coccidiosis

kevthegaff

lads i sold bull calves to a lad and he said one has coccidiosis. i said id replace him if he dies as i might have this customer for years to come. anyways i dosed all my own calves with decox, and one heifer calf who was sick for the last 5 days is down but drinking well. her legs are out to the side, is there any chance of her getting back up?

whelan1

we use vecoxan, as per the other threads, clean out sheds and disenfect as often as possible...the calf thats down needs energy so along with normal feeds give life aid or whatever to boost her, maybe sit her over a bale of straw to get her standing... did you sell the calf in the mart?

greysides

You could ask your vet for treatment. I only view Deccox and Vecoxan as preventative. The downside to treatment is that once the disease progresses beyond a certain point treatment becomes hugely less effective so early detection is vital. Electrolytes will help keep the calf as strong as possible. Is she forcing as she typically would be if it is coccidiosis?

jomoloney

whelan1 wrote: »

maybe sit her over a bale of straw to get her standing... ?

her guts are on fire and you want to put her in n more pain ?

whelan1

jomoloney wrote: »

her guts are on fire and you want to put her in n more pain ?

this is what we do saves your back when lifting them.... have you any other ideas?

ford bo

we had an awful problem too.2 years ago .but we dont have it anymore.what we do is we give the calves vecoxan at 3 weeks old .then we give the calves nuts which have vecoxan powder in the nuts. yon can get them in dairygold or many other places the calves receive small amouts of medicine each day and we never have to dose them again .they are a great job it is the only way to stop that problem .hope this helps

20silkcut

What are the name of these nuts. I am in-undated with crows here picking at the calf starter. I have them done with vecoxan already.

delaval

We had to treat calves with Vecoxin last year. Does this mean we should be taking precautions or is it a once off thing?

bbam

I wouldn't be too keen on her lying with legs out to one side.
If you can prop her up in a sitting Position as it will help keep fluid off the lungs.

You need to be thinking of keeping 8-10 litres of fluids a day into the calf to keep it hydrated and as much energy in it as possible. This is best done by alternating feeds and electrolyte in 2litre feeds throughout the day. You

Can use the homemade recipe for some of the electrolytes but I'd feed the commercial maybe once a day as they do have minerals etc in them.
I mix cheap Tesco large natural yougherts in the milk for an animal like this as it seems to settle the digestive system.

If the calf isn't running a temperature then a heat lamp might be a good idea.

Maybe ask the vet if a LA antibiotic would be a good idea as you don't want a secondary infection setting in.

whelan1

have to take my own advice, lost a few calves in the last few days... trying to narrow it down, these calves where all born while i was swanning of on my holidays:rolleyes: -note to self never to trust anyone else with MY calves- its not coccidiosis... but really fecking annoying... havent lost any all year...had everything written down what everything had to get, asked lad this morning and he said some of them mightnt have had enough biestings .... all other calves seem fine, strange that it is only fr bulls that i have lost

mauser77

What are the signs of coccidiosis?

whelan1

mauser77 wrote: »

What are the signs of coccidiosis?

normally a black dung on their tail and blood in their dung

bbam

whelan1 wrote: »

normally a black dung on their tail and blood in their dung

Arching and pressing and pressing..
Slimy muchas in the dung, often along with the blood, this is the lining of the gut being passed so you know things are bad..

http://www.merckmanuals.com/vet/digestive_system/coccidiosis/coccidiosis_of_cattle.html?qt=&sc=&alt=

greysides

delaval wrote: »

We had to treat calves with Vecoxin last year. Does this mean we should be taking precautions or is it a once off thing?

Consider it a family heirloom.

It may not be obvious and rampant every year but it'll be there.

Biggest monetary losses are considered to be due to subclinical disease rather than the sick ones. A true parasitic disease.

pakalasa

We had a lot of it until we started using vecoxan. Target is one dose at 10 days old. No cases since.

whelan1

pakalasa wrote: »

We had a lot of it until we started using vecoxan. Target is one dose at 10 days old. No cases since.

yes, make sure they get the 20ml, some might need a second dose a week or so later

bbam

greysides wrote: »

Biggest monetary losses are considered to be due to subclinical disease rather than the sick ones. A true parasitic disease.

I didn't realise that..
We had some two years ago but nothing since, or so I thought !

So at about €110 for a litre, its about €2+ a shot and people are giving two doses, so about €5 a calf... Not allot in the scheme of things..

