Introducing a "skeptic" to Star Trek...

H3llR4iser

How would you try introduce a Star-Trek-skeptic person to the show? I mean somebody that thinks along the lines of "just people in a ship going through space, boring!" but never actually watched even a single frame of any episode?

Any specific episode(s) or movie(s) that can be recommended at least make it clear how there is much more to the show than just "people in a tin box going through space"?

Myrddin

H3llR4iser wrote: »

How would you try introduce a Star-Trek-skeptic person to the show? I mean somebody that thinks along the lines of "just people in a ship going through space, boring!" but never actually watched even a single frame of any episode?

Any specific episode(s) or movie(s) that can be recommended at least make it clear how there is much more to the show than just "people in a tin box going through space"?

I put on two episodes for someone before, a non fan & who would have thought its all lasers & space ships.

The Visitor - Reduced said non fan to tears.
Hard Time - Same non fan thought it was brilliant.

I'd also recommend The Inner Light from TNG, depending on what the person lights doesn't like, my uncle is also a non fan but thought this was fantastic {I asked him to transcribe the musical notation of the flute for me so he had to watch it}.

Star Trek 2009 might also be a good bet

IvySlayer

The Best of Both Worlds.

If he insults Star Trek again, punch him in the face. :P

seamus

I'd probably start with TNG season 3. It's about the most accessible part of the whole franchise (i.e. you don't need to know things about the ST universe), and it has shed the poor production values and cheesy writing of TOS and early TNG.

Myrddin

IvySlayer wrote: »

The Best of Both Worlds.

If he insults Star Trek again, punch him in the face. :P

I dunno, to a non fan it will defintely have much less impact than it does to fans. Why would anyone care if Picard is assimilated etc? Maybe, I suppose it depends on the person.

I find to catch someones attention your gonna need a real character story, not epic space battles etc. Something human, Star Trek can be masterful when it comes to the human condition

H3llR4iser

EnterNow wrote: »

I put on two episodes for someone before, a non fan & who would have thought its all lasers & space ships.

The Visitor - Reduced said non fan to tears.
Hard Time - Same non fan thought it was brilliant.

I'd also recommend The Inner Light from TNG, depending on what the person lights doesn't like, my uncle is also a non fan but thought this was fantastic {I asked him to transcribe the musical notation of the flute for me so he had to watch it}.

Star Trek 2009 might also be a good bet

Ah, I remember "The Visitor", I think it would be the best option out of the three. I also thought about the 2009 movie but I have a feeling it might actually prove the contrary - afterall, it's more about explosions and FX with the odd addition of a sword than "proper" Star Trek.

IvySlayer wrote: »

The Best of Both Worlds.

If he insults Star Trek again, punch him in the face. :P

Afraid it's not an option; It's not even a "him" we're talking about

Kirby

EnterNow wrote: »

I dunno, to a non fan it will defintely have much less impact than it does to fans. Why would anyone care if Picard is assimilated etc? Maybe, I suppose it depends on the person.

I find to catch someones attention your gonna need a real character story, not epic space battles etc. Something human, Star Trek can be masterful when it comes to the human condition

Which is why ds9 is the best.....it has both.

Myrddin

H3llR4iser wrote: »

It's not even a "him" we're talking about

The Visitor is your man then, I was the same

Edit - there is some technobabble in that episode, but it takes a back seat to the amazing performance by Brooks & Tony Todd.

H3llR4iser

EnterNow wrote: »

I dunno, to a non fan it will defintely have much less impact than it does to fans. Why would anyone care if Picard is assimilated etc? Maybe, I suppose it depends on the person.

I find to catch someones attention your gonna need a real character story, not epic space battles etc. Something human, Star Trek can be masterful when it comes to the human condition

That's exactly what I am after, showing how much the whole show is an allegory to things that are mostly under our very eyes every day.
An episode I was thinking about is "Let that be your last battlefield", but I'd avoid TOS altogether because one should already be willing to look past the poor acting, cheesy sets et cetera...

I personally liked the dark tone of "In the pale moonlight" too, but that also needs the spectator to be a bit familiar with Starfleet's ideals to be appreciated...

goalscoringhero

EnterNow wrote: »

I'd also recommend The Inner Light from TNG, depending on what the person lights doesn't like, my uncle is also a non fan but thought this was fantastic

The Inner Light has worked for me on multiple occasions as an introductory episode (including tears).

