Coupled payment for suckler cows and sheep?

blue5000

Just wondering what are your thoughts on this? If there isn't one will there be any suckler cows left at all, and if there is one will Larry be the main beneficiary?

How much should it be?

leg wax

blue5000 wrote: »

Just wondering what are your thoughts on this? If there isn't one will there be any suckler cows left at all, and if there is one will Larry be the main beneficiary?

How much should it be?

150-180 euros

Farmer Pudsey

What it should and will be are two different things. 150 euro's will be the out side I think. More than likly there will be a limit on Number of cows and I would not be suprised if an star rating for the bull as well.

Manoffeeling

What is this obsession with expecting someone else to pay for the upkeep of a cow that is not fit to make money??

Dampintheattic

blue5000 wrote: »

Just wondering what are your thoughts on this? If there isn't one will there be any suckler cows left at all, and if there is one will Larry be the main beneficiary?

How much should it be?

What's this payment about? Is it on top of SFP, for suckler farmers per cow?
If it is, it will work just the same beef premium in the old days. The benefit will go up the chain, to Larry.
Price of weanlings will drop by amout of the coupled payment. Price of finished beef will drop by same amount. Larry, will have more money to buy donkey balls, from Poland and the likes.

Cavanjack

According to John sherily in the indo on Tuesday suckler's are a thing of the past. Friesian bulls are the way forward. Profits as good as dairying he says. Anyone care to back his story up???

Grecco

Cavanjack wrote: »

According to John sherily in the indo on Tuesday suckler's are a thing of the past. Friesian bulls are the way forward. Profits as good as dairying he says. Anyone care to back his story up???

I saw yearling Friesian Bulls at Ennis mart on Tuesday sold for as low as €280.
And they were no bad ones either

supersean1999

Any word what a ewe payment should be,

Cavanjack

Grecco wrote: »

I saw yearling Friesian Bulls at Ennis mart on Tuesday sold for as low as €280.
And they were no bad ones either

He/She could have payed close to that last year for them. They would surely leave the next man a few pound.

leg wax

Manoffeeling wrote: »

What is this obsession with expecting someone else to pay for the upkeep of a cow that is not fit to make money??[/QUOTE dairy farmers get money to support the cow and i am still getting it and not milking .why should dairy farmers get support.

Birdnuts

Dampintheattic wrote: »

What's this payment about? Is it on top of SFP, for suckler farmers per cow?
If it is, it will work just the same beef premium in the old days. The benefit will go up the chain, to Larry.
Price of weanlings will drop by amout of the coupled payment. Price of finished beef will drop by same amount. Larry, will have more money to buy donkey balls, from Poland and the likes.

That pretty much sums it up - Coveney must have been living on Mars back in the days of headage payments. TBH the less input this government has on the final outcome of the new CAP for Ireland, the better!!

Juniorhurler

Birdnuts wrote: »

That pretty much sums it up - Coveney must have been living on Mars back in the days of headage payments. TBH the less input this government has on the final outcome of the new CAP for Ireland, the better!!

To a degree I agree with this. However with export markets opening up and the dairy expansion to come I think that supplies might tighten enough to keep prices at a more sustainable level.

rancher

supersean1999 wrote: »

Any word what a ewe payment should be,

These proposals have a long way to go yet, but if coupling was set at 7%, the fund would be €84000000 which would only be roughly €60/cow on 1000000 cows plus €10/ewe on two and a half million ewes.....not hectic is it.
Thats just guessing anyway

Manoffeeling

leg wax wrote: »

Manoffeeling wrote: »

What is this obsession with expecting someone else to pay for the upkeep of a cow that is not fit to make money??[/QUOTE dairy farmers get money to support the cow and i am still getting it and not milking .why should dairy farmers get support.

How does a dairy farmer get support for keeping his cows? And don't say SFP because you can get that without keeping cows.

Birdnuts

Juniorhurler wrote: »

. However with export markets opening up and the dairy expansion to come I think that supplies might tighten enough to keep prices at a more sustainable level.

Assuming that happens, then farmers will respond anyways to better prices by producing more stock whether the headage payment is there or not. Unfortunatly the history of this sort of thing is that the farmer sees little or no net benefit of such payments in a country where processors and retailers are so powerfull:(

simx

Grecco wrote: »

I saw yearling Friesian Bulls at Ennis mart on Tuesday sold for as low as €280.
And they were no bad ones either

What kg were they?

