Sunday Independent asks: Is Fianna Fail The Future?

Brussels Sprout

Well that didn't take long.

Just 20 months after the party's annihilation in the last general election the Sunday Independent has firmly shown it's true colours. For the lifetime of this government the paper has contended itself with sniping at the government parties and Sinn Fein, whilst practically ignoring Fiann Fail altogether (The one exception being it backing the proxy-FF candidate, Sean Gallagher, in last year's presidential election).

In today's "analysis" section the paper manages to include 3 articles under the main heading "Is Fianna Fail the Future?" with such headlines as:

• Our only hope of policy chage lies in a reinvigorated Fianna Fail
• FF back in business as "squeezed middle" man returns home
• FF was arrogant, now it's back to roots

Not to mention the nauseating Eoghan Harris in a separate article:

• Off the ropes: Martin makes a fresh start for Fianna Fail

The best bit of all though is a Reservoir Dogs style photo of the remains of the parliamentary party walking together along a tree lined path including such leading lights as Niall Collins, Deirdre Heney, Denis O' Donovan, Timmy Dooley and Billy Kelleher (no sign of Willie O' Dea though).


So clearly the Sindo thinks that they've waited a respectable amount of time to champion the party that torpedoed the economy during their 14 years in power.

So, do you think Fianna Fail are the future?

thebman

No I think we need to click refresh on our political system.

We need new parties with new ideals for a modern Ireland with new people ready to lead that have a vision for the future of Ireland.

All the existing parties and their leaders appear to have no ideals except SF and I'm not sure I agree with theirs TBH.

We need more liberal social parties in Ireland that don't want to torpedo the econonmy with election buying. To do that requires political reform IMO.

Mr.Micro

Brussels Sprout wrote: »

So, do you think Fianna Fail are the future?

No. FF is the past and even if it does manage to claw its way back into office it will need to be different and cleaner. If Martin on Vincent Browne is anything to go by then it is as vacuous as ever.

Mal-Adjusted

I was so sickened by those articles I couldn't actually finish reading any of them.

Death and Taxes

I would sooner see us being part of the UK than see FF run this country again!:mad:

Nodin

Brussels Sprout wrote: »

Well that didn't take long.

Just 20 months after the party's annihilation in the last general election the Sunday Independent has firmly shown it's true colours. For the lifetime of this government the paper has contended itself with sniping at the government parties and Sinn Fein, whilst practically ignoring Fiann Fail altogether (The one exception being it backing the proxy-FF candidate, Sean Gallagher, in last year's presidential election).

In today's "analysis" section the paper manages to include 3 articles under the main heading "Is Fianna Fail the Future?" with such headlines as:

• Our only hope of policy chage lies in a reinvigorated Fianna Fail
• FF back in business as "squeezed middle" man returns home
• FF was arrogant, now it's back to roots

Not to mention the nauseating Eoghan Harris in a separate article:

• Off the ropes: Martin makes a fresh start for Fianna Fail

The best bit of all though is a Reservoir Dogs style photo of the remains of the parliamentary party walking together along a tree lined path including such leading lights as Niall Collins, Deirdre Heney, Denis O' Donovan, Timmy Dooley and Billy Kelleher (no sign of Willie O' Dea though).


So clearly the Sindo thinks that they've waited a respectable amount of time to champion the party that torpedoed the economy during their 14 years in power.

So, do you think Fianna Fail are the future?

After a period of penitence in the wilderness, and a change of personell. At the moment the chairs still have the shapes of their backsides in them. Even for the Sindo, this is fairly bad.

galwayrush

A new low for the Sindo.

Dirk Gently

galwayrush wrote: »

A new low for the Sindo.

not really a new low tbh, the Sindo has always been little more than a FF propaganda tool. More a case of the same old attempts at pro FF opinion forming dressed up as an "independent" news paper.

flash1080

I will be voting for FF in the next general election.

In case people have missed it, the recession is not just an Irish phenomenon.

downwesht

John Waters is at it as well in the Mail.

