Shane McGowan - Playwright

uch

Is Shane McGowan the greatest Irish Songwriter of our time ?

admiralofthefleet

maybe he would be if he was Irish

Where To

admiralofthefleet wrote: »

maybe he would be if he was Irish

And great.

gurramok

Where To wrote: »

And great.

Great British?

Namlub

I don't understand this thread title, you know a playwright and a songwriter are different things?

ITS_A_BADGER

a lot of people say hes great only because of fairytale of newyork

uch

Namlub wrote: »

I don't understand this thread title, you know a playwright and a songwriter are different things?

Listen

Kylo Ren

1. It's Shane MacGowan
2. He's not a playwright.
3. He's English.
3. No, no he's not the greatest.

What a disaster of a thread.

Mr Benevolent

uch wrote: »

Is Shane McGowan the greatest Irish Songwriter of our time ?

Urge to kill rising... McGowan is a UK citizen. He is NOT Irish.

sfwcork

Taxi for OP

Where To

sfwcork wrote: »

Taxi for OP

Outside here now.

uch

Confab wrote: »

Urge to kill rising... McGowan is a UK citizen. He is NOT Irish.

Ask him where he Heralds from

uch

Keno 92 wrote: »

1. It's Shane MacGowan
2. He's not a playwright.
3. He's English.
3. No, no he's not the greatest.

What a disaster of a thread.

The fact you put Shane first says it all

Martyn1989

Born in Ireland, spent his child hood here, moved to London, I think he's Irish.

Rotten accent on him though.

Table Top Joe

Hes written some great lyrics no doubt about it(songwriter would imply music too surely),but at the same time hes ridiculously overrated by people who buy into all that drunken Oirish literary genius bollocks


I actually love The Pogues but im the first to say get a grip when discussing Shane and get over his stupid bloody drunken poet image



Oh and he hasnt to my knowledge written a play either......could be wrong though

im invisible

Larry Mullen Jr., Now theres a good playwright

fasttalkerchat

Where To wrote: »

Outside here now.

Stop beeping, he's coming!

And Shane McGowan had 2 Irish parents and politically was Irish.

Sinfonia

Martyn1989 wrote: »

Born in Ireland, spent his child hood here, moved to London, I think he's Irish.

Rotten accent on him though.

He was born in England.

He spent his early childhood here, up to age six, then went back to England.

dd972

he may have a sh!t accent, but I'm sure he's an Irish citizen, for the benefit of the previous posters who labelled him a Brit, he's as English as J G Ballard is Chinese.

If you were born in Nigeria to the same Irish parents would you be black?

Martyn1989

Sinfonia wrote: »

He was born in England.

He spent his early childhood here, up to age six, then went back to England.

Yeh just saw that, in Kent while his parents were doing a stint over there, dosnt really make him English though

I like the pogues a lot, I doubt the fact he wrote some of the songs he's credited for sometimes but who cares

Sunny.Days

My friend kissed him back in the day when he had no teeth - very funny/disgusting!!

soap1978

Paul brady a very good songwriter and better then shane.

Namlub

uch wrote: »

Listen

To what?

dd972 wrote:

If you were born in Nigeria to the same Irish parents would you be black?

Well this is a terrible, terrible analogy.

kingtiger

Martyn1989 wrote: »

I doubt the fact he wrote some of the songs he's credited for sometimes but who cares

huh

Kettleson

Hang on here. Rewind. If we believed the associated story/press/hype/drinking Oirish, Mr McGowan should have been pushing up the daisies at least 20 years ago.

And we are basing his greatness on Fairytale, a few albums, his ability to sing when "drunk"?

Every feel you been had? There are plenty better singers, songwriters and so on. He was smart, he knew the deal.

Merry Christmas me arse.

Esel

Martyn1989 wrote: »

Born in Ireland, spent his child hood here, moved to London, I think he's Irish.

Rotten accent teeth on him though.

FYP

Lenin Skynard

dd972 wrote: »

If you were born in Nigeria to the same Irish parents would you be black?

