Gun Licence

Tawny Owl

Hi I have a Club Member who is in the process of renewing his Gun Licence he has received a letter from the Club Secretary ME saying he is a fully paid up member for 2112 / 2013 season and has been shooting the land permissions for the last 30 years but the Garda are looking for a Pluse Gun Club number and a Farmers or Land owners amount of land with his application I have never heard of this before as a Member within a Gun Club and still a paid up member just gets a letter saying he is still a Club Member and presents his paperwork to his local FO can anyone throw some light on this.:rolleyes:

marty555

Hi tawny owl.
As a club secretary I have come across some of this over the last few months. In the north east of the country. If you are a member of a gun club and have insurance through the NARGC then your insurance number can go in section asking for a pulse number, the reason they allowed it is because this number stays with you for life. And again if your in a club ! Just the name of it should be enough. I stand to be corrected on this, but hope it helps.

Cass

The PULSE id number the Gardaí are looking for does not apply to game clubs. I assume that is what it is. If your club is for game only, and not target shooting (IOW anything that would be defined or covered under section 4A) then there is no PULSE id to give. Plus it costs €1,000. This is usually reserved for ranges, pistol clubs, and any club/range where target shooting takes place.

The fact that the Garda asked for acreage indicates he is not sure her/himself as it's either one or the other.

Have te lad tick the box under section 4.2 and write on a separate piece of paper the details of the club, copy of his membership card/insurance card for the game club. Attach this to the application.

As for acreage. There is no requirement to provide the amount of land only the amount of land permissions you have.

marty555

What your saying is right about the pulse number. But we are a game club and this is what they are excepting as an ID number. Again I'm in a few clubs and they are excepting the insurance card number instead.

Tawny Owl

marty555 wrote: »

Hi tawny owl.
As a club secretary I have come across some of this over the last few months. In the north east of the country. If you are a member of a gun club and have insurance through the NARGC then your insurance number can go in section asking for a pulse number, the reason they allowed it is because this number stays with you for life. And again if your in a club ! Just the name of it should be enough. I stand to be corrected on this, but hope it helps.

Thanks for the reply but I phoned the Garda Station and Garda who was very nice we are not members of NARGC but KWRGC I am going to phone them tomorrow as this all happened over this weekend hopefully I can get some answers and move this on quickly and with all parties getting what they want Garda and the Member of my Club

Cass

marty555 wrote: »

But we are a game club and this is what they are excepting as an ID number. Again I'm in a few clubs and they are excepting the insurance card number instead.

I started a game club, and never faced this because i made it clear to the Garda that it is not a prerequisite of any game club to have one. The copy of the insurance card, along with the game clubs name/details always done it. Still does.

Tawny Owl wrote: »

Thanks for the reply but I phoned the Garda Station and Garda who was very nice

Didn't finish this part lad. What did she say?

............. I am going to phone them tomorrow as this all happened over this weekend hopefully I can get some answers and move this on quickly .............

/ahem .............

Cass wrote: »

Have te lad tick the box under section 4.2 and write on a separate piece of paper the details of the club, copy of his membership card/insurance card for the game club. Attach this to the application..

Tawny Owl

Tawny Owl wrote: »

Thanks for the reply but I phoned the Garda Station and Garda who was very nice we are not members of NARGC but KWRGC I am going to phone them tomorrow as this all happened over this weekend hopefully I can get some answers and move this on quickly and with all parties getting what they want Garda and the Member of my Club

Thanks Cass I am trying to explain to the Garda this but he says he keeps presenting the Application to Garda Headquarters and they keep sending it back he has two more Months before his Licence is out and I phone and they keep returning the form.:(

Cass

Presenting it to Garda HQ, and they are demanding a PULSE id. I doubt any Garda would do this as licenses are granted at district level, and placed on PULSE at the same. Once the Super gives it the Okay the details are "passed", and an issue to print the licenses is sent.

Call the FPU. You cannot give what you do not have.

Tawny Owl

marty555 wrote: »

What your saying is right about the pulse number. But we are a game club and this is what they are excepting as an ID number. Again I'm in a few clubs and they are excepting the insurance card number instead.

