Punchestown Gold Cup

Gringo180

Ladbrokes have this race priced up already they go;

2 Sir Des Champs, 5-2 Long Run, 4 First Lieutenant, 8 Roi Du Mee, 8 Sizing Europe, 10 Captain Chris, 10 Kauto Stone, 10 Riverside Theatre, 16 Pandorama, 20 bar

Ill be backing Captain Chris especially as he's back on a right handed track, hopefully I might get better than 10/1 with another bookmaker when they release there odds for the race. I cant believe Kauto Stone is only 10/1 he should be at least double that price, hes run 1 good race in his last 6 outings.

Colonel Sanders

I'd be wary of backing Sir Des. Silviniaco fell 2 out so didn't have the gruelling battle up the hill that Sir Des did but still looked to be feeling the effects at Aintree

Obviously SDC has a longer break but he was also unimpressive last year & appears to be better left handed (Knockfierna may well have beaten him at Xmas 2011 going that way round at Limerick)

Sir des champs

I'll hammer them, no competition,capt chris for the forecast

Slattsy

Sir Des Champs will not be 2/1 near the off. Get on now. Can see him going off much shorter. Will love some better ground too.

the groutch

Colonel Sanders wrote: »

Obviously SDC has a longer break but he was also unimpressive last year

that was on soft-heavy which he hated. his only two career runs on Good ground were his two wins at Cheltenham.

jimjamcos

I'll be backing Whodoyouthink in this...thought he ran a cracker in Aintree Bowl only 10,000 lengths behind First Lieutenant.

Also heard a rumour that he might be running it in the horse box. Get on.

ste2010

This will finally finally finally be a Guinness gold cup to remember. The last few had shocking interest from a big horse perspective (except denman and kauto who both disappointed)
Couldn't call it to be honest but I know captain Chris should be on the other side of roi du mee and sizing Europe in the betting. Long run is as tough as old boots but you'd have to think sir des champs on good ground has it for the taking...after last weeks surprises its difficult to nail down the form post Cheltenham

Morgans

Not sure why there is such a lack of love for First Lieutenant for this. Think he is the most obvious one.

sting60

Sir Des Champs best form by a long long way has been on soft ground.

Hulk Hands

Morgans wrote: »

Not sure why there is such a lack of love for First Lieutenant for this. Think he is the most obvious one.

If he's fully over his Aintree run then I think he'd beat SDC and LR a tad comfortably. Anyone using the good ground argument for SDC has to acknowledge that FL likes it just as much. Being the outsider of the 3 is baffling. Sizing Europe would be interesting on proper good ground

premierstone

sting60 wrote: »

Sir Des Champs best form by a long long way has been on soft ground.

He's best run over hurdles was the Martin Pipe on Good ground and he's best performance over fences was the Jewson on Good ground, not sure where you are going with the above but it doesnt add up.

Morgans

Definitely, his best form over fences was the Gold Cup.

Slattsy

FL has had 2 tough races in a reasonably short period of time.
There was to be some doubt about him even running.

sting60

premierstone wrote: »

He's best run over hurdles was the Martin Pipe on Good ground and he's best performance over fences was the Jewson on Good ground, not sure where you are going with the above but it doesnt add up.

Before you try to snipe make sure you have any understanding of horse racing.He has only two runs over hurdles one a maiden hurdle and then the Martin Pipe at Cheltenham.His Jewson run is a full 24lbs inferior to his Gold Cup run on soft going.In fact every run by SDC after the Jewson was far superior and indeed the Jewson run was equal to his only other previous rated run over fences.

Slattsy

sting60 wrote: »

Before you try to snipe make sure you have any understanding of horse racing.To educate you the Jewson was 24lbs a worse race than his Gold Cup run on soft going,FACT.

While i'll leave you 2 girls to argue

But in saying the above.... could he not have ran to a higher rating than his GC run if the ground was good? Considering Mullins/Russell have always stated he wants better ground...

premierstone

lol comparing ratings from he's novice season to those as a second season chaser, not to mention the little fact of the extra 6 furlongs.

Morgans

I hate to be agreeing with Sting, but the Jewson wasnt his best run over fences. It was you who made that comparison.

SDC may well be better on better ground (I suspect that he is), but he hasnt proven it yet.

sting60

premierstone wrote: »

lol comparing ratings from he's novice season to those as a second season chaser, not to mention the little fact of the extra 6 furlongs.

You made the comparison "his best every run was the Jewson".Just leave it at that as no more needs to be said .

premierstone

The point I was trying to make was he has excelled everytime he has run on good ground while he has dissapointed a few times on Soft/Heavy, I believe and I use the Jewson as my theory that he would have ran to a higher mark in the GC on a sounder surface.

Every connection of the horse from the Trainer to the stable lad has repeatedly made this point aswell, and if nothing else he 100% definitely jumps better on better ground, I think he travels better aswell myself but this possibly needs more evidence to back it up.

UrbanSea

This race has a habit of throwing up some funny results and I'd take a chance on the progressive Roi Du Mee in this

premierstone

UrbanSea wrote: »

This race has a habit of throwing up some funny results and I'd take a chance on the progressive Roi Du Mee in this

It has done in the past alright but it does seem a fairly loaded race this time out, you would expect at least one of them to perform to their level.

Morgans

UrbanSea wrote: »

This race has a habit of throwing up some funny results and I'd take a chance on the progressive Roi Du Mee in this

He would be the one that I would rule out. Has been avoiding the big boys. Not a big fan of the horse. Riverside Theatre would be one that is due a big race. Punchestown can be very tricky alright.

UrbanSea

Morgans wrote: »

He would be the one that I would rule out. Has been avoiding the big boys. Not a big fan of the horse. Riverside Theatre would be one that is due a big race. Punchestown can be very tricky alright.

Him avoiding the big festivals is more of a plus for me. I don't think they thought he'd be this good come the end of the year. He keeps finding more when stepped up although I was disappointed when he was comfortably dismissed by Quito de la Roque

shy-tall-knight

Would be folly to dismiss Kauto Stone if he came over. Is 2 from 2 in Ireland including beating First Lieutenant this season. Also he goes really well fresh and should have no problem with the trip on decent ground.
That said I think I would want something bigger than 12's as though you could make excuses for his last two runs, there is still a leap of faith to be taken when backing him.

sting60

shy-tall-knight wrote: »

Would be folly to dismiss Kauto Stone if he came over. Is 2 from 2 in Ireland including beating First Lieutenant this season. Also he goes really well fresh and should have no problem with the trip on decent ground.
That said I think I would want something bigger than 12's as though you could make excuses for his last two runs, there is still a leap of faith to be taken when backing him.

The only thing with regards Kauto Stone is Nicholls wants to win the British NH trainers champ.He should never have run Silviniaco Conti at Aintree after his heavy fall at Cheltenham but he has an agenda.

RichieLawlor

sting60 wrote: »

The only thing with regards Kauto Stone is Nicholls wants to win the British NH trainers champ.He should never have run Silviniaco Conti at Aintree after his heavy fall at Cheltenham but he has an agenda.

Henderson has been 1.01 since Cheltenham, Nicholls had no chance. Even winning the grand national wouldn't have helped him this year