Darmok is also amongst the episodes I use for introductions.

norrie rugger

Thinking of those episodes makes me remember why I love Star Trek.

downwithpeace

Some unmentioned DS9 episodes,
"Trials and Tribble-ations", it's an interesting mix of TOS and DS9 with an easy to follow story line as it lays everything out for the viewer.
"Waltz" probably not a great one to jump into as some past character knowledge would be necessary but it's one of those episodes that shows DS9 characters interactions at their best.
"The Sound of Her Voice", can't remember if it requires some past knowledge on characters but it's a good episode for getting some insight on the main DS9 characters as they talk to a women that's been dead for some time.

Edit: Thinking about it, even the pilot for DS9 could be a good pick for a Star Trek intro.

Daith

Duet. Self contained and very little technobabble. Everyone gets the Nazi comparison too.

Goldstein

Agree the more self-contained eps are best to start with to get to know who's who. Maybe concentrate on one show at a time so they aren't getting the characters / circumstances / order of events all mixed up (Worf / O'Brien for instance).

Maybe something like: The Neutral Zone, Cause and Effect, Frame of Mind, Peak Performance, The Wounded, Night Terrors, Schisms.

nyarlothothep

Voyager,

Threshold,
Tatoo,
Faces

TOS,

The Way to Eden,
Turnabout Intruder,
Spock' Brain

TNG

Angel One,
Code of Honour,
Shades of Gray

Myrddin

nyarlothothep wrote: »

TNG

Angel One,
Code of Honour,
Shades of Gray

They're hard to watch even for fans, I can imagine them turning non fans completely off the notion of Trek being any good

seamus

nyarlothothep wrote: »

Voyager,

Threshold,
Tatoo,
Faces

TOS,

The Way to Eden,
Turnabout Intruder,
Spock' Brain

TNG

Angel One,
Code of Honour,
Shades of Gray

Post is missing a </sarcasm> tag

norrie rugger

seamus wrote: »

Post is missing a </sarcasm> tag

We hope:eek:

Myrddin

norrie rugger wrote: »

We hope:eek:

Indeed, with nyarlo once can never be sure

A_Sober_Paddy

The newest movie, its the most mainstream of their movies, I enjoyed star trek before the movie but got a greater love for it after the latest movie.

Then focus on tng in terms of tv series

A_Sober_Paddy

The newest movie, its the most mainstream of their movies, I enjoyed star trek before the movie but got a greater love for it after the latest movie.

Then focus on tng in terms of tv series

duchalla

Slightly off topic and may even have been asked before, but has anyone noticed the similarities between the inner light episode of TNG and the movie Inception???

Daith

duchalla wrote: »

Slightly off topic and may even have been asked before, but has anyone noticed the similarities between the inner light episode of TNG and the movie Inception???

Hmm...there's similar themes but I think DS9's 'Extreme Measures' is closer.

Kirby

nyarlothothep wrote: »

Voyager,

Threshold,
Tatoo,
Faces

TOS,

The Way to Eden,
Turnabout Intruder,
Spock' Brain

TNG

Angel One,
Code of Honour,
Shades of Gray

downwithpeace

TNG: "The First Duty" followed by "Lower Decks"

sky23

how about "Up the Long Ladder" from season 2 I die laughing watching it!!

smellslikeshoes

I think I'd be more inclined to just get them to watch TNG from the beginning (even with the cringey wooden acting) and see do they continue watching. I personally don't think someone who hasn't watched it in any form before would have a clue whats going on in the majority of episodes mentioned and people are just looking at them from the eyes of a fan.

Kirby

smellslikeshoes wrote: »

I think I'd be more inclined to just get them to watch TNG from the beginning (even with the cringey wooden acting) and see do they continue watching. I personally don't think someone who hasn't watched it in any form before would have a clue whats going on in the majority of episodes mentioned and people are just looking at them from the eyes of a fan.

Good writing is good writing and it's recognisable. If you sat somebody down to watch "In the Pale Moonlight", they wouldn't know the backstory or who any of the characters are.....but it's self explanatory what is going on. Team A is losing war. Need help from aliens to win war. Fake evidence. Laughter ensues.

It's enjoyable any way you slice it....even if you aren't 100% clued in to the backstory. It also demonstrates that the whole Star tek universe isn't some silly utopian show with a bunch of carebears. That turns people off. The same applies with "Duet". Does it matter if the viewer knows who the Cardassians are? Or who Kira is? Nope. It's all explained within the episode. The same principal applies with "Hard time".

Those would my three first ports of call for non viewers, all DS9. If somebody asked me for an episode with "that bald guy", I would tell them to watch "The Inner Light"

Preidctable choices perhaps, but a they hit the right notes.

H3llR4iser

A_Sober_Paddy wrote: »

The newest movie, its the most mainstream of their movies...

