Opinion on castle please

Fuzzy Clam

Hi
The following link is to a bing maps image of a castle in Co.Longford.
http://www.bing.com/maps/?v=2&cp=syjbz9gc95xq&lvl=17&dir=0&sty=b&form=LMLTSN
The castle remains is in the upper left corner of the field, beside a road. I'm curious about the marks in the field which, when i "investigated", were ditches, approx 4 ft deep. Is this likely be be a bawn? There seems to be a circle in the lower left corner, possibly a tower(?).
I think the road must cut through this feature as I can see marks in the field just north of the castle.
Incidently, the border of Longford and Westmeath runs along the stepped ditch on the left.
I'm just really looking for a 2nd opinion on this as I haven't been able to find out much except that may have been built by Nugent in the 12th centuary. None of the old maps i looked at show anything except the main tower. Thanks.

Simon.d

Fuzzy Clam wrote: »

Hi
The following link is to a bing maps image of a castle in Co.Longford.
http://www.bing.com/maps/?v=2&cp=syjbz9gc95xq&lvl=17&dir=0&sty=b&form=LMLTSN
The castle remains is in the upper left corner of the field, beside a road. I'm curious about the marks in the field which, when i "investigated", were ditches, approx 4 ft deep. Is this likely be be a bawn? There seems to be a circle in the lower left corner, possibly a tower(?).
I think the road must cut through this feature as I can see marks in the field just north of the castle.
Incidently, the border of Longford and Westmeath runs along the stepped ditch on the left.
I'm just really looking for a 2nd opinion on this as I haven't been able to find out much except that may have been built by Nugent in the 12th centuary. None of the old maps i looked at show anything except the main tower. Thanks.

Here's the listing for a bawn at the site from archaeology.ie
"Description: On a low rise of ground in wet pasture with good views in all directions. Coolamber church (LF016-015001-) and graveyard (LF016-015002-) are located 475m to the NW. A late 16th-/early 17th-century fortified house (LF016-018001-) is situated in the NW quadrant of a bawn (int. dims. 39m N–S x 38m E–W; wall T 0.95m; Wall H 0.3m). The bawn appears to be built on an early medieval ringwork (LF016-018003-) consisting of a raised circular platform (diam. c. 40m) defined by a scarp (H 2-4m) with external fosse (top Wth 8m; base Wth 2m; ext. D 0.8-1.7m) and causewayed entrance at ESE (Wth 3m; L 10m). A modern road running roughly E–W intersects the N quadrant of the ringwork destroying the enclosing fosse from N to NE. Remains of the wall-footings of the bawn wall enclose the perimeter of the circular platform with possible evidence of a rectangular mural or garderobe tower projecting out from the bawn wall at SW. Theentrance to the bawn is via the causewayed entrance. It is uncertain whether the earthwork is contemporaneous with the bawn wall or if it was an earlier defensive earthwork that has been subsequently refortified.
"

Fuzzy Clam

Thank you Simon.d.
I was wondering if there's any need to investigate these type of sites any further or is it that once these sites are known of, they are just disregarded. I assume that when the relatively recent road was built, they ignored the significance of the site. The road, as far as I can see on the old OSI maps, only went as far as the castle from the west direction and then stops at the castle. The continuation of the road that cuts through the site is more recent.

Simon.d

Fuzzy Clam wrote: »

Thank you Simon.d.
I was wondering if there's any need to investigate these type of sites any further or is it that once these sites are known of, they are just disregarded. I assume that when the relatively recent road was built, they ignored the significance of the site. The road, as far as I can see on the old OSI maps, only went as far as the castle from the west direction and then stops at the castle. The continuation of the road that cuts through the site is more recent.

Investigate away.. It's good fun and you may find something interesting.. Regarding those ditches, they don't seem to be recorded on the archaelogical record, and may be of importance. The castle was inhabited up until 1700 or so I believe, so the features to the south may be more to do with formal gardens, or argriculture, than defence. If the land is very boggy they could simply be drainage ditches to make the land more amenable to growing a nice pristene looking lawn and garden, and If over the 300 year mark (which is quite likely) they should be recorded as national monument.

As far as I can see that road was in situ since at least 1830 or so.. There's a portion of the digitised 25" osi map missing which may have given the impression that it stopped at the castle.

Here's some skeches from the mid 19th century by Du Noyer:

Simon.d

Some more info: It looks like only 2 - 3 generations of Nugents resided at the castle.. They came out of the Baron Delvin Line of Nugents. James Nugent (died 1603), brother of the 13th Baron Delvin Richard Nugent (1523 - 1559) looks to have been the first and possibly built the towerhouse. His second son Thomas Nugent also resided there, and Du Noyer who did the sketches above also noted an inscription on a stone cross close to the castle:"Pray for the Souls of Thomas Nugent deced 12 Jan 1688 and of Rose Tyrell his wife". James Nugent (born 1618) was the last nugent in the castle I think. In 1684-1685 a new manor was built on the estate ( http://binged.it/Roxm9I ??) , and the castle was abandoned?..

There is the potential for much older origins of the castle in the Archaelogical record, as it is thought that there may be a pre-existing ringwork castle at the site, that existed prior to the tower house being built in the late 1500s.

Fuzzy Clam

Thanks Simon. Coolamber House in the Bing link above is from the mid 19th centuary but was probably built on the site of the earlier manor. Not to be confused with Coolamber Manor 2 or 3 miles to the west(ish).

Simon.d

Fuzzy Clam wrote: »

Thanks Simon. Coolamber House in the Bing link above is from the mid 19th centuary but was probably built on the site of the earlier manor. Not to be confused with Coolamber Manor 2 or 3 miles to the west(ish).

There's a monument listing for an unclassified castle within that house, so could predate 1800s, and possibly evolved from an earlier structure i.e a 17th century fortified house..

Fuzzy Clam

Simon.d wrote: »

There's a monument listing for an unclassified castle within that house, so could predate 1800s, and possibly evolved from an earlier structure i.e a 17th century fortified house..

I've seen mention of a castle on the site before, supposed to have been in the garden in front of the existing house.