Should I be paid for public holidays?

Akiv89

Hi everyone.I am working as a waitress in a pub. I worked there for 2 and a half month now.
My working hours are 35-45 hours a week with a flexible work schedule. Is my employer obliged to pay me my daily wage for each of the
december/january public holidays?

Elmo

http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/employment/employment_rights_and_conditions/leave_and_holidays/public_holidays_in_ireland.html

Your entitlement to public holidays is set out in the Organisation of Working Time Act 1997. Most employees are entitled to paid leave on public holidays. One exception is part-time employees who have not worked for their employer at least 40 hours in total in the 5 weeks before the public holiday.

Employees who qualify will be entitled to one of the following:

A paid day off on the public holiday
An additional day of annual leave
An additional day's pay
A paid day off within a month of the public holiday
The Organisation of Working Time Act provides that you may ask your employer at least 21 days before a public holiday, which of the alternatives will apply. If your employer fails to respond at least 14 days before the public holiday, you are entitled to take the actual public holiday as a paid day off.

Akiv89

Thanks)

Akiv89

Today I was not paid for Christmas public holidays. The response was that nobody is being paid cause on these days the pub is closed.What should I do?I don't want to start a conflict with my employer as I'm afraid of loosing the job.

Elmo

Akiv89 wrote: »

Today I was not paid for Christmas public holidays. The response was that nobody is being paid cause on these days the pub is closed.What should I do?I don't want to start a conflict with my employer as I'm afraid of loosing the job.

They can't fire you over your rights, they might make life difficult for you causing you to leave.

Are you part-time?

What pub is closed Stephen's and new years day?

ScouseMouse

Elmo wrote: »

They can't fire you over your rights, they might make life difficult for you causing you to leave.

Are you part-time?

What pub is closed Stephen's and new years day?

But they can let you go for no reason within the first 13 weeks, or after that for a madeup reason with just a weeks notice.

Be careful how you do it.

davo10

You have flexible times over each seven day week, are you working 35-45 hours this week as norm excluding Tuesday and Wednesday?, if so then your employer would be paying you far more than you are entitled to if he/she also paid you for these two days. In other words, the two days you were not scheduled to work this week and were not to be paid for were, Tuesday and Wednesday.

greendom

davo10 wrote: »

You have flexible times over each seven day week, are you working 35-45 hours this week as norm excluding Tuesday and Wednesday?, if so then your employer would be paying you far more than you are entitled to if he/she also paid you for these two days. In other words, the two days you were not scheduled to work this week and were not to be paid for were, Tuesday and Wednesday.

Would the OP then not be entitled for time off in iieu - having missed out on the public holidays ?

davo10

greendom wrote: »

Would the OP then not be entitled for time off in iieu - having missed out on the public holidays ?

I think "flexitime" is the key, OP did not have to be rostered to work on public holidays so may not be entitled to pay if he/she already worked 35hrs that week, if worked less than that, then there should be an entitlement to pay. Remember on flexitime, OP may not have worked every Monday or Tuesday etc

Akiv89

I normally work more than 35 hours a week - this is a full-time job to my understanding. I normally do work Tuesdays and Wednesdays. This week I worked less than 35 hours.
What would you advise to do in my case? Should I fight for this money or just let it go (as I don't want to loose this job)?

davo10

Akiv89 wrote: »

I normally work more than 35 hours a week - this is a full-time job to my understanding. I normally do work Tuesdays and Wednesdays. This week I worked less than 35 hours.
What would you advise to do in my case? Should I fight for this money or just let it go (as I don't want to loose this job)?

There is a good chance that as you have only been there a short period, your employer may let you go, only you can decide if its worth risking.

wmpdd3

OP, you should have been paid 8 % of you average weeks pay per day.

But as said before, you may see yourself with no hours at all for the month of Jan if you rock the boat.

See here:

http://www.flac.ie/download/pdf/working_hours.pdf

gozunda

wmpdd3 wrote: »

OP, you should have been paid 8 % of you average weeks pay per day.

But as said before, you may see yourself with no hours at all for the month of Jan if you rock the boat.

See here:

http://www.flac.ie/download/pdf/working_hours.pdf

Sadly sounds like more dodgy practices by some employers...

tatli_lokma

wmpdd3 wrote: »

OP, you should have been paid 8 % of you average weeks pay per day.

But as said before, you may see yourself with no hours at all for the month of Jan if you rock the boat.

See here:

http://www.flac.ie/download/pdf/working_hours.pdf

well it depends - if OP has a contract with a set number of hours then they must receive these hours. But as already posted, with less than 12mths service, you can be let go very easily and without much reason.

Having said that you do have to stand up for yourself. So I think the issue is not 'should you should say something?' (because I think you
certainly should) but 'how do you say it?'

