Health Insurance why pay it?

RoverZT

Friend was walking her dog a few days ago and broke her collar bone when the dog knocked her over to get to another dog.

She has no medical insurance and was expecting a huge bill for the operation, over night stay in the hospital etc.

She was thinking along the lines of a few thousand euro for the bill, as was I.

She was cursing herself for not having VHI etc and worried all her savings would wiped out over the accident.

She got an invoice of 75 euro for an overnight stay, no other charge

Couldn't believe it myself.

http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/health/hospital_services/hospital_charges.html

Where To

Four star hotel with 24 hour room service and hot cleaning ladies is cheaper than that.

T-K-O

Obviously it depends on the injury.

A few years back I needed to get an MRI scan without the insurance I would have been on waiting list for close to a year

seven_eleven

18 month waiting list to see a specialist with the HSE, a further 5 months before any operation will be scheduled.

1 week privately with VHI.


/thread.

1ZRed

All's fine until you get a hernia, but it's nothing a little laser eye surgery can't fix

clappyhappy

I agree with OP, for the past 2 months I have been visiting my Dr. I have seen 2 specialists since then, a nuerologist (spl) and a rheumatologist, have an ultrasound booked for Wednesday, was to be e75 but there was an error in booking. They phoned me Friday to change date, will now be seen privately at NO cost.
All I have spent so far is for my Dr visits and medication, a total of e185. I cannot fault the health service in this country. Maybe I have just been very lucky, I have a great gp, who seems to get things done very quickly.
My sister pays almost e2,000 annually for their health insurance. I , personally cannot understand why.

Frank Black

I'm lucky enough to be able to afford private health insurance, and even luckier that I've gotten very bad value out of it for the past few years.

Splendour

clappyhappy wrote: »

Maybe I have just been very lucky

Yes, you have.

apache

If you have a painful illness but not life threatening or an emergency it is agony to wait on a waiting list. My health insurance gets things done quickly.

But and this is more important for me i like having a private room with own tv and computer access. I even had my own fridge in the room the last time

I detest sharing a 6 or 10 bed ward and the constant noise that goes on.

johnwest288

Well IM public and had some "internal problems" Doctors Visit was January 10t approx, and was reffered to Public Hospital by fax that day... I finally went to hospital this week. Yes from Jan to December waiting to be tested in hospital. Now the hospital staff were EXCELLENT. But my god 1 year wait? What if i had of had some serious stuff going on inside.. ie the "big C" :eek:
If you have Insurance, I heard you still must pay approx half your bills and the VHI top up the rest, So your still paying a bomb:cool:

apache

I don't pay a penny towards inhospital stays. For meds and dentist and scans/xrays/tests etc i pay upfront and get 90% back at end of each month. For consultants and GP fees i pay upfront and claim 90% back on a yearly basis.

I never have to wait on a waiting list. Within a week or two at most i have an appointment.

Getting private health insurance is a personal choice but people who moan about their waiting times on the public and say i'm lucky annoy me. I'm not lucky. It not THAT expensive! I've had 2 major ops in the past 6 months so am delighted i held on to it. Otherwise i would have been left waiting. I'm out of work since and not getting much more than dole but i still pay it. If people can afford beer on the dole they can afford health insurance.

Its a personal choice if you have health insurance.

the_syco

johnwest288 wrote: »

If you have Insurance, I heard you still must pay approx half your bills and the VHI top up the rest, So your still paying a bomb:cool:

Depends on what your policy is.

UCDVet

I have private insurance, but I'm not sure I know how to use it (VHI).

I went to the doctor and they just charged me 65 euro for a routine office visit. Now I'm on a 6-8 week waiting list for a follow up for a potentially deadly (and time sensitive) medical condition (cancer).

I've heard people say the waiting lists were for 'public insurance' - but if that's what I'm doing, why do I pay 65 euro, I thought there was free public health care?

Is it just that my private health insurance sucks really bad? Or is this how it works.

