Question re elderly atheist relative and funeral arrangements by Catholic family.

Worztron

Hi guys.

A dear old relative of mine has recently died. I know he was an atheist. For the last 3+ years he has had deteriorating memory. Most of the family are "Catholic" but probably more out of tradition rather than truly believing in adult fairy tales.

My question is this. Will my relative get a Christian funeral (the thought turns my stomach) or is the only other way around this is if he made a will and stated he wanted a non-religious funeral?

After-all, the funeral is for him and not the relatives.

magicbastarder

no, the funeral is for the relatives. he's dead. he won't notice. whether the relatives respect his wishes is another matter.

who the fug

What we did for our father in the UK was get a Humanist celebrant in, it was a good.


Irish Website is here

seamus

I'd argue that a funeral is for the relatives. He's dead, what does he care how they choose to mark his passing?

Ultimately there's basically nothing you can do. Anyone is free to hold any kind of remembrance ceremony for anyone else. Ownership of the body passes to the person's next-of-kin, so in the strictest sense they are the ones who get to decide what kind of funeral is to be held.

But you can have ceremonies without a body, so there's nothing stopping you from holding your own. Of course you don't do that because it's ridiculously insensitive and disrespectful to the family.

I don't think even an expression of wishes in a will can be legally enforced, the NOK retains absolute right to hold whatever kind of ceremony they wish.

Unless you are close enough to the person that you feel your opinion on the ceremony holds equal weight, then I would recommend keeping schtum. The death of a loved one is hard enough without introducing arguments over the burial/ceremony. Pretty sure your relative would rather that you went with whatever option results in the least amount of animosity between his family members.

If you are that close, but his next of kin is insistent on a religious ceremony, then perhaps come to a compromise where you do a humanist reading which you feel adequately reflects him. Or perhaps even ask if you can give a homily and you can talk about the man he was, thereby removing some of the blandness an impersonalness from the ceremony. But don't mention religion. This is not a time to make a point, it's a time to grieve.

who the fug

magicbastarder wrote: »

no, the funeral is for the relatives. he's dead. he won't notice. whether the relatives respect his wishes is another matter.

Depends how he did the will

Rev Hellfire

Worztron wrote: »

Will my relative get a Christian funeral

It might be more productive to ask his next of kin rather than random strangers on the interwebs.

Ilik Urgee

Surely how he's buried is at the discretion of his next of kin.

Sarky

What if he didn't want to be buried?

Thing is, if he never specified, it's a bit late to do anything about it now. I'd imagine if it really bothered him he'd have said something like "Don't you dare bury me like a Catholic or I swear I'll come back and haunt the sh*t out of you all."

Morag

Whom ever is his legal next of kin, they get to decide the funeral.

I know someone who was legally separated nearly 12 years and died and was atheist.
But as he was not divorced his ex was still his wife under law and next of kin
as a result his partner was refused access to the hospital, had no say in medical decisions
and was not part of the funeral arrangements, was told they were not welcome at the full catholic funeral.

Dades

Unless he specified somewhere that he wanted a non-religious funeral, there's officially nothing to be done. You could mention it to whoever is going to be organising the service, but the likelihood is they're not going to be interested in thinking outside their box.

Of course you could request to speak at his service and gently mention that the aforementioned dear old relative was an atheist and would have considered the chants and the incense somewhat superfluous - that might at least clear up the memory of him to those in the pews actually interested.

Sulla Felix

Morag wrote: »

Whom ever is his legal next of kin, they get to decide the funeral.

I know someone who was legally separated nearly 12 years and died and was atheist.
But as he was not divorced his ex was still his wife under law and next of kin
as a result his partner was refused access to the hospital, had no say in medical decisions
and was not part of the funeral arrangements, was told they were not welcome at the full catholic funeral.

People can be so fúcking horrible to each other sometimes.

MrPudding

Rev Hellfire wrote: »

It might be more productive to ask his next of kin rather than random strangers on the interwebs.

The OP appears to be asking a question along the lines of, what is the position is the NOK want one thing but the dead person has requested something else in their will? That seems like a perfectly valid question to me, which could be adequately answered by random strangers on the interwebs, assuming they had sufficient knowledge of the law relating to wills.

Had he asked, "what will the NOK of my relative do?" then your comment might actually have been valid.

MrP

Rev Hellfire

MrPudding wrote: »

The OP appears to be asking a question along the lines of, what is the position is the NOK want one thing but the dead person has requested something else in their will?