You'd be Nigerian, hard to understand what black has to do with anything.

brummytom

He's written some great songs. I'm listening to a version of Rainy Night in Soho at the moment actually.

I heard Liam Clancy's son sing The Broad Majestic Shannon a few months ago, was the first time I'd heard it. Yeah, Shane's no singer, but he's a poet.

Martyn1989

kingtiger wrote: »

huh

He seems like such an incoherent drunk sometimes I doubt he could have written some of the fantastic songs he's been credited with

marcsignal

uch wrote: »

Is Shane McGowan the greatest Irish Songwriter of our time ?

No, I've met him a few times, and he's an arsehole.

buffalo909

He might have been born in England but its fairly clear from his music and lyrics that he identifies himself as Irish. His songs will endure for a long time even though he's a sad character nowadays.

dd972

Lenin Skynard wrote: »

You'd be Nigerian, hard to understand what black has to do with anything.

wtf!.....you would STILL be Irish, there are Irish people born off the island, get over it ! Cliff Richard is not an Indian he's an Englishman born in India, all those British Army children born in Germany are not Germans they are British.

Your logic makes out that James Larkin, David O'Leary, Paul McGrath, are all English, they are not they are Irish.

Just as Francis Bacon and The Duke of Wellington are Englishmen who incidentally happened to be born in Ireland.

WhatNowForUs?

dd972 wrote: »

wtf!.....you would STILL be Irish, there are Irish people born off the island, get over it ! Cliff Richard is not an Indian he's an Englishman born in India, all those British Army children born in Germany are not Germans they are British.

Your logic makes out that James Larkin, David O'Leary, Paul McGrath, are all English, they are not they are Irish.

Just as Francis Bacon and The Duke of Wellington are Englishmen who incidentally happened to be born in Ireland.

Yep but where does black come into it?

fryup

Martyn1989 wrote: »

Rotten accent on him though.

and teeth

dd972

WhatNowForUs? wrote: »

Yep but where does black come into it?

Point I was making was that you would not ethnically be African.

Sunnyisland

I just have him down as a piss artist /

Míshásta

dd972 wrote: »

Just as Francis Bacon and The Duke of Wellington are Englishmen who incidentally happened to be born in Ireland.

The Duke of Wellington:

Born in Ireland of a family that had lived in the country for hundreds of years.

Had his early education in Ireland.

Served as MP for Trim in the Irish Parliament.

Supported civil rights for Irish Catholics and had the Emancipation Bill passed when he was British Prime Minister.

Always maintained contact with his family and friends in Ireland.

People of his background are referred to historically as Anglo-Irish - not English.

BTW Wellington is often quoted as replying, when asked if he was Irish:

"Being born in a stable does not make a man a horse"

That was actually said by Daniel O'Connell.

Would you also classify Dean Swift as "English"?

kingtiger

Martyn1989 wrote: »

He seems like such an incoherent drunk sometimes I doubt he could have written some of the fantastic songs he's been credited with

that is one of the most ridiculous things I have ever read, just because a person is an alcoholic doesn't make them stupid

not to equate McGowan with Ernest Hemingway, but do you think some of Hemingway's novels where written by someone else because he was also was an incoherent drunk?

Dostoevsky

Keno 92 wrote: »

3. He's English.

Confab wrote: »

He is NOT Irish.

Shane MacGowan: I'm Irish. Should we take the word of anonymous internet posters about Shane MacGowan's identity, or of Shane MacGowan?


Most people will accept his self-definition as definitive and not try to impose an identity upon him.

Confab wrote: »

McGowan is a UK citizen.

Where's your evidence for this today in 2013?

dd972

Jonathan Aitken, Englishman who happened to be born in Ireland

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jonathan_Aitken

Shane MacGowan : Father > Irish
Mother > Irish
Upbringing and Self Identification > Irish
Passport ( which has your nationality on it ) > Irish

If Shane MacGowan has any Englishness or English blood about him then where is it?

