clearly visible on the chassis.. Even though its clearly visible on the plate in the engine bay! (But apparently this doesnt count because it can be removed and replaced! It needs to be grafted into the actual chassis)

Never even heard of this before. It definiteley seems like theyre just looking for a reason to needlessly fail people on.

I mean it hardly makes a car unroadroadworthy or a danger to drive.

If there was no VIN visible anywhere id understand but it visible in two other places, all you have to do is cross reference it with the log book

Its crap like this that gives nct centres a bad reputation and has people thinking its nothing but a money making racket.

so your telling me if 2 cars were bought crashed, chopped and welded together and the vin plates were swapped over, (which has happened more than youd care to think) would have nothing to do with safety?

ION08

harg90 wrote: »

so your telling me if 2 cars were bought crashed, chopped and welded together and the vin plates were swapped over, (which has happened more than youd care to think) would have nothing to do with safety?

Fair enough but in this case the vin was there but it was just grimey as it was on the underside of the chassis so it wasnt fully legible.

Youre giving me the impression that you work for the nct? If that is the case, how come this VIN check seems to be a new thing as per the OP's post and also in the experience of my friend whos in the trade.

This sudden over-focussing on VIN's smells a bit fishy to me? Unless theres been a major spike of cut n shuts that were not aware of?

bitburger

http://www.renaultforums.co.uk/archive/index.php/t-66428.html

its not there job to clean your car

johnnydeep

I know somebody importing a 2011 grand scenic and the chassis no could not be found. they contacted a Renault dealer who didn't know where it was located. don't know if they found it or where it was located.
I know I had a Nissan patrol fail because they couldn't find the chassis no and it was just a case of stamping it on the chassis. which anybody involved in the thousands of mythical cut and shuts could do

ION08

bitburger wrote: »

http://www.renaultforums.co.uk/archive/index.php/t-66428.html

its not there job to clean your car

Thats fair enough, so its not exactly a new thing. I just found it strange having heard it from my mate whos in the trade who has never come across it before and then having read the OP's story here.

Stoolbend

It seems to be a recent addition.

I've seen it twice, once was an NCT and the other was actually a DOE.

Both of them were Landrover Discoveries.

georgefalls

Well, the number they are looking for is there all right. But, the aftermarket alarm is mounted below it, and it can't be clearly seen, unless you bend your head a bit, like I did.
Maybe the tester has a sore neck, or just a jobsworth..!

Oh, and the alarm has been there during all its NCT's... So nothing new..!

harg90

ION08 wrote: »

Fair enough but in this case the vin was there but it was just grimey as it was on the underside of the chassis so it wasnt fully legible.

Youre giving me the impression that you work for the nct? If that is the case, how come this VIN check seems to be a new thing as per the OP's post and also in the experience of my friend whos in the trade.

This sudden over-focussing on VIN's smells a bit fishy to me? Unless theres been a major spike of cut n shuts that were not aware of?

nope dont work for nct :L im not 100% sure, but to the best of my knowledge its always been part of it, for the last 5 or more years atleast.

iv never seen the northern light, doesnt mean it doesnt happen?

iwell theres more reasons other than finding cut and shuts,

but jst because your mate was failed on something hes never seen before doesnt mean its a new conspiracy of evil nct centres looking for more money.
it makes perfect sence to check the "chassis number" on the "chassis" is correct.

there or far more rediculous fail iteams to be argued, such as the county writin on the number plate, the text size has to be 70mm, drop link, ball joint and track rod end boots torn or frayed, and such extreme fail limits on tracking?

plus, is the chassis number not a visual? ie, no charge? how can this be linked to a "money" racket?

maybe im wrong

saying that there is an awful amount of sh1t3 hawking in the nct and it is a money racket?

this 1 year test is a joke..

but to be fair from what iv seen as a mechanic is people keep there cars in better condition,
get small things done sooner,
rather let there cars go to dung over 2 years and then are suprised that it costs money to fix them?

harg90

johnnydeep wrote: »

I know somebody importing a 2011 grand scenic and the chassis no could not be found. they contacted a Renault dealer who didn't know where it was located. don't know if they found it or where it was located.
I know I had a Nissan patrol fail because they couldn't find the chassis no and it was just a case of stamping it on the chassis. which anybody involved in the thousands of mythical cut and shuts could do

as far as i know the scenics chassis num is down on the o/s fronf chassis leg and the peatrol should be on the o/s cill somether in line with the b pillar.

was your patrole private or comercial?

