New PC build [1000-1300 EURO]

heredith

Hi I am looking to get a new PC. The last time I built a PC was about 2004 so it's been a while. To be honest I am tempted to just buy a Dell to not bother going through the hassle, but from reading up about it on this site, you guys seem to be suggesting all the parts... My. biggest concern is that the components won't be compatible with each other.

Hi first time builder here. Looking for any advice you can give. Thanks!

1. What is your budget? [€1000-€1300] if this needs to be broken a little or even a bit more for something that really makes all the difference then I would consider that.

2. What will be the main purpose of the computer? [Gaming//Internet/Media hub,word processing etc] (Starcraft 2, COD, BF3, Crysis and CNC Generals 2 when that comes out!

3. Do you need a copy of Windows? [Yes] what's better Windows 7 or Windows 8?

4. Can you use any parts from an old computer? No

5. Do you need a monitor? Yes I was thinking of 1080p res being enough, unless people think otherwise... Was looking at the dell one for about 200 euro

5b. If no, what resolution is your current monitor and do you plan to upgrade in the near future? Actually, might look at getting a second monitor too, so need to incorporate a second port for the monitor, though if this adds a lot of cost let me know, and maybe I won't.

6. Do you need any of these peripherals? Keyboard/Mouse - is there anything else worth getting?

7. Are you willing to try overclocking? Not really... Again if its easy to do then so be it, but its not my thing anymore...

8. How can you pay? Bank Transfer/Laser and credit card...

9. When are you purchasing? [Probably in the next month or so]

Also big important factors for me if possible...

Quiet. A really quiet PC would be really good. This thing is in the living room area of the house and a big loud or even moderately noisy PC is out of the question.

Smaller form factor if possible and not some garish lights everywhere PC... Something simple and understated looks wise would be good. Maybe plain brushed aluminium or black etc...

I would like an SSD if possible in the budget... I like the sound of a quick boot up time!

Ok that's all. Sound a bit spoilt I'd say there... But just trying to get I. Everything that I am looking for.

Thanks... Looking forward to the feedback.

Serephucus

This is similar to a build I put together for someone a few days ago:

Item|Price
BitFenix Prodigy Mini-ITX Gehäuse - weiß, ohne Netzteil|€72.79
ASRock Z77E-ITX, Sockel 1155, ITX|€128.09
Intel Core i5-3570K Box, LGA1155|€199.81
Super-Flower SF450P14XE Golden Green Pro 80plus gold|€67.99
8GB Corsair ValueSelect PC3-10667U CL9-9-9-24|€39.00
Corsair Hydro Series H100i|€102.72
4 x Scythe GentleTyphoon 120 mm Lüfter 800 rpm|€47.96
Microsoft Windows 7 Home Premium 64-Bit (SB-Version)|€79.78
Dell UltraSharp U2312HM|€199.00
Gigabyte GeForce GTX 660 Ti Windforce 2X, 2GB GDDR5, 2x DVI, HDMI, DisplayPort|€249.77
Crucial M4 128GB SSD 6,4cm (2,5")|€99.63
Shipping|€18.99
Total|€1305.53

An overclockable processor and motherboard - OCing is extremely easy now-a-days, no excuse not to really
A very good, and quiet, CPU cooler
A very well regarded and small case - It's actually what I'll be switching to as soon as I can
A solid state drive - Will make the whole machine very snappy indeed, and makes no noise
A high efficiency power supply to keep noise down, and generally, why not?
A good graphics card with a quiet after market cooler
Much better fans - Extremely quiet for the air they push, meant as replacements for the H100i and stock case fans

Hope that helps.

heredith

Oh I meant to say the monitor should be about 23"

Serephucus

It is a 23" monitor.

heredith

Hi Serephucas... Didn't see your message there thanks for the quick reply... Will read through your options there...

Just wondering is that nvidia card much different to the non TI version in the Alienware x51 computer... Which I don't want to buy... By the way... But just catching up on my info all things computers lately...

Serephucus

http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/Gigabyte/GTX_660_OC/27.html

If you scroll down to the 1920x1200 section, you'll see the 660 (94%) then the 660 Ti (111%), so it's a good bit slower.

BloodBath

That's a great build. Cant' say I'd change much.