But that's not what they said:

Worztron wrote: »

Will my relative get a Christian funeral or is the only other way around this is if he made a will and stated he wanted a non-religious funeral?

They provided no information other than he's dead.

Perhaps if they provided some information as to the existence or not of a will and it instructions regards burial then people could comment.

But as it the post reads, blokes dead, hows he going to get sent off?

MrPudding

Rev Hellfire wrote: »

But that's not what they said:



They provided no information other than he's dead.

Perhaps if they provided some information as to the existence or not of a will and it instructions regards burial then people could comment.

But as it the post reads, blokes dead, hows he going to get sent off?

You have actually quoted his question. Where he asks, "is the only other way around this is if he made a will and stated he wanted a non-religious funeral?" It seems to me to be more of a general question as to how these things work rather than do you strangers know how my relative, whom you don't know anything about, will be buried by his relative, who you also don't know about.

I would have thought that asking a general question, like this, would be perfectly acceptable here. Similar to people asking about school admission policies and the like. It is, after all, a discussion forum. I would expect people should be free to ask questions, particularly if they relate to atheism in some way.

So, whilst in the specific case of his relative the NOK are going to be the people he needs to talk to about what is going to happen to his relative, surely it is sensible for him to get some information about what happens, in general, in circumstances such as this, so he has a better idea of what to expect? No?

MrP

Worztron

Worztron wrote: »

out of tradition rather than truly believing in adult fairy tales

Wow that is very dis respectful to Catholics or any Christian who believes in God or Heaven.

One should respect all religions.

Shame on you !

Rev Hellfire

If its a general question why address it as "Will my relative get a Christian funeral". That's as specific as it gets.

Asking us "is the only other way around this is if he made a will and stated he wanted a non-religious funeral" seems to be equally specific to said dead uncle.

But hey, I'm happy to assume they just composed the question badly.

Hotblack Desiato

Deleted User wrote: »

Wow that is very dis respectful to Catholics or any Christian who believes in God or Heaven.

No, it's disrespectful to their beliefs. I am not required to respect anyone's belief in their imaginary friend, whether they claim their imaginary friend is a god or isn't.

One should respect all religions.

People have a right to believe in whatever they want but not to impose it on anyone else, or use it to shape laws by which everyone must live, and I can't respect the view that religion should be above criticism or indeed ridicule - because religion is ridiculous.

Shame on you !

(channelling Bill Hicks) shouldn't you be forgiving him instead?

krudler

Deleted User wrote: »

Wow that is very dis respectful to Catholics or any Christian who believes in God or Heaven.

One should respect all religions.

Shame on you !

Why?

OP there's not much you can do unless he had it in his will, I told my family I'll come back and haunt them if I have a catholic funeral :pac:

MrPudding

Rev Hellfire wrote: »

But hey, I'm happy to assume they just composed the question badly.

That is kind of what I thought... Personally I think it is, when composed correctly, an interesting question...

MrP

Hotblack Desiato

I doubt a will would do any good, is it going to be read before the funeral? Even if the next of kin are aware of the will and can get their hands on it straight away, there is nothing stopping one or more of them from keeping quiet about the funeral wishes part until it's too late and the 'catholic by default' ceremony is imposed.

Sulla Felix

ninja900 wrote: »

I doubt a will would do any good, is it going to be read before the funeral? Even if the next of kin are aware of the will and can get their hands on it straight away, there is nothing stopping one or more of them from keeping quiet about the funeral wishes part until it's too late and the 'catholic by default' ceremony is imposed.

Especially since, in my experience at least, it's usually the women of the household who do a lot of the arranging and decision making at times like this. So, a certain amount of the attitude we see at census time comes into play as well, "ah, sure we'll put him down as Catholic anyway, tis only a phase."
Edit: Ok, that sounds a bit hostile to women now. Pretty sure y'all know what I mean though.

ninja900

ninja900 wrote: »

No, it's disrespectful to their beliefs. I am not required to respect anyone's belief in their imaginary friend, whether they claim their imaginary friend is a god or isn't.

Having respect for someone's beliefs is showing respect for the person. And we should respect other people regardless of their beliefs.

ninja900 wrote: »

People have a right to believe in whatever they want but not to impose it on anyone else, or use it to shape laws by which everyone must live, and I can't respect the view that religion should be above criticism or indeed ridicule - because religion is ridiculous.

Where did this come from ?

Dades

Deleted User wrote: »

One should respect all religions.

