Why are shortened nationality names regarded as racist?

hatrickpatrick

This came up in a typically random hangover conversation the other day

Why is it considered offensive or racist to shorten the name of a race or nationality? For example, one does not simply use a word like "Paki" or "Jap" without being regarded as racist, but in fact the words are simply abbreviations of Pakistani and Japanese.

Contrast this with referring to English, Welsh or Scottish (mainly English) people as "brits" and it's not regarded as offensive at all, and is in fact used by British people all the time. "Scots" to refer to Scottish people isn't offensive either.

We had a couple of examples of other shortened nationality names which would be regarded as racist, but at the moment Jap and Paki are the only ones I can remember, I'll edit the post if any more of them come back to me. So why are they racist? Is it not more or less the same as calling a guy named Peter "Pete"?

ElleEm

I think it's cos those terms tend to be used by ignorant people who refer to anyone who from the Far East as a "Jap" cos of how they look, not because they are from Japan. The term "Paki" is usually used to describe people from the Middle East cos of the colour of their skin, not because they are from Pakistan.

So does that mean we're "Iri"?

frag420

What were the Poles doing during WW2??

Holding up the fences!!

Grayson

Because they're used in a deroatory manner.

Tom_Cruise

'Sand monkeys' is another term people from the desert lands do not like to be called.

Fizman

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

This came up in a typically random hangover conversation the other day

Why is it considered offensive or racist to shorten the name of a race or nationality? For example, one does not simply use a word like "Paki" or "Jap" without being regarded as racist, but in fact the words are simply abbreviations of Pakistani and Japanese.

Contrast this with referring to English, Welsh or Scottish (mainly English) people as "brits" and it's not regarded as offensive at all, and is in fact used by British people all the time. "Scots" to refer to Scottish people isn't offensive either.

We had a couple of examples of other shortened nationality names which would be regarded as racist, but at the moment Jap and Paki are the only ones I can remember, I'll edit the post if any more of them come back to me. So why are they racist? Is it not more or less the same as calling a guy named Peter "Pete"?

Nigeria may fall into that category!

Maybe they're just not great craic.

I think Argy is another one. It's odd in that only some people find it offensive, and others find it endearing.

BizzyC

It's all about how they've been used historically.

People don't commonly use the words "scot" or "brit" in a derogatory way, so they're not seen as offensive.

9959

Here we go, as the racists and latent racists awake from their slumber, like something from the 'Thriller' video, to regale us with with their unfunny jokes and mock earnest pleas of "What gives you the right to complain, if I choose to use hurtful and insulting language, I'm only asking a question".

clairefontaine

BizzyC wrote: »

It's all about how they've been used historically.

People don't commonly use the words "scot" or "brit" in a derogatory way, so they're not seen as offensive.

For some reason if it applies to teh anglo saxon nations, Brit, Yank, Aussie, people feel full permission to use them.

Any other nations are a no no.

Such is the nature of double standards.

To put it in another context if you called someone with a mental retardation a "retard" it's offensive because of the way the word has been used in other contexts

DazMarz

Historical reasons, mostly.

The expressions "Mick" and "Paddy" were often used to derogatorily refer to the Irish, but now not so much. Ditto with "Brit" and "Limey" for British people.

"Paki" and "Jap/Nip" are usually used with prejudice. Similar to "Chink", "Slope", "Gook", "Wog", etc. They have far longer lasting and negative connotations than others.

Same idea as calling German people "Krauts", "Huns" or "Nazis", or Spanish/Hispanic people "Spic". There is a historical, deeply offensive prejudice at work there, and they are usually used in a racist/prejudiced manner. Rarely as a term of affection/endearment.

orestes

BizzyC wrote: »

It's all about how they've been used historically.

People don't commonly use the words "scot" or "brit" in a derogatory way, so they're not seen as offensive.

People don't commonly use the word brit in a derogatory manner? I've been called a brit and a west-brit plenty of times because I'm half English, and I'm pretty sure it was never meant as a compliment.

It's not about the word, it's about the meaning and connotation of the word.

Guy:Incognito

Tom_Cruise wrote: »

'Sand monkeys' is another term people from the desert lands do not like to be called.

They should move out of sandmonkonia then.

CruelCoin

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

This came up in a typically random hangover conversation the other day

Why is it considered offensive or racist to shorten the name of a race or nationality? For example, one does not simply use a word like "Paki" or "Jap" without being regarded as racist, but in fact the words are simply abbreviations of Pakistani and Japanese.

Contrast this with referring to English, Welsh or Scottish (mainly English) people as "brits" and it's not regarded as offensive at all, and is in fact used by British people all the time. "Scots" to refer to Scottish people isn't offensive either.

We had a couple of examples of other shortened nationality names which would be regarded as racist, but at the moment Jap and Paki are the only ones I can remember, I'll edit the post if any more of them come back to me. So why are they racist? Is it not more or less the same as calling a guy named Peter "Pete"?

People only ever say paki when they are referring to someone who looks vaguely middle eastern. It's always said with a nasty racist tinge.

sbsquarepants

CruelCoin wrote: »

People only ever say paki when they are referring to someone who looks vaguely middle eastern. It's always said with a nasty racist tinge.

Not true.
It's just an abbreviation. I call people paki's on occassion and i wouldn't have any nasty racist leanings whatsoever.
It's like saying "we'll get a chinks tonight" it's no different to saying "we'll get a mackers" - it's not racist, it's just shortened speech. People are far too touchy about this stuff.

twinQuins

Fair enough but I think anyone with a bit of cop on would understand that in common parlance it still has racist tones, whether you personally don't use it as such or not.