Just that is the German version of windows. Windows 8 has some nice features like ultra fast boot which gets boot times down to about 5 seconds from powering on compared to 10-12 seconds with W7. (with high speed ssd's)

Not really a big deal but still nice. The ui is the main problem and a lot of people don't like it but performance and feature wise it is the better os.

For €15 more this ssd is far superior and has a longer warranty.

http://lb.hardwareversand.de/Solid-State-Disk/67801/Samsung+SSD+840+Pro+128GB+SATA+6Gb+s.article

Since you're not getting a Hdd you might need a bigger ssd. The 256gb version of the same ssd which also happens to be faster and includes a free copy of Assassins creed 3.

http://lb.hardwareversand.de/Solid-State-Disk/67799/Samsung+SSD+840+Pro+256GB+SATA+6Gb+s.article

Serephucus

Yup, I have to say I'm actually quite jealous of that build. :P

Would have thrown it in (there actually was a 256GB SSD in there originally) but given his budget, and that the build doesn't include a keyboard or mouse, I left it at 128.

heredith

Thanks for all the advice! That's great...ok so would it be worth adding another 8 GB of ram to that to give 16GB? Looks like a reasonable price for another 8GB ram.

I was already looking at a 256 gb ssd ...thanks for that Samsung suggestion ... Will take that on board...just out of curiousity ... Why is the Samsung ssd hdd better than the Crucial?

I was thinking would it be worth going for an extra 1 or 2TB second hard disk drive for space...would it fit... Or at least if I knew it would fit I can get it in the future...

I know I'm going over my budget here but just exploring options... Hope that's ok.

heredith

Also actually, where would I get an English version of windows 7 or windows 8?

MiskyBoyy

I'm not an expert but apparently 8gb ram is enough for anything and is the optimum amount required for gaming.

Also, as far as I can see, that case has plenty of free drive bays so adding HDD's in the future shouldn't be a problem.

For English Windows, you can also get it from that same site:
http://lb.hardwareversand.de/OEM-Software/67054/MS+Windows+8+64bit+%28SB-Version%29+Englisch.article

heredith

http://lb.hardwareversand.de/OEM-Software/67052/MS+Windows+8+Pro+64bit+%28SB-Version%29+Englisch.article


http://lb.hardwareversand.de/OEM-Software/67054/MS+Windows+8+64bit+%28SB-Version%29+Englisch.article
Actually... Just found it after a little rooting around on that German site.

Should I get the pro version or the normal version... I presume I should go for the 64 bit or am I wrong?

Also just with regards to the last sentence on that list of components...

"Much better fans - Extremely quiet for the air they push, meant as replacements for the H100i and stock case fans"

Does that mean I get that scythe fans AND the h100i or I get the fans OR the h100i?

Thanks again for all your help!

MiskyBoyy

In regards to your choice of Windows 8 or Windows 8 Pro:

"Windows 8 Pro is comparable to Windows 7 Professional and Ultimate[4][5] and is targeted towards enthusiasts and business users; it includes all the features of Windows 8. Additional features include the ability to receive Remote Desktop connections, the ability to participate in a Windows Server domain, Encrypting File System, Hyper-V, and Virtual Hard Disk Booting, Group Policy as well as BitLocker and BitLocker To Go."

Unless you plan on using any of these features then save yourself the money and get the normal edition.

Yes, 64 bit.



Also, if you prefer the black version of that same case, here it is:
http://lb.hardwareversand.de/Mini/60296/BitFenix+Prodigy+Mini-ITX+Geh%C3%A4use+-+schwarz%2C+ohne+Netzteil.article

heredith

Thanks.

BloodBath

Does that mean I get that scythe fans AND the h100i or I get the fans OR the h100i?

I wouldn't use those fans on the h100i. They have virtually no static pressure which is important for pushing air through radiators and would make that h100i about as useful as the stock cooler only quieter.

I was already looking at a 256 gb ssd ...thanks for that Samsung suggestion ... Will take that on board...just out of curiousity ... Why is the Samsung ssd hdd better than the Crucial?

It has slightly faster reads, much faster writes and much faster random reads/writes. It's pretty much near the limits of sata 3. Drives won't get much better than this on sata 3.

Should I get the pro version or the normal version... I presume I should go for the 64 bit or am I wrong?

Noramal 64 bit version.

The black version of the case has a mesh front where as the white's is solid. The white should have better sound dampening where as the black should have better airflow.

