second hand smoke in bedroom

xiwang

Not sure if this is the right place to post but it affects my 10 week old so I think I should start here.

Basically the problem is my partner's smoking, he stopped smoking in the house but every time he sleeps in the bedroom at night I wake up with a headache. I am fairly sure this is a second-hand smoking headache, a thing I only learnt existed once I got pregnant. Now I am wondering if I get the headaches, how badly will it affect the wee man?

My partner suffers from depression-related sleeping problems and only started to sleep in the bedroom at night time about a week ago, and I am very happy that he seems to be on the way to normal sleeping hours and being awake during the day, so the last thing I want to do is make him feel bad for actually going to bed.

seamus

Unfortunately second-hand smoke is one of the causal factors for SIDS, so having a child sleeping in a room (and especially a bed) with a parent who smokes puts the child in the higher risk category for SIDS.

Thankfully the main issue is around the availability of oxygen/air, so simply improving the circulation in the room reduces the risk of SIDS and other breathing problems for the child (and probably yourself).

Ensure that the room is adequately vented (leave the windows on night latch if needs be) and/or put in some kind of fan to circulate the air in the room and you should find it improves for you.

iguana

You could also ask your partner to shower before bed and ensure that the clothing he was wearing while smoking are not left in the bedroom. That will reduce the smell considerably.

Peppa Pig

Is second hand smoke not the smoke you get when a smoker is actually smoking beside you?
Are you saying that he doesn't smoke in the house at all but you are getting a headache because of the smell off him and his clothes?
New one on me.

seamus

She is actually referring to third-hand smoke. Second-hand smoke is the smoke from the cigarette immediately exhaled by the smoker.

Third-hand smoke is lingering fumes and particles from clothes, skin, hair, breath etc of a smoker and has been shown to have harmful effects on babies in particular.
The problem is magnified when the child is sharing a room with the parent(s) because people often close doors and windows to keep the heat in, so the 3rd hand toxin emitted by the smoker build up in the room overnight. This effect is even more concentrated if the child is sleeping in the bed.

Anything which removes the toxins from the air is to be explored. As iguana says, if he showers and puts his clothes outside the bedroom before going to bed, most of the toxins will be removed. He should also avoid smoking in the 30 minutes before going to bed as relatively high levels of toxins continue to be breathed and sweated out by smokers in the minutes after finishing a cigarette.

As I mention above, ensuring that there is sufficient circulation in the room is also a good idea (even for non-smokers).

EireGreg

third hand smoke holy god think of the children. I myself hope third hand smoke gets banned from the workplace maybe a designated area where third hand smokers can go im very worried someone might make me a fourth hand smoker by bringing there third hand smoke around me

I know smokers scoff at third-hand smoke, but it is a very real issue. I have terrible allergies and get very, very sick from breathing in smoke on people's clothes or being in a room where someone has recently smoked. Full-on sinus headaches, breathing issues, the works. I just had a private class with a student in my spare bedroom, where I work, and she'd smoked before she came in. I had to open all the windows and the smell is still lingering and bothering my sinuses. No way at all would I want to expose a baby to this.

Orion

EireGreg wrote: »

third hand smoke holy god think of the children. I myself hope third hand smoke gets banned from the workplace maybe a designated area where third hand smokers can go im very worried someone might make me a fourth hand smoker by bringing there third hand smoke around me

It's fine not to agree with the concept but let's leave the sarcasm out of it please.

seamus

Just in the interests of the discussion

http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=what-is-third-hand-smoke

The fact is that tobacco has been linked as a major factor in SIDS, so people should do their utmost to avoid exposing their children to it, be that from first, second or third-hand sources.

Personally I don't understand how any modern parent can continue smoking when a child comes along, but then never having been a smoker I don't know how strong the urge to smoke is.

lazygal

I don't think its fair on children to smoke in the house full stop. Smoke lingers on cloths and furnishings and while adults might be happy to live with it children don't have the choice of living elsewhere or speaking out. Smoking should be done outside, full stop. We don't allow anyone to smoke in our house, even when its raining/snowing, and had the rule before baby.

Hannibal Smith

if your partner wears a jacket outside when smoking and takes it off when he comes back in, then washes his hands when he comes in...that should help a bit? I think theres advice out there that recommends you don't go near a child for 30 mins after smoking or something like that.

xiwang

thanks for all your replies, and thanks for clarifying that it is third-hand smoke rather than second-hand smoke.

I have the windows open during the day to make sure there is fresh air in the room, but will try and open them a bit at night as well. If that doesn't work I will use the fan.