I'd have the odd calf develop a dirty backside but nothing black/dark usually cream or grey and it clears up in a day or two..

kevthegaff

the heifer i had down, her joints dont seem great, shes drinkin well but has her legs out to the side like the splits, p££ssin me off at this stage

whelan1

bbam wrote: »

I didn't realise that..
We had some two years ago but nothing since, or so I thought !

So at about €110 for a litre, its about €2+ a shot and people are giving two doses, so about €5 a calf... Not allot in the scheme of things..

I'd have the odd calf develop a dirty backside but nothing black/dark usually cream or grey and it clears up in a day or two..

think you can get a 2 litre pack as well i dont buy the 2 litre one anymore since some one drove over it with the digger, big loss.... ... sure if you save one calf the money is well worth it

delaval

greysides wrote: »

Consider it a family heirloom.

It may not be obvious and rampant every year but it'll be there.

Biggest monetary losses are considered to be due to subclinical disease rather than the sick ones. A true parasitic disease.

We got it last year in weaned calves at grass in July and treated with Vicoxin.
I spoke to our vet today. She told me that you need to give about a week before they are usually affected, also told me that if I do now will have to do again. As our problem is not on this farm and calves will not be on that farm this summer she recommended that we wait and see. What do you think?

Incidenty the farm was only about 1 mile as the crow flies from a landfill I am only remembering this now

greysides

The Vecoxan may work like a vaccine but it is not a vaccine.

It subdues the parasite while the animals own immune system gets a head-start in the race. Coccidiosis is a disease where there is a huge input from the immune system. That's the reason most infections are subclinical, the immune system dominates. Where infection levels are high or the animals immunity low then you will see the clinical disease. From the parasites point-of-view, it's not in its' best interests to kill the host but that is risk. It would prefer to quietly get about its' business where a balance is drawn between it killing its' hosts and its' hosts killing it.

Anyway, back on point, while the Vecoxan is in its' system the calf must come in contact with the parasite for it to develop immunity. When the Vecoxan has worn off it's the immunity of the animal that protects it. Mistime the administration and the Vecoxan is wasted.

Older animals tend to be less susceptible to coccidiosis but that's far from an absolute.

pakalasa

Once again it highlights just how important it is, to get the beastings into the newborn calf in the first few hours. Nothing like a healthy working immune system to keep sickness at bay.

delaval

You would get away with no feed for 3 days if beestings is got in in time

whelan1

a question for greysides, does it matter if the biestings that the calf gets in the first couple of hours is from a cow calved a day or so, does it have to be really fresh iykwim... like if i had a calf born this morning would it stil get all it needs from milk from a cow calved yesterday?

greysides

Off the top of my head, from work published through AHI, the immunoglobulin content of colostrum drops about 4% per hour. Six hours after calving one quarter of the antibodies are no longer present in the colostrum.

So in answer to the question, while it may be the best you can do it isn't going to be adequate. I'd use some artificial colostrum substitutes and then back it up with what you have available.

Found some info....... here.

After calving, dairy cows immediately start to produce large amounts of milk, which means that the colostrum is of poorer quality with every hour that passes between calving and first milking.

The second and subsequent milkings of a dairy cow contain less antibodies and should not be considered colostrum but as transition milk. Transition milk is milk that is not saleable from the first eight milkings.
Colostrum should not be mixed with transition milk and fed to new born calves.

Another point to note is this:

The quality of colostrum is defined by the concentration of antibodies. It can vary between cows.

In dairy cows the colostrum quality is lower in higher yielding cows. Holstein cows have the poorest quality colostrum within the dairy breeds.

This is a very important point to note this year for cows calving from now on as the pinch is really beginning to be felt.

In healthy beef cows the colostrum quality is usually good. Problems may arise if beef cows are undernourished before calving, e.g. if they are put on a straw only diet.

The document is well worth reading and in plain language for anyone who may not have read it.

whelan1

thanks, at what age would you give the first go of vecoxan, we used to give it at birth til vet said they are not born with it they meet it- so had wasted alot of money- now give it at ten days, should i be giving it earlier, normally give a second dose a week later

freedominacup

whelan1 wrote: »

thanks, at what age would you give the first go of vecoxan, we used to give it at birth til vet said they are not born with it they meet it- so had wasted alot of money- now give it at ten days, should i be giving it earlier, normally give a second dose a week later

I think there's a bit of an opening here greysides. A bit of online consultancy. I only want around a 5% retainer for the advice you can keep the rest:D.

