Budget 2013

davet82

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/budget/budget-2013-fg-threatens-to-put-dole-on-table-for-cuts-3305379.html

FINE Gael is threatening to press for a cut in the dole in next week's Budget, if Labour keeps pushing for tax increases on high earners.

Labour wants to increase the Universal Social Charge (USC) on those earning over €100,000 by 3pc, but this is regarded as a breach in the Programme for Government by Fine Gael.

cant believe its that time of the year already! (5th Dec)

I think it would be really shítty thing to do cutting the dole, i cant see it happening anyways...

whatdoicare

I don't think they'll cut the dole but I reckon they'll cut a lot of the extras like rent allowance and child benefit etc etc that way they'll hit the pensioners too without technically touching their pensions.

Fun times ahead.

Ghandee

Take from those with little or nothing to protect the high earners?

These lads are committing political suicide!

Remember whose your pal when the G.E rolls around again.

sfwcork

I would think the USC will go up for all by a least 1/2 %.

I hope they stay away from fuel.Its already a joke

Cigs and the pint are the usual suspects too!

snubbleste

Cut the dole www.joanburton.ie/contact-us
Don't cut the dole www.joanburton.ie/contact-us

summerskin

cut the dole, it's a ridiculous amount, bring it more in line with most of europe.



and cut my taxes.

neil_hosey

guessing car tax will take a fairly big hit on all levels.

snubbleste

1c tax on each sms message
5c tax on each meassgeboard post
10c tax for logging into facebuke

stevedublin

summerskin wrote: »

cut the dole, it's a ridiculous amount, bring it more in line with most of europe.



and cut my taxes.

You're not on the dole I take it, hehe.

sfwcork

car tax got hit a while back didnt it

Pherekydes

snubbleste wrote: »

1c tax on each sms message
5c tax on each meassgeboard post
10c tax for logging into facebuke

You'll be popular around here!

neil_hosey

sfwcork wrote: »

car tax got hit a while back didnt it

yeah but im guessing anything under 1.8 will have a big rise, and anything over will just have a smallish rise. I drive a 2 ltr accord, so its a killer already at 700 odd quid!

squod

Multi-billion euro companies paying a pittance in corporation tax here (can be as low as 2%) and we have posters on here advocating a tax on text messages .

SW payouts are quite low as a proportion of GDP.

Duggy747

Turn people on the dole to soylent green, or cage them up so we can extract nutrients from them for our own beneift.

*Posh chortle*

Chips Lovell

Going by yesterday's paper, there appears to be a bit of a bunfight going on behind the scenes over the proposal to increase the USC on people earning more than €100,000 a year.

One of three main planks of the programme for government was a commitment not to touch income tax. There's a faction in Fine Gael who believe that this move would impinge on that commitment. The talk of cutting the dole is no doubt retaliation, since that's another sacred cow.

If it's being framed as cutting the dole vs. taxing the rich, you already know which side has lost.

Oranage2

They should cut all the bullcrap and just tell us the cost of alcohol, smokes and petrol so we can moan already!

davet82

Oranage2 wrote: »

They should cut all the bullcrap and just tell us the cost of alcohol, smokes and petrol so we can moan already!

no they have to scare the shíte out of us first so when the budget comes out we'll all be relieved and be thankful

franktheplank

Abolish Rent Allowance, there's tens of thousands of empty houses in the country and we're paying for rent! It doesn't benefit people on the dole. Only putting more money in the hands of property investors. This government no different from the last.

Also creates a false floor in the rental market and property market. Time to stop propping these up, we can't afford it.

Also, there should be massive cuts on the highly paid public serpents but of course that's not gonna happen.

zirafute

Vladimir Kurtains wrote: »

If it's being framed as cutting the dole vs. taxing the rich, you already know which side has lost.

yeah and I wonder why do you rich keep winning when it's the working class people who vote them in?why do politicians get paid millions when they don't do much to improve our lifestyles.I get that it's hard times and there isn't an easy way out but cutting the dole child benefits college grants will make our lifestyle worse than it already is.Students are thinking about not studying because it costs too much or go abroad to study and live. People are struggling and all politicians care about is their own money. They should get a big wake up call and realize that they are messing with peoples lifes. And if they do cut it they people should make it very clear that hey aren't happy and do something about it.