What short memories we have.
I know the present crowd are creating pain but in no way are they as bad as the Bertie/Cowen gang.
Let's face it we are being governed indirectly by Europe whether we acknowledge the fact or not,
We are paying for FF's giveaway budgets of the past, plus the bankers mistakes, plus the developers.
Give this crowd a full term and they will be judged at the ballot box,hopefully they will have improved things.....they can't get much worse!

laoch na mona

when will FF and FG join together and get it over with they're the same basicly

Dirk Gently

flash1080 wrote: »

I will be voting for FF in the next general election.

In case people have missed it, the recession is not just an Irish phenomenon.

eroding the tax base, promoting a property bubble and perusing low/none regulatory policy were domestic Irish decisions.(That's ignoring their corruption) It just so happens that they were being cheer leaded by the other parties but FF were the ones in Government at the time and they saw fit to buy election after election and be populist rather than responsible in Government.

Dirk Gently

Dirk Gently wrote: »

not really a new low tbh, the Sindo has always been little more than a FF propaganda tool. More a case of the same old attempts at pro FF opinion forming dressed up as an "independent" news paper.

Who is it that is driving this blatantly obvious FF agenda at the independent newspaper ? Why are they still there ?

They along with FF need to accept that part they played with FF in the destruction of this country.:(

flash1080

flash1080 wrote: »

I will be voting for FF in the next general election.

In case people have missed it, the recession is not just an Irish phenomenon.

The recession isn't the problem, its the legacy of FF(high PS wages, High pensions, Lots of waste, Corruption, budget imbalance) that is the problem. It will take a lot more than 1 term to fix FF's mess.

Brussels Sprout

Deleted User wrote: »

Who is it that is driving this blatantly obvious FF agenda at the independent newspaper ? Why are they still there ?

I always assumed that the paper just ecoed the opinions of Tony O' Reilly who previously controlled INM. However, Denis O' Brien has managed to oust the O' Reilly family so perhaps it's the editor (now Anne Harris since the death of her husband Aengus Fanning). Fanning used always get his picture taken with the FF ministers and the property developers at the black tie events during the boom years and splash them all over the papers.

Death and Taxes

flash1080 wrote: »

I will be voting for FF in the next general election.

In case people have missed it, the recession is not just an Irish phenomenon.

the worst banking collapse and housing market crash ever seen in world is, and the blame lies squarely wit the goons in FF, in particular Ahern, Lenihan, and Cowen!

Fattes

the worst banking collapse and housing market crash ever seen in world is, and the blame lies squarely wit the goons in FF, in particular Ahern, Lenihan, and Cowen!

FF/FG/LB Had identical manifesto and polices through the boom so what does that tell you?

As a nation we all wanted what FF/FG/LB were peddling and bought it. Perhaps it is time the Irish people stopped looking at the Smoke screen, and focused on the real problems when that happens maybe we can get to the root of the problem

A corrupt political system with no accountability to the electorate

A disfranchised and uninterested electorate who blames everyone else on their problems

Dealing with the Government overspending & Waste the ridiculous welfare system, and the over payed heads of semi state bodies.

thebman

flash1080 wrote: »

I will be voting for FF in the next general election.

In case people have missed it, the recession is not just an Irish phenomenon.

Complaining that opposition would have done the same due to the structure of our political system when your in government and are the only ones with the power to change the political system is however FF's fault directly.

And it is FG's fault that they are doing the same now in the hope to buy elections through putting local things in their constituencies like Reilly is doing in the hope to pull the same trick FF were pulling hoping people care more about getting the road fixed than the austerity.

Like I said, we need new parties with new ideas not more of the same auld b*ll*cks.

Death and Taxes

[QUOTE=Fattes;81931553]FF/FG/LB Had identical manifesto and polices through the boom so what does that tell you?