In fairness you're a great asset to the forum, the oul píseogs don't have much chance when you're around.

beef burger

had to put a calf down with coccodiosis last year he came down with it at about 6 weeks old never had it before.got the vet out i thought was just a bad scour put it down to the weather at the time anyway his guts were only getten worse and he eventually put his back passage out. a very bad experience but we were told to dose calves with the vecoxon no earlier than 5 and a half weeks it worked on the rest of them after that last year so just wondering will i do the same this year or could i do it earlier.

greysides

Being lazy, I've pulled quotes from the Irish and British datasheets. They're like the instructions for a child's railway set that no one reads......... for the first hour.

This is the statement of what the product is licensed (read 'proven') to do.

To aid in the control of coccidiosis in calves caused by Eimeria bovis and Eimeria zuernii.

Note the difference when it comes to lambs:

For the treatment and prevention of coccidial infections in lambs caused in particular, by the more pathogenic Eimeria species E. crandallis and E. ovinoidalis.

Not sounding as positive in calves as lambs, at all!

1 mg diclazuril per kg body weight or 1 ml Vecoxan per 2.5 kg body weight, administered as a single dose, 14 days after moving into a potentially high risk environment. If a satisfactory response is not observed, then further advice should be sought from your veterinary surgeon and the cause of the condition should be reviewed. It is good practice to ensure the cleanliness of calf housing.

Note the mention of 'single dose'...... the literature goes on to later state:

Frequent and repeated use of antiprotozoals may lead to the development of resistance in the target parasite.

With only a single dose to be used (unless circumstances are such that the challenge is extreme) the timing is rather important, the British document states:

1 mg diclazuril per kg body weight or 1 ml Vecoxan per 2.5 kg body weight, administered as a single dose, 14 days after moving into a potentially high risk environment.

While the Irish datasheet says:

The preferred timing of treatment is directed by the known epidemiology of Eimeria spp. and the presence of coccidia in the flock or herd should be confirmed by faecal sampling prior to treatment, if there is no recent and confirmed history of clinical coccidiosis.

But fear not, it does work for a while:

Treatment with diclazuril causes interruption of the coccidial cycle and of excretion of oocysts for approximately 2 weeks. This allows the animal to bridge the period of decrease of maternal immunity (observed at approximately 4 weeks of age).

With this warning:

Diclazuril treatment will only have limited effect on the intestinal lesions caused by parasitic stages older than 16 days.

Generally, there is a pattern of disease noticed, either in relation to age of onset or to movement to a particular house. My advice is to give the Vecoxan a week before the earliest they normally show clinical disease or on moving to a known infected building.


A few other useful bits and bobs from the sheets:

Clinical coccidiosis generally occurs late in the parasite’s life cycle after most of the damage to the calf’s intestine has already been done. This severely damaged intestine can easily be infected by secondary bacteria and/or other agents. In cases of acute clinical coccidiosis treated with Vecoxan, fluid therapy is essential and the use of an antibiotic should be considered. Symptoms of clinical disease may remain obvious in some calves treated with Vecoxan, even though oocyst excretion is reduced to a very low level, and overall prevalence of diarrhoea is decreased.

Calves: in certain cases, only a transient reduction of oocyst shedding may be achieved.

Coccidiosis is an indicator of insufficient hygiene in the flock/pen. It is recommended to improve hygiene and to treat
all lambs in the flock and all calves in a pen.
.......
To alter the course of an established clinical coccidial infection, in individual animals already showing signs of diarrhoea, additional supportive therapy may be required as diclazuril has no antimicrobial activity.

A very good synopsis of the disease is available here.

Allow it a moment to load, depending on your download speed.

MOOVAN

beef burger wrote: »

had to put a calf down with coccodiosis last year he came down with it at about 6 weeks old never had it before.got the vet out i thought was just a bad scour put it down to the weather at the time anyway his guts were only getten worse and he eventually put his back passage out. a very bad experience but we were told to dose calves with the vecoxon no earlier than 5 and a half weeks it worked on the rest of them after that last year so just wondering will i do the same this year or could i do it earlier.

10 days old.
The leaflet says you must confirm a case of coccidiosis in the calves before treatment.Dung sampling might save a few bob.

Good loser

Yesterday found a yearling very thin in a pen of 20 and decided to take him out to a small grass paddock. When just out noticed he had a very loose, dark scour. Treated with 80 ml Vecoxan and today he has dried substantially.
Checked the tails of the remainder today and treated another.

whelan1

had vet out this morning doing wash outs etc , got her to look at my calves. she said they are flying:D took a sample of dung to do the 10 minute test, this will not do for coccidiosis but will check for rotavirus, crypto etc