Eh, no. Respect needs to be earned, and the Catholic Church certainly hasn't earned theirs much.

Will be interesting to see how much 'respect' is paid to the deceased's belief in this case.

krudler

krudler wrote: »

Why?

Why not ?

Dades

Dades wrote: »

Eh, no. Respect needs to be earned, and the Catholic Church certainly hasn't earned theirs much.

Will be interesting to see how much 'respect' is paid to the deceased's belief in this case.

I never said anything about the Catholic Church, in fact I did not mention any religion ?

What has the catholic church done on you ?

I try respect other people regardless of who they are until they give me reason not to, so someone is equal in my book regardless of their race/religion/beliefs

I never stated the deceased shouldn't have his wishes carried out. In fact I find it downright disrespectful if he did not want any religious burial.

Hotblack Desiato

Deleted User wrote: »

Having respect for someone's beliefs is showing respect for the person. And we should respect other people regardless of their beliefs.

People aren't deserving of respect no matter what. Although you do backpedal from this a couple of posts later.
Beliefs which are irrational, ridiculous, or hateful certainly don't deserve respect.

Where did this come from ?

My keyboard.

We all know that 'respect religion' is convenient shorthand for 'don't criticise religion' so I thought I'd cut to the chase.

ninja900

ninja900 wrote: »

People aren't deserving of respect no matter what. Although you do backpedal from this a couple of posts later.
Beliefs which are irrational, ridiculous, or hateful certainly don't deserve respect.



My keyboard.

We all know that 'respect religion' is convenient shorthand for 'don't criticise religion' so I thought I'd cut to the chase.

So you treat people with utter disrespect until such time as you think they deserve respect ? am I reading that correct ?

I mentioned nothing of religion, you assumed I was talking about religion when I said beliefs !

Dades

Deleted User wrote: »

I never said anything about the Catholic Church, in fact I did not mention any religion ?

Eh, you said ALL religions?

Deleted User wrote: »

I try respect other people regardless of who they are until they give me reason not to, so someone is equal in my book regardless of their race/religion/beliefs.

There's an obvious difference between respecting religions, and respecting people. Don't be moving the goalposts here!

Hotblack Desiato

Deleted User wrote: »

So you treat people with utter disrespect until such time as you think they deserve respect ? am I reading that correct ?

No, you're creating a massive strawman.

I mentioned nothing of religion, you assumed I was talking about religion when I said beliefs !

Dear oh dear. Allow me :

Deleted User wrote: »

Wow that is very dis respectful to Catholics or any Christian who believes in God or Heaven.

One should respect all religions.

Shame on you !

Peregrinus

The legal position is this: the right and responsibility for making funeral arrangements is the next-of-kin’s. (If they fail to do so, or if there are no traceable next-of-kin, eventually the Health Services Executive will step in and arrange something, but that’s not at issue here.)

If you’re concerned about your own funeral, and you want to ensure that it will not be (or, alternatively, that it will be) a religious funeral, you need at a minimum to make your wishes clear to your next of kin. If you are concerned that they will not respect your wishes, you can do things like book (and pay for) your own funeral in advance with a funeral operator, with all the details arranged the way you want them. Yes, your NOK could still ignore the arrangements you have made and do something else, but you might think that’s less likely.

In general, there’s not much point in putting something about this in your will. Typically, your will won’t get read until after the funeral, and so won’t influence the funeral arrangements. But there is one circumstance where your will could be relevant; if you think your NOK will disrespect the wishes you have expressed to them regarding your funeral, you can leave them a bequest in the will conditional on their having respected your funeral directions, and make sure they know that you have done this. That gives them a powerful incentive to respect your wishes.

If you have an elderly relative and you expect to be in the position of being their next of kin and having to arrange their funeral, you probably know what they would like. If you don’t know, the only way you can find out is to ask them, though I appreciate that could be a sensitive conversation to have.

If their wishes for their funeral are not for the kind of funeral that you would like to attend, you have a dilemma; are you going to respect their wishes, or are you going to ignore their wishes and organise the kind of funeral and you and/or the wider family want? Or are you going to tray for some compromise which reflects a bit of both? But it’s an ethical dilemma, not a legal one. Legally, decisions about the funeral will be for you to make.

If you are neither the person whose funeral we are talking about nor the person who expects to be the next of kin, but a more distant family member or friend, your role is clear; butt out. If it upsets you that poor Jim is having a religious funeral (or a non-religious funeral) you have to deal with that upset yourself; your feelings are your problem, and not anyone else’s.