Oranage2

We should tax the Dole!

Mr Benevolent

summerskin wrote: »

cut the dole, it's a ridiculous amount, bring it more in line with most of europe.

Uh, you really have no idea how much the dole is in other European countries, do you? Bringing it in line with other EU countries would increase it dramatically.

donegal_road

franktheplank wrote: »

Abolish Rent Allowance, there's tens of thousands of empty houses in the country and we're paying for rent! It doesn't benefit people on the dole. Only putting more money in the hands of property investors. This government no different from the last.

Also creates a false floor in the rental market and property market. Time to stop propping these up, we can't afford it.

Also, there should be massive cuts on the highly paid public serpents but of course that's not gonna happen.

good chance it will be cut, government cant borrow the money anymore to put towards such benefits. Rent allowance cannot be prioritized over home help budget, which is for the chop

franktheplank

donegal_road wrote: »

good chance it will be cut, government cant borrow the money anymore to put towards such benefits. Rent allowance cannot be prioritized over home help budget, which is for the chop

I think it might be cut a small amount but i think they should abolish it, while opening all the empty house for poor folk and the like to live in. Fair is fair.

I'm paying for those friggin houses i want to see em put to use.

Reality_Check1

I have to laugh at some of the suggestions to raise the USC. Now dont get me wrong I'm not one of these people earning over 150k or anywhere near that (I actually only work part time so I can put myself through college) but when you consider that Ireland has already got the 3rd highest income tax rate in all of Europe you have to look elsewhere to make cuts imo.

In all reality I can see both happening which is sad to see but necessary. The dole will be systematically cut over the next few years to fall in line with Europe as well as cuts to child benefit and allowances.

People forget that its not the current government that put us in this position and even if they make all the necessary cuts and people get pissed off and vote them out the next government will have to do the exact same thing anyway

Reality_Check1

Confab wrote: »

Uh, you really have no idea how much the dole is in other European countries, do you? Bringing it in line with other EU countries would increase it dramatically.

lol

franktheplank

Reality_Check1 wrote: »

People forget that its not the current government that put us in this position and even if they make all the necessary cuts and people get pissed off and vote them out the next government will have to do the exact same thing anyway

This government has the same mentality as the last. Bow down to the bankers, property investors and public serpents.

Nothing has changed.

Grayson

Reality_Check1 wrote: »

I have to laugh at some of the suggestions to raise the USC. Now dont get me wrong I'm not one of these people earning over 150k or anywhere near that (I actually only work part time so I can put myself through college) but when you consider that Ireland has already got the 3rd highest income tax rate in all of Europe you have to look elsewhere to make cuts imo.

In all reality I can see both happening which is sad to see but necessary. The dole will be systematically cut over the next few years to fall in line with Europe as well as cuts to child benefit and allowances.

People forget that its not the current government that put us in this position and even if they make all the necessary cuts and people get pissed off and vote them out the next government will have to do the exact same thing anyway

Any links to clarify that? Is it the third highest over all? Or the third highest if you're earning 150k? Third highest is a very vague figure.

Caliden

You can guarantee petrol/diesel, road tax, cigs and alcohol prices will increase and all we will do about it is complain while paying for it. We need these things and the government knows we'll pay whatever price they are.

High earners need to be taxed before the camel's back well and truly breaks because it's the same people getting hit with cuts all the time.

Reality_Check1

Grayson wrote: »

Any links to clarify that? Is it the third highest over all? Or the third highest if you're earning 150k? Third highest is a very vague figure.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tax_rates_of_Europe

cris210580

well if they will cut the rent allowence then they will have a bigger problem whit homeless people....there are a subtantial no of people who cant afford to pay rent cos they lost their jobs and they have to feed their children ...and to be honest here rent is way to much now compare whit the salarryies,prices are going up,salarys and dole are going down but thats only for the normal people who have to work a lot only to struggle to survive cos the rich people dont give a damn about the other,they care only about protecting their hudge bank aaccount
everibody is complaining here about the dole...well this is not the first big problem of ireland..the big one are the banks and the goverment who still live in their own world...THE RICH WORLD....