Zaph

A number of years ago I had a sudden unforeseen complication following knee surgery that left me in absolute agony and unable to walk. Not knowing what was wrong, I went to A&E where an x-ray quickly showed what the problem was. It was clear that another operation was required, so I expected to be told I'd have one within a few days. I was stunned when they told me that I should go home and that they'd be in touch with me in "about 6 weeks" to discuss scheduling the operation. Not that the operation would be in 6 weeks, just that they'd give me a date for it at that stage. When I said that was ridiculous because I couldn't walk due to the extreme pain (far worse than the pain of the original complaint) and would have to go on sick leave, I was told that because it wasn't life-threatening I was a non-urgent case. It then dawned on me that because I was in A&E I was probably being put on the public waiting list, so I asked if my VHI meant I could have the operation sooner. The reaction I got clearly demonstrated the divide in the public and private healthcare systems in this country, it was pretty much "You have VHI? Well why didn't you say so? Take a seat and we'll see what we can do for you". I had the operation a week later.

I fully appreciate that health insurance is expensive, and in the event of financial difficulties it's probably one of the first things to go. But having first hand experience of the benefits of having it on a number of occasions, I do believe that if you can afford it getting rid of it is a very short-sighted thing to do.

Ush1

When I had Crohns and was undiagnosed for about 2 years I was fairly rough and got a referal from a GP to a specialist. They said it would be three months as I'd be going public, I didn't really mind as I'd suffered for long anyway but herself rang up and threw up a bit of a fuss. I got seen in 3 weeks an from there everything was done fairly quickly.

I recently had a groin injury and knew I'd be a long time for that as it wasn't as serious so I just paid for an MRI in a private clinic. Perhaps the wait wouldn't have been so long going public but I went private to uct out any messing.

seamus

^^
Zaph's is a textbook example of what private health insurance does for you.

Thankfully nobody in this country gets financially crippled if they get ill, but even in semi-serious cases you could be waiting months for effectively life-saving treatment - beart bypasses, etc.

Death and Taxes

My PHI is anout €1,200 just for myself, but it is the last thing I would give up.
like it or not, waiting lists are getting longer in the public system, wards are closing and people who need elective, non emergency treatment could be left waiting for years!
My OH has been treated for cancer on her PHI, had cateracts removed, and had laser eye surgery, apart from the cancer she would have been waiting years on the public system to get the cateracts and laser surgery.

bbam

The thing is that in most cases in the public system if your an adult and its not life threatning then you will usually wait, and wait, and wait. Pain and suffering has no bearing on the decision.
In the private system and you have a serious life threatening you will usually get seen very quickly, and not be treated like a nusience.

With Private health care you will be seen quickly no matter what the situation or how serious the complaint is. You will get better 1:1 attention from the consultant and most probably get to stay in nicer surroundings and avoid being mixed with too many public patients.

My OH works in the HES and says that on the whole children don't need private healthcare. In the public system they are seen directly by the consultant anyway and generally afforded better care than adults under the public system.

Unfortunitely both of us have gotten allot of use from our private healthcare and we will struggle to keep it on for as long as possible. When you need it, its great to be treated quickly and pleasntly, even for "non life threatnening" issues.

For those who have private healthcare and feel it's not doing any good, well like it or not you need to be sayng that you have private healthcare. Check your policy and see does it cover your problem and that your attending the correct hospital. Providing you are polite about it they will be greatful as they now get to charge your company big time for you to be seen.

Sunnyisland

if you don't count the taxes that pay for it all. Everyone resident in Ireland is entitled to free public health coverage. The level of free coverage depends on your economic health - the poorer it is, the higher your level of coverage. There are two categories of public health coverage. Once you are resident in Ireland, you are automatically entitled to one or the other.
Free it may be, but you're also free to wait. Waiting lists for those without private insurance can stretch into years - even for critical operations like heart operations. There are tens of thousands of people waiting for their "free" medical services. Before, during and after the Celtic Tiger, fairly long waits remain the norm.

To cut down the waits, you need to pay for private health insurance.

stmol32

RoverZT wrote: »

....when the dog knocked her over to get to another dog.

she should have sued the dog and get it's insurance company to pay.

Ghandee

It still sucks that public health clinics and equipment is used to treat private patients.

We pay for private (wife is a nurse in a private hospital) were I believe only private, or fee paying patients can attend.

Why can't our public hospitals be the same?

Death and Taxes

Ghandee wrote: »

It still sucks that public health clinics and equipment is used to treat private patients.

We pay for private (wife is a nurse in a private hospital) were I believe only private, or fee paying patients can attend.

Why can't our public hospitals be the same?