"myhtical" cut and shuts :L:L

you serious?

thought a cowboy such as yourelf would more in the know. :L

bitburger

maybe im wrong but didnt a certain couple of years of scenic or espace come without any number atall? i remember my father had one and finding some info from a google search to suggest it but i cant actually remember anything about it, and just say these "mythical cut and shuts" are infact just mythical, what about the other nasties like cloning? and dont tell me that doesnt go on because i know for a fact that it happens in several vintage and classic circles around ireland.

jetfiremuck

Stoolbend wrote: »

It seems to be a recent addition.

I've seen it twice, once was an NCT and the other was actually a DOE.

Both of them were Landrover Discoveries.

Monkey failed me on my discovery too, on its 5th nct. Pain in the hole as the chassis has undercoated and the vin was laser cut, v small and hard to read. When i came back for retest and told him where it was i had to go to the lift and point it out when he couldnt see it. Ok says he and that was it. So whether there is somerthing fishy with land rovers commercial to private or what i dont know.

mister bishi

dead right

johnnydeep

harg90 wrote: »

as far as i know the scenics chassis num is down on the o/s fronf chassis leg and the peatrol should be on the o/s cill somether in line with the b pillar.

was your patrole private or comercial?

"myhtical" cut and shuts :L:L

you serious?

thought a cowboy such as yourelf would more in the know. :L

the patrol was private and may have been part of a group manufactured In Cyprus. doubt it ever had a chassis no.
sure there is cut and shuts but very few and far between. although I have seen them have never heard of one falling apart on the road

harg90

johnnydeep wrote: »

the patrol was private and may have been part of a group manufactured In Cyprus. doubt it ever had a chassis no.
sure there is cut and shuts but very few and far between. although I have seen them have never heard of one falling apart on the road

id be surised if there was no chassis num?

true there not near as common and most have faded out due to the strictness of the nct, but there are still oddbals round.

a freind of mine was hit by one, the car split rite down the middle. and that was only 2 years ago.

harg90

bitburger wrote: »

maybe im wrong but didnt a certain couple of years of scenic or espace come without any number atall? i remember my father had one and finding some info from a google search to suggest it but i cant actually remember anything about it, and just say these "mythical cut and shuts" are infact just mythical, what about the other nasties like cloning? and dont tell me that doesnt go on because i know for a fact that it happens in several vintage and classic circles around ireland.

mythical? go back to your office job ya clown. let me guess, google said it was a myth? everyones a google mechanic.

bitburger

read that again and you might realise i was actually defending your argument :rolleyes:

and im actually a student, but ive seen enough of a certain type of classic motorcycle that is "lovingly restored" in the far east to know how to spot 2 or more vehicles welded together.

harg90

bitburger wrote: »

read that again and you might realise i was actually defending your argument :rolleyes:

and im actually a student, but ive seen enough of a certain type of classic motorcycle that is "lovingly restored" in the far east to know how to spot 2 or more vehicles welded together.

ha sorry, read that totally wrong :L unfortunatly it was a case of wrong place wrong time, was in a woaful bad mood earlyer. got a red card for it too.

hope you can ecept my hole hearted apolagy.

bitburger

heh, water under the bridge.

harg90

bitburger wrote: »

heh, water under the bridge.

just hope its not 2 bridges welded together.. =J

bitburger

:pac:

stacexD

You can get a form from the NCT place for missing VIN.

Bring it to the Garda station to get filled out. The garda looked at my log book and the plate on the windscreen, checked my ID and filled out the form no bother.

So it was back for the re-test within half an hour and passed :P
(That was only 3 months ago)

For the people who got it stamped on, how much did it cost?

John T Carroll

stacexD wrote: »

You can get a form from the NCT place for missing VIN.

Bring it to the Garda station to get filled out. The garda looked at my log book and the plate on the windscreen, checked my ID and filled out the form no bother.