Reality_Check1

Caliden wrote: »

High earners need to be taxed before the camel's back well and truly breaks because it's the same people getting hit with cuts all the time.

lol do people realise what they are saying? The high earners already pay way more than their share! They practically fund the public sector including health, transport and yes social welfare! high earners have been hit equally hard over the last number of years to suggest otherwise is silly

summerskin

Confab wrote: »

Uh, you really have no idea how much the dole is in other European countries, do you? Bringing it in line with other EU countries would increase it dramatically.

In most other countries it is for a limited amount of time, and is based on your tax contributions. Of course, people who have made higher contributions receive higher amounts of benefits, and quite rightly so too.

Here anyone can get their few hundred quid and never bother lifting a finger in their life, or contributing to society. Dole should be for one year, maximum, with only limited hardship funds available afterwards.

zirafute

Reality_Check1 wrote: »

In all reality I can see both happening which is sad to see but necessary. The dole will be systematically cut over the next few years to fall in line with Europe as well as cuts to child benefit and allowances.

They cut the dole before, they cut single mothers benefits and other benefits that are helping working class people survive after loosing their jobs. So how is it fair that working class have to save money somehow when rich people don't agree to pay 3 percent more which would add 71 million euros to the budget.

cris210580

the goverment should facilitate first the people to go back to work..they should cut childcare and alow parents to go and work and afford childcare

Reality_Check1

zirafute wrote: »

They cut the dole before, they cut single mothers benefits and other benefits that are helping working class people survive after loosing their jobs. So how is it fair that working class have to save money somehow when rich people don't agree to pay 3 percent more which would add 71 million euros to the budget.

they raised income tax before too why should people who earn good money be forced to be the only ones that have to pay back our countries debt when all it would take is for everyone on the dole to smoke 1 less packet of cigarettes a week or have one less trip to the off licence

above is an extreme example that I dont agree with but it mirrors your equally ludicrous example

Chips Lovell

Reality_Check1 wrote: »

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tax_rates_of_Europe

I can see a couple of glaring errors in that table.

summerskin

zirafute wrote: »

They cut the dole before, they cut single mothers benefits and other benefits that are helping working class people survive after loosing their jobs. So how is it fair that working class have to save money somehow when rich people don't agree to pay 3 percent more which would add 71 million euros to the budget.

So why should I pay more taxes to support single mothers who do not work???? Why I should I fund "working class" people so that they can save more money? I'd prefer if more of them worked, lowering the tax burden on people who pay too much tax already.

And before i get accused of bashing single parents, my mother was one. She worked throughout my childhood though, paying her way, the same as all single mothers should.

cris210580

Reality_Check1 wrote: »

they raised income tax before too why should people who earn good money be forced to be the only ones that have to pay back our countries debt when all it would take is for everyone on the dole to smoke 1 less packet of cigarettes a week or have one less trip to the off licence

above is an extreme example that I dont agree with but it mirrors your equally ludicrous example

why do you think that all people on dole are smoking and drinking?
i think the prices on cigarets and drink should increase in ireland especially for drink.

zirafute

Reality_Check1 wrote: »

they raised income tax before too why should people who earn good money be forced to be the only ones that have to pay back our countries debt when all it would take is for everyone on the dole to smoke 1 less packet of cigarettes a week or have one less trip to the off licence

above is an extreme example that I dont agree with but it mirrors your equally ludicrous example

they raised it before true but they cut down more benefits. Not everyone on the dole smoke and drink. I know there are a few that abuse the system but there are loads who are trying to save money pay mortgage and feed their children and it isn't fair that their benefits are being cut because rich people won't pay a little bit extra.
I do agree that sometimes it isn't fair that rich people should pay more but times are hard and it's especially hard if you can't feed your children and pay rent.

Reality_Check1

cris210580 wrote: »

why do you think that all people on dole are smoking and drinking?
i think the prices on cigarets and drink should increase in ireland especially for drink.

