Classic Cars- lower rate of road tax ?

RATM

Just looking to get some knowledge from posters here. I'm thinking of changing my car this year. Thing is I drive a motorbike 80-85% of the time and only really use the car when it is lashing rain or else for long journeys' I probably use it less than 50 days the entire year and barely manage to do 1,500 miles annually in it.

So although I want to keep owning a car for those wet cold days or longer journeys at the same time I want to reduce my costs of ownership as much as possible. So a mate suggessted a classic car. I understand they attract a lower rate of insurance- can anyone give ball pak details on this ?

And do they attract a lower rate of road tax ? It seems pointless of me to buy a 1970's 2.0l Merc or similar if I'm going to get stiffed for the best part of €1000 to tax it for the sake of 50 days driving a year.

Neilw

To get a classic insurance policy they usually require you to have a daily driver, if they accept your bike policy I wouldn't know.

For classic tax the car needs to be 30 years old, the rate is €56.

djimi

Bear in mind the maintenance costs on a classic car could well outweigh the savings made from classic car tax/insurance.

superfly35

You could probably get Carol Nash to get you a price if you have a bike with, or First Ireland.
If you are on the 30 years old car, the thing to watch out really is rust, and go for a maintain car.

I do have a bike like and with my car like you do with yours, and my car is a classic and one of the reason is the running cost (insurrance + tax).
Depending on what you want for a car, think about the petrol as 30 years old car can do 10L/100km depending on the car of course.

Capri

I know this is probably heresy :eek: but have you considered gocar.ie http://www.gocar.ie/ or renting when you need it or taking a taxi

'A classic is for life, not just when you need it , or to get around the tax system ' - it requires constant maintainence etc, maybe a Polo 1.0 or similar would end up costing you the same , cheapest tax/insurance in this overtaxed land

superfly35

Another option you could have is to take on a non-classic car, and convert it as a van or get one like that directly I think the van tax is about €300.

As i said early on, maintenance and all you need to chose the right car.

w124man

superfly35 wrote: »

Another option you could have is to take on a non-classic car, and convert it as a van or get one like that directly I think the van tax is about €300.

Only if you are VAT registered ...... Driving a commercial for private use is illegal these days.

monkeynuz

w124man wrote: »

Only if you are VAT registered ...... Driving a commercial for private use is illegal these days.

You don't need to be vat registered for van tax but you do need to sign a declaration at your Garda station that it will be for commercial use only. Obviously not all tradesmen are vat reg.

Hope this helps.

M.

cocobear

Neilw wrote: »

To get a classic insurance policy they usually require you to have a daily driver, if they accept your bike policy I wouldn't know.

For classic tax the car needs to be 30 years old, the rate is €56.

The law was changed in 2011, the 30 year rule no longer applies to qualify for classic /Vintage road tax. Only pre 1981 vehicle now qualify, post 1981 require full road tax and NCT every year.

monkeynuz

cocobear wrote: »

The law was changed in 2011, the 30 year rule no longer applies to qualify for classic /Vintage road tax. Only pre 1981 vehicle now qualify, post 1981 require full road tax and NCT every year.

Is that really so?

Only I just looked on citizens information and only last December (2012) they were still saying 30 years applies? Confused now.

M.

Kenny Logins

cocobear wrote: »

The law was changed in 2011, the 30 year rule no longer applies to qualify for classic /Vintage road tax. Only pre 1981 vehicle now qualify, post 1981 require full road tax and NCT every year.

Not true. Vin/vet tax after 30 years.

NCT applies to all cars from 1980 on.

SCOOP 64

Kenny Logins wrote: »

Not true. Vin/vet tax after 30 years.

NCT applies to all cars from 1980 on.

He's right.

da_hambo

nig1 wrote: »

He's right.

Indeed my 83 finally hit 30 in jan and i went to tax office got the reg cert changed to vintage and paid 56 eur for a lovely disc. No hassle at all.

Capri

monkeynuz wrote: »

You don't need to be vat registered for van tax but you do need to sign a declaration at your Garda station that it will be for commercial use only. Obviously not all tradesmen are vat reg. ;)

Hope this helps.

M.

HOW ABOUT one of those 90's Micra/Fiesta car vans - I don't think they need DoE or NCT

monkeynuz

Capri wrote: »

HOW ABOUT one of those 90's Micra/Fiesta car vans - I don't think they need DoE or NCT

I don't remember putting the winks in my original post?

Perhaps someone is trying a nudge nudge wink wink vibe?

When I say not vat reg. not all tradesmen earn enough to be vat reg.

M.

w124man

monkeynuz wrote: »

You don't need to be vat registered for van tax but you do need to sign a declaration at your Garda station that it will be for commercial use only. Obviously not all tradesmen are vat reg.

Hope this helps.

M.

I dont think this is correct. When this regulation came out I was unable to tax my Freelander Commercial at the commercial rate, I had to pay full whack as I'm not VAT registered. I was not offered the facility of the declaration.

Anyway you still cant drive a commercial vehicle privately .....

mattroche

It is really down to your personal circumstances, what your budget is, what comfort you like when driving, if you have a family that will be travelling with you, when you do a long journey, and how often you do long journeys, ect. I would suggest that that you go for a post 1980 - 1982, it will require a N.C.T. every year, but that is a good thing, as you will be driving a car that is safe and roadworthy. I had someone last week who is in a simular situtation to you, he wanted a car for going to play golf, about 4 miles a day, he paid me E 2700 for a nice Merc 280SE, which had a new N.C.T. and taxed for the year. Now E56. He got insurance from Carol Nash for E185, full comp. for 2000 Miles per year. This is giving you a kind of yard stick to go by. As far as I am aware, ALL vans are subject to a D.O.E. test, and there are a lot of restrictions attached to getting it taxed commercially. BUT you do NOT have to be V.A.T. Reg. I hope this may be of some help to you.:):):)

monkeynuz

w124man wrote: »

I dont think this is correct. When this regulation came out I was unable to tax my Freelander Commercial at the commercial rate, I had to pay full whack as I'm not VAT registered. I was not offered the facility of the declaration.