So it was back for the re-test within half an hour and passed :P
(That was only 3 months ago)

For the people who got it stamped on, how much did it cost?

A friend brought his 2010 Kia Ceed 1.6 Diesel for its first NCT yesterday but the examiner wouldnt issue a certificate because the (official) VIN is hidden under the carpet under the drivers seat, the examiner said he didnt want to cut the carpet as people might get a bit stroppy. (Its probably not his job anyway.) My friend had to get the loan of a stanley knife, feel around the carpet to feel the outline of the VIN and then cut a little flap in the carpet to enable the reading of the VIN.
Perhaps Kia would like to comment on this.

fmcg_scribe

georgefalls wrote: »

Wifes car just failed because examiner couldn't see VIN on the block.
Clearly visible on the VIN plate though.

When did this come into practise.? Never had a problem previously...

This issue appears to have been discussed at least once before on this forum:
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=73193806

ION08

John T Carroll wrote: »

A friend brought his 2010 Kia Ceed 1.6 Diesel for its first NCT yesterday but the examiner wouldnt issue a certificate because the (official) VIN is hidden under the carpet under the drivers seat, the examiner said he didnt want to cut the carpet as people might get a bit stroppy. (Its probably not his job anyway.) My friend had to get the loan of a stanley knife, feel around the carpet to feel the outline of the VIN and then cut a little flap in the carpet to enable the reading of the VIN.
Perhaps Kia would like to comment on this.

I would imagine there is a flap that can be lifted without having to cut anything which the nct tester and subsequently your friend overlooked.

http://vin-numbers-location.weebly.com/kia-ceed.html

biko

Tbh, the VIN should never be a fail unless an owner has made some change.
Wherever the location, that's how the car was built and is not a fault of the owner..

Long Time Lurker

More nonsense from the NCT. Nothing to do with safety, all to do with making money. I give an NCT cert (and company) very little credence in relation to the actual condition of a vehicle. You could pass an NCT test with 10% brakepads left, 1.6 mm of thread on your tyres, a half litre of oil in your sump and yet you'll fail if you dont have Atha Cliath written on a Dublin reg and the tester cant find/read your vin number. There's your tax, you'll probably fail me first time anyway.

John T Carroll

ION08 wrote: »

I would imagine there is a flap that can be lifted without having to cut anything which the nct tester and subsequently your friend overlooked.

http://vin-numbers-location.weebly.com/kia-ceed.html

Thanks, thats very interesting indeed as it quite clearly implies that a flap already exists, I will talk to my friend shortly.

Guy:Incognito

Long Time Lurker wrote: »

More nonsense from the NCT. Nothing to do with safety, all to do with making money. I give an NCT cert (and company) very little credence in relation to the actual condition of a vehicle. You could pass an NCT test with 10% brakepads left, 1.6 mm of thread on your tyres, a half litre of oil in your sump and yet you'll fail if you dont have Atha Cliath written on a Dublin reg and the tester cant find/read your vin number. There's your tax, you'll probably fail me first time anyway.

How are they making money on free visual retest?

If you don't check vin numbers anyone can get any heap of **** a brand new nct if they can borrow someone else car of the same model and colour

Oil will fail you if it's below minimum.

Why should brakes fail if the pads are at 10% and how will they tell anyway? Do you want them to spend a full day on every car stripping parts to check everything hidden? 10% on the pads of one car could be a year's driving and a week on another car, should cars be failing because something will wear out in the future? Nothing will ever pass then.

georgefalls

Just to expand on this thread revival:

Last week I got a NCT letter, telling me if I test my 05 car (due in January) before the 19th of this month, I can have a 2 year cert from the day it passes.

If I wait until January, it will only get 12 months. So, if I sacrifice three months, I gain nine.

Passed last Sunday, until 04/10/2016

Bizarre..!

John T Carroll

John T Carroll wrote: »

Thanks, thats very interesting indeed as it quite clearly implies that a flap already exists, I will talk to my friend shortly.

Friend just informed me that it was the outline of the flap that he felt, he then had to cut it, he reckons it may have been some fault during manufacture/stamping of the carpet.