Iamthepast

This is a build I put together recently:

Coolermaster HAF 922 Mid Tower Chassis

Asus SABERTOOTH Z77

Intel i7-3770K

XFX Radeon HD 7970 DD 3GB

Corsair Vengeance 8GB RAM

Coolermaster Hyper 212 EVO CPU Cooler

Seagate Barracuda 1TB 7200RPM

Corsair HX750 Professional Series

Microsoft Windows 7 Home Premium 64-bit

Samsung 24" LED Monitor(1920 x 1080 Full HD, 2ms, HDMI/VGA)

It's a little bit over your budget, about 1500 Euro or so via Amazon.co.uk but it is an absolute beast and future proof for a fair while to come.
Sadly I used a Sabertooth P67 I got last year, and the bloody thing is bust, have to RMA it

heredith

BloodBath wrote: »

I wouldn't use those fans on the h100i. They have virtually no static pressure which is important for pushing air through radiators and would make that h100i about as useful as the stock cooler only quieter.

Ok. So I'm a little confused about what I should do with regards to the fans and h100i cooler?

Do I need the fans suggested or what am I to do?

Also lets say then that I want to spend another 60 or 70 quid on a graphics card what would you suggest?

heredith

Iamthepast wrote: »

This is a build I put together recently:

Coolermaster HAF 922 Mid Tower Chassis

Asus SABERTOOTH Z77

Intel i7-3770K

XFX Radeon HD 7970 DD 3GB

Corsair Vengeance 8GB RAM

Coolermaster Hyper 212 EVO CPU Cooler

Seagate Barracuda 1TB 7200RPM

Corsair HX750 Professional Series

Microsoft Windows 7 Home Premium 64-bit

Samsung 24" LED Monitor(1920 x 1080 Full HD, 2ms, HDMI/VGA)

It's a little bit over your budget, about 1500 Euro or so via Amazon.co.uk but it is an absolute beast and future proof for a fair while to come.
Sadly I used a Sabertooth P67 I got last year, and the bloody thing is bust, have to RMA it

Thanks for this suggestion, but it looks a little on the big and loud side for me... Again... Thanks though.

Serephucus

If you go with the build I suggested (as regards fans) you'll get the H100i, and extra fans. The idea is that you take the H100i, throw away the stock fans, and use the extra ones in place of the stock ones.

You could add an extra 8GB of RAM if you wanted, but it's not really necessary. It's something very easily added in the future if you decide you need it, but 8GB is more than enough for gaming and anything else you might be doing with it for the moment (next couple of years)

The case does have space for mechanical drives. By default, it comes with space for five mechanical drives, and five SSDs. To get the graphics card to fit though you'll have to remove one of the drive cages, so that brings you down to two mechanical and five SSDs (still plenty). If you were to spend a bit of extra money on the GPU, I'd look at the GTX 670. The Gigabyte version that I chose is ideal because that's the type of cooler this case is designed to work with.

BloodBath

If you aren't going to overclock you could save €150-200 on that build and still keep it quiet.

Small form factor and silence don't exactly go hand in hand with overclocking but sereph's suggested part's are probably the best way to do it.

I'd also take a 7950 over a 660ti and 670gtx. It performs on par with the 670gtx and costs less.

Serephucus

I'd have to disagree there. It gets higher framerates, yes, but recent reviews have shown that AMD still haven't nailed down their frame latency problems. I'd take more consistent framerates over higher averages personally.

http://www.hardwarecanucks.com/forum/hardware-canucks-reviews/59785-nvidia-geforce-gtx-titan-6gb-performance-review-15.html

Not the best example, but it's the newest I could find, and probably one of the few using AMD's new drivers that supposedly patch the problem. Bearing in mind that Titan stutters quite a bit more than the 660 Ti/670/680.

BloodBath

Those benchmarks show varying frame latency across all cards. The 7970 performs better than the gtx 690 and titan in some and worse in others. It's all driver related and amd (and I'm sure Nvidia) are working on improving it in more and more games.

There is some chronic spiking in some.

13.2 driver's are still in beta though.

Serephucus

The 690 is a dual GPU card; I'd be worried if it didn't have latency problems compared to a single GPU. The titan is brand new and has more latency issues than the GK104 core cards.