As a nation we all wanted what FF/FG/LB were peddling and bought it. Perhaps it is time the Irish people stopped looking at the Smoke screen, and focused on the real problems when that happens maybe we can get to the root of the problem

A corrupt political system with no accountability to the electorate

A disfranchised and uninterested electorate who blames everyone else on their problems

Dealing with the Government overspending & Waste the ridiculous welfare system, and the over payed heads of semi state bodies.[/QUOTE]
It tells me that they were in oppostion! FF were in Government and as such must accept the blame for their actions.
Does the fact the lots of people want the speed limit increased lessen the culpability of a selfish drunk who ploughs into bus stop full of people while driving at 200kmh? No, it doesn't.

Fattes

WileyCoyote; Farily missing the point there young man.

The Irish People voted for it that is all that was on offer from the opposition means that is what people were asking for that is what the Irish people wanted and yes, we are partly to blame.

FF were crap in goverment but they were cheered on by the Irish Electorate

Yeah more pay rises and less tax whoo, yes more money thrown at HSE, White elephant project Yeahhh more more

FG are no better in power, incase you missed it the man appointed to run the Gathering with 14,000 Euros of your Money every month is an Ex-Chairman of Fina Gael, James Reilly well enough said the problem is not FF its the system and how we as the electorate accept it.

Now stop blaming the boogie man and work on change.

thebman

Fattes wrote: »

FF/FG/LB Had identical manifesto and polices through the boom so what does that tell you?

As a nation we all wanted what FF/FG/LB were peddling and bought it. Perhaps it is time the Irish people stopped looking at the Smoke screen, and focused on the real problems when that happens maybe we can get to the root of the problem

A corrupt political system with no accountability to the electorate

A disfranchised and uninterested electorate who blames everyone else on their problems

Dealing with the Government overspending & Waste the ridiculous welfare system, and the over payed heads of semi state bodies.

I think its not true that people wanted what FF were peddling.

People saw the economy doing fine and booming even articles saying we were rich and so voted for more of the same.

They were unaware of how crazy the policies that were keeping the show on the road were or where they would eventually take us.

Much like getting in a taxi and telling him to bring you somewhere. If he goes off on a mad route to drive up the cost of the fare and you don't know the route, only where you want to go then there is not much you can do.

You could argue that people should know but that would require a proper civics education in secondary schools which most people never received which is again another failure of the state.

If you run the show, you can't take credit for success and delegate responsibility when things fail.

thebman

Fattes wrote: »

WileyCoyote; Farily missing the point there young man.

The Irish People voted for it that is all that was on offer from the opposition means that is what people were asking for that is what the Irish people wanted and yes, we are partly to blame.

FF were crap in goverment but they were cheered on by the Irish Electorate

Yeah more pay rises and less tax whoo, yes more money thrown at HSE, White elephant project Yeahhh more more

FG are no better in power, incase you missed it the man appointed to run the Gathering with 14,000 Euros of your Money every month is an Ex-Chairman of Fina Gael, James Reilly well enough said the problem is not FF its the system and how we as the electorate accept it.

Now stop blaming the boogie man and work on change.

That change can only be done by the government unfortunately so the question is how do you get a turkey to vote for Christmas?

Death and Taxes

Fattes wrote: »

WileyCoyote; Farily missing the point there young man.

The Irish People voted for it that is all that was on offer from the opposition means that is what people were asking for that is what the Irish people wanted and yes, we are partly to blame.

FF were crap in goverment but they were cheered on by the Irish Electorate

Yeah more pay rises and less tax whoo, yes more money thrown at HSE, White elephant project Yeahhh more more

FG are no better in power, incase you missed it the man appointed to run the Gathering with 14,000 Euros of your Money every month is an Ex-Chairman of Fina Gael, James Reilly well enough said the problem is not FF its the system and how we as the electorate accept it.

Now stop blaming the boogie man and work on change.

At 48 I consider your "young man" remark condescending in the extreme.
Bottom line is FF were in power, they chose to act corruptly and recklessly, what others might have done is moot.

GRMA

Someone should smash the SINDO presses.

