1700 euro first build

KD11

Hey, So my 300 euro laptop just crapped out and iv decided to buy a desktop instead and reading other threads on here and pretty much everywhere else, building it yourself seems to be the only way to go.

Budget was between 1300 and 1500 for the rig and around 300 for the monitor. Its mostly going to be used for movies, AutoCAD, some CATIA V5 and I also wanted a decent gaming PC. I wont be upgrading anything for at least three years so I wanted to get it as good as possible now and not have to worry about upgrading in a year. Three days of research later and this is what iv finally settled on. Im happy enough with it but I wanted to check with you guys here first before I buy it since boards has been a huge help in choosing the parts.

Case: Fractal Design R4 £80
CPU: i5 3570K £175
MoBo: ASUS P8Z77-V £130
GPU: ASUS 2GB GTX 670 £312
Optical Drive: Pioneer Bluray BDRS07XLT £64
HDD: Seagate 1TB Barracuda £54
SSD: Crucial M4 128GB £80
PSU: Corsair 650W 80plus gold £100
RAM: Corsair Vengeance 1600 (2x8gb) £75
O/S: WIN7 PRO 64 BIT £107
CPU fan: ARCTIC COOLING FREEZER 13 £21
Monitor: DELL U2412M £221
Total: £1473
(~1726 EURO)

After pricing around Scan.co.uk turned out to be cheaper than HWVS so I think ill go with them. Has anyone bought a hardware bundle of them? i.e they assemble the CPU, RAM, Fan and MOBO and do a soak test on it, which im guessing is like a stress test, and optimize the BIOS, then deliver it. Anyway does anyone have any suggestions/ideas for the build, Is it balanced? Are there bottlenecks anywhere? Is 650W enough? Thanks for the help.

Serephucus

Looks good. You don't need 650W though, 550W would still leave plenty for overclocking as well. I'd maybe spend a bit more on the cooler. The Freezer 13 is fairly average. Maybe an AIO liquid cooler (Corsair H80, Swiftech H220, etc.)? or a better air cooler, like Noctua's NH-D14.

BloodBath

I'd maybe spend a bit more on the cooler. The Freezer 13 is fairly average. Maybe an AIO liquid cooler (Corsair H80, Swiftech H220, etc.)? or a better air cooler, like Noctua's NH-D14.

Why bother when it will make 0 difference to your overclocking potential with Ivy's. 3570k's will overclock the same with a cheap ass 212 evo as they will with expensive water loops.

Unless you are willing to delid and replace the crappy thermal compound then it's a pointless waste of money. Even then you might get 200mhz max over a quality budget air cooler.

It's a nice build but the price seems a little high. I'm sure it could be built cheaper on hwvs. I'd go with a 7950 over the 670gtx. The cards are pretty close to each other. The 7950 is just quite a bit cheaper.

I'd replace the artic cooler with a coolermaster hyper 212 evo. A better cooler for around the same price.

I'd go with an Asrock pro4 motherboard as well. Quality board for a budget price.

16gb of ram is overkill as well. 8gb is more than enough for now. I don't think auto cad or 3d modelling is that memory hungry.

Serephucus

BloodBath wrote: »

Why bother when it will make 0 difference to your overclocking potential with Ivy's. 3570k's will overclock the same with a cheap ass 212 evo as they will with expensive water loops.

Unless you are willing to delid and replace the crappy thermal compound then it's a pointless waste of money. Even then you might get 200mhz max over a quality budget air cooler.

Not the case. As this thread indicates, most people can only get between 4.4-4.5 with the Evo. With my water loop, I'm sitting at 4.6 with temps between 66 and 70° under Prime. 10°C lower temps with .1GHz more. And it's quieter. I agree a good air cooler would get close, but the 212 Evo isn't a good air cooler. It's just not in the same league as something like the D14.

BloodBath wrote: »

16gb of ram is overkill as well. 8gb is more than enough for now. I don't think auto cad or 3d modelling is that memory hungry.

It's not, they do.

BloodBath

Serephucus wrote: »

Not the case. As this thread indicates, most people can only get between 4.4-4.5 with the Evo. With my water loop, I'm sitting at 4.6 with temps between 66 and 70° under Prime. 10°C lower temps with .1GHz more. And it's quieter. I agree a good air cooler would get close, but the 212 Evo isn't a good air cooler. It's just not in the same league as something like the D14.

Guess what. That's the exact same overclock and temps I get with my 212 evo.

I have overclocked three 3570k's now. Two using 212 evos and 1 using that artic 13 cooler. All have overclocked to 4.6ghz. Both the 212 evos are maxing at 70c. The artic is maxing at 75c. Granted the case's they are in have good airflow but it's the exact same as your waterloop.

The problem is 3570k's are terrible at dissipating heat because of the crappy thermal compound that's between the core and the ihs. If we were both to remove and replace it with a quality compound my temps would drop by 10-15c and yours would drop maybe 20-25c.

Unless you are willing to do this then there is no difference.