ElleEm

sbsquarepants wrote: »

Not true.
It's just an abbreviation. I call people paki's on occassion and i wouldn't have any nasty racist leanings whatsoever.
It's like saying "we'll get a chinks tonight" it's no different to saying "we'll get a mackers" - it's not racist, it's just shortened speech. People are far too touchy about this stuff.

If I heard you saying this, I would think otherwise.
Are you calling people "Paki" as an abbreviation for their country of origin (which you know as a fact), or are you calling any dark- skinned person a "Paki"?

mackeire

What do people from Mongolia not like to be called?

looksee

The term Brit was originally intended to be offensive but the Brits took the sting out of it by using it themselves, so now everyone assumes it is harmless.

Its all to do with intention, and most of these terms were originally intended to be offensive, but they are only offensive if you accept them as such.

If you have no problem about calling someone a Paki then you should have no problem being called a Paddy or a Mick. Some Irish people will be offended at being called Paddy or Mick, and similarly some Pakistanis will object to being called Paki. So unless you want to cause offense, you avoid all of them.

My husband was a french teacher in a small town school, so inevitably he was called Froggy. Our kids went to the same school so they were called frogspawn, and I heard myself referred to as Mama Tadpole, which I though was very funny, so any intention to be offensive (which there was not) was totally wasted.

TheLastMohican

mackeire wrote: »

What do people from Mongolia not like to be called?

Magnolias?

RobbingBandit

Tom_Cruise wrote: »

'Sand monkeys' is another term people from the desert lands do not like to be called.

recylingbin

mackeire wrote: »

What do people from Mongolia not like to be called?

horseback chinks?

desertcircus

clairefontaine wrote: »

For some reason if it applies to teh anglo saxon nations, Brit, Yank, Aussie, people feel full permission to use them.

Any other nations are a no no.

Such is the nature of double standards.

Anti-white racism: the fault of the Thais, Uzbeks, Tajiks, Kurds, Afhgans, and Swiss. Bloody Swiss.

desertcircus

Also the Serbs, Croats, Finns, Danes, Turks, Kazakhs, etcetera.

Tom_Cruise

TheLastMohican wrote: »

Magnolias?

Mongos

sbsquarepants

ElleEm wrote: »

If I heard you saying this, I would think otherwise.
Are you calling people "Paki" as an abbreviation for their country of origin (which you know as a fact), or are you calling any dark- skinned person a "Paki"?

I would use it to describe someone who i knew, or at least assumed to be pakistani, ie "where is so and so from? He's a paki" I'd use it the very same way i'd use brit or yank, geography being the only difference in intent.

quad_red

clairefontaine wrote: »

For some reason if it applies to teh anglo saxon nations, Brit, Yank, Aussie, people feel full permission to use them.

Any other nations are a no no.

Such is the nature of double standards.

Call someone from the Southern states of the US a yank and you'll know all about it!

sbsquarepants

looksee wrote: »

If you have no problem about calling someone a Paki then you should have no problem being called a Paddy or a Mick. Some Irish people will be offended at being called Paddy or Mick, and similarly some Pakistanis will object to being called Paki. So unless you want to cause offense, you avoid all of them.

I for one have no problem whatsoever being called a paddy or a mick. It's all down to intent, people can and regularly do call you allsorts and mean no offence. Similarly you can be called sir, while being looked down on.
The meaning is every bit as much in the speaker as in the word spoken.

Hoop66

mackeire wrote: »

What do people from Mongolia not like to be called?

Bastards?

9959

sbsquarepants wrote: »

I would use it to describe someone who i knew, or at least assumed to be pakistani, ie "where is so and so from? He's a paki" I'd use it the very same way i'd use brit or yank, geography being the only difference in intent.

"Where's so and so from?"
"He's a Paki"

Why not try this:

"Where's so and so from?"
"Pakistan"

There you go, no convoluted language, no offence caused, and you've saved yourself a syllable.

Spook_ie

CruelCoin wrote: »

People only ever say paki when they are referring to someone who looks vaguely middle eastern. It's always said with a nasty racist tinge.

Bit of a generalization there, there's a popular restaurant in Malahide,
http://www.kajjal.ie/ it's often referred to as the Paki Restaurant, rather than the Pakistani restaurant, pretty sure nothing racist is being inferred there, just laziness in using the full name

Spook_ie

9959 wrote: »

"Where's so and so from?"
"He's a Paki"

Why not try this:

"Where's so and so from?"
"Pakistan"
Pakiland
There you go, no convoluted language, no offence caused, and you've saved yourself a syllable.

Still saves a syllable but yeah, the problem is with the way different people interpret racism, someone was saying that Brit isn't racist, I often get called a ****in Brit because of my accent, yeah it can be racist, but it's all to do with context

sbsquarepants

9959 wrote: »

"Where's so and so from?"
"He's a Paki"

Why not try this:

"Where's so and so from?"
"Pakistan"

There you go, no convoluted language, no offence caused, and you've saved yourself a syllable.

Why not have the option of both?

CruelCoin

Spook_ie wrote: »

Bit of a generalization there, there's a popular restaurant in Malahide,
http://www.kajjal.ie/ it's often referred to as the Paki Restaurant, rather than the Pakistani restaurant, pretty sure nothing racist is being inferred there, just laziness in using the full name

I'm going to throw the ring out there and say that a Pakistani restaurant based outside knackerville would not be called "the paki restaurant".

Edit: ok, i'm sure they would, but still, not good mmmkay?

9959

Spook_ie wrote: »

Bit of a generalization there, there's a popular restaurant in Malahide,
http://www.kajjal.ie/ it's often referred to as the Paki Restaurant, rather than the Pakistani restaurant, pretty sure nothing racist is being inferred there, just laziness in using the full name

Looks like a nice place, I wonder would it be too difficult to refer to it as 'Kajjal'?

longhalloween

Don't forget the Spicks

dr.bollocko

Jesus ****ing christ.