Nothing but a rag which has played a long and important role in ruining the country

Fattes

That change can only be done by the government unfortunately so the question is how do you get a turkey to vote for Christmas?

The Government should answer to its people, not the people answering to a Government if enough people ask the system has to change

At 48 I consider your "young man" remark condescending in the extreme.

And I find the its all the gov fault line insulting to everyone but hey the world is a place full of opinions and they are not always the same. But facts are different and the fact is we all voted for them and gave them the power to do what they did.

They were unaware of how crazy the policies that were keeping the show on the road were or where they would eventually take us.

Really an average 3 bed room house in the capital was as expensive as Geneva and more expensive than London, we had civil servants being paid 100K Plus a year and Government ministers being paid more than their US/UK/German piers.

Banks on a small Island with 4 million people being valued more than large institutions in Europe

Yeah there was no signs what so ever. :rolleyes:

Zombrex

Brussels Sprout wrote: »

So, do you think Fianna Fail are the future?

Yes, because most Irish people are politically retarded, as things like the Quinn rally demonstrate.

FF will simply select local "business men" who are great craic down which ever pub you are in in Sligo or Galway or Kerry or Dublin, build a few swimming pools and they will be back in power in no time.

The Irish electorate have even shorter memories than the US electorate.

Death and Taxes

Fattes wrote: »

The Government should answer to its people, not the people answering to a Government if enough people ask the system has to change



And I find the its all the gov fault line insulting to everyone but hey the world is a place full of opinions and they are not always the same. But facts are different and the fact is we all voted for them and gave them the power to do what they did.



Really an average 3 bed room house in the capital was as expensive as Geneva and more expensive than London, we had civil servants being paid 100K Plus a year and Government ministers being paid more than their US/UK/German piers.

Banks on a small Island with 4 million people being valued more than large institutions in Europe

Yeah there was no signs what so ever. :rolleyes:

we disn't ALL vote for them , almost two thirds of voters voted against them.

meoklmrk91

How quick people are to forget, FF have pissed us off lets all vote FG, and the reverse the process when FG pisses us off. Personally I can say it will be a cold day in hell before I would ever vote FF, I think the same regarding FG now due to a number of policies and positions that they have taken that I cannot agree with. Greens, no, labour should change their name. So all that's left is SF :eek:, we really need some new political parties!

Fattes

And I find the its all the gov fault line insulting to everyone but hey the world is a place full of opinions and they are not always the same. But facts are different and the fact is we all voted for them and gave them the power to do what they did.

Everyone that voted either voted for them or one of the Alternatives that were offering the same policies or worse....

Death and Taxes

Fattes wrote: »

Everyone that voted either voted for them or one of the Alternatives that were offering the same policies or worse....

Get a grasp of reality, FF were the ones in power, they were charged with the governance of the state and they ruined it through corruption and ineptitude.
The what if the opposition had been in power is hypothesis and is moot, those who were in power must be made to take responsibility.

Monty Burnz

flash1080 wrote: »

I will be voting for FF in the next general election.

In case people have missed it, the recession is not just an Irish phenomenon.

And of course outright national bankruptcy is a hallmark of all the well-run countries - us, Greece...and probably all the other good ones I guess...

liammur

Brussels Sprout wrote: »

Well that didn't take long.

Just 20 months after the party's annihilation in the last general election the Sunday Independent has firmly shown it's true colours. For the lifetime of this government the paper has contended itself with sniping at the government parties and Sinn Fein, whilst practically ignoring Fiann Fail altogether (The one exception being it backing the proxy-FF candidate, Sean Gallagher, in last year's presidential election).

In today's "analysis" section the paper manages to include 3 articles under the main heading "Is Fianna Fail the Future?" with such headlines as:

• Our only hope of policy chage lies in a reinvigorated Fianna Fail
• FF back in business as "squeezed middle" man returns home
• FF was arrogant, now it's back to roots

Not to mention the nauseating Eoghan Harris in a separate article:

• Off the ropes: Martin makes a fresh start for Fianna Fail

The best bit of all though is a Reservoir Dogs style photo of the remains of the parliamentary party walking together along a tree lined path including such leading lights as Niall Collins, Deirdre Heney, Denis O' Donovan, Timmy Dooley and Billy Kelleher (no sign of Willie O' Dea though).