Serephucus

I'm well aware of Ivy's limitations (I've been considering delidding for a while myself). I stand by what I've said though; water will do better (and this is more pronounced the higher you go) than air for a given overclock, and be quieter doing it. Granted, it's quite a bit more, and €/OCed GHz, it's not nearly as good value as a decent air cooler, but I'm just giving the OP options.

Also, proof? :P

BloodBath

Normally you would be right but in the case of 3570k's I don't think it applies. Your water cooling setup is probably rated for 200-250+ TDP. It's probably at least twice to 3 times as good as the evo yet it still can't keep that 3570k much cooler.

Delidding is so damn risky as well. Is it worth killing your cpu for maybe an extra 200-300mhz? Screw intel for putting that crap gunk in there. They make enthusiast overclocking chips and throw cheap ass compound in there.

Ok I'll throw a screenshot up in a bit.

Serephucus

It's more for the temps that I'd be doing it. Most people only see 20°C drops in the 4.8+ range, but I'd still expect a healthy 10° drop where I am. The only real reason I'm hesitant is selling it on. Would people buy a CPU with no warranty? Then again, how often to CPUs really fail, and anyone into OCing would probably sooner buy a known working delidded chip than risk doing it themselves. Let me know if I've got that ass-backwards.

I realise the full benefit of water isn't been seen with the chip, but it would still help. If nothing else (assuming custom loop) he could also add his graphics card in and get a huge boost in performance that way, and still have a very quiet rig.

BloodBath

Sorry for hijacking your thread, here's a screeny of a short test.

Ok, I lied, it's 71c.

Serephucus

Nice. Notice though that your fan speed is 1500RPM. Mine is only about 600. To me a 1500RPM fan sounds like a truck. It's not the same for everyone I know, but something to consider.

BloodBath

Well yes. There is a quiet hum off of my machine but that was always going to be there unless I spent a fortune.

I'd have to watercool everything in a silent case with a silent/quiet psu to get rid of that small hum.

Compared to my last pc it's so damn quiet so I don't mind. Considering the amount of fans on the go in there it's actually really quiet.

KD11

Thanks, I had looked at the asrock pro4, it's a good board but a bit too low budget. the Cpu and board will definitely be the last parts upgraded so i dont mind spending a bit more on them, plus i also like the look of the p8z77-v more.

I had planned on just using the stock CPU fan supplied but the bundle I bought included the arctic freezer 13, it cost around 20£ to assembly and test the board, ram and CPU, is this worth the money? I don't have a clue when it comes to using BIOS plus at least the parts won't be DOA. I'm not planning on overclocking for a good while yet so ill look at better cooling then.

I can't find a good 550w 80plus gold on scan, anyone recommend a decent one? The 650w might be overkill alright.

Your right about the 7950, think I might change that, it's about 50euro cheaper. The exact same build above is 50-60euro dearer on hwvs including delivery and windows is in German.

And I'd prefer to keep the 16gb ram, it's not too much dearer and better to have it and not need it as they say.

Serephucus

Ah, now let me show you something. The 70°C temps I was talking about was after twenty four hours of Prime. After about the same amount of time you ran it for, my temps are significantly lower.

I admit, they're not as good as what you'd get with a H100, but they are more representative of what's possible.

Edit: RE PSU, this is a very good one
http://www.scan.co.uk/products/550w-seasonic-g-550-modular-80-plus-gold-eps-12v-quiet-fan-atx-psu

BloodBath

Good stuff. That artic cooler will be good for at least 4.5ghz anyway.

I would say build it yourself so you know how to do it. It's really easy and there's a sense of achievement from it. If you don't have the time or the desire then £20 is reasonable for a pre build and testing.

I wasn't gonna wait 24 hours to post a screenie. It might creep up to 75c by then. Your one is a fair bit lower but the overclock is still the same.

Mine can do 4.5 at .1 volts less which drops temps by 10c which is what I prefer to run it at. .1v is a bit much for 100mhz.

KD11

I'll be building it myself, looking forward to that part. They just assemble the CPU and board, test it and deliver it separately.

KD11

This is what I went with in the end.

Case: Fractal Design R4 £79.99
CPU: i5 3570K £175
MoBo: ASUS P8Z77-V £130
GPU: ASUS 3GB Radeon 7950 £263
Optical Drive: Pioneer Bluray BDRS07XLT £64
HDD: Seagate 1TB Barracuda £54
SSD: Crucial M4 64GB £55.97
PSU: Seasonic 650W 80plus gold £93
RAM: Corsair Vengeance 1600 (2x8gb) £75
O/S: WIN7 home premium 64 BIT £72
CPU fan: ARCTIC COOLING FREEZER 13 £21
Monitor: DELL U2412M £221
Total: £1380 (1600 EURO)

If anyones interested Scan are doing a good deal with the 7950 GPU + 4 free games: Bioshock Infinite, crysis 3, Sleeping dogs and Far Cry 3

Serephucus

That's not Scan, that's AMD.

KD11

My bad, still good though