He did prensent his Insurance Card and the Letter from me.

Cass wrote: »

I started a game club, and never faced this because i made it clear to the Garda that it is not a prerequisite of any game club to have one. The copy of the insurance card, along with the game clubs name/details always done it. Still does.

Didn't finish this part lad. What did she say?


/ahem .............

He said I have to produce a letter from a Farmer with land permission we have 40 land owners and also Coillte lands masive amount

Cass

In your OP you said the Garda wanted the amount of land. In acres? Or is it the amount of permissions?

Either way you are not obliged to give land estimates. This only applies to deer license. You need only give in a couple/few land owners consent. Even that is a push as the club carries this consent by being a club. If that makes sense.

To satisfy the Garda you can give in some land permissions the club has, but seriously i would call the FPU. Explain your situation to them, ans how you cannot provide what you don't have, and that some of the information being sought is not mandatory.

Tawny Owl

Cass wrote: »

Presenting it to Garda HQ, and they are demanding a PULSE id. I doubt any Garda would do this as licenses are granted at district level, and placed on PULSE at the same. Once the Super gives it the Okay the details are "passed", and an issue to print the licenses is sent.

Call the FPU. You cannot give what you do not have.

I have just spoke to the Club Member by phone he is shooting 50 yeras this is as I am saying not a new application but renewal I wiil tkae your advice and call FPU

Thanks for the imput cheers.

Cass

The fact it's a renewal is even worse. The FCR should be filled in already. All you should have to do is sign it and return it. Assuming no details have changed.


What did your club member say?

Tawny Owl

Cass wrote: »

The fact it's a renewal is even worse. The FCR should be filled in already. All you should have to do is sign it and return it. Assuming no details have changed.


What did your club member say?

He said he ticked all the boxes as normal and nothing else as he has done before he very Patient but very P####d off at what is going on I will do what I can tomorrow as Secretary of the Club after that I will let the KWRGC take it in hand Thanks for all the input.

Cass

Just to 100%. It was the pre-populated FCR he received, and not an FCA1 he filled in himself?

Tawny Owl

Cass wrote: »

Just to 100%. It was the pre-populated FCR he received, and not an FCA1 he filled in himself?

I would say its the normal renewel form I will ask before I start the phone calls tomorrow.

Cass

Do. the Gardaí are not accepting FCA1 forms for renewals. At all.

Only the pre-populated FCR forms. They will constantly refuse FCA1's if used to renew any licenses.

Tawny Owl

Cass wrote: »

Do. the Gardaí are not accepting FCA1 forms for renewals. At all.

Only the pre-populated FCR forms. They will constantly refuse FCA1's if used to renew any licenses.

Its the pre-populated FCR form renewal I was onto a Garda in FPU today and he gave me his name to contact the other Garda about this but I could start to write a book on this so far 24 hours trying to either catch a Garda on Duty while another is off Duty and one that know's what he is talking about and the other is not sure well I have to call again tonight and see where that leads us:(

Cass

Sorry, just getting around to this now.

If it's the FCR you should just have to sign the thing and send it back. Unless your details have changed.

Excuse my ignorance here, but i got my FCR's some months ago, signed them and sent them back so not 100% on them. There should be no ticking of boxes (to the extent of the FCA1).

So how in the hell is this Garda telling you that they are not accepting the details on the FCCR when it's the details they have listed for your member, that they granted the license for the first time. :mad::rolleyes:


Jesus. I mean seriously. Not getting at you, but that's beyond silly. I think it's a case of be more forceful. Know your rights, what is needed, and what is not, and go back again if you get no joy from other sources.

Tawny Owl

Cass wrote: »

Sorry, just getting around to this now.

If it's the FCR you should just have to sign the thing and send it back. Unless your details have changed.

Excuse my ignorance here, but i got my FCR's some months ago, signed them and sent them back so not 100% on them. There should be no ticking of boxes (to the extent of the FCA1).

So how in the hell is this Garda telling you that they are not accepting the details on the FCCR when it's the details they have listed for your member, that they granted the license for the first time. :mad::rolleyes:


Jesus. I mean seriously. Not getting at you, but that's beyond silly. I think it's a case of be more forceful. Know your rights, what is needed, and what is not, and go back again if you get no joy from other sources.