Anyway you still cant drive a commercial vehicle privately .....

I never said you could drive a commercial privately.

Thankfully Mattroche has agreed with me that you can get commercial road tax without vat registration.

I also know this to be categorically true because I have van tax and am not vat registered.

I started my business only last year and dont yet have the turnover required to have to register.

The thing with the garda station applies whether you are vat registered or not.

It is a declaration that has to be countersigned by a gard on duty.

M.

Big Nasty

djimi wrote: »

Bear in mind the maintenance costs on a classic car could well outweigh the savings made from classic car tax/insurance.

This is bandied about a lot and I don't necessarily agree. A classic in good condition that is used regularly will normally give relatively hassle free motoring IMO.

Plus parts are readily available and cheap for most models and aren't full of sensors and gizmos that can cost €1000's when they go wrong like modern cars.

I would be more worried about fuel costs TBH as a 30-40 year old 2L will use a hell of a lot more fuel than a modern 2L but then again if only doing 1500 miles a year that doesn't really arise.

Dades

MCMLXXV wrote: »

This is bandied about a lot and I don't necessarily agree. A classic in good condition that is used regularly will normally give relatively hassle free motoring IMO.

Given the last 12 months, I'd have to second this.

I paid more fixing my VW Passat this year than I paid for my classic. And loads of people I've spoken to recently have paid small fortunes to keep their 200X cars on the road. (Want to replace a pump on a 2004 3-series? Gotta take the engine out first...)

There will reach a point where a big bill comes up, but if you buy a classic with a strong engine and minimal rust issues, with a little TLC it's never going to be as big as the stuff that can go wrong with a modern.

All that said, I think you're buying a classic for the wrong reasons. It's like having kids to get child benefit. You really need to know what else you're getting yourself into.

unfit2006

Totally agree with ^.

I could name a half dozen frequent and expensive repairs that modern cars fall victim to. And to add insult to injury, they have become "accepted" in the sense that they are often explained away in the trade by statements such as "sure they all do that" and "they dont make them like they used to".

Issues such as :

Control arms falling apart after relatively low mileage
Brake discs not outasting brake pads
DPFs, EGRs
Injector pumps and/or injectors failing prematurely

The list goes on.

Theres a lot to be said for the simplicity of old school mechanics and maintenancing.... Petrol/Healthy Spark/Timing right and she will go !!

M44B19

Capri wrote: »

HOW ABOUT one of those 90's Micra/Fiesta car vans - I don't think they need DoE or NCT

Car vans need DOE.

2cv

M44B19 wrote: »

Car vans need DOE.

Not if they're below 1 liter, right?

M44B19

2cv wrote: »

Not if they're below 1 liter, right?

No they all need DOE.

Likes of Fiesta and Corolla vans used be exempt but within the last 2 years their enforcing the DOE on them.

You also need to present a DOE cert to tax them (Private or Commercial)

2cv

M44B19 wrote: »

No they all need DOE.

Likes of Fiesta and Corolla vans used be exempt but within the last 2 years their enforcing the DOE on them.

You also need to present a DOE cert to tax them (Private or Commercial)

Ah ok :-) i knew there used to be some sort of loophole that meant that vans under 1 litre were exempt. They must have finally copped on to that

unkel

monkeynuz wrote: »

I have van tax and am not vat registered.

I started my business only last year and dont yet have the turnover required to have to register.

Just in case anyone is doubting this - it's perfectly legitimate and here's the backup. E.g if you supply services and your annual turnover is below €37,500, you do not have to register for VAT

Linky

corktina

€37500 in turnover is so small I doubt many businesses come under it...

Snake_Doctor

M44B19 wrote: »

No they all need DOE.

Likes of Fiesta and Corolla vans used be exempt but within the last 2 years their enforcing the DOE on them.

You also need to present a DOE cert to tax them (Private or Commercial)

Something else you need to Know - when I was trying to sort out a claim after totalling my Commercial 4x4, the Insurance company wouldnt even look at the claim untill I produced an in-date DOE - so there are also Insurance implications.

gobnaitolunacy

2cv wrote: »

Ah ok :-) i knew there used to be some sort of loophole that meant that vans under 1 litre were exempt. They must have finally copped on to that

My Ford Escort van was exempt from both NCT (as it wasn't a car) and the 'normal' van test, but haven't run it in yonks so don't know the current situ. There can't be that many small vans around, thought there were more knocking about in the 90's. Perhaps all the poor students got rid of them to get poser SUVs in the boom years.

galwaytt

OP, buy a late 90's Micra. Reliable, economical and only €190 tax for the year. If you want it just for winter , tax it for 3 or 6 months.

shooter88

monkeynuz wrote: »

I never said you could drive a commercial privately.

Thankfully Mattroche has agreed with me that you can get commercial road tax without vat registration.

I also know this to be categorically true because I have van tax and am not vat registered.

I started my business only last year and dont yet have the turnover required to have to register.

The thing with the garda station applies whether you are vat registered or not.

It is a declaration that has to be countersigned by a gard on duty.

M.

you definatly do not need to be vat reg for a commercial vehicle.
you do need your tax clearance cert which is available to all residents and can be obtained by filling out a form from revenue it takes about a week to get the cert.
you will need your pps
goods only form