OP - what is your relationship with your direct manager? can you approach them? if so, I would just start off by casually asking them how do things normally work with regards to bank holidays etc. Sound them out - it could literally be a case of an error with payroll. A lot of places seem to screw up wages around Christmas - it is usually down to inexperienced payroll operators who don't know the law, who just process the payments as an administrative task. If that is the case, they may have processed your wages on hours actually worked and not taken the BH's into account.

So when you mention it to your manager, first off I would go in softly, see what the situation is. Then if it turns out that your manager says you should have been paid, then contact payroll and sort it out. It could be that you don't get paid, but do get TOIL later when things are more quiet. So it is definitely worth asking in the first instance.

If the manager says you should not be paid, respectfully advise them that actually they are incorrect and you should be paid, based upon the Organisation of Working time act 1997. Tell them that you have looked into it, and from this you have discovered that you are entitled to 1/5th of your average working week either paid for the BH or as time off in lieu. At all times keep calm, have the information you need to hand, and firmly but politely and professionally state your case. Print out info from citizens information and have it to hand.

This may irk your manager, particularly if they don't like being told how to do things, but if you are polite and professional and if you are a good worker normally and not seen as a trouble maker, they will just be annoyed for a short time and then they will get over it. If they don't get over it and make your life difficult in work, then start looking elsewhere. But always remember, if you have a contract with a certain amount of hours then they have to honour this. Even if they want to let you go, they still need to honour the contract up until the time you leave.

Personally I don't think they will let you go just for standing up for yourself in a non-confrontational manner. By showing them tactfully that you know your rights, they might be less inclined to just sack you, and if they do want rid of you will more likely 'manage' you out, and this can take time - hopefully if it comes to that you will have found something else before the ax falls. You need to be prepared that this may well happen. But in my experience of retail and hospitality (all be it when I was younger) there are two types of employer - by the book who will follow the law, and whilst perhaps still not the most flexible, won't punish you for pointing out an error, and the other type are those who look for people they can expolit, try to avoid adhering to the law and generally take the p!ss. If you work for the second, then you are better off looking elsewhere anyway, as this issue will probably be the tip of the iceberg.

Good luck OP - let us know how you get on.

Akiv89

Thank you very much for the above said.I've decided not to go any further with the issue,cause unfortunately my employer is the second type one. I'm just looking for another job at the moment.

tatli_lokma

Sorry to hear that....but just because you don't say anything now, doesn't mean you have to let them get away with it. Make sure you keep a diary of any events, and keep your payslips. When you have another job secured contact NERA and report them. Whilst it might not be the best course of action for you to stand up for yourself right now, this doesn't mean you can't stand up for yourself in other ways once your new job is secured.

Best of luck with finding a new job and I hope it all works out for you.

take care

huggy15

resurrecting this thread as im in the same predicament as yourself. I've been working with this company for nearly 3 months its a small shop with about 10 employees. the xmas hours have been put up and everyone except me will be getting there public holiday entitlements for xmas day, St. Stephen's Day and New Year's Day.
I know im entitled to them but the manager doesn't seem to think so. its a bit annoying because xmas day and st Stephens day fall on days i normally work so my wages the week after will be sh!t.
I was thinking about printing out the citizens advice info regarding the situation but i dont know if i should because more than likely they will make life very difficult for me . what can i do without rocking rocking the boat too much?

Elmo

huggy15 wrote: »

resurrecting this thread as im in the same predicament as yourself. I've been working with this company for nearly 3 months its a small shop with about 10 employees. the xmas hours have been put up and everyone except me will be getting there public holiday entitlements for xmas day, St. Stephen's Day and New Year's Day.
I know im entitled to them but the manager doesn't seem to think so. its a bit annoying because xmas day and st Stephens day fall on days i normally work so my wages the week after will be sh!t.
I was thinking about printing out the citizens advice info regarding the situation but i dont know if i should because more than likely they will make life very difficult for me . what can i do without rocking rocking the boat too much?

Work out what your entitled to for those days if your part time, they might reconsider if its not a full days wage. But hard to say what to do, ask the manager for a written reason as to why your not entitled to payment?

huggy15

Elmo wrote: »

Work out what your entitled to for those days if your part time, they might reconsider if its not a full days wage. But hard to say what to do, ask the manager for a written reason as to why your not entitled to payment?

wouldnt really be too keen on asking them for it in writing id say that would p!ss them off a bit.
i thought i read some where for xmas day at least because they are closed that im entitled to a days pay worked out from the last 13 weeks ive worked. its hard to know what to do! id hate to let them get away without paying me.

