Checking a door number

Hermy

This 1901 census return gives the address as 713 Killeen Road Rathmines. Killeen Road is a cul de sac of about 45 houses so I'm wondering what the real door number would have been if anyone has a way of checking this. Annie Dennehy is the head of the family and Relly is in fact Pelly.

shanew

sometimes, particularly on the 1901 returns, the enumerators continued the site numbers they were using from the main streets down the lanes, and squares etc.

Is the family at the same street in 1911 ?

shanew

Better site numbers appear for the street in the 1911 - and these seem to match up with the actual street numbers on the reverse of the form.

Sometimes you can match up households on the 1901 vs 1911 census, to match up the same houses on both. (As long as the enumerator followed the same sequence)

shanew

The street is listed in Thom's 1899, and some of the surnames are starting to match up - will see if I can work out a sequence..

Hermy

Grateful to you as ever Shane. Annie died in 1906 and her daughter and son-in-law had moved to Kingsland Parade by 1911.

Hermy

Maybe No. 23 given that Burgess is at No. 5 in both cases?

shanew

I have probable match up using a combination 1899 and 1904..

Odd numbers 1 to 41 run north to south on the west side of the road.
Even numbers 2 to 44 run north to south on the east side of the road -
except 46 and 48 which are at the closed off end of the road to the south.

The 1901 enumerator went south on the west side, and back up the east - so site numbers 693 to around 713 correspond to the west side/odd numbers in increasing order, and sites 714 to 737 are the east side/even numbers in decreasing order.

I dont have name matches for site 713 but it looks to be one of the houses at the southern end of the road on the west side - probably 41.

Hermy

While I have you there would you be able to check one other address?
Person is John Dennehy Solicitor in Frankfort Avenue Rathmines in the 1870's - again I'm missing a door number.

shanew

just to follow up on Killeen Rd. - in 1899 number 41 is listed as vacant, and in 1904 as a Mrs. Donegan. There's no Dennehy (head of household in '01), or Pelly listings on the road in either.

Hermy

Annie's husband died in 1900 so perhaps this was a time of transition.
John Dennehy is the husband and church records record their address as Frankfort Avenue.

Hermy

Actually, I just found some old notes which put James pelly in 17 Haroldville Avenue in 1906 and then 33 Kingsland Parade in 1908!

shanew

Hermy wrote: »

......
Person is John Dennehy Solicitor in Frankfort Avenue Rathmines in the 1870's - again I'm missing a door number.

In 1872 he's listed in the Legal section with an address at 190 Gt. Brunswick St. - might be his office

Frankford Avenue is Rathgar, and the only Dennehy listed on the road is a Mrs Ann Dennehy at number 26.

The index shows just the Gt. Brunswick address for John (often a separate residence address is included in the street and index entries).

Hermy

shanew wrote: »

In 1872 he's listed in the Legal section with an address at 190 Gt. Brunswick St. - might be his office

Frankford Avenue is Rathgar, and the only Dennehy listed on the road is a Mrs Ann Dennehy at number 26.

Possibly his wife...

The index shows just the Gt. Brunswick address for John (often a separate residence address is included in the street and index entries).

Well that's new info if it is the same John/ Jack Dennehy!:)

shanew

no John Dennehy in the solicitors in 1879 - just a Laurence

dont see any Dennehy on Frankfort Ave..

will check '77 later

Hermy

That's no problem Shane - appreciate your time.

shanew

In the attorney/solicitor listing in 1877 he's at 12 Lwr. Ormond Quay, with 1864 given as the year he was admitted to practice.

10 Lwr. Ormond quay is listed with 16 different solicitors, including ..

John Dennehy, res. 57 Frankfort Ave, Rathgar

Most of the other solicitors listed at the address also have address outside Dubin e.g. Fermoy, Limerick, Carlow, Omagh Dundalk etc. I believe all Solicitors in Ireland were required to have a Dublin address.

The Rathgar listing confirms him at 57. Checking back to Thom's '79 shows a Mr. John Kelly at 57, and in 1872 there's a John Halbert esq., so doesn't look like your John lived there very long...

In 1868 he's listed as a solicitor, with an address at 1 Capel St, residence at 24 Lwr. Mount St.

L1011

Do you have any mid-1900s to mid 1910s Thoms? Or, less abusive or your time-wise, are they easily accessible in the DCL&A or similar?

shanew

I have 04, 06 and 14.

I'm not familiar with Dublin City Library & Archive Thom's collection, but know that several libraries have almost complete sets. There a good collection of them in the National Library.

L1011

I've seen 04 on Ancestry and the building of interest isn't listed as who I'm looking for (151 Great Britain Street - now Parnell Street).

I'll take a trip in to Pearse St some day soon if I get a chance.

shanew

quick look at the dates I have for that address :

151 Britain St. Great

1904 Thomas McCormack, grocer
1906 Patrick Byrne, wine & spirit merch.
1914 Miss Metcalfe, tea, wine & sprirt merch., The Dear's Head (as Parnell St.)

directories can be a little behind by the time they are published, and businesses seem to be more likely to be up to date than private residences.

It's also worth checking the street listing with both the alphabetical index and trades index, to cross check - as sometimes they are not all in step.

Hermy

@MYOB The set of Thom's in Tallaght Library was missing '01, '03, '04 and '05 when I used to go there 2 or 3 years back.

@Shane That's great work. The mid 1870'2 ties in nicely as the baptismal records which mention that address are from 1873 and 1877.

So from 1868 he moved around a lot - the church record of his marriage in 1871 lists his address as 23 Rathmines Road.

L1011

shanew wrote: »

quick look at the dates I have for that address :

151 Britain St. Great

1904 Thomas McCormack, grocer
1906 Patrick Byrne, wine & spirit merch.
1914 Miss Metcalfe, tea, wine & sprirt merch., The Dear's Head (as Parnell St.)

directories can be a little behind by the time they are published, and businesses seem to be more likely to be up to date than private residences.

It's also worth checking the street listing with both the alphabetical index and trades index, to cross check - as sometimes they are not all in step.

Thanks for that.

Metcalfe is who I'm looking for, as I've never been able to find a licence application notice in her name in the papers, but family folklore and the 1911 census have her there... but if the census is correct she should have been a Mrs (widow) in 1914!

shanew

she might have been able to transfer the licence from the previous owner.

I checked 1921 and it's the same listing as 1914