So clearly the Sindo thinks that they've waited a respectable amount of time to champion the party that torpedoed the economy during their 14 years in power.

So, do you think Fianna Fail are the future?

There's a reason why their share price is 6cents. LOL.

Fattes

My reality is FF were in Power and made a right royal Balls of running the country.

They were voted in 3 times by the Irish people in sufficient numbers to form a coalition. People voted en mass for the opposition who were offering the same deal.

So a sa people we asked our politicians for particular policies which they gave us. It is not hypothetical about what the opposition would have done it is what they were offering it was the same.

Look now, people voted for Enda and co and they have failed to deliver Political reform of any shape and that is what we need Political reform FF/FG/LB are all the same tripe.

The political structures and the whole Civil system is broken that is what needs to change not the parties. The public need to ask for more from their politicians, look at the Swiss political system. Its an education in how a state should operate.

Mr.Micro

Fattes wrote: »

My reality is FF were in Power and made a right royal Balls of running the country.

They were voted in 3 times by the Irish people in sufficient numbers to form a coalition. People voted en mass for the opposition who were offering the same deal.

So a sa people we asked our politicians for particular policies which they gave us. It is not hypothetical about what the opposition would have done it is what they were offering it was the same.

Look now, people voted for Enda and co and they have failed to deliver Political reform of any shape and that is what we need Political reform FF/FG/LB are all the same tripe.

The political structures and the whole Civil system is broken that is what needs to change not the parties. The public need to ask for more from their politicians, look at the Swiss political system. Its an education in how a state should operate.

The facts are that FF did not put the brakes on when told the economy was overheating and going out of control, and much more, and as the party in power, the buck stops with them. Its a bit lame saying other parties had the policies......, even if they had makes no difference, and if they had been in power, they could have had proper regulation and cooled the economy etc. FF are happy to blame Lehman Brothers, the opposition party, the voters but never itself.

Monty Burnz

Fattes wrote: »

My reality is FF were in Power and made a right royal Balls of running the country.

They were voted in 3 times by the Irish people in sufficient numbers to form a coalition. People voted en mass for the opposition who were offering the same deal.

So a sa people we asked our politicians for particular policies which they gave us. It is not hypothetical about what the opposition would have done it is what they were offering it was the same.

Look now, people voted for Enda and co and they have failed to deliver Political reform of any shape and that is what we need Political reform FF/FG/LB are all the same tripe.

The political structures and the whole Civil system is broken that is what needs to change not the parties. The public need to ask for more from their politicians, look at the Swiss political system. Its an education in how a state should operate.

I think we do need political reform but to be fair the current mob are in disaster management mode and it's probably a bit much to expect them to engage in root and branch reform at the same time. The trick will be to keep the pressure for reform on when the economy stabilises - that's when it will be reasonable to expect action. And if they fail then, I will be throwing brickbats at them with the rest of you.

Of course, we all probably have conflicting ideas of the needed reforms.

thebman

Monty Burnz wrote: »

I think we do need political reform but to be fair the current mob are in disaster management mode and it's probably a bit much to expect them to engage in root and branch reform at the same time. The trick will be to keep the pressure for reform on when the economy stabilises - that's when it will be reasonable to expect action. And if they fail then, I will be throwing brickbats at them with the rest of you.

Of course, we all probably have conflicting ideas of the needed reforms.

That is the platform they ran on for election though and if we wait until economy stabilizes it won't ever happen and we'll end up back here again.

They'll just get cozy and think, ah sure it'll be grand, this time will be different ...

Fromthetrees

God almighty, anyone who would vote for Mehole Martin and Willie back into power probably have some sort of undetected brain tumor that they should get treatment for.