Beruthiel

Worztron wrote: »

my relative get a Christian funeral (the thought turns my stomach) or is the only other way around this is if he made a will and stated he wanted a non-religious funeral?

My hubby and daughter are very well aware that my body should be brought no where near a church.

So, if your relative did not go to the trouble of being very insistent to the people around him, you would have to conclude, that he really didn't care enough about what happens to his body once he had passed away.
Perhaps you could let that be some comfort to you.

Ilik Urgee

Been thinking about this since my last post and I've changed my mind due to realising the will would never have been read by the time of the funeral.

Would it be feasible to ask the NOK whether the deceased wishes are being respected,(not in so many words but sensitively) before the funeral?

It's a fine line I know but people can be very bullish when it comes to breaking tradition regarding funerals- I know I've been at funerals of friends and relatives and questioned whether certain proceedings really were suitable to their character/beliefs.
I've since told my OH if she'll get satisfaction from throwing me into a rain barrel when I'm gone to do it, so long as she gets some kind of closure for herself.

So in that respect,thank you OP!

Peregrinus

Ilik Urgee wrote: »

Been thinking about this since my last post and I've changed my mind due to realising the will will never have been read by the time of the funeral.

Would it be feasible to ask the NOK whether the deceased wishes are being respected,(not in so many words but sensitively) before the funeral?

Well, it's feasible, but I question whether there is much point.

First, however sensitive you are, it's hard to ask the question without giving offence. The fact that you ask the question at all implies that you think they might not respect the deceased's wishes. They might get a bit shirty at that implication.

Secondly, whatever the NOK is planning, they are hardly going to answer by saying that they are flouting the deceased's wishes. They will do what they decide to do, and tell you that it is the deceased's wishes. ("Yes, I know mother never entered a church after her first communion, and regarded all priests as the spawn of Satan, but she didn't want/wouldn't have wanted to upset Great Aunty Kate by not having a funeral mass.") And, however grave your suspicions may be, you can't really quarrel with this; the NOK is almost certainly closer to the deceased than you are.

It's very, very unlikely that your asking this question is going to change the NOK's mind about what do to, and quite possible that it will cause a rift between you and the NOK.

There are some things you are not responsible for, and organising the funeral of someone to whom you are not next of kin is one of those things. You may feel that the person who is NOK is discharging that responsiblity well, or discharging it badly, but the range of action you can properly engage in is limited. You can (a) be supportive, helping them with what they have to do and giving them any guidance which you think they want and will find helpful. And there may be some opportunity their to help them decide to honour the deceased's wishes, rather than Great Aunty Kate's, if that is a conflict they are experiencing. Or you can (b) keep schtumm. Explicitly or implicitly criticising what they do, I'm afraid, is not on, even if the criticism is entirely justified. (Especially if the criticism is entirely justified!)

Worztron

ninja900 wrote: »

I doubt a will would do any good, is it going to be read before the funeral? Even if the next of kin are aware of the will and can get their hands on it straight away, there is nothing stopping one or more of them from keeping quiet about the funeral wishes part until it's too late and the 'catholic by default' ceremony is imposed.

I can see it now - some mealy-mouthed priest saying something like "He is with Jesus now..." -- Oh the madness!

Worztron

Dades wrote: »

Eh, no. Respect needs to be earned, and the Catholic Church certainly hasn't earned theirs much.

Will be interesting to see how much 'respect' is paid to the deceased's belief in this case.

Excellent point. The very fact that he was an atheist seems destined to be pushed aside by the unfortunate default catholic stance.

kylith

OP, all you can do is ask "Will John be having a humanist ceremony, since he wasn't religious?" If they then say that he's being given a Catholic send-off, officiated by the pope himself, there's nothing you can do about it.

Dades

Peregrinus wrote: »

But there is one circumstance where your will could be relevant; if you think your NOK will disrespect the wishes you have expressed to them regarding your funeral, you can leave them a bequest in the will conditional on their having respected your funeral directions, and make sure they know that you have done this. That gives them a powerful incentive to respect your wishes.

That is a delicious idea. I am filing that one away in the bottom drawer.

Kinski

Peregrinus wrote: »

you can leave them a bequest in the will conditional on their having respected your funeral directions, and make sure they know that you have done this. That gives them a powerful incentive to respect your wishes.