So What!
Those with PHI are also tax payers and as such are fully entitled to use those facilities.

seamus

Ghandee wrote: »

It still sucks that public health clinics and equipment is used to treat private patients.

We pay for private (wife is a nurse in a private hospital) were I believe only private, or fee paying patients can attend.

Why can't our public hospitals be the same?

There is an argument that a purely public | private divide would lead to a formalised two-tier health system where the private hospitals have all the best gear and the best hospitals and the public system is creaking at the seams, manned with staff who couldn't get the better-paid private jobs.

At least with our current system where consultants take both public and private patients, there's no erosion in the quality of the staff in the public system.

I agree on principle that it seems wrong that everything in the treatment is the same, the only difference is that you're seen quicker when you flash the cash. But it would be interesting to know if the public system benefits more from this arrangment than it otherwise would.

Ghandee

WileyCoyote wrote: »

So What!
Those with PHI are also tax payers and as such are fully entitled to use those facilities.

I agree with you, I just think its a tad hypocritical that they get to jump the queue in a public hospital.

Is their health more important because of their wealth

I mean, does someone with a prepaid bus ticket get to board a Dublin bus before a guy whose paying the driver?

Both may be tax payers, availing of a publicly provided service.

johnwest288

johnwest288 wrote: »

If you have Insurance, I heard you still must pay approx half your bills and the VHI top up the rest, So your still paying a bomb:cool:

Depends entirely on your level of cover. But if you have VHI B plan or equivalent, you're completely covered in the likes of Blackrock Clnic because they cover the shortfall, so you pay nothing extra on top of your insurance.

I was told last week that I would get an appointment for a scan I would need to tell me whether or not I might have cancer in six weeks. Now like Zaph, that wasn't an appointment for six weeks time. That was a letter in six weeks telling me when my appointment might be. Thankfully I don't have cancer, and thankfully I have private health insurance, I understand it's not something everyone can afford but it's the last thing I think I would give up if I was making cuts to my financial outgoings.

Ghandee

Deleted User wrote: »

Depends entirely on your level of cover. But if you have VHI B plan or equivalent, you're completely covered in the likes of Blackrock Clnic because they cover the shortfall, so you pay nothing extra on top of your insurance.

I was told last week that I would get an appointment for a scan I would need to tell me whether or not I might have cancer in six weeks. Now like Zaph, that wasn't an appointment for six weeks time. That was a letter in six weeks telling me when my appointment might be. Thankfully I don't have cancer, and thankfully I have private health insurance, I understand it's not something everyone can afford but it's the last thing I think I would give up if I was making cuts to my financial outgoings.

Glad to hear you got the all clear whoopsie!

You brighten up this forum at times.

davetherave

Needed an MRI on my knee about three years ago, would have been 18 months waiting for it in Naas. Got it done the next day in Clane.

donegal_road

Dr booked me to have CT scan. I have VHI. I was told it could be up to 8 weeks wait to have it at the local hospital. Then I heard an add on the radio for Euromedics. They provide CT, X-ray, MRI, Ultrasound, PET scan, all you have to do is get your doctor to fax through an appointment form and they will organise the rest. 2 days later I had the CT and was out the door with a CD with all the images. They forward the results to your doctor who will contact you the next day. The whole thing cost €175 and took 2 days, and thankfully I was all-clear

LuckyLloyd

When it happens, you'll know.

Ghandee

Ghandee wrote: »

You brighten up this forum at times.

And that brightened my day, thank you

allibastor

I was injured in hospital, was dropped on my shoulder and broke a bracial plexus. neither the Governement or my health insurance paid for the 2600 euro i needed to have a physio help em out so i could use my shoulder properly again, so they are all useless in my books.

kippy

Health Insurance is kinda like any form of insurance really.
Absolute pain in the ass to pay it, especially when times are tight and there is a strong chance you'll never actually need to use it, but if and when you do need to use it, you'll be happy you have it.


When I was younger I had a conversation with an elderly relation about the costs of insurances in general and made the off the cuff remark that if I reach 70 I'd have paid X amount of money in insurances and would have wasted it all if I hadn't used them. I'd be better putting the money into a bank.