I dont I pointed out I was being extremest. If you raise the price of alcohol too much people wont go out and then pubs will close down losing more jobs and putting a bigger strain on the social welfare bill. Its a fine balance between rising the price of something to collect tax and the long term consequences of the hike

neil_hosey

cris210580 wrote: »

why do you think that all people on dole are smoking and drinking?
i think the prices on cigarets and drink should increase in ireland especially for drink.

why? its so fúcking expensive already!

cris210580

summerskin wrote: »

So why should I pay more taxes to support single mothers who do not work???? Why I should I fund "working class" people so that they can save more money? I'd prefer if more of them worked, lowering the tax burden on people who pay too much tax already.

And before i get accused of bashing single parents, my mother was one. She worked throughout my childhood though, paying her way, the same as all single mothers should.

yes thats so true ,but first they should afford childcare....and i dont think is fair to pay 1000+ per month for it from a 1200euro sallary

Reality_Check1

zirafute wrote: »

they raised it before true but they cut down more benefits. Not everyone on the dole smoke and drink. I know there are a few that abuse the system but there are loads who are trying to save money pay mortgage and feed their children and it isn't fair that their benefits are being cut because rich people won't pay a little bit extra.
I do agree that sometimes it isn't fair that rich people should pay more but times are hard and it's especially hard if you can't feed your children and pay rent.

of course its fair. why should these so called "rich" people be forced to give up things in their life cause they are the only ones having to tighten the belt?

If the dole was dropped to €175 in the morning people wouldnt starve for christ sake they would find a way. the heating might not be on as long or you might not be able to have nice food but you'd hardly be walking the streets

Anyone

cris210580 wrote: »

why do you think that all people on dole are smoking and drinking?
i think the prices on cigarets and drink should increase in ireland especially for drink.

These two products would raise so little extra its hardly worth while. Actually, I would foresee that another increase on cigarettes will mean less income for the Gov as people will buy blackmarket cigarettes instead.

Raising alcohol duty is just going to mean more people drinking at home instead of pubs, which means more pubs closing and more jobs lost.

Lenin Skynard

They've already priced themselves out of the cigarette market tbh. I'm not a smoker but most smokers I know won't buy them in shops because they're too expensive. Sad to say it but they would probably take in more tax by reducing the price of a packet of cigarettes.

Drink's a whole other story though. There were crates of 24 500ml branded beers for €20 in my local supermarket recently. It's obviously still creeping down in price and I don't think it's a good thing. €1 per can should be the lowest these should go.

They need to stay a million miles away from doing anything to motor fuel, it's far too expensive at this stage.

davet82

Anyone wrote: »

Raising alcohol duty is just going to mean more people drinking at home instead of pubs, which means more pubs closing and more jobs lost.

its already been suggested that the tax on alcohol will be only placed on off licence purchases, idk how likely that will be though

cris210580

Reality_Check1 wrote: »

of course its fair. why should these so called "rich" people be forced to give up things in their life cause they are the only ones having to tighten the belt?

the heating might not be on as long or you might not be able to have nice food

ohhhh your so right but you know what lets just kill them all people on dole and the rich people live happylly ever after......

hay_maker

budgetery descisions are more often than not political in nature than economic

for example , despite the fact that pensioners have not been touched since the rescession began , their will be no cuts to the OAP due to the fact that they are one of the most powerfull voting blocs

same deal with the croke park agreement as public servants are also a powerfull and unified voting block

fairness and politics rarely go together

Chips Lovell

davet82 wrote: »

its already been suggested that the tax on alcohol will be only placed on off licence purchases, idk how likely that will be though

Ya gotta look after the publicans.

Chips Lovell

cris210580 wrote: »

ohhhh your so right but you know what lets just kill them all people on dole and the rich people live happylly ever after......

"What if we kill the poor and cut VAT?"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s_4J4uor3JE

Reality_Check1

cris210580 wrote: »

ohhhh your so right but you know what lets just kill them all people on dole and the rich people live happylly ever after......

Id be all for giving them a fighting chance. Stop dole payments completely in the morning. Those that are any use will find themselves some work and survive and all the rest will die out instantly improving the status of the country

we'll call it the final solution