This, sure the other crowd would have done the same nonsense is no different than saying if Hitler hadn't went and did the whole gas and murder and genocide thing than someone else would have, sure if Larry Murphy didn't do his nudey rapey mountain thing to random women someone else would have.

NO! Fianna ****ing failure were in power, they called the shots and we'll be paying back the mess they made for at least a generation, those of us that are left anyway.

Hearing sh1t like this makes me want to vote for Eirigi.

thebman

Fattes wrote: »

The Government should answer to its people, not the people answering to a Government if enough people ask the system has to change

In Ireland's case, this will take a revolution or about a million people to march the streets.

Most people in jobs just don't care.

raymon

Sinn Fein have an Phoblacht , FF have had the Independent as its voice and newsletter for many years.

I'm not sure why anyone is surprised at the blatant support of the party that ruined our economy.

jasonmcco

flash1080 wrote: »

I will be voting for FF in the next general election.

In case people have missed it, the recession is not just an Irish phenomenon.

did someone mention corruption:)

hallelujajordan

Mr.Micro wrote: »

The facts are that FF did not put the brakes on when told the economy was overheating and going out of control, and much more, and as the party in power, the buck stops with them. Its a bit lame saying other parties had the policies......, even if they had makes no difference, and if they had been in power, they could have had proper regulation and cooled the economy etc. FF are happy to blame Lehman Brothers, the opposition party, the voters but never itself.

From this years Ard-Fheis party leaders speech

"It’s not enough to point to the worst world recession in 80 years and the Eurozone crisis.
Nor to point to the fact that other parties were demanding policies which would have made things worse – that’s for them to answer for.
We were in government and we should have acted differently.
We made mistakes.
We got things wrong.
And we are sorry for that.
No equivocation.
No half-apology.
Just the plain, unvarnished truth.."

FF have no difficulty accepting responsibility for the role they played in creating the crisis.

raymon

hallelujajordan wrote: »

From this years Ard-Fheis party leaders speech

"It’s not enough to point to the worst world recession in 80 years and the Eurozone crisis.
Nor to point to the fact that other parties were demanding policies which would have made things worse – that’s for them to answer for.
We were in government and we should have acted differently.
We made mistakes.
We got things wrong.
And we are sorry for that.
No equivocation.
No half-apology.
Just the plain, unvarnished truth.."

FF have no difficulty accepting responsibility for the role they played in creating the crisis.

Not true . Michael Martin appeared on Vincent Browne last week and denied that FF were to blame.

Monty Burnz

hallelujajordan wrote: »

From this years Ard-Fheis party leaders speech

"It’s not enough to point to the worst world recession in 80 years and the Eurozone crisis.
Nor to point to the fact that other parties were demanding policies which would have made things worse – that’s for them to answer for.
We were in government and we should have acted differently.
We made mistakes.
We got things wrong.
And we are sorry for that.
No equivocation.
No half-apology.
Just the plain, unvarnished truth.."

FF have no difficulty accepting responsibility for the role they played in creating the crisis.

So they preface their 'taking responsibility' with a shower of excuses?

Seems legit.

Dirk Gently

hallelujajordan wrote: »

FF have no difficulty accepting responsibility for the role they played in creating the crisis.

What does that mean, "accept responsibility". It's one of the great modern PR phrase con jobs. It's the default response in recent years when Politicians are caught red handed and it's not practical to spin their way out of something because the truth is so glaringly obvious and even the most hard necked would have dificulty ducking the question so they say something along the lines of "I accept that" or "I take responsibilty for that", usually followed by "now lets move on". It has no actual meaning though. What does "I accept that" or " I take responsibility" mean in practical terms. It means nothing really does it, it just means, ok, you got me, now lets move along., nothing to see here.