He said, if you get to seventy without using your insurances, you've had a safe and healthy life, be happy.

weisses

Save up your money that you will otherwise pay for Health insurance and pay your scans yourself in the unlikely event you need it .... No waiting lists either

pampootie

My boyfriend doesn't have health insurance. Just before Christmas 2009,he went to his dr with his chronic ear infections and she said she would have to refer him on as he was likely to need an operation. He had it last Wednesday. The hospital lost his records after about 18 months after he requested a change of address, meaning all tests etc had to be redone. He was told in may this year he would have the op at the end of the summer, I rang them in oct and the lady in admissions told me the dr "hadn't bothered" to request the surgery on his medical notes. To be fair, the care he received in hospital was fantastic. I think the care is probably the same but the difference in wait times is shocking.
I also know a lady currently undergoing aggressive chemo for a cancer which she had for at least 19 months while she waited on a scan. I really wouldn't let it lapse if you can afford it at all

seven_eleven

As I said earlier I had a 1 week wait with private insurance in a private hospital. I was in pretty bad pain, and had been to my GP about it 2 times before it was decided I needed to be referred to a specialist. I could hardly walk I was in so much pain, it was really impacting my life.

I was told there was an approximately 18 month waiting list to be seen, but because I'm only 20 I would be seen to faster :eek:. It makes me wonder how long elderly people have to wait.

So instead I went privately with my VHI and was seen within 7 days, and had my operation within 10 days after initial referral. Total cost, €150 for consultation with the specialist, €117 for the surgery. Worth every penny imo, and I'm just glad that I'm lucky enough to be able to afford it.

admiralofthefleet

seven_eleven wrote: »

18 month waiting list to see a specialist with the HSE, a further 5 months before any operation will be scheduled.

1 week privately with VHI.


/thread.

likewise. if my wife gets an infection in her left eye we literally have to get into the mater private straight away, thats why we have it

apache

Ghandee wrote: »

It still sucks that public health clinics and equipment is used to treat private patients.

We pay for private (wife is a nurse in a private hospital) were I believe only private, or fee paying patients can attend.

Why can't our public hospitals be the same?

see it dosen't work like that and your wife should know this being a nurse. on my first surgery i was in the hermitage (exclusively private) - bloody lovely place i have to say! you get your own room, tv, internet and fridge. deadly

my second surgery was more serious so i had to go to a public hospital as a semi private patient. they don't really have the best equipment or resources in a private hospital. i spent two days in a high dependency ward with 3 other people then a step down ward for another day with 5 other people until i improved to be able to have a room of my own. obviously i was so ill at that time that i didn't even notice or care about private or public. there is not the resources in the private hospital for more serious cases so if it is a major operation you usually go to a public hospital as semi private and skip the q. i would prefer to go to a public hospital if i am seriously ill as they have the best resources. my consultant and most other health professionals would be of the same opinion. they prefer to use public resources.

my mother went for a day case 7 years ago to a private hospital and complications arose. they didn't have the right equipment in the private so she was transferred to the public (mater - like a few hundred yards down the road) in the back of an ambulance and her heart stopped in that short distance 3 times. she spent a year on life support and 2 years in total in hospital. so i am wary of the resources in private hospitals. if you are very ill public hospitals are best and as a private patient you get no long waiting times so insurance is important for that. seeing consultants quickly is obviously another added bonus.

my two hospital bills for the operations in the past 6 months came to e25,000! didn't have to do anything. just signed the form and the hospital and insurance company worked it out. the secretary told me i had the best insurance as they pay out straight away. i have POMAS - that and the guards pay out quickly enough but she said VHI was the worst in stalling to pay.

i can't wait til january as i have all my consultant and GP bills to claim back then - i get 90% back. i can only claim at the start of every year for them for the previous year. i added it up and between them both i have e1,350 to claim back. drugs and scans and tests are claimed every month.

shedweller

How does the queue dissapear when you have health ins.? From what i gather, more or less the same people do the surgery whether you have it or not. Just that they leave you hanging if you are public.

Lets say we all got health ins. Would we all get seen quicker?
I have health ins by the way, and it pains me to pay it. There is no reason (that i can see)why the public system should be so slow.

o1s1n

A few years back I broke my leg and decided to give the VHI card a go - got put into a public ward for the first few days.

They finally stuck me in a semi private ward half way through my stay - the difference? 4 people in the ward rather than 6. That was literally it.

