Crazy child maintenance!

Pebbles!

Just wondering how much is the average child maintanence? My partner is seperated from his wife, has 2 kids. He is currently paying over €1500 per month, half is to cover the mortgage. They are planning to sell the house so we are wondering what should he pay after that, they will both have a loan due to negative equity. We were thinking €600 per month, but I think she will be looking for between €800-€1100.

Be well and win

if he is paying 1500 a month and half of that is to cover the mortgage, it means he's paying €750pm in maintenance. Even after selling the house the the kids will still have to live somewhere so I'm not clear why you think the maintenance should be reduced even further to 600

Pebbles!

As by selling the house (downsizing) bills- oil/ESB are straight away reduced. they both have rent each month but she should be able to cover her own rent then as he is covering his.

Is €300/€350 per month per child a reasonable figure? He will give whatever she wants as he still wants his kids to have the best. But we just want to know what other people are giving.

wolfpawnat

In the courts it is means tested. But to avoid that route a reasonable sum for both parties is necessary. To be honest I can't see what in the world two children would need €750pm for.

That would cover their food, clothes and everything single handedly IMO it is supposed to be half and half. But if you kept it at that, you are still halfing your partners spending once the house is sold.

Pebbles!

wolfpawnat wrote: »

In the courts it is means tested. But to avoid that route a reasonable sum for both parties is necessary. To be honest I can't see what in the world two children would need €750pm for.

That would cover their food, clothes and everything single handedly IMO it is supposed to be half and half. But if you kept it at that, you are still halfing your partners spending once the house is sold.

I think the same but then again I don't have kids. She has sat down and went they the figures & claimed she needed that to get by. I think it's to cover part of the household bills, but he also has his own bills now also. He has rent/ESB etc. Childcare is a big expense also so I guess a lot of the maintenance is going on that.

She is on an extremely good salary so our opinion was if the house was downsized & bills reduced surely the maintenance could be reduced also?

Stheno

Pebbles! wrote: »

I think the same but then again I don't have kids. She has sat down and went they the figures & claimed she needed that to get by. I think it's to cover part of the household bills, but he also has his own bills now also. He has rent/ESB etc. Childcare is a big expense also so I guess a lot of the maintenance is going on that.

She is on an extremely good salary so our opinion was if the house was downsized & bills reduced surely the maintenance could be reduced also?

In the district court, the guidelines are up to €150 per week per child, and up to €500 per week for spousal maintenance. So doing basic maths, the most the district court will award per child on a monthly basis is €650 per month which is fairly rare though. http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/birth_family_relationships/separation_and_divorce/maintenance_orders_and_agreements.html

It is based on both spouses means, you might be best off encouraging him to attend mediation with her to work it out as a start. If it goes to court, both parties must disclose details of all of their finances and the judge awards after considering everything.

ash23

If she has a salary then she is working I assume? Are the children in childcare? If so, half that cost is his to cover and half is hers. Add half the mortgage to that and it's easy enough to see where the sums add up.

There is a spreadsheet on solo.ie to work out a childs costs giving an idea of the total costs for a child.

http://www.solo.ie/downloads/Weekly%20Expenditure%20Blank.xls

I think if childcare is an expense then 600e for 2 children is very low.

It also depends on his earnings and expenditure. If he has a good wage he will be expected to pay more than someone who is on a low wage. If he has the children often his maintenance should reflect that also (higher the less he has them).

Just from the opposite point of view, I can't share a house because I have a child. I have to have 2 bedroom minimum, factor in location (schools, childcare etc) plus how safe an area is. So where I used to be able to rent a cheap room in a cheap place and not worry too much about amenities and location, now I have to carefully pick where to live. And usually pay more for it.

Also, are you and your partner living together? Is the mother living alone? If so, his rent and bills are halved whereas if she has the kids the majority of the time, hers are doubled.

Then there is all the additional expenses. Lessons, clothes, health insurance, medications, school trips, friends birthday parties, book fairs, bake sales aswell as the obvious clothes, shoes, education etc.

These tend to be the costs people don't think of when thinking about maintenance as they're the "hidden" costs that come in the schoolbag now and then. And the older the kids get, the more expensive they tend to get.

300 a month per child seems fair enough but perhaps childcare should be in addition to that. Again though, it depends on what he is earning. Her salary isn't really a factor. It's about working out the costs for the kids and splitting it in half and him paying as much (preferably all) of his half while being able to live off what he has left.

velosolex

Ash23, the solo.ie site seems to be 10 years out of date, anyone know of an alternative site?

ash23

The spreadsheet is an excel sheet though so i can't really be out of date. A person can adjust it to add in other expenses not mentioned.
It also has forms and figures for 2012.