Juniorhurler

Birdnuts wrote: »

Assuming that happens, then farmers will respond anyways to better prices by producing more stock whether the headage payment is there or not. Unfortunatly the history of this sort of thing is that the farmer sees little or no net benefit of such payments in a country where processors and retailers are so powerfull:(

I am an optimist so I choose to see the other side;-). Seriously though, I think if beef is wanted, with the abolition of milk quota and the land grab this will bring, margins will have to improve or other sectors like going into milk or contract rearing will eat into beef supplies or so I hope.

Birdnuts

Juniorhurler wrote: »

I am an optimist so I choose to see the other side;-). Seriously though, I think if beef is wanted, with the abolition of milk quota and the land grab this will bring, margins will have to improve or other sectors like going into milk or contract rearing will eat into beef supplies or so I hope.

Well given the debacle over the horse meat then the likes of South American product would probably fill the gap:( I'm feeling pessimistic tonight between the weather outlook and this governments handling of this issue and so many others:rolleyes:;)

caseman

Dampintheattic wrote: »

What's this payment about? Is it on top of SFP, for suckler farmers per cow?
If it is, it will work just the same beef premium in the old days. The benefit will go up the chain, to Larry.
Price of weanlings will drop by amout of the coupled payment. Price of finished beef will drop by same amount. Larry, will have more money to buy donkey balls, from Poland and the likes.

The scws scheme was't passed onto larry and the boys ,it brought me an hoildays when it was E80.

tabby aspreme

If there is a coupled sheep payment I hope they include breeding ewe lambs

Juniorhurler

Birdnuts wrote: »

Well given the debacle over the horse meat then the likes of South American product would probably fill the gap:( I'm feeling pessimistic tonight between the weather outlook and this governments handling of this issue and so many others:rolleyes:;)

Ya but they are tilling more and more land so their supplies are tightening too. Also the horsemeat debacle may cause people to question the traceability of beef and there is next to none on these imports. But then we were meant to have it and horses were sold as beef so that argument is dead. Just the tighter supplies so.

supersean1999

rancher wrote: »

These proposals have a long way to go yet, but if coupling was set at 7%, the fund would be €84000000 which would only be roughly €60/cow on 1000000 cows plus €10/ewe on two and a half million ewes.....not hectic is it.
Thats just guessing anyway

It would be capped I'd imagine prob 100 ewes or something. The figures don't add up alright , not a clue what the average flock size is.

Irishmale

Juniorhurler wrote: »

Ya but they are tilling more and more land so their supplies are tightening too. Also the horsemeat debacle may cause people to question the traceability of beef and there is next to none on these imports. But then we were meant to have it and horses were sold as beef so that argument is dead. Just the tighter supplies so.

we do have it, and it works well, we just got shafted by processors and coveny and the news saying it was farmers. it was factories who have/are/will always be working against farm interests

leg wax

Manoffeeling wrote: »

leg wax wrote: »

How does a dairy farmer get support for keeping his cows? And don't say SFP because you can get that without keeping cows.

what do you call it so we can all get sfp without keeping stock or am i wrong.

Manoffeeling

leg wax wrote: »

Manoffeeling wrote: »

what do you call it so we can all get sfp without keeping stock or am i wrong.

I just have to keep .15 of a livestock unit to get SFP and head age. For some guys thats 6 cattle over 70 acres. Why would you need a grant to pay for the up keep?

reilig

Birdnuts wrote: »

Well given the debacle over the horse meat then the likes of South American product would probably fill the gap:( I'm feeling pessimistic tonight between the weather outlook and this governments handling of this issue and so many others:rolleyes:;)

Been following south american beef prices lately. They are almost on a par with irish prices. When you factor in transport costs they are on a par. Nobody will buy hormone treated untraceable beef if they can source irish beef at the same price. The horsemeat scandal was a blip that tarnished the Irish meat industry, but so far, it appears that it has done most damage to the processed meat sector. The last few weeks have seen huge rises in price for whole beef and this has lead to good rises in factory prices. There is a report in this week's journal about how uk factories have increased prices too.

So in a way, if the horsemeat scandal has one benefit, it will be to force meat processers to clean up their act.