I was discharged, but a month later had to go back for another week. This time I was put in a public ward for the whole stay.

I can understand the waiting list aspect, but as far as actual hospital stays go, I don't see much of a difference. Unless you're lucky enough to get a private room to yourself.

Soon after that, VHI increased their prices and I canceled my insurance with them.

ancapailldorcha

If you make a claim on your health insurance or get diagnosed with an LTI, do your premiums skyrocket? I was thinking of getting it but here in the UK people seem happy with the NHS.

apache

shedweller wrote: »

How does the queue dissapear when you have health ins.? From what i gather, more or less the same people do the surgery whether you have it or not. Just that they leave you hanging if you are public.

Lets say we all got health ins. Would we all get seen quicker?
I have health ins by the way, and it pains me to pay it. There is no reason (that i can see)why the public system should be so slow.

obviously because money talks. you know the amount of pressure the public health system is under. they have to prioritise thousands of cases every day hence the huge delays. this is simple stuff. no? everybody in ireland will not get private health insurance tomorrow so that point is null.

Our man in Havana

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

If you make a claim on your health insurance or get diagnosed with an LTI, do your premiums skyrocket? I was thinking of getting it but here in the UK people seem happy with the NHS.

Nope. This is not car insurance. You can claim as often as you can and it won't increase.

Madam_X

seven_eleven wrote: »

18 month waiting list to see a specialist with the HSE, a further 5 months before any operation will be scheduled.

1 week privately with VHI.


/thread.

I pay it - €80 a month, and I have recurring sinus trouble. The doc referred me to an ENT consultant, for a more expert opinion - €150 for one visit; VHI doesn't cover a cent.

I'll continue paying for it of course - this "In my opinion it's not worth it" stuff is gas. But does anyone know why it wouldn't cover my consultation?

Stheno

Madam_X wrote: »

I pay it - €80 a month, and I have recurring sinus trouble. The doc referred me to an ENT consultant, for a more expert opinion - €150 for one visit; VHI doesn't cover a cent.

I'll continue paying for it of course - this "In my opinion it's not worth it" stuff is gas. But does anyone know why it wouldn't cover my consultation?

Could be the type of policy you have, mine covers a portion of gp visits, and fully covers consultants

Gillo

I got a statement for a seven week stint in hospital a few years back, it was a little over €27,000. I went private, anyone I've spoken too who have been admitted to a public hospital with the same illness and all had horror stories.

Our man in Havana

What will happen in 2015 when the government is going to force everyone to have insurance?

apache

Madam_X wrote: »

I pay it - €80 a month, and I have recurring sinus trouble. The doc referred me to an ENT consultant, for a more expert opinion - €150 for one visit; VHI doesn't cover a cent.

I'll continue paying for it of course - this "In my opinion it's not worth it" stuff is gas. But does anyone know why it wouldn't cover my consultation?

re my earlier post after talking to claims secretary she said that VHI was the worst to pay out. i don't know anything about VHI but surely the consultant visit should have been covered. what did they say when you enquired? maybe theres different rates of cover? with e80 you may only be covered for certain things? i'm only surmising.

apache

Stheno wrote: »

Could be the type of policy you have, mine covers a portion of gp visits, and fully covers consultants

oh there you go. same what i'm thinking madam. you may have to pay more to get everything covered.

johnwest288

Our man in Havana wrote: »

Nope. This is not car insurance. You can claim as often as you can and it won't increase.

So if you know you have an LTI and your up front and tell the VHI or whatever Health Insurer your with when signing up that listen I could be headin to hopsital a lot lads, You pay the same as the guy who lets on he is in perfect health and then tells the he has a severe condition 5 months later?

apache

Gillo wrote: »

I got a statement for a seven week stint in hospital a few years back, it was a little over €27,000. I went private, anyone I've spoken too who have been admitted to a public hospital with the same illness and all had horror stories.

well i was admitted to a public hospital as a private patient and i have a horror story. i only got discharged last week and am still traumatised by my experience. i think its because they are so overstretched and with the cuts etc bitterness is setting in.

Lenin Skynard

Our man in Havana wrote: »

What will happen in 2015 when the government is going to force everyone to have insurance?

We'll all be levied with a flat charge, regardless of ability to pay it. Private Health insurance will still be available and still expensive, and the health service won't have improved.