DEFTLEFTHAND

kingtiger wrote: »

that is one of the most ridiculous things I have ever read, just because a person is an alcoholic doesn't make them stupid

not to equate McGowan with Ernest Hemingway, but do you think some of Hemingway's novels where written by someone else because he was also was an incoherent drunk?

Yes there's quite a few people who achieved acclaim in the arts world who had drinking problems. Edgar Allan Poe and Scott F Fitzgerald are two others I can think of offhand.

The use of substances can often stimulate a creative mind.

Kettleson

DEFTLEFTHAND wrote: »

Yes there's quite a few people who achieved acclaim in the arts world who had drinking problems. Edgar Allan Poe and Scott F Fitzgerald are two others I can think of offhand.

The use of substances can often stimulate a creative mind.

Wasn't there some carry on a few years ago where Seamus Heaney had won some sort of (foreign :rolleyes:) literary prize, upon which he said that he had written the poem with a few whiskeys taken, (note Irish, well the english spelling of Irish Whiskey with the "e").

Whereupon the awarding committee quickly huddled together and announced that they were considering removing the accolade from him as the muse was only rising because he was pissed. Or am I dreaming that?

McGowan is talented for sure. But he used the "Irish" brand to its best effect...But this is turning into a nationality issue which means diddly squat.

A Muslim friend of mine tells me that whatever country they live in, that's the country they take to their heart, in other words, that becomes "their nation". McGowan chose his Irish connections to chose his nationality.

I have only one passport, but its not a passport of my nationality. The nationality angle is a time wasting pursuit.

McGowan has written some great stuff, and he helped make Irish traditional/fusion music/instrumentation acceptable at at time when it was unacceptable (and yes I'm talking about the north here) ..and for that he deserves some some sort of foreign peace prize..:D

Now where's my quill? Glug, glug, glug...

Son0vagun

Call him what you want, but Shane MacGowan is a genius. His songs are identifiably irish, and will be sung till the end of time. I love him, he's the last of his kind.

Mardy Bum

Kettleson wrote: »

Wasn't there some carry on a few years ago where Seamus Heaney had won some sort of (foreign :rolleyes:) literary prize, upon which he said that he had written the poem with a few whiskeys taken, (note Irish, well the english spelling of Irish Whiskey with the "e").

Whereupon the awarding committee quickly huddled together and announced that they were considering removing the accolade from him as the muse was only rising because he was pissed. Or am I dreaming that?

Sounds like a dream all right.

Kettleson

Mardy Bum wrote: »

Sounds like a dream all right.

Yeah I know Mardy Bum, but I can def recall some sort of short-lived news feature about it, probably a bad news week and based on nothing at all.

Lapin

McGowan is Irish.

Where you are born doesn't determine your nationality.

Winston Churchill's brother, John was born in Dublin.

No one would consider him as being Irish.

C.K Dexter Haven

I didn't grow up with him so don't know if he plays right or not.

DainBramage

He's no playwright as he has never written a play, but he's a great songwriter - up there with the best of them imo. No one captures the emigrant experience in song as good as the Pogues.

Is he irish? he was born in the UK and moved back here shortly after with his irish parents until he was 6, then returned to London and came back most years on holidays etc. has lived in Dublin for the last number of years so he certainly has some claim.

Martyn1989

kingtiger wrote: »

that is one of the most ridiculous things I have ever read, just because a person is an alcoholic doesn't make them stupid

not to equate McGowan with Ernest Hemingway, but do you think some of Hemingway's novels where written by someone else because he was also was an incoherent drunk?

Ah now the man struggles to string a sentence when he's sober he's that far gone and from what I know he's always been bad, it surely isn't actually one of the most ridiculous things you've ever read

WumBuster

Liam Clancy singing Shane's Broad majestic Shannon and dueting on Irish Rover

rockbeast

Rainy Night In Soho. That is all.

If anyone denigrates an artist for being a substance abuser then, here's the news, but your life is going to be a slow and boring place.

Must be trolls at work. Must be trolls at work. Must be trolls at work.Must be trolls at work....ad infinitum....

RB