The Big Red Button

Stheno wrote: »

In the district court, the guidelines are up to €150 per week per child, and up to €500 per week for spousal maintenance. So doing basic maths, the most the district court will award per child on a monthly basis is €650 per month which is fairly rare though. http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/birth_family_relationships/separation_and_divorce/maintenance_orders_and_agreements.html

But those are weekly rates? So wouldn't the max amount per month be a lot more than that? (Though, as you said, I would imagine they rarely award the max.)

Stheno

atheists ate my baby wrote: »

But those are weekly rates? So wouldn't the max amount per month be a lot more than that? (Though, as you said, I would imagine they rarely award the max.)

Read the post again, I said weekly €150 max. per child which equates to a max. of €650 per month per child.

pwurple

Just to throw in, in a mortgage application, each child is assumed to cost 500 euro a month. So they assume two children would be costing 1000 per month, on top of a mortgage.

iguana

Stheno wrote: »

Read the post again, I said weekly €150 max. per child which equates to a max. of €650 per month per child.

So that's a maximum payment of roughly €3500pm that could be awarded to an ex-wife and two children.

The Corinthian

iguana wrote: »

So that's a maximum payment of roughly €3500pm that could be awarded to an ex-wife and two children.

In the district court. If maintanence is sought in the higher courts, the limits become higher, and in the high court, there is no limit.

Of course, for the vast majority of people, it never gets beyond the district court, or even the limits imposed by the district court.

velosolex

My partner is seeking maintenance presently, we have 3 kids 10 to 16 years, we are separating and still live acrimoniously in the same house, I pay all utility bills as well as buy food of approx. €140 p.w. I eat approx. €20 p.w of this food - I feed my self in work. No mortgage outstanding. My income is €425 p.w. and my ex. has an income of €410 p.w. The maintenance sought relates to kids only as we are not married, she pays for the pets, the kids clothing and school costs. What should I offer as a maintenance figure if anything?

wolfpawnat

velosolex wrote: »

My partner is seeking maintenance presently, we have 3 kids 10 to 16 years, we are separating and still live acrimoniously in the same house, I pay all utility bills as well as buy food of approx. €140 p.w. I eat approx. €20 p.w of this food - I feed my self in work. No mortgage outstanding. My income is €425 p.w. and my ex. has an income of €410 p.w. The maintenance sought relates to kids only as we are not married, she pays for the pets, the kids clothing and school costs. What should I offer as a maintenance figure if anything?

If you are living in the same house then surely you can come to an agreement, bills and food for the children should all be halved, she and you should pay for your own, milk and whatnot go under the shared. All costs for the children should be halved. Clothes, school outings etc. Other than that she would need nothing for their rearing if you insist in paying half of their bills, which to me is the fairest option since you are on similar incomes.

I can imagine it is very hard being in the same house these days, hopefully relations will get more friendly after a while.

velosolex

wolfpawnat wrote: »

If you are living in the same house then surely you can come to an agreement, bills and food for the children should all be halved, she and you should pay for your own, milk and whatnot go under the shared. All costs for the children should be halved. Clothes, school outings etc. Other than that she would need nothing for their rearing if you insist in paying half of their bills, which to me is the fairest option since you are on similar incomes.

I can imagine it is very hard being in the same house these days, hopefully relations will get more friendly after a while.

Yes your suggestion for sharing house utility bills, pets and child costs is reasonable. My ex. recently produced, as justification for the maintenance claim, an expenses sheet outlining the costs for 3 kids and pets, excluding food or holidays of €16000 p.a. I think this is excessive. No chance of relations improving unfortunately, even for the sake of our children.

wolfpawnat

velosolex wrote: »

Yes your suggestion for sharing house utility bills, pets and child costs is reasonable. My ex. recently produced, as justification for the maintenance claim, an expenses sheet outlining the costs for 3 kids and pets, excluding food or holidays of €16000 p.a. I think this is excessive. No chance of relations improving unfortunately, even for the sake of our children.

What is she saying costs that much for the children and dogs? that is 153 (16,000/2 then divided by 52) for three teenagers and dogs, but what does that include? I cannot see what that would be without food, do they require a carer after school or is that including private healthcare? There are some things that come up and cost money, I can imagine clothing three kids isn't easy, but as I said that is for both of you to contribute to, has she included that?

If you decide to start paying her money, put it into her bank account DO NOT pay it to her directly, she could claim you never gave it then (seldom happens, but it could), if you lodge it, her bank statement and your dockets will prove otherwise.

Also if she goes on a holiday, that's her choice, I can imagine you would give the kids money, but you are not duty bound to fund her holiday if you are separated.

January

No legal advice. Speak to a legal professional such as FLAC or your solicitor.