That's exactly the problem - if anything, the latest movie will only reinforce the notion of ST being just about giant starships and lasers; It lacks the character depth, the interaction and the atmosphere of proper Star Trek.

Myrddin

Kirby wrote: »

The same principal applies with "Hard time".

Those would my three first ports of call for non viewers, all DS9. If somebody asked me for an episode with "that bald guy", I would tell them to watch "The Inner Light"

Preidctable choices perhaps, but a they hit the right notes.

Predictable maybe, but your only gonna have one shot at showing a newcomer what Trek is about. If you go & show them something like Code of Honor, they're forever gonna be turned against Trek & no amount of 'predictable' episodes will turn that around.

I know from experience, as I said I was faced with the same quandary the OP was faced with. I chose Hard Time & The Visitor with one newcomer, & The Inner Light to another. Both people, told me it was not what they expected {in a good way}. And from that, I could nurture further, rather than try and carry out damage control after showing them the wrong episode.

I say throw notions about predictability out the window, Trek is masterful, but pick the wrong episode at the wrong time for the wrong person, & it could make Trek look even worse than what they already imagine without having seen it.

H3llR4iser

EnterNow wrote: »

Predictable maybe, but your only gonna have one shot at showing a newcomer what Trek is about. If you go & show them something like Code of Honor, they're forever gonna be turned against Trek & no amount of 'predictable' episodes will turn that around.

I know from experience, as I said I was faced with the same quandary the OP was faced with. I chose Hard Time & The Visitor with one newcomer, & The Inner Light to another. Both people, told me it was not what they expected {in a good way}. And from that, I could nurture further, rather than try and carry out damage control after showing them the wrong episode.

I say throw notions about predictability out the window, Trek is masterful, but pick the wrong episode at the wrong time for the wrong person, & it could make Trek look even worse than what they already imagine without having seen it.

Now the fun part is, what do they imagine it to be? I struggle to figure what a "Trek-hater" or "Trek-indifferent" person might imagine it to be, other than them applying some stereotype about "boring sciency stuff", "people in space" and "uncool"...

Myrddin

H3llR4iser wrote: »

Now the fun part is, what do they imagine it to be?

science_ed

I was nearly in tears watching the Voyager episode "Drone" when Seven of Nine became mentor to a Borg drone with 29th century technology.
You really needed to know Sevens back story to get the full effect of that storyline though.

Incidentally, I wrote a bit on how Star Trek technology like replicators, phasers and tractor beams are already being built today, way ahead of the 24th century. Have a read - www.thegazeboeffect.wordpress.com

Myrddin

Recently watched 'Drone' myself, very good ep

Kirby

science_ed wrote: »

I was nearly in tears watching the Voyager episode "Drone" when Seven of Nine became mentor to a Borg drone with 29th century technology.
You really needed to know Sevens back story to get the full effect of that storyline though.

EnterNow wrote: »

Recently watched 'Drone' myself, very good ep

"You are hurting me..."

Beautifully delivered. You gotta admit, the boobs can act.

Myrddin

Kirby wrote: »

You gotta admit, the boobs can act.

Can't remember the episode name, but the one where the Borg Vinculum keeps changing her personality definitely shows the girl can act. From a very convincing Ferengi, to a lost little girl, to her tormented self...brilliant stuff

Please Kill Me

EnterNow wrote: »

Can't remember the episode name, but the one where the Borg Vinculum keeps changing her personality definitely shows the girl can act. From a very convincing Ferengi, to a lost little girl, to her tormented self...brilliant stuff

That was Infinite Regress. Fantastic episode!!

Myrddin

Please Kill Me wrote: »

That was Infinite Regress. Fantastic episode!!

Thats the one. Agreed, twas brilliant

Myrddin

I'll be interested to hear how the OP gets on, have you showed her an ep yet OP?

FutureGuy

I really liked Counterpoint, one of my favourite Voyagher episodes.

From DS9, Duet and Far Beyond the Stars were great, but The Visitor beats them for emotional impact, and to be honest, when trying to show that trek is more than "pew pew lazerzzz" then you cannot beat that.

I must sit down with the gf later and watch it with her.

Kirby

FutureGuy wrote: »

I really liked Counterpoint, one of my favourite Voyagher episodes.
.

Agreed. I was a big Voyager fan and used to tune in every week on it's original run through on tv. I had seen every episode or so I thought but interestingly enough had missed this one. Years later it was a pleasure watching Counterpoint for the first time because it was a total surprise. It was like having a brand new episode to watch. Kind of like finding old money in your pocket.