I think he smokes without a jacket most of the time, but for now I am going to stress that he should wash his hands after smokes to start with and point him to the articles re SIDS and third-hand smoke. I don't think I'll get him to shower before bed, as I said it is relatively new that he manages to go to bed and we are a long way away from regular showers unfortunately, but I try suggesting it to him.

The little one is in his cot on my side of the bed, not on his side, so at least 1 meter away from him, and he is only sleeping in our bed very very rarely and never when OH is there, but there is still a lot of room for improvement. I obviously want the best for my kid but at the same time I don't want to loose the progress OH has made in terms of trying to get a normal sleeping pattern going.

Gee_G

xiwang wrote: »

thanks for all your replies, and thanks for clarifying that it is third-hand smoke rather than second-hand smoke.

I have the windows open during the day to make sure there is fresh air in the room, but will try and open them a bit at night as well. If that doesn't work I will use the fan.

I think he smokes without a jacket most of the time, but for now I am going to stress that he should wash his hands after smokes to start with and point him to the articles re SIDS and third-hand smoke. I don't think I'll get him to shower before bed, as I said it is relatively new that he manages to go to bed and we are a long way away from regular showers unfortunately, but I try suggesting it to him.

The little one is in his cot on my side of the bed, not on his side, so at least 1 meter away from him, and he is only sleeping in our bed very very rarely and never when OH is there, but there is still a lot of room for improvement. I obviously want the best for my kid but at the same time I don't want to loose the progress OH has made in terms of trying to get a normal sleeping pattern going.

I completely read that last paragraph wrong! I thought you meant your partner only sleeps in the bed when your oh isn't there ha ha
Also, try the little bottle of hand sanitisers after washing hands. In my job I find its the only thing that properly gets rid of smokey hands.

iguana

Does your baby use a dummy Xiwang? There is some evidence to suggest that a baby who sleeps with a smoker but uses a dummy as they fall asleep has a much lower SIDS risk than other babies who sleep with smokers. Breastfeeding to sleep also reduces the risk in a similar way as long as the baby is allowed to continue suckling even though they aren't actually drawing milk, as for some reason suckling as they fall asleep helps to protect against adverse conditions.

xiwang

sorry for this very late reply, I thought I had posted earlier but I must have timed out without noticing it. OH now undresses outside the room before going to bed and is washing his hands more often, also the room is aired frequently during the day and for a few minutes every time I get up at night after I feed the little man. OH is also smoking a little bit less and *thinking* about quitting. Iguana, he doesn't use a soother but he is breastfeed to sleep most nights, glad to read there is an added benefit to it other than him being easy when it's bed time.

Morph the Cat

EireGreg wrote: »

third hand smoke holy god think of the children. I myself hope third hand smoke gets banned from the workplace maybe a designated area where third hand smokers can go im very worried someone might make me a fourth hand smoker by bringing there third hand smoke around me

Their.

nesf

seamus wrote: »

Just in the interests of the discussion

http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=what-is-third-hand-smoke

The fact is that tobacco has been linked as a major factor in SIDS, so people should do their utmost to avoid exposing their children to it, be that from first, second or third-hand sources.

Personally I don't understand how any modern parent can continue smoking when a child comes along, but then never having been a smoker I don't know how strong the urge to smoke is.

Seamus, did you actually read that article? I know it's in SciAm, but the part about "no known link between third hand smoke and any disease" is kind of a give away that the conjecture below it is just conjecture and at best can just present a list of things for scientists to go out and test not actual health findings with THS.

The evidence gathering so far has not been massive. To my knowledge we are still at the stage where we're looking at in vivo testing of damage from particles and not looking at any actual epidemiological studies. Until the latter come out, we don't really know what risks are involved here.


The big thing to come out of most of the research so far is the focus not on the smoker who smokes outside and then comes in but smoking in rooms or cars when the kids aren't around. This is a problem, in that we're calling two very different things the same thing, and people are reporting "THS causes damage" without mentioning that the study only talked about the latter and not the former. The core difference is, if a smoker smokes and comes indoors they have particles on their clothing and skin and may emit them into the atmosphere. If on the other hand a smoker smokes in a car or room while the children are there they are depositing on all surfaces and on the dust in that room toxins from the cigarette smoke. Think about babies and toddlers crawling around said room the next morning putting their hands and toys from that room into their mouths and you see the problem. The key with any of this stuff is exposure level. Just because there are toxins does not immediately mean there is an actual problem here. It's the concentration of those toxins on surfaces and in the dust in the air that is important and that's partially why they are so focused on the smoking in rooms and cars when the kids aren't around. This leaves a lot more accessible toxins than someone coming in from a cigarette does.

And we're still at a point where it's just conjecture that this is going to be a problem I think, even though logically it might seem like an open/shut case with very young children involved.