Elmo

huggy15 wrote: »

wouldnt really be too keen on asking them for it in writing id say that would p!ss them off a bit.
i thought i read some where for xmas day at least because they are closed that im entitled to a days pay worked out from the last 13 weeks ive worked. its hard to know what to do! id hate to let them get away without paying me.

To be entitled to pay you need to have worked in the company for 5 weeks before the bank holiday, you meet this requirement.

You are entitled to the average pay for that day based on 13 weeks of employment

e.g. if you work 20 hours on average every week for 13 weeks up to a bank holiday your entitled to 4 hours worth of pay. (not sure if you divide by 5days or 6days it could be 6), your entitled to Christmas Day, Stephen's and New Years

email your manager/HR to asking them why your not entitled, if they don't reply they don't reply. If they do you have an answer in writing.

dingus12

I work 32 hours per week, every week, monday to thursday for the past 2 years, the hotel closes this year on tuesday the 23rd and opens on friday after boxing day, so I'll miss out on 3 days work next week, am I entitled to be paid?

allibastor

In jobs where there is a roster, you need to have the public days as a rostered day, or indeed where this would mean your working week would be less than your normal 35-40 hours per week.

I work with some companies that close on Christmas and Stephens, there is no pay for this but staff are rostered in for the remaining 5 days of that week and paid for that.

Sorry, but it seems they can do this so long as it doesn't affect your standard hours.

anonyanony

Akiv89 wrote: »

I normally work more than 35 hours a week - this is a full-time job to my understanding. I normally do work Tuesdays and Wednesdays. This week I worked less than 35 hours.
What would you advise to do in my case? Should I fight for this money or just let it go (as I don't want to loose this job)?

Sounds like a zero hour contract, if you he only has to pay you the hours you work, you where no rostered that week for those days so does not need to pay you, expect to get less hours after xmas too.

Last zero hour place I worked I got 35-40hrs over the xmas period but was getting 10-15 in feb

Elmo

You get your average daily hours for bank holiday regardless. If you never work a Monday (generally a bank holiday) your entitled to a day in lieu or your average daily hours in pay.

anonyanony

Elmo wrote: »

You get your average daily hours for bank holiday regardless. If you never work a Monday (generally a bank holiday) your entitled to a day in lieu or your average daily hours in pay.

Not on a zero hour contract

Beaner1

Don't rock the boat till you leave then you can request all of your holiday pay and not worry about losing your job.

toadfly

anonyanony wrote: »

Not on a zero hour contract

The contract is irrelevant, you are entitled to 1/5 of your average weekly hours based on the 13 weeks prior to the BH.

dingus12

dingus12 wrote: »

I work 32 hours per week, every week, monday to thursday for the past 2 years, the hotel closes this year on tuesday the 23rd and opens on friday after boxing day, so I'll miss out on 3 days work next week, am I entitled to be paid?

anyone?

toadfly

dingus12 wrote: »

anyone?

Did you read the thread?

therecklessone

dingus12 wrote: »

anyone?

See here: http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/employment/employment_rights_and_conditions/leave_and_holidays/public_holidays_in_ireland.html

Your entitlement to public holidays is set out in the Organisation of Working Time Act 1997. Most employees are entitled to paid leave on public holidays. One exception is part-time employees who have not worked for their employer at least 40 hours in total in the 5 weeks before the public holiday.

Employees who qualify for public holiday benefit will be entitled to one of the following:

A paid day off on the public holiday
An additional day of annual leave
An additional day's pay
A paid day off within a month of the public holiday

The Organisation of Working Time Act provides that you may ask your employer at least 21 days before a public holiday, which of the alternatives will apply. If your employer fails to respond at least 14 days before the public holiday, you are entitled to take the actual public holiday as a paid day off.

The Organisation of Working Time (Determination of Pay For Holidays) Regulations (SI 475/1997) set out the appropriate rate of daily pay.

As a part time employee this will be of interest to you:

Part-time employees

If you have worked for your employer at least 40 hours in the 5 weeks before the public holiday and the public holiday falls on a day you normally work you are entitled to a day's pay for the public holiday. If you are required to work that day you are entitled to an additional day's pay.

If you do not normally work on that particular day you should receive one-fifth of your weekly pay. Even if you may never be rostered to work on a public holiday you are entitled to one-fifth of your weekly pay as compensation for the public holiday.

If you do not have normal daily or weekly working hours, under SI 475/1997, an average of your day’s pay or the fifth of your weekly pay is calculated over the 13 weeks you worked before the public holiday.

In all of the above situations your employer may choose to give you paid time off instead of pay for the public holiday.

So in short yes you are entitled to a paid day off for the public holidays, and one fifth of your weekly pay for Friday as it is a day you are usually off. If you have not taken your full allowance of annual leave you could/should also ask for the non-public holiday days (23 and 24 December) as paid holidays. See here for your annual leave entitlements.