Does that still hold water legally if the deceased didn't make them aware of it? I can see some crotchety old people with no children of their own could have quite a lot fun imagining the look on their hated nephew's face when he finds out that the tidy sum his mad old uncle promised him was dependent on him organising a 21 gun salute for the funeral...the funeral that's already over.

Mark Hamill

seamus wrote: »

But you can have ceremonies without a body, so there's nothing stopping you from holding your own. Of course you don't do that because it's ridiculously insensitive and disrespectful to the family.

Is it not ridiculously insensitive and disrespectful of the family to have a christian funeral for someone who wasn't christian? What if he was muslim and they insisted on having a christian funeral? Would that not be disrespuctul of them.

Peregrinus

Kinski wrote: »

Does that still hold water legally if the deceased didn't make them aware of it? I can see some crotchety old people with no children of their own could have quite a lot fun imagining the look on their hated nephew's face when he finds out that the tidy sum his mad old uncle promised him was dependent on him organising a 21 gun salute for the funeral...the funeral that's already over.

Well, there's no point in including it in your will if you're not going to make people aware of it.

Yes, it would hold water, unless the condition attached is illegal, unconscionable or contrary to public policy. But if you attached a "surprise" condition that you not only failed to mention beforehand, but that was something the beneficiary couldn't reasonably have known or expected you have wanted, they might use that to challenge the entire will on the basis that you were obviously of unsound mind when you made it!

seamus

Mark Hamill wrote: »

Is it not ridiculously insensitive and disrespectful of the family to have a christian funeral for someone who wasn't christian? What if he was muslim and they insisted on having a christian funeral? Would that not be disrespuctul of them.

This is where the water gets muddy though. The deceased was nominally Catholic, presumably considered to be culturally Catholic, and from the OP's wording probably never told anyone he was atheist.

So in this case it's not exactly the same as holding a catholic burial for a muslim. From his family's POV they probably would say he was Catholic, therefore there's no inherent disrespect in them proceeding with a catholic burial.

If they knew of his leanings or he outright professed hatred of the catholic church, one would hope they'd have the sensitivity to see that a catholic burial would be inappropriate.

eviltwin

I have it drilled into my family that when I die I do not want anything remotely catholic at my funeral. I hope they will respect that and I would imagine my kids will, my only concern is my siblings making a big hoo hah out of it. I know I won't be here so its all moot what they do with me but its very important to me that my views on the church are respected and to an extent they are while I am here so why should it be any different just cause I'm not.

I suppose for some there is less hassle with a church funeral, people have to seek out alternatives, how much easier just to stick with what you know in a time of distress. But hopefully in time more options will be out there and it won't be as hard to arrange.

Peregrinus

eviltwin wrote: »

I have it drilled into my family that when I die I do not want anything remotely catholic at my funeral. I hope they will respect that and I would imagine my kids will, my only concern is my siblings making a big hoo hah out of it. I know I won't be here so its all moot what they do with me but its very important to me that my views on the church are respected and to an extent they are while I am here so why should it be any different just cause I'm not .

Your next of kin will be your spouse, if they survive you, and if they don’t then your kids, if they survive you. Only if your spouse, kids, grandkids and more remote descendants all die before you do will your siblings be your next of kin, and in a position to impose the funeral you don’t want. And hopefully that’s not going to happen.

If you think your kids will come under pressure from more distant family, you can strengthen their hand by writing down the wishes you have already discussed with them, and making sure they know your funeral instructions are on the top shelf of the dresser, in the unhappy event etc etc. Then your kids can wave this in the faces of your interfering relatives and tell them to sod off.

eviltwin wrote: »

I suppose for some there is less hassle with a church funeral, people have to seek out alternatives, how much easier just to stick with what you know in a time of distress. But hopefully in time more options will be out there and it won't be as hard to arrange.

May you be spared for many years, and hopefully by then there will be lots of options, and lots of experienced people to support your family in organising the funeral you want. But if you’re concerned that destiny approaches a bit more quickly than that, and you want to spare your kids the hassle you might think they would have in organising a non-religious funeral, you can talk to the Humanist Association of Ireland about what they can do in this regard, and you can talk to an undertaker with experience of humanist funerals, and make a few choices and specify them in the funeral directions that you leave on the top shelf of the dresser.

Mark Hamill

seamus wrote: »

This is where the water gets muddy though. The deceased was nominally Catholic, presumably considered to be culturally Catholic, and from the OP's wording probably never told anyone he was atheist.