The problem is or where it starts is when all is done there is this section that has to be filled in on the computer in the Garda station and it needs the FO to have this section done or it will not let him / her proceed to the next box like a pulse number as some have said they sent in the Membership card number if this can be used then great it moves on if not the Super will return the form for that information by the way this application is not for me it's a Club member I have made so many calls to Garda stations but to be fair to both Garda I have been dealing with there very good in helping it the Computer system it should have a drop down box which will accept a
Membership number
A Pulse number if a Rifle or shooting Range
A Club number if a rough shooting Club

Happy days ahead not finished I will be on the drink before this is sorted:D:D:D

Cass

My point is why is this one causing so much grief? I have the same as does a load of lads i'd imagine, and have never had to deal with this.

The Garda says he needs to fill it in on screen. If it's the FCR it should be filled in already as the form is a copy of the information they have on record for the member. So if it's not on screen then it should not be on the FCR?

lapua20grain

if it is a renewal form was the original licence issued with the understanding that you were a member of a club? if so your pulse id on your licence should suffice as it is the pulse that is issued with the original licence and does not change. if all else fails contact the dept of justice firearms section as some gardai don't have a clue re firearms legislation they just facilitate the passage of the forms

Tawny Owl

lapua20grain wrote: »

if it is a renewal form was the original licence issued with the understanding that you were a member of a club? if so your pulse id on your licence should suffice as it is the pulse that is issued with the original licence and does not change. if all else fails contact the dept of justice firearms section as some gardai don't have a clue re firearms legislation they just facilitate the passage of the forms

If you read some of my posts I state the person is renewing his licence has shot the same ground for nearly 50 years I as Secretary have filled Club forms out stating this for other Club Members and will still do this till there Insurance is out when they dont renew there Insurance I will then send a letter to the Local FO informing him / Her that person is no longer a Member of the said Club I know about each Gun having a Pulse ID on each Licence But they will not accept this I dont think I need go as far as contacting the Department of Justice firearms section as these Garda are FO I will get it sorted but its something that I will bring up at a Regional Meeting to see if it can be sorted in a simple manner its starting to take up lots of my time I will be into day three tomorrow sorry about the long reply and I hope you dont think I am having a go at you but I am normally easy going it's getting funny at this stage :mad:

lapua20grain

Tawny Owl wrote: »

If you read some of my posts I state the person is renewing his licence has shot the same ground for nearly 50 years I as Secretary have filled Club forms out stating this for other Club Members and will still do this till there Insurance is out when they dont renew there Insurance I will then send a letter to the Local FO informing him / Her that person is no longer a Member of the said Club I know about each Gun having a Pulse ID on each Licence But they will not accept this I dont think I need go as far as contacting the Department of Justice firearms section as these Garda are FO I will get it sorted but its something that I will bring up at a Regional Meeting to see if it can be sorted in a simple manner its starting to take up lots of my time I will be into day three tomorrow sorry about the long reply and I hope you dont think I am having a go at you but I am normally easy going it's getting funny at this stage :mad:

i know the feeling i hold handguns and i am on my 4th FO myself and have had to enlighten each one on a lot of firearms legislation as they are only conduits to processing firearm certs they would not be as up to speed on legislation as most shooters they only forward to the local superintendent for appraisal that is why i suggested the dept of justice as they would have the definitive answer.

Tawny Owl

lapua20grain wrote: »

i know the feeling i hold handguns and i am on my 4th FO myself and have had to enlighten each one on a lot of firearms legislation as they are only conduits to processing firearm certs they would not be as up to speed on legislation as most shooters they only forward to the local superintendent for appraisal that is why i suggested the dept of justice as they would have the definitive answer.

Cheers I understand sorry if I had a rant if I was sitting in front of a computer and filling in Renewal forms and applications each day as a Garda even if it was for 2 hours of your Duty would it not make sence to highlight the same problems that I keep coming accross daily and see how we could sort these out to more effectively put the two hours to good use and not returning forms to have them presented to me another day anyway thanks for the tips and I may I hope not but may have to talk to that Justice Dept yet.