You're right - It is driver related, and I'm sure both camps are working on solutions, it's just my personal preference to go with NVIDIA as they typically have less issues. I'd be especially inclined to go with NVIDIA given that the 600 series cards might very well see GPU Boost 2.0 functionality enabled in the near future, which would be a huge boost (no pun intended) in customisation, and performance.

BloodBath

Here's another recent article with more relevant 7970 vs 680gtx comparrisons. It's a mixed bag across games when it comes to frame latency. The amd cards are definitely behind though but it's really only an issue in a couple of titles.

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/geforce-gtx-titan-performance-review,3442-3.html

Serephucus

I'm not sure what you mean by mixed bag. In that link, of the six games they tested, the 7970 was worse than the 680 (mostly by a huge margin) in five. The exception being Borderlands 2.

BloodBath

I'm not sure what figures you are reading. If you think you can notice the difference between 4 and 6 ms then you have great eyes. Not even taking the triple monitor setups into the equation here.

They are so close in 4 that it would not be noticeable except for FC3 and WOW where the 7970 seems to be having issues.

It's ahead in borderlands 2 and bf3.

Serephucus

I'm looking at the consecutive frame latency charts. You're looking at framerates, by the sounds of things.

And it is something I notice. This is someone who's legally blind, my eyesight is that bad, an I notice that Borderlands 2 feels a bit... choppy, skittish, almost, to me on my 670, even though I'm getting a good framerate according to Afterburner. If I didn't know about frame latency, I couldn't nail it down to that, but I would be able to tell you that the game doesn't feel like it's running very well.

BloodBath

According to those charts at 1080p a 670gtx should be having no frame latency issues. Even at 1440p those latency figures are low enough to be a smooth experience unless it's spiking which we can't see in those charts. Unless bumping up the physx also bumps up the latency.

Serephucus

Agreed. In Borderlands 2 they're mostly even, I was just saying that it's the one example where the 670 fairs noticabely worse than the 7970. If you look at Far Cry 3 as an example though, the 7970 does a lot worse here. That's more representative of what the other titles show as well.

BloodBath

Not really, FC is the exception and the latency issue here is pretty awful and definitely noticeable. I really hope they fix this in the final 13.2 release.

heredith

Hi Bloodbath & Serephucus.

Ok so... re-read the thread. And just did some reading myself in places such as tomshardware etc...

I have a few questions:

1. The black case and the white case? You say the white one is better for sound reduction and the black one is better for airflow? Do you think if I went for the black one it would be a problem?

2. If I hold off on the 16GB and get only the 8GB Ram, I suppose I could get more if I need to in the future. Does this

3. Quote from Bloodbath about the fans:

BloodBath wrote: »

I wouldn't use those fans on the h100i. They have virtually no static pressure which is important for pushing air through radiators and would make that h100i about as useful as the stock cooler only quieter

This goes against the statement by Serephucus:

Serephucus wrote: »

If you go with the build I suggested (as regards fans) you'll get the H100i, and extra fans. The idea is that you take the H100i, throw away the stock fans, and use the extra ones in place of the stock ones.

So what should I do - I think if I was to go ahead with this build I am pretty much persuaded by Serephucus's first post on this thread, but after Bloodbath said that I just wanted to check?

4. Ok. Lots of talk here about GTX660ti, GTX670 and the ATI HD 7950, and the 7970... Did a bit of reading and it all seems pretty close to me in some areas. The way I look at it, the monitor I am buying is the one attached so the only performance I will be seeing will be on 1080p monitor... as I said if the GTX660ti is EUR250 (http://lb.hardwareversand.de/articledetail.jsp?aid=65488&agid=1156). I am willing to go to maybe 350 if its was worth it for a better card... however reading that you (Serephucus) said that you specifically picked the Gigabyte GTX660ti for the slection of my computer to do with the cooler working with the case... can you clarify that for me?

Serephucus wrote: »

...If you were to spend a bit of extra money on the GPU, I'd look at the GTX 670. The Gigabyte version that I chose is ideal because that's the type of cooler this case is designed to work with.

I am really sorry for all of the questions, and I know they may all seem like little nuanced things, but for me this is the only PC i'll be buying for the next 4 years at least and I just want to make sure that I understand what I am getting.

Again... really really really appreciate the help. There is no way I would be doing this if it wasnt for the help on this site... all the other blogs and reviews etc etc, get so confusing!