So in this case it's not exactly the same as holding a catholic burial for a muslim. From his family's POV they probably would say he was Catholic, therefore there's no inherent disrespect in them proceeding with a catholic burial.

If they knew of his leanings or he outright professed hatred of the catholic church, one would hope they'd have the sensitivity to see that a catholic burial would be inappropriate.

Fair enough. Unless the OP returns and tells us the deceased's family was aware he was atheist, then what you say makes sense.

mathepac

I'd like to go back to a point raised in some preceding posts that seems to have been dismissed or ignored. The funeral rites in many cultures and religions serve a number of purposes including respecting and remembering the life of the departed person. Another important purpose they serve is for friends and family of the departed to gather in commemoration of that person to share memories, anecdotes and grief (or glee, as the case may be).

The rites and ceremonies of any belief system or religion are for the surviving family and friends and serve to give them a template for the ceremonies and a formal, well-practiced means of bidding farewell to the deceased. The "arrangements" can be safely left to 3rd-parties, funeral directors / clergy, so that the arranging doesn't impinge upon the loss and sorrow being experienced by the mourners.

Only an extreme control freak with a wish to exert malign influence and impose unnecessary hurt on survivors would insist on removing the comfort of the traditional rites from his family.

Typically, in this thread some atheists (already dead?) yet again want to impose their will on grieving families.

If you're an atheist, when you're dead you're dead. Whatever religious rites happen in and around your decomposing chemical remains once the life-force is extinguished cannot effect you - or can it, hence the hullabaloo?

Pherekydes

mathepac wrote: »

I'd like to go back to a point raised in some preceding posts that seems to have been dismissed or ignored. The funeral rites in many cultures and religions serve a number of purposes including respecting and remembering the life of the departed person. Another important purpose they serve is for friends and family of the departed to gather in commemoration of that person to share memories, anecdotes and grief (or glee, as the case may be).

The rites and ceremonies of any belief system or religion are for the surviving family and friends and serve to give them a template for the ceremonies and a formal, well-practiced means of bidding farewell to the deceased. The "arrangements" can be safely left to 3rd-parties, funeral directors / clergy, so that the arranging doesn't impinge upon the loss and sorrow being experienced by the mourners.

Only an extreme control freak with a wish to exert malign influence and impose unnecessary hurt on survivors would insist on removing the comfort of the traditional rites from his family.

Typically, in this thread some atheists (already dead?) yet again want to impose their will on grieving families.

If you're an atheist, when you're dead you're dead. Whatever religious rites happen in and around your decomposing chemical remains once the life-force is extinguished cannot effect you - or can it, hence the hullabaloo?

If you can have a legally binding will as to how your estate is divided up after you become a decomposing bag of chemicals, why can't you have a binding agreement as to how that bag of chemicals is disposed of?

As for myself, I intend to leave my body to science. I won't feel guilty about this because I'll be dead.

Nice try at the guilt trip, though. I wouldn't expect anything else from the religious.

seamus

Pherekydes wrote: »

If you can have a legally binding will as to how your estate is divided up after you become a decomposing bag of chemicals, why can't you have a binding agreement as to how that bag of chemicals is disposed of?

Afaik, a will only legally recognises the disbursement of one's assets, it does not give any legal power to acts you request. The Father Ted episode of the night in the crypt with the coffin, afaik is not something which is legally enforceable.

Thus, you can specify that your sister gets your house, but you can't demand that she never changes the layout of the house or never builds an extension. Once you pass the asset to the other individual, they are free to do whatever they please with it.
Such it is with the body. You can specify in your will who is to have charge of your body, but you cannot specify what they are allowed do with it.

Afaik; I could be totally wrong.

Worztron

Mark Hamill wrote: »

Fair enough. Unless the OP returns and tells us the deceased's family was aware he was atheist, then what you say makes sense.

He was atheist.

Worztron

Deleted User wrote: »

Wow that is very dis respectful to Catholics or any Christian who believes in God or Heaven.

One should respect all religions.

Shame on you !

What? For saying the truth?

Worztron

Deleted User wrote: »

In fact I find it downright disrespectful if he did not want any religious burial.

Seriously? Are you for real? Consider floating back to the christianity section. You are offering noting of worth to this thread.

mathepac

seamus wrote: »

... The Father Ted episode of the night in the crypt with the coffin, afaik is not something which is legally enforceable ...

@seamus good point.

@Pherekydes, take 100 lines: "Father Ted was not a documentary series", "Father Ted was not a documentary series" ...