Accepting responsibility would amount to something like resigning for an individual or perhaps disbanding for a political party who destroyed the economy. In PR speak though accepting responsibility is merly drawing a line under criticism and moving on like your record is clean. Imagine we had a situation where law courts worked like PR talk. The Thief stands up in the dock and answers the charges with, "I accept that, I take responsibilty" and then the judge says grand so, good man, your free to go. It doesn't work like that though because accepting responsibility usually means facing consequences to your actions. If FF accept responsibilty, then actually do it and disband.

It's easy to have "no difficulty" accepting responsibility when to accept it has no actual consequence or responsibilty attached to it.

tipptom

Undoubtably the most corrupt party in Irish politics going back to its very inception.They were getting 1 billion for every 100,000 houses built and used this to pay of main players that are vastly overpaid today and bribed the the Irish electorate so that their main aim was achieved,and that was not the good of Ireland,it was simply keep FF in power,no matter what the cconsequences to Ireland.It was only ever about FF,their developer friends and bankers.
Sunday ind policy was always driven by Eoghan Harris and Angheos Fanning for FF who gained massivly from the FF corruption poicys and now cheerlead no marks in the party like senator wifes of leading Irish Independant political journalists who seem to be pushed in to our faces out on thr plinth even though they got no mandate from the electorate.
Cannot wait until the next election when it is clarified to them that their corrupt sleeven brand of politics is finished and retire once and for all Michael Martin and the rest of his cronies who sat through that period are gone and forgotten from Irish politics.

Sierra Oscar

raymon wrote: »

Not true . Michael Martin appeared on Vincent Browne last week and denied that FF were to blame.

You are lying raymon. He did not say that FF were not to blame - he admitted that the party made serious judgement errors in regards policy which greatly contributed to the financial difficulties. However he also said that there were other factors at play other than FF being in government, which any balanced analyst would admit.

Monty Burnz

Sierra Oscar wrote: »

You are lying raymon. He did not say that FF were not to blame - he admitted that the party made serious judgement errors in regards policy which greatly contributed to the financial difficulties. However he also said that there were other factors at play other than FF being in government, which any balanced analyst would admit.

So basically as long as there was a boom, they were able to avoid bankrupting the country and losing our sovereignty. But as soon as the boom ended, they did that.

Great.

donegal_road

the Indo is for lighting the fire

Death and Taxes

Sierra Oscar wrote: »

You are lying raymon. He did not say that FF were not to blame - he admitted that the party made serious judgement errors in regards policy which greatly contributed to the financial difficulties. However he also said that there were other factors at play other than FF being in government, which any balanced analyst would admit.

With respect, what other factors after all the set up the FSRA, they allowed the housing bubble to grow, they told those of us critical of their economic policy that we should commit suicide.
If you take FF disasterous domestic policies out of the equation then the international financial crisis would have had a far less disasterous effect on us.

raymon

Sierra Oscar wrote: »

You are lying raymon. He did not say that FF were not to blame - he admitted that the party made serious judgement errors in regards policy which greatly contributed to the financial difficulties. However he also said that there were other factors at play other than FF being in government, which any balanced analyst would admit.

Saying that I am lying is bizarre behaviour for a moderator.

The first ten minutes of this interview is mostly denials of FF causing
the collapse of our economy.

http://www.tv3.ie/3player/show/41/55941/1/Tonight-with-Vincent-Browne

Please retract your " you are lying " accusation.

Mr.Micro

hallelujajordan wrote: »

From this years Ard-Fheis party leaders speech

"It’s not enough to point to the worst world recession in 80 years and the Eurozone crisis.

Nor to point to the fact that other parties were demanding policies which would have made things worse – that’s for them to answer for.

We were in government and we should have acted differently.
We made mistakes.
We got things wrong.
And we are sorry for that.
No equivocation.
No half-apology.
Just the plain, unvarnished truth.."

FF have no difficulty accepting responsibility for the role they played in creating the crisis.

The bit above quote of your quote negates what came after it, because it suggests others would have done the same as FF. The apology after these words then is so hollow and insincere, just weasel words. Poor FF really do need to accept in full, without any dilution its gross negligence of the Irish economy and how it let its own people down.